#1
Hey all,

I was reading an article the other day about soloing, and the progression it was talking about in particular was a progression that went I-bVII-V in the key of C. I guess it's not technically actually in the key of C, because it has the flattened 7th, but for all intents and purposes C is the tonal center of the progression, right? With that in mind, using C mixolydian over the progression makes sense since it has a b7.

What I'm wondering is, would it make sense to make other progressions this way for a certain feel? As in playing in a certain key, but choosing a different note to act as the "root" for the progression (so in this case the key is Bb, but C is used as the root for the progression). Let's say I want more of a minor feel, could I choose D as the "tonal center" and then also utilize the bIII like the bVII was used in the example above?

Or maybe I'm just over complicating this...
#2
it's in the key of C

it's not in the scale of C

you're not playing a mode, you're just changing a note, aka an accidental. this could be done a million ways for a million purposes.

it's not as easy as 'choosing' the tonal center, or "changing the root". if the key is Bb, the root of the progression is Bb. it's not as easy as changing the scale you're using.

you're definitely making life harder on yourself, but just in the sense that nobody's told you that you really don't need to worry about your scale or mode or whatever very much in music. accidentals happen all the time in music for certain "feels" and it's easiest to work it out by ear because a lot of your tone will come from accentuation, dynamics, rhythm, tempo - all things irrelevant to your note choice.

griff if you mention modes of limited transposition i'm gonna hurt you
modes are a social construct
#4
I want to point out that you ALSO have a natural 7 in that progression (the third of you V chord).

If it resolves to C major it's in the key of C, regardless of what notes it has.

The way you solo over something which is non-diatonic is to be aware of your chord tones, and selectively avoid notes that will cause problems. So, you example, on the C you could use a B or a Bb - they both work, but will give you a very different feeling. over the Bb, obviously, you won't use a B. And over the G you won't use a Bb.

This requires that you have an awareness of your scales beyond just a box shape of interchangeable notes. It also requires that you know the sound of each note. But if you just used Mixolydian without thinking, you could get into trouble by playing that Bb over the G chord.
#5
Quote by sarcoplasm
Hey all,

I was reading an article the other day about soloing, and the progression it was talking about in particular was a progression that went I-bVII-V in the key of C. I guess it's not technically actually in the key of C, because it has the flattened 7th, but for all intents and purposes C is the tonal center of the progression, right? With that in mind, using C mixolydian over the progression makes sense since it has a b7.

What I'm wondering is, would it make sense to make other progressions this way for a certain feel? As in playing in a certain key, but choosing a different note to act as the "root" for the progression (so in this case the key is Bb, but C is used as the root for the progression). Let's say I want more of a minor feel, could I choose D as the "tonal center" and then also utilize the bIII like the bVII was used in the example above?

Or maybe I'm just over complicating this...



How is the Key Bb and at the same time the "root" of the scale C?

How do you make C sound like the root over a Bb tonality?

Best,

Sean
#6
Quote by Sean0913
How is the Key Bb and at the same time the "root" of the scale C?

How do you make C sound like the root over a Bb tonality?
Put a capo on the 6th fret and play "The Hendrix Chord".

Before you say anything, I'm just joking...

Besides, that would give you a C# anyways.
Last edited by Captaincranky at Jun 17, 2013,
#7
Quote by sarcoplasm
Hey all,

I was reading an article the other day about soloing, and the progression it was talking about in particular was a progression that went I-bVII-V in the key of C. I guess it's not technically actually in the key of C, because it has the flattened 7th, but for all intents and purposes C is the tonal center of the progression, right? With that in mind, using C mixolydian over the progression makes sense since it has a b7.

What I'm wondering is, would it make sense to make other progressions this way for a certain feel? As in playing in a certain key, but choosing a different note to act as the "root" for the progression (so in this case the key is Bb, but C is used as the root for the progression). Let's say I want more of a minor feel, could I choose D as the "tonal center" and then also utilize the bIII like the bVII was used in the example above?

Or maybe I'm just over complicating this...


You can. Yes.

For example if you were to use Dm F G and C in such a way as to make Dm the tonal centre then D Dorian would work in that situation.
Si
#8
Quote by Hail


griff if you mention modes of limited transposition i'm gonna hurt you


Don't worry I'm not going to mention modes of limited transposition, TS isn't ready for them yet.
#9
So basically a bVII appears. A bVII has all of its notes in common with the key except one, the b7. So you decide to play a b7 over that chord. You also know that playing a maj 7 over that chord would sound like crap because you listened to it and said yuk.

Why did you play the bVII in the first place? Because you tried it randomly and liked the sound.

And that's all there is to that little story. You don't need any further explanation going back to Greece.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#10
Fun modes fact: The western Church modes don't reflect the Greek modal system. The names probably came about as a result of a translation error.
.