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#1
David Cameron on Wednesday signalled a major overhaul in benefits for 18- to 24-year-olds when he announced plans to withdraw housing benefit and jobseeker's allowance from many of the 1 million youngsters currently not in work, education or training.

At the end of a Conservative conference in Manchester dedicated to sending tough messages on welfare, party officials said the proposals for young people to be either "earning or learning" were a prime example of how a modern Tory state would not turn its back on the world, but instead "equip the vulnerable for the global race". The proposal was the only policy announcement in a speech dedicated to setting out the prime minister's vision of a society in which there is opportunity for all.

Details of how the benefits would be withdrawn, and any groups exempted, will be included in a review into Britain's complex patchwork of youth unemployment initiatives now being led by the cabinet secretary, Sir Jeremy Heywood. But Tory sources said jobseeker's allowance (JSA) and housing benefit would be removed from anyone unreasonably turning down the offer of work or education.


What do you guys think of this?

I think it's a terrible idea. Cameron is a shitstain who's been paid through life by his rich parents. He should be removed from power as he clearly has no idea how the anyone who isn't comfortably upper middle class/upper class lives.

Absolutely outraged at this. The Tories have been bad enough so far but this is absolutely the last straw for me. It's hard enough for graduates to get a job as it is. what's he proposing now? The young unemployed go homeless and rake the bins for food scraps?

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#2
anyone else notice how everything is going to shit everywhere
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#3
I have no idea what he intends. There are not enough jobs. That's a fact. I really hope this loses him the election, but the current alternatives really aren't much better.
#5
I'm just going to take a guess that the UK has a similar issue as the US that you have such a large (and growing) population of retirees who get far more in benefits, but will never see those cut since they are the country's largest, most consistent voting block.

My point is, the elderly are ****ing leeches and should not be committing themselves and societies resources to continuing their terrible sickness-ridden lives.
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#6
The thing is, house prices in the UK, are quite high versus wages.

They are pushing for this help to buy scheme to push up house prices. This means you can get a mortgage with a 5% deposit with help from the government.

Ok. That's going to drive house prices up, possibly creating a bubble.

What Cameron is saying, is, under 25s will have to put on their job helmet, jump inside the job canon, and be fired into job land where jobs grow on jobbies, or go to school for more education.

Just how, exactly, are they supposed to buy a house? They can rent, yes, absolutely, but landlords have the law on their side. This will ALWAYS be like that in the UK because all these cunts in politics have hundreds upon hundreds of homes they rent out to peasants.

Solution? Build more houses. Drive down demand, give more supply.

What's actually happening? People are given more credit, more debt to carry instead.

This new proposal of Cameron will drive under 25s to stay at home longer. And, believe it or not, not all kids get along well with their parents.

On the other hand, we have Ed Shiteband. So, yeah, pick your poison.
Last edited by Philip_pepper at Oct 2, 2013,
#7
'Hey, students who are massively in debt because we bumped up uni prices, you now have no job (because there aren't any) and no money (because I want a swimming pool). lol, silly prole'
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#8
Quote by snipelfritz

My point is, the elderly are ****ing leeches and should not be committing themselves and societies resources to continuing their terrible sickness-ridden lives.

#9
Quote by snipelfritz
I'm just going to take a guess that the UK has a similar issue as the US that you have such a large (and growing) population of retirees who get far more in benefits, but will never see those cut since they are the country's largest, most consistent voting block.

My point is, the elderly are ****ing leeches and should not be committing themselves and societies resources to continuing their terrible sickness-ridden lives.


Well also the fact that the elderly are "hogging" the job market so there's no job for young people but the elderly have loads of jobs and the youth have nothing effectively creating an underclass.

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#10
Quote by Todd Hart
'Hey, students who are massively in debt because we bumped up uni prices, you now have no job (because there aren't any) and no money (because I want a swimming pool). lol, silly prole'


Oh yeah, forgot England has high uni fees.

That makes it all even worse. Jesus. Wankeron is not gonna win this.

The UK should improve its apprenticeship programs.
#11
Quote by snipelfritz
I'm just going to take a guess that the UK has a similar issue as the US that you have such a large (and growing) population of retirees who get far more in benefits, but will never see those cut since they are the country's largest, most consistent voting block.

My point is, the elderly are ****ing leeches and should not be committing themselves and societies resources to continuing their terrible sickness-ridden lives.


