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#1
Hello,
I'm in the market for a new amp - budget being around 1000 dollars or so.
I was looking at a deal for a used JCM900 with a 1960b cab for about 900 dollars (both seem to be in good shape).
I plan to use them with (if I decide to buy it) an Eclipse 1 CTM Esp, which I thing has 81/60 emgs, and the guy I'm buying it from also mentioned something about floydrose (please clarify someone).
I like playing Metal, more specificly Metallica, A7X, SOAD and so on. I use a DS-1 Distortion pedal from Boss, and a Crybaby GCB-985 Wahwah pedal.

Thoughts on used amps?
Thoughs on this particular amp? Anything better out there for the money?

Thanks in advanced \m/
#2
To my understanding the 900 is sort of a one trick pony depending on which one you get, I believe there's two different types of 900s. There are probably better choices considering the one trick the 900 can do isn't really metallica-esque stuff. I know theres the dsl401 which is a popular choice, theres also the jcm2000. If it were me I'd keep saving a bit longer and get the 800. There are a lot of guys on here that know more about Marshall than myself...they'll be in shortly.
Fender Strat Deluxe
Fender MexiStrat
Epiphone Sheritan
Ibanez Artcore
Fender Twin Reverb silverface
Roland JC120
Pedals

Quote by CaptainAmerican
I would recommend the marshal MG100

Very versatile and quality sound. It should treat you well
#4
Quote by gerraguitar
There are a lot of guys on here that know more about Marshall than myself...they'll be in shortly.


we aren't really into obscure boutique brands. TS should get a 6505
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#5
I never really understood what amps are supposed to do; aren't their main feature just to be a speaker anyway? Since you can modify the signal using different pickups and pedals anyway, wouldn't a good quality speaker (like a Marshall) do the trick? Why does good distortion/effects need to be part of the amp?
I'm genuinly curious, because I really don't get it.. :/

#Matt
I asked the seller for more specifics on the JCM head amp, I expect an answer tommorrow
#6
there is practically nothing that a speaker has in it that changes the sound of your tone in that respect. speakers will add things at an equalization level, more low end or more mids for example, but the distortion sound is a part of the amp. in the case of a tube amp its when the tubes start to get pushed harder by turning up the volume and they start to do whats called "breakup". Pedals are made to emulate the sound of a tube breaking up, but the original sound will always start with the amp. Certain amps have more gain to them than others too. There's much more to discuss about the topic at hand, this is just a very surface part of it.
Fender Strat Deluxe
Fender MexiStrat
Epiphone Sheritan
Ibanez Artcore
Fender Twin Reverb silverface
Roland JC120
Pedals

Quote by CaptainAmerican
I would recommend the marshal MG100

Very versatile and quality sound. It should treat you well
#7
Quote by Foldageren
I never really understood what amps are supposed to do; aren't their main feature just to be a speaker anyway? Since you can modify the signal using different pickups and pedals anyway, wouldn't a good quality speaker (like a Marshall) do the trick? Why does good distortion/effects need to be part of the amp?
I'm genuinly curious, because I really don't get it.. :/

#Matt
I asked the seller for more specifics on the JCM head amp, I expect an answer tommorrow

marshall do not make speakers, let alone high quality ones. and yes, you can modify the signal with pickups and effects, but then all that is shaped by the amp, which is the overall factor of your tone. if you have a shitty amp, you'll have shitty tone, regardless of your guitar, pedals, pickups, and speaker(s). remember - any amp can make your guitar loud, but that doesn't necessarily mean it'll sound good.
#9
Quote by Foldageren
I never really understood what amps are supposed to do; (A)aren't their main feature just to be a speaker anyway? (B)Since you can modify the signal using different pickups and pedals anyway, wouldn't a good quality speaker (like a Marshall) do the trick? (C) Why does good distortion/effects need to be part of the amp?
I'm genuinly curious, because I really don't get it.. :/


this is kinda a thread hijack, but anyway...

A - an amplifier takes a small electric signal and makes it into a big electric signal (i think it usually increases the voltage of the signal, but i am no amp doctor). a speaker converts an electric signal to an acoustic signal (a type of transducer). two very different things, but one really does not effectively work without the other.

