#1
Hi guys , As the tittle states , I have been playing guitar for 2 years and never really liked picks . I've rarely been very comfortable with my picks . I dont really know how to hold it ( find what comfortable is a shit in my opinion because I think there's a best way and maybe slight adjustments on it . I put it on the side of my finger but I couldn't figure out whether the tip of the pick and the tip of index is %100 aligned or index is curled in a little more so tip of index is showing the edge of the pick . I found the latter more comfortable and hold it that way is it ok ? A little stupid question so I hope you got me .

I have tried many picks and one day I say that pick will be my lifetime pick( I feel very comfortable ) and tomorrow that pick feels like CRAP . You can imagine how frustrated I am in that situation . The main problem , If I really choke up on the pick I feel no resistance but have no control , unintentional pinch harmonics occur etc. If I choke up less I feel the strings pushing the pick back and forth or the pick pushing the string back and forth (Happened in EVERY pick I tried from .50 mm to 3mm) When playing this way , the pick pushes the side of the index too. I've tried to grip it loose and relaxed that worked a little but felt a little floppy because I couldnt track what I was playing . Although I've never been comfortable with my picks , thanks to my passion I've improved myself greatly(imo) .

So If you any advice , that will greatly be appreciated
#2
I don't think plectrum guitar exists long enough for us to know the best way to play it. Most players I see are doing something along these lines and it works fine for them:

For me it works better to shift the pick further proximal, above the joint of middle and distal phalanx of index finger. The pick's axis is completely orthogonal to the finger axis, rather than tilted towards the nail. Also I only letting a few millimeters of the tip show, rather than a considerable amount like in these pictures. That way I cover more surface and need less pressure and have more control.
Last edited by Facecut at Jul 28, 2013,
#3
Quote by Facecut
I don't think plectrum guitar exists long enough for us to know the best way to play it. Most players I see are doing something along these lines and it works fine for them:

For me it works better to shift the pick further proximal, above the joint of middle and distal phalanx of index finger. The pick's axis is completely orthogonal to the finger axis, rather than tilted towards the nail. Also I only letting a few millimeters of the tip show, rather than a considerable amount like in these pictures. That way I cover more surface and need less pressure and have more control.


Thanks for the detailed the reply man . Also you explained it in a little ''essay'' way I think I got you . Do you mean like this way ? ****************c25MCx
Last edited by belaliyaldo at Jul 28, 2013,
#4
The index finger looks like its curled with tension. Don't. You seem to be about to place the tip above your distal phalanx rather than the joint which is standard but not how I would do it. I slide it distal when doing fast downpickings though. Sorry for my english:-)
#5
Quote by belaliyaldo
Thanks for the detailed the reply man . Also you explained it in a little ''essay'' way I think I got you . Do you mean like this way ? ****************c25MCx


Troll elsewere.
baab
#6
Quote by My Last Words
Troll elsewere.


First of all , I'm serious with what I've asked . Secondly , this is not my photo I found this in another video and copied here to ask .
#7
Quote by belaliyaldo
Thanks for the detailed the reply man . Also you explained it in a little ''essay'' way I think I got you . Do you mean like this way ? ****************c25MCx


Hilarious.
#8
Quote by redd9
Hilarious.


I'm so glad it make you happy,smarty. It's from a video from youtube . I of course know it shouldn't be held that way . The instructor doesnt hold that way , either . He just show where to place the pick . Then he opens the finger . Please ignore that and answer this questiion :

I put it on the side of my finger but I couldn't figure out whether the tip of the pick and the tip of index is %100 aligned or index is curled in a little more so tip of index is showing the edge of the pick .
#9
Quote by belaliyaldo


I put it on the side of my finger but I couldn't figure out whether the tip of the pick and the tip of index is %100 aligned or index is curled in a little more so tip of index is showing the edge of the pick .


Can't you tell from the 5-step link Facecut posted?
baab
#10
Quote by My Last Words
Can't you tell from the 5-step link Facecut posted?


