jacobmusicboy
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
125 IQ
#1
Im a 19 year old singer im a baritone. my voice sounds somewhat like jeremy camp . f2 is the end of my low end and f4 the high end. i can hit an a4 using my head voice but it sounds trebly and really ugly . i really want to sing like myles kennedy and chris daughtry . i believe its all about the technique . and im sure the right technique doesnt involve strain .


what is that right technique? I read that myles kennedy uses bel canto technique and anotherthing i speak in a low tone does that affect my range? are high pitched notes supposed to sound loud while singing? i have dark deep voice and i love singing with a scratch in my voice i play guitar i write songs AND HIGH PITCHED parts of the song are the peaks

i really want to nail those notes . people like scott stapp and the skillet singer and james hetfield are baritones i believe but they also hit high notes in their songs how do they do it ? thats a lotta questions . i know .coz im serious about music and about improving . anyone with right knowledge kindly help me out
will42
UG's bassoon-master
Join date: Aug 2010
1,093 IQ
#2
Range expansion is a long process, and it isn't particularly rewarding. My range has expanded by one step in the past year of music school. You can improve the tone of your high register, though.

Make sure you are using enough air when you go for high notes, it's easier to hit them loud rather than soft. Be sure that you are breathing properly. Breathe from the bottom of your stomach, and your whole body should expand when you take a breath. Support all of your notes with a full air column. Stand up straight and avoid slumping so you don't have cramped lungs or a crooked air column.

Also, take a few lessons. They never hurt.

Also, strain is bad. Strain and tension will pinch your tone on any instrument or voice. Tension is never good.
Strauss!
"I am hitting my head against the walls, but the walls are giving way." - Gustav Mahler.

Quote by AeolianWolf
absolutely what will said

Yay, my first compliment!
Sethis
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2011
171 IQ
#4
You're probably trapped in chest voice as most beginners. You need to find your head voice. It will actually be falsetto at first...weak, unsupported and breathy. Don't give up on it though, it's the tool to build a strong head voice. It's going to take a while though so you need patience. There are lots of videos or articles that can teach you about this.
Tyson2011
Registered User
Join date: Sep 2010
212 IQ
#5
Quote by Sethis
You're probably trapped in chest voice as most beginners. You need to find your head voice. It will actually be falsetto at first...weak, unsupported and breathy. Don't give up on it though, it's the tool to build a strong head voice. It's going to take a while though so you need patience. There are lots of videos or articles that can teach you about this.

F2-F4 is pretty standard baritone vocal range, with head voice. Head voice does not start out as falsetto, falsetto is a completely different vocal mechanism.

Anyways, Regardless of range expansion techniques, you're not going to sound like Myles Kennedy. His vocal timbre is completely different than that of a baritone, and it won't match up. Just work with what you've been given...as a leggiero tenor, I'd kill to be a baritone a lot of the time, there is SO much music that we just can't sing.

What will42 says is correct, on all accounts.
Tyson2011
Registered User
Join date: Sep 2010
212 IQ
#6
Quote by Doveri
well if you have proper cord closure then you can obviously tune your tone/resonance to sound like different singers.

and for expanding your range, of course you can expand it. It's very complex thing to train that takes a long time, but my best simple advice, would be to sing with a bunny/nerdy/nosey voice whenever you sing anything.

Tyson2011, hah maybe it would be nice to be a baritone, but not if you have a low ass texture. I'm a baritone but I only had 1 octave of chest and the rest falsetto to begin with. took a long time to work closure through the whole range and tune my resonance.



its just a matter of getting over the passagio

Of course you "can" change your voice, musical theater people do it all the time. But for the best possible tone, he should focus on making his voice sound good, not trying to sound like a second rate version of someone else (I struggled with this for a LONG time, I started out in an 80's cover band and was constantly trying to match singers..it wasn't until starting training as an opera singer that I got over it)
BSaxby
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
43 IQ
#7
My 2 cents : try to consider your voice as ONE voice from lows to highs, and not focusing too much on the higher notes. Working on your low register is also helpfull to develop your range.
Then you have to find out about mixed voice (Thyroid Tilt), it will allow you to access your "head voice" without flipping into falsetto.
BloodReverence
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2008
917 IQ
#8
F2-F4 is pretty standard baritone vocal range, with head voice

Sorry but, to my experience, that's all chest voice for a baritone. Now that I can get into my head voice, I can hit well into the octave above the F4 before using falsetto in the 5-6'th octave.