B - marshall doesn't make speakers, but they do usually use celestion speakers. the signal still needs to be amplified before being sent to a speaker or the speaker output would pretty much be inaudible.

C - it doesn't. most of my amps don't really have 'distortion' the way we think of it in contemporary times.

let's also clear this up. a 'perfect' or 'ideal' amp would strictly reproduced an amplified signal of the guitar without any distortion or coloration. the guitar community has pretty much unanimously agreed that ideal amps (there is no such thing btw) don't sound good so guitar amp design is all about designers 'coloring' the guitar tone in their own unique ways.

also, distortion style pedals generally just try to reproduce how amps sound when they distort so question C is kinda backwards.

edit: i don't know if this has been said, but TS needs a 6505.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
Last edited by gumbilicious at Jun 20, 2013,
#10
Thanks Naked, that cleared up a few things!

I don't mind gumb, it was helpful! What you said about ideal amps is how I pictured it in my head, but you seem to be saying, that you need an amp to get a good sound out of a guitar! Thanks for clarifying! Is this not how amp heads work essentially? Say you have a marshall speaker cabinet, and you run a head-amp, doesn't the head amp more or less function like a pedal, and the speaker cabinet, well, like a speaker?
#11
The head determines what effects and tones you get while the cabinet is essentially just a speaker. So if you want to sound like Metallica or A7x just find out what heads they use and what sounds closest to those heads if you can't afford them. But if you buy a head you need to get a cab if you dont already have one because heads don't function as speakers.
#12
There are three types of JCM900, the mark 3, the Dual Reverb and the SL/X. All three are quite different to each other. There will be a model number written on the front of the amp on the right. It's in quite a small font. If you tell me what that model number is I can tell you pretty much anything you need to know about it, even how to modify it to get the most out of it.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#13
Quote by Foldageren
Is this not how amp heads work essentially? Say you have a marshall speaker cabinet, and you run a head-amp, doesn't the head amp more or less function like a pedal, and the speaker cabinet, well, like a speaker?


i guess that is one way of thinking about it, but that is kinda like saying 'doesn't a computer act like a smart phone?'

amps were around before pedals. an amp's main job is to amplify the signal (make it bigger), all the knobs and tone effecting attributes are mainly side effects of the problems inherent to amplifying a signal.

a pedal's main job is to process the signal in some way, as mentioned before most distortion style pedals try to reproduce what guitar amp's sound like.

but i will concede, you can think of an amp as 'functioning more or less like a pedal' that has a power amplifier attached to it.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#14
The way i look at is this. The amp should produce a base tone that is close to what you need all by itself - pedals are just fine tuning. If you can't play a gig with just the amp and guitar, you bought the wrong amp.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#15
Alright, this helped clear up a few things, thanks guys!
Back to the matter at hand though; I was looking at other used Marshall's, and came across these:
Marshall JCM 2000 TSL 60 and 2x JCM 900 Lead (cab) - 1300 dollars
Marshall JCM 2000 TSL 60 - 800 dollars
Marshall JCM 800 2203 - 1100 dollars

Since the first deal inclues the 2 cabinets (which I do beleive are around 400 each?), it seems like a pretty good deal, but I'd like a comparrison of:
JCM 2000 TSL 60 vs JCM 800 vs. JCM 900

Also, am I limiting myself too much by mainly looking at Marshalls?
#16
I've already told you, there are three different types of JCM900. Without knowing which one it is it's all just pissing in the wind.
However, the 2203 is the best amp you've listed, even without knowing which JCM900 it is.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#17
Sorry cathbard, I was sure I wrote this, my bad, turns out I wrote it to matt earlier!
I contacted the seller, asking which JCM900 it is, I'm awaiting his answer (fairly sure it will be here by tommorrow).
Also, while it may be the best, it is also the most expensive - is it worth the extra cash, considering the alternatives (is the the most bang for the buck)?
#18
Depends on which one it is. Let's wait until we have the info, huh?
The 2203 is one of the most sought after Marshalls ever made. They are always pricey.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#20
I don't like TSL's. They don't really sound like a proper Marshall. It was their attempt to move in on the Mesa market - they failed.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#21
I found another one on the used market for about the same price, which included the specs:
JCM 900 100W Hi Gain Dual Reverb Model 4100
Any good?
#22
They are the worst of the JCM900's. It's what I have. They can be turned into a good amp with some mods to the circuit board but otherwise they are pretty ordinary. People that know Marshalls hear my modded 900 and always ask why it sounds so much better than all the others they've heard.

