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#1
when you realize that there is no audience for your music? do you sell out and write bullshit to get paid or do you give up on music completely and move on to a more stable and secure financial plan?

i feel like im getting to the point where getting good at guitar for the sake of getting good isnt working. its not getting me anywhere, nor does anyone care, ie my girlfriend or familly or non musician friends. my personal music is completely bizarre and has no target audience because it was made for me and im different than people.

if you were the only person on the planet, would you make music even if nobody could hear it? i wouldnt, it would be sad. kinda like right now, sad.
#2
I wouldn't really care cos I don't make music.

I'd also stop smoking so much weed.


But actually I had the thing where I stopped caring about practicing guitar for the sake of being good at it too. I just play occasionally for fun now.
Last edited by captainsnazz at Aug 1, 2013,
#4
Quote by CodeMonk
I make music cause I enjoy making music.
If others like it fine.
If they don't fuck'erm


This, pretty much.

I WILL NEVER SELL OUT AND I WILL NEVER STOP.
This I vow.
I have nothing important to say
#5
I hate the term "sellout." Because to me, it just refers to someone who's down-to-earth and realistic. It's arrogant to think that your preferred playing style will confer some magical experience upon the listener. If you aren't moved by your own music, you're doing it wrong. That's where your motivation should lie. Who care what music you put out into the world? If people identify with it and it doesn't cause harm, more power to it. Sell whatever music people will like. You can still play what you want to.
#6
Well, let me explain. My music is amazing to me. Its the most amazing thing ever every time i hear it. It occupies my brain, sends me into a trance that tames my never ending ideas and sends them in a fashionable line down a rainbow of happiness. I make music completely different than what i listen to. Making music has always been for me, but eventually knowing nobody relates to you is saddening. Every time i make a song i remember nobody will like it and nobody relates to me or understands me. Itl never blow up, and il never make money off it.
the only other option is to write music that other people will like and be like everyone else.
#8
i didnt say that. making money is very important in life. having a job takes up a lot of your life. this time cant be used towards you music. having music be your source of income is something i highly desire. i want to write music full time.
#9
For what it's worth I actually really like your music.

How are you going about trying to get it to a wider audience? It couldn't hurt to find some people with like-minded interests and get a band together. Covers would be helpful to get noticed and engage a few people when you start.

Also vocals are fairly useful when trying to engage an audience. A lot of non-musicians couldn't really sit through a bunch of instrumentals.
West Ham United
#10
You're best bet is to grow up and get a job.
If you're not already working towards writing music as a career you're probably not going to be in the future.
My Soundcloud dudes
Recording gear:
Yahama Hs8
Saffire Pro 40
Shure Sm57
Shure Sm7b

Guitar gear :
Ebmm BFR7
Axe fx XL+
Walrus audio Janus
Ibanez Ergodyne
Black Market Custom cab
#11
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
i didnt say that. making money is very important in life. having a job takes up a lot of your life. this time cant be used towards you music. having music be your source of income is something i highly desire. i want to write music full time.


No you don't. Nobody writes music full time. People play their instruments all day, but they don't spend all day writing music. It can be tedious and difficult and frustrating. At least for me, because I'm an immensely harsh critic of whatever I'm writing.

You want to be able to live off of doing nothing but playing guitar all day and writing some songs. Honestly though, I'll bet you can find something else you're passionate about.
#13
Maybe as time goes on, il collect a handful of listeners. i personally think my idols would appreciate it more than any fans il ever find. but not having anyone relate to you in nearly every aspect of life sucks, music hurts the most.
avoiding self advertisement, but i havent heard anyone make music like me. i wouldnt expect anyone to.
edit: thanks flying dutchman. i dont know how to gain an audience. i go play jam nights a few times a week with my drummer. we play funk jazz and prog metal, but half an hour of wanking and what, someone gonna come up and say hey do you have any music let me check it out, ok here sir, have some crazy experimental electronic music to sit thru in agony.
Last edited by jrcsgtpeppers at Aug 1, 2013,
#14
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
i personally think my idols would appreciate it more than any fans il ever find.

then you underestimate people. there are a lot of freaks in the world dude, you just have to find them. your music is good, you know it's good, and if you show it to literally as many people as you can then a proportion of them will agree that it is good. i'm not saying you'd ever make a living from your sort of music, but it could be one of several incomes.

Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
someone gonna come up and say hey do you have any music let me check it out, ok here sir, have some crazy experimental electronic music to sit thru in agony.

yes that's exactly what you do, except without the needless self deprecation that comes across more as arrogance.
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Aug 1, 2013,
#15
i am not underestimating anyone. trial and error of 6 hours worth of music has lead me to having no fans. nobody goes hey check out this band animals as leaders its pretty sick, with my music. because it appeals to me. its music written for me, i just thought i could find another person to enjoy it with. i enjoy animals as leaders with many people. am i as talented as tosin matt navene or javier? no, but neither are the jonas brothers. so thats not it. i cant work on that. am i black? no i cant work on that either. whats different between me and aal? an infinite amount of non existent things that separate all music from one another, the formula used to write it, and since i dont use that formula, im not going to have a fanbase or anyone to enjoy myself with.

which is why iv come to this conclusion, do you sell out or give up or keep doing what you do best and try and not suffer?

people like me live cuz i shred and my drummer shreds and we look cool showing off, but they wont be interested in my personal music because its not what they expect. its not the john mayer or joe satriani they know, music that is easy to follow and understand but still shows some skill for solos.
#16
There is always a market for any genre of music....Crunkcore being a shining example...

'Build it and they will come'
Come back if you want to
And remember who you are
‘Cause there's nothing here for you my dear
And everything must pass
#17
Surely if your music is made for you, then it doesn't matter if anyone else is listening or not?

You should never compose music in the aim of pleasing other people, if you do, you'll only ever be disappointed.
#18
Think about it this way: you're (presumably) an individual. Therefore, music that deeply moves you; music that you connect and identify with in a deep, complex, and individual way, is unlikely to work the same way for many people... with the exception of notable and ingenious pieces of music.
#19
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

which is why iv come to this conclusion, do you sell out or give up or keep doing what you do best and try and not suffer?

do both. why do you have to choose? there's no shame in "selling out", most bands anyone has heard of has done that to a certain degree. if you actually want a career in music, selling out is really not something you should stress about.

Quote by matt bickerton
You should never compose music in the aim of pleasing other people, if you do, you'll only ever be disappointed.

what a load of utter tosswank.
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Aug 1, 2013,
#20
Quote by korinaflyingv
what a load of utter tosswank.


Care to form a coherent counter-argument instead? If you're not writing music for your own personal enjoyment, then why are you writing it? For other people to like it and become famous? I forgot you were selling out stadiums on your world tour.

EDIT: I didn't actually read your response to the other post above mine, nevermind, we clearly have very different views on music.
Last edited by matt bickerton at Aug 1, 2013,
#21
Do you want a career in music, or do you want to make music? Ask yourself that question and you'll figure out what you need to do.

That's what Joseph Olin told me once - it was about games, not music, but the same principle applies.
#22
Quote by matt bickerton
Surely if your music is made for you, then it doesn't matter if anyone else is listening or not?

You should never compose music in the aim of pleasing other people, if you do, you'll only ever be disappointed.

I agree, but i never said it was my aim, by any means. its just a concept that gets brought up eventually; wanting to share your music. Aside from that, music as a career would be nice, but very hard to achieve
#23
The concept of selling out is silly. Some of what's generally considered to be the finest music ever written was composed to please others. Self gratification isn't necessarily a prerequisite for 'good' art, and I'm sure a lot of musicians get more pleasure from pleasing other people with their music than pleasing themselves.
#24
Quote by matt bickerton
Care to form a coherent counter-argument instead?

Well to be fair you just made that up off the top of your head. I personally get most of my satisfaction after making a tune out of sharing it with people and them enjoying it with me.
#25
Quote by matt bickerton
Care to form a coherent counter-argument instead?

No, I don't need one, you knew you were wrong when you posted it. Why bother?

When someone says "I write music for myself, not others", all that says to me is "I wish people liked my music". It's just a juvenile defense against criticism.
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Aug 1, 2013,
#26
Quote by willT08
Well to be fair you just made that up off the top of your head. I personally get most of my satisfaction after making a tune out of sharing it with people and them enjoying it with me.

That. I would just find it depressing if you're the only one who likes your music.

There's a certain gratification you get out of others enjoying your tunes, and that's one of the best aspects of music. Others digging it.
West Ham United
Last edited by King Donkey at Aug 1, 2013,
#27
a musician isn't entitled to an audience
just enjoy what you do, and if you don't then find something else to do
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#28
Why not use popular as a platform to get your music out there? Get a You Tube channel, cover some Animals As Leaders songs, gain a fan base and unleash your music via You Tube so those listeners hear it and start spreading it.

I do think your entire point is a bit redundant if I'm honest. The things you mentioned aren't exclusive unless you're 'creating music for you' and as a direct result you don't care if other people relate to it or you're after a career and your focus is only making money.

Do session work or cover bands for money. If you truly enjoy playing guitar and appreciate most styles of music, this shouldn't be an issue.

