#1
Hi guys, after having used cracked software for a while , i am glad that my time has come to finally time buy a daw. I am already feeling like a good person.

So:

I am semi comfortable with Ableton Live 8. Ableton Live 9 seems to have disapointed a lot of people and killed a lot of expectations. But now seeing that with 9.1 they are finally listening to their users and adding long wished features such as multi monitor support, i feel like Ableton may still have a promising future. I am however not always happy with Ableton, i always feel like something is missing. Like there must be better ways. Like i am always pressing to many buttons and ****ing fighting with the Warp feature.

I am super exited about Bitwig. Since the only reason why Windows is still poluting my Computer is becuase of Linux Daws inability to support VStis. Bitwig should change this. The con is that no one knows how long it will take before Bitwig is released, i am also afraid that making it work properly under linux could prove hard, i do not feel like struggling, but the linux community is a really smart community... Bitwig seems like a Pro Version of Ableton, like Ableton and Cubase's child or sth.

Reaper.. I have been reading a lot about Reaper being great, about Reaper having a promising future about Reaper curing cancer. I do not get it. I tried it. It looked ugly, it looked primitive. I did not like the workflow and the layout. I did not get it. I know looks are not important, but it just disapointed me.

Studio one does not seem to support some Vstis that i have (Gutiar rig) so it is out of the question. Im saddened by this because i really liked SO.

As for Cubase i have been to lazy to get the dongle just for the trial version. And i do not know if this will make my decision any easier. I have seen Cubase being used and i kinda liked it. It seems reliable and smooth. But again i am reading lots of angry comments about Cubase 7..

So... i guess i could narrow it down to wait for Bitwig.. or just get Ableton 9.1.

Should i really wait for Bitwig ?
Am i missing something else?
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#3
Reaper can be fully customized however you like it. It can function nearly identically to Pro Tools, Cubase, etc. even look like it with custom skins. I guess the default UI is lackluster, but it's easily fixed with a new Theme:

http://stash.reaper.fm/tag/Themes

Not sure what you mean by Studio One not supporting some VSTs (first of all, Guitar Rig is not a VSTi [instrument] it's a VST). It's only the Artist version of the software that doesn't allow you to use 3rd party plugins. If you're talking about it not being able to use 32 bit plugins in the 64 bit version, this is pretty standard in newer DAWs now - Very few come with a built in bridge, as far as I know. That being said, Guitar Rig has a 64 bit VST, so you'd still be able to use it... Still, you can buy jBridge for $20 and make older plugins work:

http://jstuff.wordpress.com/jbridge/

As far as workflow goes, I hear S1 is easy to get a hang of... I own S1 2 Pro and I can't figure that thing out for the life of me It DOES come with some of the best stock plugins I've ever heard, though.

Cubase is very similar to Reaper IMO. Obviously, it has some features that set it apart from other DAWs, but they have many similar functions. I own 6.5 and it's great. Reaper is just more tailored to how my workflow has developed over the years, but I think I'm finally going to switch to Pro Tools 11 now that Waves has released 64 bit AAX support. Someday I'll update to Cubase 7, though... I really wanna try out the Chord Track feature.


My main question to you is - What exactly are you looking to do with this DAW? Ableton is a cool software, but I find a lot of its features to get in the way of my workflow, as it's mostly tailored toward electronic music producers. That being said, there's a TON of really cool features that Ableton has that no one else does. They continue to innovate and add things that people didn't even know they needed.

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Link to this Bitwig thing, please?

http://bitwig.com/en/bitwig-studio
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#5
Ableton Live 9 is great, I haven't had any issues and I haven't upgraded to 9.1 yet. Produced a full six-song EP on it(lavenderlane.bandcamp.com), from loop sketch demos to full on tracking and mixing (Not mastering, paid someone else to do that). I highly recommend it.

Why are you using the warp feature? Unless you're slicing samples for hip-hop you should avoid warping.
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#6
Bitwig kinda looks like ableton but not ableton... interesting.
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#7
As a Cubase 7 user, I vote Cubase big time. I didn't want to deal with the hassle of the dongle/trial thing either, so I just bought it outright. It was a big risk but it paid off, it's the best software for how I structure my workflow and lots of intuitive tools for mixing.
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#8
A lot of it is personal choice, if you have time, do the research, download trials and play with things. I love StudioOne and haven't had any problems with VST's apart from when it comes to 32/64 bit issues, it doesn't have a built in bridge but you have the option to install either 32 or 64 bit versions of the software, I normally stick to 32. If you really wanna go 64 bit though you can always buy JBridge, that's what I did.
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#9
Choosing a DAW is a very personal thing. The only way to know which is really right for you is to try them out for yourself and see how you like them. That's really the only answer you need.