The Dual Reverb has two channels. A "clean" channel and a lead channel. The lead channel is a fuzzy mess without mods. The clean channel isn't too bad unmodded. Let me try to explain it in terms you may understand.
Channel 1 is a JCM800 with a tubescreamer in front of it.
Channel 2 is a JCM800 with a fuzz box in front of it.

The SL/X is the good 900. It only has one channel with two master volumes - but what a channel. It's basically an 800 with an extra tube up front to boost it into heavier distortion and an extra master volume.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#23
For my setup, the most spent money is for the effect because it's the center piece of electric guitar playing, IMO. When a guitar is played through the effect, the guitar becomes transparent.
The amp is a 50Wx4 car stereo for 200W total power. The car stereo needed some clean 12 Volts so I used a power supply from a discarded desktop computer.
The guitar is plugged into the effect's guitar input. The effect's headphone out connects to the Auxiliary input of the car stereo.
My speakers are two 2-way Roadmaster boomboxes connected to the car stereo's front and rear outputs. But they don't sell it anymore. It was $20 each. Other branded boomboxes should be OK since guitar's frequency range is not anything extreme.
Roadmaster boombox

The cost:
$50-$100 Car stereo
$50-$100 Boomboxes
$20 Power supply
If your budget is $1,000, you still have $780 to buy any effect such as the $300 Boss ME-70. The car stereo setup is better than a standalone amp/speaker cabinet because it got remote control. When I'm bored with playing guitar, I can play CD, iPod, ... on it.
I started with the Line 6 Pod 2.0 effect, it was only $70 at Best Buy in the last month. I also bought a few more effects since the prices were too good.
Last edited by OneLP at Jun 20, 2013,
#24
The power listed on car stereo amps is normally a complete fantasy. I've repaired plenty where I've looked at the transistors being used and the voltage rails present and they were capable of producing a tenth of the rated power if they were lucky.
Car stereo amp indeed. Get out of my office.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#26
Well, to blow up the hearing, connect some outboard amp, $100.
Most amps/cabs made for guitars are way overpriced. I don't waste my money on them and recommend people not to. Even the tube amp is a myth. When people picking up new hobby in electric guitar, they don't care.
The skill is the most important. Owning $10,000 amp can never make you a better player.
Last edited by OneLP at Jun 20, 2013,
#27
There are two types. The single channel 2203/2204 and the dual channel 2205/2210.
The 2203/2204 is by far the best sounding of the two. In many people's minds (mine included) the 2203/2204 is the last real Marshall.
For a complete list of which model is which go here:
http://drtube.com/marshall.htm


Quote by OneLP
Well, to blow up the hearing, connect some outboard amp, $100.
Most amps/cabs made for guitars are way overpriced. I don't waste my money on them and recommend people not to. Even the tube amp is a myth. When people picking up new hobby in electric guitar, they don't care.
The skill is the most important. Owning $10,000 amp can never make you a better player.
Get out of my office or I'll call security.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
Last edited by Cathbard at Jun 20, 2013,
#28
Quote by OneLP
For my setup, the most spent money is for the effect because it's the center piece of electric guitar playing, IMO. When a guitar is played through the effect, the guitar becomes transparent.
The amp is a 50Wx4 car stereo for 200W total power. The car stereo needed some clean 12 Volts so I used a power supply from a discarded desktop computer.
The guitar is plugged into the effect's guitar input. The effect's headphone out connects to the Auxiliary input of the car stereo.
My speakers are two 2-way Roadmaster boomboxes connected to the car stereo's front and rear outputs. But they don't sell it anymore. It was $20 each. Other branded boomboxes should be OK since guitar's frequency range is not anything extreme.
Roadmaster boombox

The cost:
$50-$100 Car stereo
$50-$100 Boomboxes
$20 Power supply
If your budget is $1,000, you still have $780 to buy any effect such as the $300 Boss ME-70. The car stereo setup is better than a standalone amp/speaker cabinet because it got remote control. When I'm bored with playing guitar, I can play CD, iPod, ... on it.
I started with the Line 6 Pod 2.0 effect, it was only $70 at Best Buy in the last month. I also bought a few more effects since the prices were too good.