I can't tell if you're serious or satirical, but you make a valid point. 70% of Medicare costs, for example, are used for old people in the last six months of their lives.

70%!!!!! That number is too high. I get that people want to drag out their lives, and I'm not unsympathetic, but being that big a burden on the economy ain't cool. I don't have a solution, because I don't want to suggest they just die, but it's a huge problem.
#13
Quote by progdude93
70% of Medicare costs, for example, are used for old people in the last six months of their lives.

70%!!!!! That number is too high. I get that people want to drag out their lives, and I'm not unsympathetic, but being that big a burden on the economy ain't cool. I don't have a solution, because I don't want to suggest they just die, but it's a huge problem.


That's because that's who Medicare covers lol. If we just said, "hey as of today everyone is paying for and covered by this system", per capita cost would be driven down tremendously and it'd be ok.
#14
Quote by Todd Hart
'Hey, students who are massively in debt because they chose to go to an expensive school, you now have no job (because you picked a bad major) and no money (because you spent it on your school). lol, silly prole'
Haha, naw, that other stuff probably has some influence. But let's be serious, students don't have to go to a Uni, and they don't have to live in the same city, or even country they started in.
#15
Quote by Philip_pepper
Oh yeah, forgot England has high uni fees.

That makes it all even worse. Jesus. Wankeron is not gonna win this.

The UK should improve its apprenticeship programs.


we've been trying and it is improving, quite a lot actually, but there's still a lot of work to be done

Quote by seanlang01
Haha, naw, that other stuff probably has some influence. But let's be serious, students don't have to go to a Uni, and they don't have to live in the same city, or even country they started in.


my choices were as follows:

1: stay at home with my parents and get a shitty, zero hour contract job for the next 4-5 years and hope the job market picks up so I can at least get a job slightly above minim wage and solid hours.

2: go to uni and further my education, so that I can get a degree that will get me better jobs. And hopefully the job market will be better so I can at least start somewhere decent.
Eat your pheasant
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Last edited by Bladez22 at Oct 2, 2013,
#16
Quote by beadhangingOne
That's because that's who Medicare covers lol. If we just said, "hey as of today everyone is paying for and covered by this system", per capita cost would be driven down tremendously and it'd be ok.




The average life expectancy in the US is ~80, and you qualify for Medicare, AT THE LATEST, at age 65.

So 70% of costs cover 3.3% of the duration of Medicare coverage.
Last edited by progdude93 at Oct 2, 2013,
#17
Quote by Bladez22
we've been trying and it is improving, quite a lot actually, but there's still a lot of work to be done


I remember Cameron saying once that Britain should take a more "Germanic approach" in the economy.







He's going in a totally different direction.
#18
Quote by seanlang01
Haha, naw, that other stuff probably has some influence. But let's be serious, students don't have to go to a Uni, and they don't have to live in the same city, or even country they started in.


They don't have to, no, but why should they be unable to - even if they are academically brilliant - simply because their parents cannot afford extortionate fees?
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#19
Quote by Philip_pepper
I remember Cameron saying once that Britain should take a more "Germanic approach" in the economy.







He's going in a totally different direction.


I think I remember that. he says a lot of stupid comments, and does a lot of stupid things that completely contradict his stupid comments

Quote by Todd Hart
They don't have to, no, but why should they be unable to - even if they are academically brilliant - simply because their parents cannot afford extortionate fees?


this. I'm from a working class family whos really struggling at the moment, Im in uni now and unless my grant comes through soon, I'm screwed. Why should I have to quit and go work a dead end job for the rest of my life becauase my parents cant afford to throw money at me?
Eat your pheasant
Drink your wine
Your days are numbered, bourgeois swine!
Last edited by Bladez22 at Oct 2, 2013,
#20
David Cameron showing once again, that rich tossers do not make good leaders

It's like he thinks I enjoy being an unemplyed under-25 year old or something

Yeah David old pal, I'm having a blast here, being poor, living with my parents and generally having no life whatsoever.
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#21
Quote by Todd Hart
They don't have to, no, but why should they be unable to - even if they are academically brilliant - simply because their parents cannot afford extortionate fees?




I go to a public university. It costs far more than yours does. I don't view it as extortionate. There are things worth paying for, and education is one of them. It's not the government's job to make sure you get a college education, it's yours.

