#1
So i'm looking for a new DAW to work with...

I'm currently using Ableton Live 8 which is awesome for electronic music and live looping but i find it completely awkward for a more traditional approach to recording. For those purposes i use garage band, which is good for basic stuff and sketches but it feels like a toy when i'm trying to do something more elaborate.

I'm really thinking to upgrade to Logic Pro but i really want to have more options, so... any good recommendations?

BTW, i'm working mainly with Virtual instruments since i'm a one-man-band, so i really want a DAW that works well with those.
#2
TBH, if you're on a Mac, it's pretty hard to beat Logic for the price.
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#3
This is a hugely late reply, but it's worth an answer anyway.

At your time of writing, and now, I operate similarly to yourself.

I use a combination of Reason 5 and Logic Pro 9, with ReWiring; not a big fan of Ableton personally, and I find Cubase to be like poison.

Pro-Tools is ok, but I've not got much experience with that.
#4
For audio recording? Logic is cool, but not especially well suited to live audio. It's netter than Live, but its strongest suit is midi. Reaper is cool. From there the prices go up and honestly they don't really improve THAT much.
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#5
You want traditional recording, but presumably great freedom with Plug-ins (Vst's/Au).

Sounds like you need Ableton Live.

What do you lack in Ableton at the moment?

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#6
Quote by xxdarrenxx
You want traditional recording, but presumably great freedom with Plug-ins (Vst's/Au).

Sounds like you need Ableton Live.

What do you lack in Ableton at the moment?

This.

Ableton should do everything you want and more. You may need to replace SOME of the built-in sounds, but for the most part it will have what you need and you can just ignore all of the electronic instruments.

Just switching from session to arrangement mode should give you everything you're looking for. I use Ableton EVERY DAY to sketch out songs in a traditional manner. In fact, 80% of my sessions don't use VST instruments, I use mics and DI for all of my sounds and I'm very happy with the results.

Oh, just saw that you want mostly virtual instruments. EVEN BETTER! Ableton is perfect for that stuff. If the sounds aren't organic enough for you, check out Puremagnetik for some $12 VSTs that generally sound great. I use their Rhodes and Wurlitzer samples constantly (at least until I bought a Korg SV-1). They have some good drums as well.
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Last edited by Sid McCall at Oct 29, 2013,
#7
^^ I wanted to ask TS if he knew there was Arr. view and Sess. view.

Arrangement view is pretty much standard DAW, and controlling basic production automation is really easy and straightforward.

Also Sid, what sounds don't you find organic?

The own plugin's are amazing, especially something like Collision, or Operator.

You can adjust so many parameters to change on velocity and/or pitch you can make any sound as if it's a natural occurring one.

Made a Harp the other day, when going higher in the pitch, the sustain decreases, and the stiffness increases. I got midi velocity set to detune upwards when hitting harder, something which also occurs on guitar, figured it might as well do on a harp.

/sound design geek

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Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Oct 29, 2013,
#8
Quote by xxdarrenxx
^^ I wanted to ask TS if he knew there was Arr. view and Sess. view.

Arrangement view is pretty much standard DAW, and controlling basic production automation is really easy and straightforward.

Also Sid, what sounds don't you find organic?

The own plugin's are amazing, especially something like Collision, or Operator.

You can adjust so many parameters to change on velocity and/or pitch you can make any sound as if it's a natural occurring one.

Made a Harp the other day, when going higher in the pitch, the sustain decreases, and the stiffness increases. I got midi velocity set to detune upwards when hitting harder, something which also occurs on guitar, figured it might as well do on a harp.

/sound design geek

Well as far as 'organic' goes, it depends on which version of Live you have. If it's just intro (or 'lite' as they called it back in my day!) then the drums and stuff are all synthesized, which sounds like butt. I have Suite, and there are INSANE multi-sampled drums that I use on everything. I forget what Live standard offers, there should be some sampled drums at least.

The biggest thing that Live was lacking for me was a Rhodes, which is hard to find anywhere. I had a synthesized one I used for a long time, but it started to stick out as I replaced all of my other sounds with real instruments and started using mics instead of VST amps etc.
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#9
Quote by xxdarrenxx
^^ I wanted to ask TS if he knew there was Arr. view and Sess. view.

Arrangement view is pretty much standard DAW, and controlling basic production automation is really easy and straightforward.


Don't worry, i know how ableton works

But for some strange reason it feels awkward for making non-electronic (or loop based) music, maybe it's just because i got really used to experiment with loops in session and then getting all together in arrangement.

I've just found out that a friend uses logic, so i'm going to try it and learn to use it before actully getting it.

A big thank you to everyone who helped
#10
Quote by deluxity
i got really used to experiment with loops in session and then getting all together in arrangement.

For what it's worth, that's how I write all of my songs, and they're not the least bit electronic. You may find yourself missing it eventually
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#11
Ableton can for sure do non electronic music fine.

But the main issue sounds like it's not got the right workflow for you, it doesn't sound like a huge problem but if you're fighting against the software more than you're creating a good sound it can negatively impact your output.

It might be worth while trying some trail versions of certain DAW's and seeing which one feels right. It may even be worth just buying REAPER and then using it's very functional customisation options to create the work flow that does work for you.
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#12
Have you tried learning how to use Ableton more efficiently? the only down side to ableton is advanced audio editing.
Ableton is a fantastic program.
#13
Quote by unofficiallyme2
Have you tried learning how to use Ableton more efficiently? the only down side to ableton is advanced audio editing.
Ableton is a fantastic program.


Would you elaborate on what this downside is?

I have seen people turn 3 kick drums into one using of one the attack, one the sustain and one the sub frequencies through raw audio editing within just 2 minutes, no artifacts.

I can also transpose an audio track an octave at half tempo without audible artifacts.

Likewise I can change a raw audio guitar solo into midi notes with just 2 clicks.

I can also grab a swinging jazz track, extract the groove/feel and apply it to my own drum VST.

How is this not one of the most advanced audio manipulation? Srry for my fanboyish, but often when doing stuff I wish it could be done faster or better, but Ableton almost always has a method to get somewhere with something.

I do find that the midi editing is lacking somewhat, but midi automation is like the opposite and extremely easy and extensive, which is funny

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Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Nov 1, 2013,
#14
I mean when editing drums to sit on the grid, comping vocals, and arranging guitars and other pieces of music. Ableton lacks in the user friendliness, in this department.
Abletons audio manipulation tools, which you described, are freaking brilliant. But it lacks in the editing department.

"I can also transpose an audio track an octave at half tempo without audible artifacts."
That is fan boyishness talking, lol.
#15
Quote by unofficiallyme2
I mean when editing drums to sit on the grid, comping vocals, and arranging guitars and other pieces of music. Ableton lacks in the user friendliness, in this department.
Abletons audio manipulation tools, which you described, are freaking brilliant. But it lacks in the editing department.

"I can also transpose an audio track an octave at half tempo without audible artifacts."
That is fan boyishness talking, lol.



I agree in the editing it feels not so user friendly for some reason in some places.

Would you elaborate on what is hard for the drum editing 'on the grid' ?

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#16
By on the grid i mean. Incredibly accurate down to a 32nd. Its powerful because you can group the audio tracks so it does it to all of them.