It's not the right way or the way that I like . The right way is Paul Gilbert's mechanics but I couldnt see in his video how his index looks like . Please man just concentrate on my questions and dont think I'm a troll , I swear I'm not trolling here .
#11
Quote by belaliyaldo
It's not the right way or the way that I like.
Did you give it a chance? Every new technique takes some getting used to. IMO, it seems highly unlikely that this method isn't working for you taken the fact that nearly every player holds the pick like that. Maybe you need to give it some time.
baab
#12
Quote by belaliyaldo
It's not the right way or the way that I like . The right way is Paul Gilbert's mechanics but I couldnt see in his video how his index looks like . Please man just concentrate on my questions and dont think I'm a troll , I swear I'm not trolling here .


Paul Gilbert holds it exactly like that when he alternate picks single notes.
#13
Quote by My Last Words
Did you give it a chance? Every new technique takes some getting used to. IMO, it seems highly unlikely that this method isn't working for you taken the fact that nearly every player holds the pick like that. Maybe you need to give it some time.


It's not completely different from my way . In the photos the index is curled way too much I think but still resembles to my grip . I also found thin picks (.73-.88) is better for me like PG . Dont know why
#14
Quote by belaliyaldo
It's not completely different from my way . In the photos the index is curled way too much I think but still resembles to my grip . I also found thin picks (.73-.88) is better for me like PG . Dont know why


I tend to hold my pick on the side of my very last knuckle of my index finger and I don't seem to have any problems at all. I use Jazz III's. All you need to do is find the right balance in holding it tight enough so it doesn't fall out but loose enough to minimise the string resistance, if you know what I'm saying.

I'd strongly recommend watching Guthrie Govans video on alternate picking:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlePTeNihp4

there are points in the video where he goes in-depth about pick choice and holding the pick and wrist placement and whatnot. Check it out!
baab
Last edited by My Last Words at Jul 29, 2013,
#15
Quote by My Last Words
I tend to hold my pick on the side of my very last knuckle of my index finger and I don't seem to have any problems at all. I use Jazz III's. All you need to do is find the right balance in holding it tight enough so it doesn't fall out but loose enough to minimise the string resistance, if you know what I'm saying.

I'd strongly recommend watching Guthrie Govans video on alternate picking:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlePTeNihp4

there are points in the video where he goes in-depth about pick choice and holding the pick and wrist placement and whatnot. Check it out!


Thanks for the great video . As you said , MINIMUM string resistance(In my terms , not feeling the string pushing back my finger ) is my aim . I one day I find that spot and after that day , under almost same conditions , it dissappears . It's what I dont understand
#16
Quote by belaliyaldo
Thanks for the great video . As you said , MINIMUM string resistance(In my terms , not feeling the string pushing back my finger ) is my aim . I one day I find that spot and after that day , under almost same conditions , it dissappears . It's what I dont understand


Everyone has bad days and good days. Persevere, and soon it will feel like 2nd nature.
baab
#17
Trust me I've had soo many bad days in this 2 years . Today looks like one of them
#18
The linkages between leads were once simple crossings of lines; one wire insulated from and "jumping over" another was indicated by it making a little semicircle over the other line.circuit diagram are pictures with symbols that have differed from country to country and have changed over time, but are now to a large extent internationally standardized. Simple components often had symbols intended to represent some feature of the physical construction of the device. For example, the symbol for a resistor shown here dates back to the days when that component was made from a long piece of wire wrapped in such a manner as to not produce inductance, which would have made it a coil. These wirewound resistors are now used only in high-power applications, smaller resistors being cast from carbon composition (a mixture of carbon and filler) or fabricated as an insulating tube or chip coated with a metal film. The internationally standardized symbol for a resistor is therefore now simplified to an oblong, sometimes with the value in ohms written inside, instead of the zig-zag symbol. A less common symbol is simply a series of peaks on one side of the line representing the conductor, rather than back-and-forth as shown here.
#19
^ Some people just don't have a clue about how internet forums work do they.

I wonder if he does that in real life, whenever someone is having a conversation about something he just wanders up and comes out with something completely random?
#20
Quote by Facecut
Paul Gilbert holds it exactly like that when he alternate picks single notes.


No man . In the link pick is on the knuckle . Gilbert puts on the side of his index but that's not the important part . What I've been overlooking is that I have to have a loose grip . As long as pick is gripped without pressing fingers on the pick very much(thumb and index) , pick choice seems to be a personal preference .
#21
I have found jazz IIIs to be the most comfortable and "natural" feeling pick. They cut through the strings easier. I think people underestimate the awkwardness of holding the pick in the beginning learning guitar. When I adopted a consistent method of holding it and keeping it that way, I felt more accustomed.