My opinion!
#29
I would like to sell out but even that's hard to make money from.


I mean, just look at all those fucking "Idol" shows. Every cunt and his dog wants to be a star, what makes you think that you -who has failed at achieving any of your current musical goals - can just switch genres and conquer the mainstream?


That sounded more bitter than it should have.


I'm doing music at uni right now and I have no delusions of grandeur, but I didn't pick music because I wanted to be rich and famous. Or even stable. I just wanted to hang out with fellow musicians for a few years.
Last edited by Butt Rayge at Aug 1, 2013,
#30
Just realized 3 Hertfordshire lads just posted in order and in agreement. A show of true solidarity
#32
If your music is extremely uncommercial I think its unfair to expect more from normal music fans, but people seem to think that its either making music like you want or "selling out". There is a definite middle ground and its rarely so black and white.
Spiraling Up Through the Crack in the Sky...

...Leaving Material World Behind...


SOUNDCLOUD

GT - Elite Curbstomp
#33
Quote by korinaflyingv
IIRC Ben's not actually from Herts, he just studies here. ****ing pretender.

(do correct me if I'm wrong)

True story. I'm really from Swindon which is pretty sucky

I'm just an imposter to this herts elite club you guys have got going on
Last edited by BenRaah at Aug 1, 2013,
#34
Quote by willT08
Well to be fair you just made that up off the top of your head. I personally get most of my satisfaction after making a tune out of sharing it with people and them enjoying it with me.


Quote by korinaflyingv
No, I don't need one, you knew you were wrong when you posted it. Why bother?

When someone says "I write music for myself, not others", all that says to me is "I wish people liked my music". It's just a juvenile defense against criticism.


Quote by King Donkey
That. I would just find it depressing if you're the only one who likes your music.

There's a certain gratification you get out of others enjoying your tunes, and that's one of the best aspects of music. Others digging it.


How am I 'wrong' in my opinion? Hey, if you guys have no qualms about being the new Scouting For Girls of the generation in order to be successful then that's fine, good on you, I hope you do well and make lots of money, I'm just saying that's not why I play or write music. None of you can say that's 'wrong'. If people do like my music, awesome, but I'm not gonna cry about it if they don't.
Last edited by matt bickerton at Aug 1, 2013,
#35
Quote by matt bickerton
How am I 'wrong' in my opinion? Hey, if you guys have no qualms about being the new Scouting For Girls of the generation in order to be successful then that's fine, good on you, I hope you do well and make lots of money, I'm just saying that's not why I play or write music. None of you can say that's 'wrong'.

Well you didn't talk about just yourself, did you?

You should never compose music in the aim of pleasing other people, if you do, you'll only ever be disappointed.


And you don't have to make music like Scouting For Girls (though I had their first album) to find people who like your music. I made a kinda underground ambient garage-y track that I liked and when I put it up online it got blogged about and I had people telling me they really connected to it. It's perfectly possible to make music for yourself and still find the most enjoyment in the process to be the sharing of it with other people.
#36
My point was clearly that if your only aim when making music is to try and please others, then you're asking for disappointment. I don't understand how that's so far-fetched .
#37
Quote by matt bickerton
My point was clearly that if your only aim when making music is to try and please others, then you're asking for disappointment. I don't understand how that's so far-fetched .

Because it's not founded in anything. Some of the best music ever written was made to order, look at Purcell's work for the Royal Family. In Dance music there's a whole culture driven by producers making songs to be enjoyed by groups of people on a dancefloor.

You personally don't derive any enjoyment from it. So stick to statements purely about yourself.
#38
I'm talking about the majority though obviously. Of the thousands of people that try and make music to please others and get played on the radio, what percentage do you think actually make it? All the shitty bands playing songs in their garage, there's obviously more that don't make it than do.

Obviously I'm not talking about every single artist and every single song ever, otherwise there'd be no concept of famous artists or famous songs.
Last edited by matt bickerton at Aug 1, 2013,
#39
Quote by matt bickerton
Of the thousands of people that try and make music to please others and get played on the radio, what percentage do you think actually make it?

That has nothing to do with getting enjoyment out of writing music for other people. This isn't the 80's, you can not 'make it' and still have an audience of thousands.
#40
Quote by willT08
That has nothing to do with getting enjoyment out of writing music for other people. This isn't the 80's, you can not 'make it' and still have an audience of thousands.


And just as similarly, you can also not make it and have an audience of 0. I don't see what point you're trying to make, of everyone in the entire world that writes and makes music, there's obviously way more that have a practically non-existent fanbase than those that do.
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