griffRG7321
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#2
Only on a guitar forum would someone think a tetrachord is actually a chord.

TS, that tetrachord would be found in harmonic minor. It could also be part of some synthetic scale. Depends on the context.
rob904
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#3
it could also be found in an octatonic scale or the altered scale, it would depend on the harmony.
cdgraves
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#4
by tetrachord you mean half of a scale? If it's the first half, it's C minor #11 13 . If it's the second half of a scale, it's G harmonic minor.
Angusman60
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#5
I would say it's most likely the upper tetrachord of G harmonic minor.
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amonamarthmetal
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#6
Doesn't a tetra-chord only work for the major scale?
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ibanez1511
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#7
Thank you all for your responses.
At the moment I know the common names for a major tetrachord, a minor tetrachord. a phyrgian tetrachord a lydian tetrachord and a harmonic tetrachord. I am unable to find a widely recoginzed name for the bottom half of the double harmonic minor scale , or the hungarian minor scale as i believe it is also known by ?

so with a harmonic minor scale would describe the bottom half as a minor tetrachord and the top half as a harmonic tetrachord. with a whole tone gap between them.
But with the double harmonic minor the top half seems to stay harmonic but the bottom half , I have been unable to find a commonly used name.

Minor harmonic makes sense to me. But if anyone is aware of another more widely accepted name , i would welcome any help.
cdgraves
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#9
Tetrachords aren't really a functional category for analysis of anything. It literally just means 4 notes in a row. I would not waste time trying to identify, classify, or use them.
MattyBoy 1337
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#10
Holy cow. I do believe that I have never seen a more useless musical endeavor. You in no way need to name/classify/ or even identify any tetrachord ever. They're just parts of scales. Learn the scales and make actual music with them. What could possibly be the benefit of doing what you're doing?
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ibanez1511
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#11
I have been using them to understand finger patterns on the guitar. And also some of symmetry they produce.
I have pdf file of what i have been writing about 12 pages so far, which you are welcome to look at if you wish ?


Today I was thinking of joining them together with only a semitone distance between the two.

With two major tetrachords this gives us :

1,2,3,4b5,b6,b7,7 which is a pretty unusual scale it it's own right, but as i have started join other tetrachords in a similar fashion i have found cycles of notes that cover two octave, and can create very unusual music effects.
As I love the idea of a two major triads a tritone apart, and this seems like a natural progression of this.
Last edited by ibanez1511 at Jun 23, 2013,
cdgraves
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#12
"cycles of notes that cover two octaves" = arpeggios.

If you just sit down and learn your scales and chords your "tetrachord" stuff will make a lot more sense.
Last edited by cdgraves at Jun 23, 2013,
Angusman60
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#13
I see what you're going for Ibanez. However, tetrachords are most commonly used within the context of an already existing scale, not to create a new scale.
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amonamarthmetal
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#14
Quote by cdgraves
"cycles of notes that cover two octaves" = arpeggios.

Not really.
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#15
Quote by Angusman60
I see what you're going for Ibanez. However, tetrachords are most commonly used within the context of an already existing scale, not to create a new scale.


meh, at least he's not running up and down shapes and he's exploring his intervals a little bit. i won't say it's the best method, but at least he's showing some curiosity and having fun with it

but yeah cdg and angus are right
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cdgraves
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#16
Quote by amonamarthmetal
Not really.


Think about this for a second... it's not a scale if you skip the tonic every other octave. That's just putting notes in non-scalar order, hence, an arpeggio.
Angusman60
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#17
Well, yeah, but it doesn't HAVE to span two octaves. That's just common practice in piano technique.
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JbfMusic
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#18
You could call it a C diminished triad add 2- I can't say I've ever encountered this chord.

However, you can see it as a D7 flat 9 with no 5th. If you add in A the it's a Dom7 flat 9.

D7 Flat9 (no 5th)

--11-- Eb
-------
--11-- Gb(F#)
--10-- C
-------
--10-- D


D7 Flat9

--11-- Eb
--10-- A
--11-- Gb(F#)
--10-- C
-------
--10-- D

If you're looking for a musical use for it in relation to playing over a chord- which your post suggested- D7 flat9 should work pretty well. It's a fairly common jazz chord too

Pat Martino has got this whole thing about diving the guitar into 4 sets of flat 3rds (diminished arpeggio) or 3 sets of Major 3rds (Augmented arpeggio) to create the octave. It gets more complicated, because he also mutates these scales to get other chords, shapes, scales etc.

The basic principle (if I remember rightly) was to do with symmetry within the octave, this might be worth a look? Hes definitely got a few videos about it kicking about, I believe he called it 'Sacred Geometry'.
ibanez1511
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#19
Hi angus and Cdg, Thank you for the tips.
You are right that learning scales and chords is a good place to gain solid foundation.
And I am not sure of the traditional use of tetrachords.
Jb, It took me a while to realise you was responding to the initial post i made.

So C,D,Eb and F# would be b7,1,b9,3 I can understand this choice of intervals, especially when they are used on their own.

I have gone with naming the a
'minor harmonic tetrachord', as this best describes them as the lower half of the double harmonic minor scale.

if it is okay? for reference i would like to share a link to a png file of this tetrachord stacked in tritones !
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=407562089358695&set=a.148778368570403.31164.100003147228026&type=1&theater
One of books that has inspired me recently is called 'the rest is noise.' it talks about classical composers stacking block of notes or arpeggios in what i believe
to a similar way.
cdgraves
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#20
Tetrachords aren't really a thing you "use", traditionally. Your use of them is more of a serialist approach, which is novel and interesting, but is also very far removed from traditional harmony and melody. Taking a set of intervals and repeating them at various pitches is a common compositional technique in modern classical music.
xxdarrenxx
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#21
Band aiding a wound makes me more of a doctor, than merely learning the name of every disease.

Don't bother too much with names and memorising scales.

Maybe I'm wrong, but then show me how you use this in a simple musical example, preferable in harmonic context and sheet, but if you can't write sheet, do a tab or recording.

I'm always on look out fo new visions, so don't take this negatively cheers

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Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Jun 25, 2013,
ibanez1511
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#23
and darren, your point of view makes sense as well. I think Jdmusic ? gave a good example of using C,D,Eb and F# over a D7b9 chord.
With the png i posted a few messages before this one. I thought it would make an interesting middle 8 or a break in a piece of music. Perhaps originating in the key of F minor. Or as a crazy diminished type thing over an E dominant 7th .