Are you using strict alternate picking for fast lines? I think that is probably one of the most difficult things to master and get comfortable. Some guitarists, and I was guilty of this, have a sloppy combo of economy/alternate picking starting out. I was very mindful to strict U-D it a la the Paul Gilbert exercises, inside and outside string picking, 1-2-3-4, and songs, and then it eventually became second nature and I felt like I had more control of the pick.
#22
Quote by sweetdude3000
I have found jazz IIIs to be the most comfortable and "natural" feeling pick. They cut through the strings easier. I think people underestimate the awkwardness of holding the pick in the beginning learning guitar. When I adopted a consistent method of holding it and keeping it that way, I felt more accustomed.

Are you using strict alternate picking for fast lines? I think that is probably one of the most difficult things to master and get comfortable. Some guitarists, and I was guilty of this, have a sloppy combo of economy/alternate picking starting out. I was very mindful to strict U-D it a la the Paul Gilbert exercises, inside and outside string picking, 1-2-3-4, and songs, and then it eventually became second nature and I felt like I had more control of the pick.


Since they're pretty small , they force you to hold it the right way . They're great picks for sure but I have a bad habit of choking up very much on my picks in order not to feel strings(I want the pick to feel almost same when I'm picking in free air and on the string) Combining this habit with small size , my thumb always htis the string, I produce unintentional pinch harmonics etc . Also , rhythm playing doesnt seem to be easy with them too
#23
Quote by belaliyaldo
Since they're pretty small , they force you to hold it the right way . They're great picks for sure but I have a bad habit of choking up very much on my picks in order not to feel strings(I want the pick to feel almost same when I'm picking in free air and on the string) Combining this habit with small size , my thumb always htis the string, I produce unintentional pinch harmonics etc . Also , rhythm playing doesnt seem to be easy with them too


Picking the strings feels awkward for sure, especially inside picking but you have to get used to that feeling and cut the bad habit out. It will feel uncomfortable at first, but you get used to it and you will realize you are happy for making the switch. Kill bad habits immediate. Maybe you should use a lighter gauge string or check out other guitars.

Once you get used to one pick, then you will get used to others (at least that's how it is for me). Actually check out the Jazz III XL if you are doing more strumming vs speed picking.
#24
Quote by sweetdude3000
Picking the strings feels awkward for sure, especially inside picking but you have to get used to that feeling and cut the bad habit out. It will feel uncomfortable at first, but you get used to it and you will realize you are happy for making the switch. Kill bad habits immediate. Maybe you should use a lighter gauge string or check out other guitars.

Once you get used to one pick, then you will get used to others (at least that's how it is for me). Actually check out the Jazz III XL if you are doing more strumming vs speed picking.


If it happens every time I play guitar then I will be convinced but it happens one day and fixed the day after and happens again etc . That's what I dont get . I'm overlooking a simple detail , one day without realizing it I do it right , the other I dont . I have to find that detail .
#25
Though plectrums can be useful, some people simply don't do well with them. Perhaps try a thumb pick?

Artists like O Paon, Dylan Carlson, Phil Elverum etc all play without picks and they play great stuff! And then you have fingerpickers like Tim Collis, Matthew McGee and Chris Arp. You don't necessarily need to use a pick to be a technical guitarist, or even a good songwriter!
Quote by EndTheRapture51
who pays five hundred fucking dollars for a burger
#26
Quote by Banjocal
Though plectrums can be useful, some people simply don't do well with them. Perhaps try a thumb pick?

Artists like O Paon, Dylan Carlson, Phil Elverum etc all play without picks and they play great stuff! And then you have fingerpickers like Tim Collis, Matthew McGee and Chris Arp. You don't necessarily need to use a pick to be a technical guitarist, or even a good songwriter!


The music I want to play (thrash metal , hard rock etc.) requires a pick . And if this problem dont be solved after I find a local teacher and studied with him , than I will start to piano
#27
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvP_Vx1qhwQ

in between weedily stuff, watch what he's doing with his fingers when he chugs. He's making a point with his index and thumb nail, and using that as a pick. More difficult, but perfectly possible.