Your post and word choice demonstrates that you're an entitled little princess.
#22
Quote by Todd Hart
They don't have to, no, but why should they be unable to - even if they are academically brilliant - simply because their parents cannot afford extortionate fees?

This is why the UK needs a German apprentice system.
#23
That is absolutely unbelievable.

The very reason why many of them are unemployed is because they cannot afford to get good qualifications that are attractive to employers. Why? Because he crushed their dreams of a good career by ramming the cost of tuition fees up the ass.

He's basically trying to clean up after his own shit. By shitting on what he's already shat on.
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Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Oct 2, 2013,
#24
Quote by progdude93


I go to a public university. It costs far more than yours does. I don't view it as extortionate. There are things worth paying for, and education is one of them. It's not the government's job to make sure you get a college education, it's yours.

Your post and word choice demonstrates that you're an entitled little princess.

What? It's better for the country to make education as accessible as possible.

It IS the government's job to ensure as much education of its public as can be achieved; it's directly related to public well-being and development and therefore falls well within the remit and responsibility of governments. How could you possibly say otherwise?

And maybe he sounds entitled because we ARE entitled to the education that is due us, and we are responsible for utilising that knowledge for this generation and future generations. Rights and responsibilities.
#25
Quote by modus operandi
What? It's better for the country to make education as accessible as possible.

It IS the government's job to ensure as much education of its public as can be achieved; it's directly related to public well-being and development and therefore falls well within the remit and responsibility of governments. How could you possibly say otherwise?

And maybe he sounds entitled because we ARE entitled to the education that is due us, and we are responsible for utilising that knowledge for this generation and future generations. Rights and responsibilities.


Agreed.
#26
Quote by snipelfritz
I'm just going to take a guess that the UK has a similar issue as the US that you have such a large (and growing) population of retirees who get far more in benefits, but will never see those cut since they are the country's largest, most consistent voting block.

My point is, the elderly are ****ing leeches and should not be committing themselves and societies resources to continuing their terrible sickness-ridden lives.



See that's where you are considerably wrong, elderly people have already put in 40 years or more of work and paying tax at the same time, they are more deserving of old age benefits then some 20 year old kid who has done jack shit and paid a pittance in taxes. The Greeks have a similar mind set going on, the young people think they should just be given stuff for doing nothing, now their country in bankrupt and totally ****ed up. Its just like the Occupy Wallstreet bullshit, dumb over-privledged kids demanding everything while contributing nothing.
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#27
Quote by modus operandi

And maybe he sounds entitled because we ARE entitled to the education that is due us, and we are responsible for utilising that knowledge for this generation and future generations. Rights and responsibilities.


No one is entitled to anything from birth until death. You may earn things, and be owed things at some point, but no one else owes you anything just because you exist.
#28
Quote by seanlang01


No one is entitled to anything from birth until death. You may earn things, and be owed things at some point, but no one else owes you anything just because you exist.


Fair enough. But a country has to invest in its youth.
#29
Quote by seanlang01


No one is entitled to anything from birth until death. You may earn things, and be owed things at some point, but no one else owes you anything just because you exist.


education should be accessible to anyone, regardless of their families income. Everyone is entitled to learn, and to EARN their qualifications and such.
Eat your pheasant
Drink your wine
Your days are numbered, bourgeois swine!
#30
Quote by seanlang01


No one is entitled to anything from birth until death. You may earn things, and be owed things at some point, but no one else owes you anything just because you exist.


Actually, we are. This is the basis for every conception of rights. In every government in the world, some people are entitled to certain things. That's how government works; it regulates the allocation of resources.

What I'm saying is that it's in everyone's interest to ensure education is as accessible as possible. This is because education allows people to develop technologies and products which benefit the country, and health breakthroughs and so on that benefit all of humanity.

Rights are the cornerstone of modernism. If we ensure the right entitlements are upheld, we are bound to feel the reward of doing so.
#31
Quote by progdude93


I go to a public university. It costs far more than yours does. I don't view it as extortionate. There are things worth paying for, and education is one of them. It's not the government's job to make sure you get a college education, it's yours.

Your post and word choice demonstrates that you're an entitled little princess.