My voice used to have a G2-G4 range, which is pretty much the same baritone range, and now I have the ability to go from G2 to notes in the 6'th octave. It's all about training your voice, finding your head voice, and practicing to not strain.
jacobmusicboy
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
125 IQ
#9
Quote by BloodReverence
F2-F4 is pretty standard baritone vocal range, with head voice

Sorry but, to my experience, that's all chest voice for a baritone. Now that I can get into my head voice, I can hit well into the octave above the F4 before using falsetto in the 5-6'th octave.

My voice used to have a G2-G4 range, which is pretty much the same baritone range, and now I have the ability to go from G2 to notes in the 6'th octave. It's all about training your voice, finding your head voice, and practicing to not strain.



that sounds interesting. Does that mean you are a baritone who can sing tenor also . Is your head voice powerful like the chest voice. Can you explain a bit more about your vocals and the techniques you use?
jacobmusicboy
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
125 IQ
#10
Thank you all for your replies. This is a question that almost all the male singers have. So keep on posting , it will help other struggling baritones like me. haha .
BloodReverence
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2008
917 IQ
#11
Basically, there's a point in your voice where it kind of "shifts gears". You have your lower chest voice and your higher head voice, but it's finding the way to connect them and mix them (mix voice) where you get your full voice out of.

I can't accurately describe how it feels other than, lower notes are felt in the chest resonating where high notes only resonate in your head.

Yes, the high notes are powerful like chest voice. Tenor's just have an easier time singing it. It's basically the difference between Russel Allen (Symphony X, extremely well-trained baritone) hitting his high notes vs Scott Barnes (In Fear and Faith, natural tenor with an average tenor range).
jacobmusicboy
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
125 IQ
#12
Quote by BloodReverence
Basically, there's a point in your voice where it kind of "shifts gears". You have your lower chest voice and your higher head voice, but it's finding the way to connect them and mix them (mix voice) where you get your full voice out of.

I can't accurately describe how it feels other than, lower notes are felt in the chest resonating where high notes only resonate in your head.

Yes, the high notes are powerful like chest voice. Tenor's just have an easier time singing it. It's basically the difference between Russel Allen (Symphony X, extremely well-trained baritone) hitting his high notes vs Scott Barnes (In Fear and Faith, natural tenor with an average tenor range).


thanks mate

i recently discovered my head voice but it has a lot of treble in it. I can hit notes like b4 n c4 using head voice but i cant sing using it . The break happens at g4 ,at that moment im like 'should i switch to head or chest'. What im saying is my head voice has an ugly tone and its easily distinguishable when i shift from chest to head. Is their a way i can make them sound more chesty.

What do you think about belting. ?is it a good technique?

If i can hit those notes using my upper register then i can sing in it i guess . I think you can help me out with this.
BloodReverence
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2008
917 IQ
#13
Any note you can hit in "falsetto" you can hit in a full voice, remember that. It'll take time and effort, but it is possible.

I'm not going to say that you should or shouldn't belt notes, just due to the fact that, without proper technique, belting can hurt. A lot.

My head voice was similar, one exercise you can do to help strengthen it is to start on a falsetto note and slowly transition it into your full voice. Mess around with your falsetto until you can get rid of the breathiness and put some body behind it.
Sethis
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2011
171 IQ
#14
^Everything he said. Plus my favourite exercise is octave slides, very light at first. They really helped me but you gotta do LOTS of them. So don't get discouraged cause it may take from several months to a few years.
BSaxby
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
43 IQ
#15
"chest" and "head" are only resonance places. It's different from "full voice" and "falsetto" which are 2 different mechanisms.
To extend your range, you have to find out about "mixed voice" and "thyroid tilt". There are good explanations on the internet and youtube.
Doveri
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2012
32 IQ
#16
Quote by BSaxby
"chest" and "head" are only resonance places. It's different from "full voice" and "falsetto" which are 2 different mechanisms.
To extend your range, you have to find out about "mixed voice" and "thyroid tilt". There are good explanations on the internet and youtube.


though it's important to note, a singer should always sing with their resonances and not get the idea that a full voice is supposed to be 'strong'. If a singer's resonance is light, so is their full voice.
BSaxby
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
43 IQ
#17
The fact is that one should consider is vocal range as ONE voice, feeling the buzz in the soft palate - mask, without overthinking about bridging.
metalmetalhead
Panterica
Join date: May 2007
517 IQ
#18
Your speaking voice resonates properly. yet when you yell at someone across the room it becomes a strain. see for yourself.