However, get a teacher (a well reputed one, not someone advertising in a shop window), and if that fails, try a thumbpick. If that fails, I'd recommend you learn different ways of getting a heavy sound with what you have. Don't treat it as defeat; treat it as a chance to develop your own style. Takes time, but it's possible, and rewarding.
Quote by EndTheRapture51
who pays five hundred fucking dollars for a burger
#28
Quote by sweetdude3000
Picking the strings feels awkward for sure, especially inside picking but you have to get used to that feeling and cut the bad habit out. It will feel uncomfortable at first, but you get used to it and you will realize you are happy for making the switch. Kill bad habits immediate. Maybe you should use a lighter gauge string or check out other guitars.

Once you get used to one pick, then you will get used to others (at least that's how it is for me). Actually check out the Jazz III XL if you are doing more strumming vs speed picking.


Also when I'm on my good day ( 7 days in a row usually in a month ) I can pretty much play anything I know,perfectly and very comfortably . On my bad days I sound like crap both tonewise and notewise . To give an example I sound like Kirk Hammett in 1989 in my good days , Kirk Hammett in nowadays on my bad days
#29
Quote by Banjocal
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvP_Vx1qhwQ

in between weedily stuff, watch what he's doing with his fingers when he chugs. He's making a point with his index and thumb nail, and using that as a pick. More difficult, but perfectly possible.

However, get a teacher (a well reputed one, not someone advertising in a shop window), and if that fails, try a thumbpick. If that fails, I'd recommend you learn different ways of getting a heavy sound with what you have. Don't treat it as defeat; treat it as a chance to develop your own style. Takes time, but it's possible, and rewarding.


Thanks for the encouraging comment but I have overcame so much obstacles in my guitar adventure and I now feel as a tired warrior (gave a 1.5 year break and started all over again ) What frustrates me is : After overcoming so many obstacles , reaching my %90 dreams and finally see the light at the end of the tunnel , this little s^+% problem takes all my motivation . I'm a VEEERY detailed minded type of person(and hate that trait) and the problem is causes by it , I cant easily say to myself ''Nevermind , it will feel good after some time. ''
#31
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
Play more guitar.


without knowing the correct motions and feeling pressure on my finger nail ?
#32
I think you're over analyzing this. While there may be a "correct" way, being comfortable and sounding good are the important things. It simply will not click instantly. It takes time.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#33
Quote by BladeSlinger
I think you're over analyzing this. While there may be a "correct" way, being comfortable and sounding good are the important things. It simply will not click instantly. It takes time.


I'm OVER³ analyzing it ( that's my nature in every area ) . However , what dont kill me , makes me more strong
#34
Quote by belaliyaldo
I'm OVER³ analyzing it ( that's my nature in every area ) . However , what dont kill me , makes me more strong

Or you could spend so much time finding a "correct" way that you adopt an uncomfortable method that detracts from your playing.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#35
Quote by BladeSlinger
Or you could spend so much time finding a "correct" way that you adopt an uncomfortable method that detracts from your playing.


That's exactly what happened to me . Although the method itself ''seems'' true , it sometimes feel great and sometimes awkard (%80 time awkard)
#36
Quote by Facecut
I don't think plectrum guitar exists long enough for us to know the best way to play it. Most players I see are doing something along these lines and it works fine for them:

For me it works better to shift the pick further proximal, above the joint of middle and distal phalanx of index finger. The pick's axis is completely orthogonal to the finger axis, rather than tilted towards the nail. Also I only letting a few millimeters of the tip show, rather than a considerable amount like in these pictures. That way I cover more surface and need less pressure and have more control.


Was this meant to be serious?

If so, congrats, you passed a first year physiology course. For those of us that haven't, care to use everyday language?
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Last edited by Shadowofravenwo at Jul 30, 2013,
#37
I don´t know every casual english word when it comes to these details. Nobody answered so I did, but I don´t want to look up every single word.
#38
I made some small adjustments -and I'm aware this time - . Before,the pick was pushing way too hard on my index finger when doing upstrokes and was squishing the finger nail . Now I put it some place between the finger print and side of index . It felt a little natural for me and helped me a bit about not feel the string resistance .