That's what I did and, after having tried damn near anything and everything (and after a few years running Logic on a cursed MacBook), I eventually settled for Cubase on PC. It does everything I need, has a lot of specialized tools that I find super-useful, is generally stable and pleasurable to work with. Then again, most of what I do is MIDI, so your needs may be different. I personally really really detest Reaper and can't stand it at all (and see no similarities with Cubase ). Not sure what you mean about Studio One not supporting VSTs -- it (full version at least) most certainly does.

Regarding Bitwig, to be honest: it's been "in beta stage and will be released soon" for so long by now it's getting ridiculous. No one knows when -- or indeed, if -- it will be released. And no one knows if it will be any good, stable or even usable when/if it is. And no one knows if its supposed native Linux support will really be worth anything (with essentially all other plugins in the world being Windows/MacOS only, I don't see the audio world moving to Linux anytime soon). With the expectations that's been built-up around it, I predict massive disappointment. My best advice is... until this thing is actually released and there's some actual facts to base your choice on, simply forget you've ever heard about BitWig and move on with your life. Base your choice on what's available *now*.

Try anything you can find that looks interesting, even if you have to get a dongle (they're cheap anyway). My gut says you should look at Studio One again though if you said you really liked it, aside from that VST issue -- because that really shouldn't be an issue.
#10
Really good and nice answers guys.

@Matrix Those Reapers skin do look nice. You are right in asking. I want to produce whole tracks. I mostly record myself playing all instruments. And from time to time i jam with friends. The Live View is really cool for playing around with ideas. But indeed, i often find myself (maybe biased thinking) wondering if Ableton is more suited to Electro and Beats. Since all the major releases are geared towards live view music making. Push being the example of what they worked the most for live9.

I want a smooth DAW that gives me the possibility of experimenting a lot and has decent midi editing capabilities. This is where i am not really happy with Ableton. Especially for rock drums.

@Chemicalfire. Nice to see that you have it working. I assume i do need Jbridge thanks for the info. If i remeber correctly though Studio One was not recognizing the Guitar Rig.dll at all, 32 bits nor 64. It must be a mistake on my part. Will reinstall GR and SO. Something about Studio One made really like it right away.

@Sid: Everytime i import Audio Ableton autowarps it, i disabled the autowarp function, i used to be able to just change the seg.bpm of any track with live 8. But after live 8.3 it is blocked/greyed out unless i assign warp markers/turn warp on. The warp markers somehow manage to only alter the bpm of the clip unregularly even if i use only one at the beginning and at the end of the track, the global Bpm does not have any effect on the imported track whatsoever. It works with some tracks and it does not with others. it drives me nuts :P
There is something i am not figuring out..

@Acidosis, Thanks i think i will stop waiting for Bitwig, realistically speaking you are right. If it turns to be the miracle its supposed to be i guess i could always still buy it.

@Shredder: I am gonna try Cubase 7. ^^

And also retry Studio One. Thanks a lot for the fresh perspectives guys.

Edit: Studio One is working. I think i am crazy, because from a logical point of view the following makes no sense, but i swear i recorded the same song with the exact same instruments and tracks and SO sounds better/clearer than Ableton.

Im in love with Studio One <3. <3. <3. I love the workflow... i love that it supports 64 bits and i can use up all my Ram, it is incredibly cool of them to give you the full pro version completely unlocked for 1 month. I think i might have decided already, let's see what i think when the trial expires, i think for the price i am getting a bargain. If i need other DAW i could always rewire... I'm sold.

Would not have retried it if it wasn't for your suggestions so THANKS a lot .
Quote by Hail
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Quote by Steve Albini
Remixing is for talentless pussies who don't know how to tune a drum or point a microphone.
Last edited by Slashiepie at Sep 20, 2013,
#11
I used too use ableton live a few years back, didn't get it, now I use it almost exclusively.

The new version has all the audio to midi conversion options which are amazing. I'm a guitar player, and while I can play some decent piano, my feel and timing is much better on guitar.

I often play a chord progression or melody on guitar, only to right click convert, and it's midi right down to the mistakes and timing nuances.

You can also insert a complete song, and right click extract drums to get just the drums in midi data. This I use the most when I want a particular drum groove. Something which would take ages to get the exact hi hat nuances down for example, now takes 30 seconds, and it's like at least 90% accurate. Also depending on how clear the initial recording is off course.

That being said the midi editing is so rough at the most basic of places, and the cpu overhead is also quite big.

That being said workflow for recording is fastest ever. I let someone play track and just click a new clip during recording, then all the takes are listed down, and i can live check them out one by one for the best ones.

If u have mac Logic would be perfect. Cheap and excellent midi editing abilities, and still increasing. Also newest version has native ipad support so you can have a touch mixer or touch editing etc.

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#12
A natural work flow can really add to a sound, if you're thinking about the music instead of struggling with the technology it's gonna be easier to get a good sound.
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