Learn to use your speaking voice incorporate that and become relaxed controlling it.
BloodReverence
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2008
917 IQ
#19
Quote by metalmetalhead
Your speaking voice resonates properly. yet when you yell at someone across the room it becomes a strain. see for yourself.

Learn to use your speaking voice incorporate that and become relaxed controlling it.


I dunno about you but I'm the opposite. I've blown my voice out more from talking than yelling, when i yell i end up using the same technique i use for screaming, diaphragm support, and it doesn't strain.
BSaxby
Registered User
Join date: Apr 2013
43 IQ
#20
for me too, speaking voice and singing are two different things
metalmetalhead
Panterica
Join date: May 2007
517 IQ
#21
BloodReverence I dunno about you but I'm the opposite. I've blown my voice out more from talking than yelling, when i yell i end up using the same technique i use for screaming, diaphragm support, and it doesn't strain.
.

I don't know either. Iv been speaking since I was 3, I couldn't imagine doing it incorrectly. Much less blowing out my voice by talking. Maybe If you alter your speaking voice But that wouldn't be your natural speaking voice. and it would not be resonating correctly.

besides If your a screamer and you practice for a hour and hurt your voice knowing it or not knowing it..talking afterwards the rest of the day isn't going to make it any better...You follow? smoking while talking or singing is bad too. speaking out of your range wouldn't be good either.

everyones different. using my speaking voice greatly helped me stay relaxed. It also will help you get an idea of how your natural voice should sound like. at least whatever is left of it. Not directed to anyone. But if you damage your voice it will change the sound and tone of your voice.

BSaxby for me too, speaking voice and singing are two different things


But Are they really 2 different things?
Sethis
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2011
171 IQ
#22
Quote by metalmetalhead

But Are they really 2 different things?


Yes. Not in the sense that the sound is produced somewhere else, it's still your cords. But a few things change like pronunciation, tone, vocal placement, vowels etc. We don't generally sing the same way we talk.
Blind In 1 Ear
Git-Man
Join date: Jun 2006
2,967 IQ
#24
Quote by jacobmusicboy
Im a 19 year old singer im a baritone. my voice sounds somewhat like jeremy camp . f2 is the end of my low end and f4 the high end. i can hit an a4 using my head voice but it sounds trebly and really ugly . i really want to sing like myles kennedy and chris daughtry . i believe its all about the technique . and im sure the right technique doesnt involve strain .


what is that right technique? I read that myles kennedy uses bel canto technique and anotherthing i speak in a low tone does that affect my range? are high pitched notes supposed to sound loud while singing? i have dark deep voice and i love singing with a scratch in my voice i play guitar i write songs AND HIGH PITCHED parts of the song are the peaks

i really want to nail those notes . people like scott stapp and the skillet singer and james hetfield are baritones i believe but they also hit high notes in their songs how do they do it ? thats a lotta questions . i know .coz im serious about music and about improving . anyone with right knowledge kindly help me out

learn a technique called vocal fry. use it as an exercise to learn how to shed weight from the voice, sing with more ease, place your voice better, and increase your range. i'm a baritone as well who can go down to about a Db2 with a full tone. but with this technique i can get up to an A4 pretty comfortable now. i can get up to a B4 as well but not as comfortable and full as the A4 yet. and when i was practicing more when i wasn't working as much, i was getting up to tenor C and up. granted they sounded more "rock-like" as vocal fry will distort your voice. think axl rose for a more exaggerated version of vocal fry. you don't need to sound that way though. the key is to work on it and try to find the sweet spot where you are the edge of fry and true voice and to shed weight from your lower notes.

i find one thing that helps too is to not fill out your lower notes too much. try to keep your voice tonally consistent throughout your range. most tenors have thinner sounding voices so don't be afraid to sound a little "sissy" at first. you'll get used to it and the notes will sound better with time. also, when hitting higher notes, think less air not more. most people hear a high note coming, they take a big breath and belt it out. that can work sometimes, but doing with ease and control would be better right? vocal fry will teach you to use less air anyway. it's also a lot to do with mentality. if you hesitate the note will usually not sound that great. singing is about confidence and building that requires practice so sing often.