Quote by OneLP
Well, to blow up the hearing, connect some outboard amp, $100.
Most amps/cabs made for guitars are way overpriced. I don't waste my money on them and recommend people not to. Even the tube amp is a myth. When people picking up new hobby in electric guitar, they don't care.
The skill is the most important. Owning $10,000 amp can never make you a better player.


i'm surprised more pros haven't caught on to this.

wait, did you invent the AxeFx?
#29
Quote by Cathbard
There are two types. The single channel 2203/2204 and the dual channel 2205/2210.
The 2203/2204 is by far the best sounding of the two. In many people's minds (mine included) the 2203/2204 is the last real Marshall.
For a complete list of which model is which go here:
http://drtube.com/marshall.htm


Get out of my office or I'll call security.


LOL. Some Aussie can be so hostile in his down under office.
#30
You still here?
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#31
Quote by OneLP
Well, to blow up the hearing, connect some outboard amp, $100.
Most amps/cabs made for guitars are way overpriced. I don't waste my money on them and recommend people not to. Even the tube amp is a myth. When people picking up new hobby in electric guitar, they don't care.
The skill is the most important. Owning $10,000 amp can never make you a better player.

i agree with your point that skill is the most important. but i utterly disagree with everything else you've said in this thread. a ****ing car stereo and boomboxes? people won't have time to hear your skill because they'll be too busy running away from your horrid cluster**** you call your tone.
#32
Quote by gregs1020
i'm surprised more pros haven't caught on to this.

wait, did you invent the AxeFx?


Well, I'm no pro. If I am, I would not be confined playing in music in my living room making no money from music playing.
My only point is not to invest too much money when starting. When the skill can't be improved, the expensive equipment can cause sadness when looking at it.
#33
You're no pro? No shit? I would never have guessed.

Now run along and go outside and play ball with your friends. Grown ups are trying to talk.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#34
Quote by OneLP
Well, I'm no pro. If I am, I would not be confined playing in music in my living room making no money from music playing.
My only point is not to invest too much money when starting. When the skill can't be improved, the expensive equipment can cause sadness when looking at it.

the best way to start out is to buy decent second-hand gear. if you don't like it, you can sell it for about what you paid. buying new when you're starting out (providing you have the option of buying second-hand) would be considered foolish in my books.
#35
Quote by NakedInTheRain
i agree with your point that skill is the most important. but i utterly disagree with everything else you've said in this thread. a ****ing car stereo and boomboxes? people won't have time to hear your skill because they'll be too busy running away from your horrid cluster**** you call your tone.


I say that through the effect, most electric guitars sound the same. Prove to me that that's wrong.
#36
Quote by OneLP
I say that through the effect, most electric guitars sound the same. Prove to me that that's wrong.
You're making a fool of yourself. Kindly **** off.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#37
Quote by OneLP
I say that through the effect, most electric guitars sound the same. Prove to me that that's wrong.

so what you are saying is that the tone of a guitar is meaningless because you're going to ruin it by shoving it through cheap effects anyway?

i think i'm starting to get it.

tell us how this is good for a newbie again?
#39
Quote by gregs1020
so what you are saying is that the tone of a guitar is meaningless because you're going to ruin it by shoving it through cheap effects anyway?

i think i'm starting to get it.

tell us how this is good for a newbie again?


Sorry, I didn't make my point clear.
Take ten guitars, one effect, ten speakers. You have 100 combinations that sound the same. Any amp in between will just make them sound louder or softer.
Last edited by OneLP at Jun 20, 2013,
#40
You're an idiot.


TS: ignore this clown.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
Last edited by Cathbard at Jun 20, 2013,
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