"I'm a sucker being sucked and I'm okay with that"

And you are aware that simply throwing the term entitlement around isn't really an argument? I'm not arguing that university should be free, I'm saying that in the space of a year increasing the cost of university education by 2.5x is absurd. The increase does not benefit the country economically: short term is has meant that the government is paying much more money in order to pay for student loans, in the long term it means that higher education becomes a property of the elite, and the number of people in the UK with higher education will likely decrease, all only resulting in a slightly higher trickle of money coming from the number of people who can pay off their student debt (a number which will not at all be effected by this cut in unemployment benefits because, in the majority of cases, people aren't on the dole because they wish to be, but because the job market is small).
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#32
Quote by Philip_pepper
Fair enough. But a country has to invest in its youth.
Of course, and I'm not from the UK so I can't say much with authority, but it seems like you guys need to figure out a better system. Especially because when you can't contain the costs, they just get passed directly to the constituents who may be struck with a little sticker shock.
#33
Quote by seanlang01
Of course, and I'm not from the UK so I can't say much with authority, but it seems like you guys need to figure out a better system. Especially because when you can't contain the costs, they just get passed directly to the constituents who may be struck with a little sticker shock.


we need a lot of new systems, and david cameron wont help with that
Eat your pheasant
Drink your wine
Your days are numbered, bourgeois swine!
#34
Quote by seanlang01
Of course, and I'm not from the UK so I can't say much with authority, but it seems like you guys need to figure out a better system. Especially because when you can't contain the costs, they just get passed directly to the constituents who may be struck with a little sticker shock.


A better system like Germany's? Yeah, I agree.

They don't pay uni tuition fees.

They get financial support for going to uni.

Their apprenticeship programs are much better.

Their unemployment is very low.

Under 25s can apply for unemployment benefits if they wish.
#35
Quote by modus operandi
What? It's better for the country to make education as accessible as possible.

It IS the government's job to ensure as much education of its public as can be achieved; it's directly related to public well-being and development and therefore falls well within the remit and responsibility of governments. How could you possibly say otherwise?

And maybe he sounds entitled because we ARE entitled to the education that is due us, and we are responsible for utilising that knowledge for this generation and future generations. Rights and responsibilities.

Maybe in communist countries this is true
#36
Quote by Weaponized
Maybe in communist countries this is true

It's true everywhere, it doesn't matter what political philosophy the country subscribes to.

It's a simple proposition: Fund education, feel the benefits that education brings to the country in the form of new technologies, health breakthroughs, services and companies.

It doesn't really matter where you live, this is an international constant. Improve education, improve the quality of life of the country.

Now what were you blathering on about? Communism?
#37
Quote by Weaponized
Maybe in communist countries this is true


>Assumed Weaponized was American.
>Checked profile
>Assumed correctly.

How's Obamacare doing? Everyone agreeing on it? Are the republicans realizing that it won't fail and that people want it? Yeah? Have tuition fees reached new highs again? Everything cool, up and running in the land of the free?

Yeah, ok then.
#38
Quote by captainsnazz
It's almost as if he knows nobody is ever going to vote for him again, so he's just doing stupid bullshit for the lulz. Kinda like when people here get themselves banned intentionally by posting boobs.

Yea but posting boobs is not stupid bullshit. We like boobs.
#39
Quote by modus operandi
It's true everywhere, it doesn't matter what political philosophy the country subscribes to.

It's a simple proposition: Fund education, feel the benefits that education brings to the country in the form of new technologies, health breakthroughs, services and companies.

It doesn't really matter where you live, this is an international constant. Improve education, improve the quality of life of the country.

Now what were you blathering on about? Communism?

I agree with fund education, make sure state schools are fantastic at what they do. I don't feel we gotta get all socialist and make school dirt cheap (worsening schools)
Quote by Philip_pepper
>Assumed Weaponized was American.
>Checked profile
>Assumed correctly.

How's Obamacare doing? Everyone agreeing on it? Are the republicans realizing that it won't fail and that people want it? Yeah? Have tuition fees reached new highs again? Everything cool, up and running in the land of the free?

Yeah, ok then.

Someones mad he's not in America lmao, enjoy paying for Greece and Spain
#40
Quote by seanlang01


No one is entitled to anything from birth until death. You may earn things, and be owed things at some point, but no one else owes you anything just because you exist.

l2basichumanrights

Quote by metaldud536
Yea but posting boobs is not stupid bullshit. We like boobs.

That's why I used the word "kinda"
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