hope that helps a bit. but don't be down on a low voice. focus on emoting a song, bringing out something unique in your voice, make the best of the range you have, and remember most tenors wish they could sing rich, full, low notes like baritones and basses. also, girls dig manly voices :P
metalmetalhead
Panterica
Join date: May 2007
517 IQ
#25
Quote by Sethis
Yes. Not in the sense that the sound is produced somewhere else, it's still your cords. But a few things change like pronunciation, tone, vocal placement, vowels etc. We don't generally sing the same way we talk.


Maybe If you try singing higher or out of your range. Then you see all your vocal flaws. And you have vocal strain. but in the same notes, your speaking voice may lack support and seem weak but is it relaxed? Thats what your looking for.
BloodReverence
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2008
917 IQ
#26
Quote by metalmetalhead
Maybe If you try singing higher or out of your range. Then you see all your vocal flaws. And you have vocal strain. but in the same notes, your speaking voice may lack support and seem weak but is it relaxed? Thats what your looking for.


But for a baritone to sing in his speaking range is not largely useful. The notes are much lower than 90% of music that is popular or being played.

Also, your voice is perfect as a baby but as you grow older it becomes flawed, which is why many people need to LEARN how to sing. The speaking voice is often the most flawed for most people and, if I were to try and sing in my higher range with the same voice as my speaking, it'd crack up and I'd be back to square one.

There needs to be diaphragm support and a small about of tension squeezing the chords together as you go up in your range, which won't happen with your speaking voice.

NOTE: Tension =/= strain

Tension is the small amount of squeeze that's necessary to keep your vocal chords zipped together, where strain is your body's reaction to improper singing. Strain will make your cheeks, jaw and throat start to lock up.


Also, not sure if you were making a jab at screaming or not, but screaming properly does not hurt your chords. Often times I sing my best after warming up with screaming as it exercises the diaphragm and helps you regulate air-flow while keeping your throat relaxed.

Also, often times the sound of a person's singing voice will be different due to the added resonance that one creates while singing. My speaking voice is more low and vocal-fry'ish where as my singing voice is much more open, rounded and higher in tone. Why? Because my singing resonates in a different place than my singing.
metalmetalhead
Panterica
Join date: May 2007
517 IQ
#27
Quote by BloodReverence
.


I'm not saying you can learn to sing by just speaking. I'm saying Someones natural speaking voice resonates more freely in the sinus and head cavities. And thats where you see your true voice. Your still thinking your voice is separated into parts vocal fry, chest voice, head voice, middle voice, and false voice. I wont say this is wrong but its not how I look at it.

How about just 1 Call it Your Modal range. False voice and vocal fry not included.

Learning to sing is a long process. Theres alot involved and it takes along time. Even speakers need vocal lessons. I'm not saying you can just learn to sing by talking. Heres what I'm getting at. pay attention to your friends chatter and laugh and joke..Alot of times you will here people talking and laughing these really high notes. in there natural voice. And they don't sing.

Air support comes natural If your jaw or neck and face is relaxed. And air is allowed to move freely. Did you know There are 4 different types of abdominal breathing? I Hardly pay any attention to my diaphragm anymore. Its mostly inhale.

Now you gotta realize we are only trained to do short breaths while speaking. so your speaking voice will lack support. But its a good place to start if you want to find your true natural voice.

Your range is determined by your speaking voice. Its not so much the notes you hit as it is the sound of your voice hitting the notes. Notice how theres so much depth in an opera singers voice? resonating the voice and allowing it to be free will greatly help you in your higher notes.

What helps me Is ill play a song I made up speak it very short phrases, not holding no long notes. But also relaxed tongue and not pronouncing the words quite well. I try to imagine breathing in and up into my head and nose area.

I'm not making no jabs, I scream some but Nothing serious. I'm more into Gnr, disturbed, alice in chains. and stuff. But I don't have a heavy metal voice.
shanchu
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2007
851 IQ
#28
Look up Robert lunte, James lugo, Jaime vendera or Ken tamplin. Those guys have exercises for expanding the range. It's perfectly doable for a baritone to sing high tenor notes.