Ian_the_fox
Banned
Join date: Feb 2011
2,990 IQ
#1
...in the nicest way possible. How do you do it?

There's a guy who's good at bass that I'd like to play in my band. As bass player. But he also wants to sing lead vocals. Problem: he CAN'T.

Any time I try to be polite and give helpful critique he looks pained because he seemingly thinks he's a good vocalist. He can't get one, NOT ONE, note correct.


I mean, he has some really good bass skills but how fan I tell him that he's not AT ALL a suitable singer but be polite about it? Like, it's not even singing he does. It's like, pitched talking. But worse.


And this isn't my usual trolling self. I need some help this time. D:
Baby Joel
Join date: May 2008
6,273 IQ
#2
Quote by Ian_the_fox

And this isn't my usual trolling self.

Does this count as a confession?
Snake™
Bad2DaBone
Join date: Jul 2008
2,639 IQ
#3
Don't tell him he sucks, just say he shouldn't ever ever ever ever ever try to sing
I NEED TO CHANGE MY USERNAME


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-Mantra-
Mhm
Join date: Apr 2008
47 IQ
#4
Tell him to make fox noises instead. Worked for those norwegian guys.
Hydra150
cutebutt mcsexyface
Join date: Nov 2006
1,793 IQ
#5
I close their threads.
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
whywefight
~I'm not fuckin around~
Join date: Dec 2010
1,725 IQ
#7
stick your dick in his mouth till his vocal cords don't work anymore
modus operandi
UG Newbie
Join date: Apr 2009
39 IQ
#8
What makes you think you have to tell him he "sucks"? Find a tactful way of arranging it such that you don't need to.

Something like "The music I want to make in this band isn't really suited to backing vocals" or whatever you want.
vIsIbleNoIsE
The Asian-Viking Paradox
Join date: Feb 2006
1,542 IQ
#12
"Hey, your vocal style isn't really what we're looking for. We kinda want a voice that doesn't suck as much."
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eGraham
Rattle That Lock
Join date: Oct 2008
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#13
You've completed the first step at least by creating a thread on UG
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Snake™
Bad2DaBone
Join date: Jul 2008
2,639 IQ
#16
Quote by Hydra150
I close their threads.


I thought I was on Twitter and literally spent like 3 minutes trying to figure out where the favorite button was, curse you for this comment full of win
I NEED TO CHANGE MY USERNAME


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FearMyLightning
Banned
Join date: Oct 2010
482 IQ
#17
"hey buddy, I know you think you're fuckin' hard but I'll tell you what I'm not intimidated bud."

That'll teach him.
whywefight
~I'm not fuckin around~
Join date: Dec 2010
1,725 IQ
#18
Quote by Snake™
I thought I was on Twitter and literally spent like 3 minutes trying to figure out where the favorite button was, curse you for this comment full of win


*favorited*
Hydra150
cutebutt mcsexyface
Join date: Nov 2006
1,793 IQ
#19
Quote by whywefight
*favorited*

reblogged
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
Rockford_rocks
Z -> v -> ^+A
Join date: Apr 2006
1,316 IQ
#20
Tell him you think he needs to improve before taking on such a large role.

Then recommend him a vocal teacher if you know one, if not just tell him a teacher can help solidify his technique or some "you're almost there" bullshit. Then he/she can tell him that he sucks so he can hear it from a professional.

Bam.
Last edited by Rockford_rocks at Nov 17, 2013,
Ian_the_fox
Banned
Join date: Feb 2011
2,990 IQ
#21
Quote by modus operandi
What makes you think you have to tell him he "sucks"? Find a tactful way of arranging it such that you don't need to.

Something like "The music I want to make in this band isn't really suited to backing vocals" or whatever you want.
This I have actually tried.

Ended unsuccessfully, with a shit ton of excuses. And the problem isn't with backing vox (which we make use of), it's that he wants lead parts.
Snake™
Bad2DaBone
Join date: Jul 2008
2,639 IQ
#22
Quote by Hydra150
reblogged


shared
I NEED TO CHANGE MY USERNAME


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AwesomeOne3
Registered User
Join date: Oct 2013
626 IQ
#23
Just say he doesn't fit in the vocal category of the band
Hydra150
cutebutt mcsexyface
Join date: Nov 2006
1,793 IQ
#24
oh hey
I'm moving this to bandleading
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
Danjo's Guitar
UG's Math/Physics Major
Join date: Jun 2007
995 IQ
#26
^Thats actually a brilliant suggestion. If he still thinks he's good when he hears it then he's not worth bothering with.

I would say just tell him his singing style is not what you want, but it sounds like you've tried that and it hasn't worked.
Mdawg291
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2012
54 IQ
#27
Tell him straight out that he can't sing, but don't be angry with him. Let him know that you want him in the band AS A BASSIST. If you wanna take the nicer approach, drop hints at it before actually telling him.
Lt. Shinysides
Perma'd
Join date: Apr 2009
2,195 IQ
#28
show him this thread?
It's okay, Lt. Shinysides. You don't have to eat it now, you're just sleeping, you can eat it later. You can eat it later Lt. Shinysides!
Ian_the_fox
Banned
Join date: Feb 2011
2,990 IQ
#29
Okay so multi-quoting is a bitch on my my phone so I'm gonna be lazy and refers to post #'s.

#26: That isn't too bad of an idea, but if it's anything like before he'll just excuse-ify it during playback.


#28: I've dropped as many hints as I can possibly drop, I've even stated we have vocals covered. But he really seems to want a role as a singer for some reason.

And I really don't know how to flat out tell him he can't sing without naturally sounding like an ass.
Masten
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2005
10 IQ
#30
1. Record him and play it back to him.

2. Really put the praise on thick for his bass playing but say that for this project his vocals dont mesh with the sound you are going for.

If he still does excuses.

Tell him I need a killer bass player. And you are him. But I am looking for something different on vocals. If this is to work out i need you on bass not vocals. If you want to pursue lead vocals you will need to find a different project.

If he still says excuses

Then just drink enough beer that he actually sounds good.

Problem.

Solved.
AlanHB
Godin's Resident Groupie
Join date: Aug 2008
1,703 IQ
#31
Don't step around the subject - hit it head on.

Mate, I like your bass playing but I want a singer who is better than you for this band.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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Sir Stoney
Registered User of Herb
Join date: Aug 2012
1,385 IQ
#32
Say you like his bass playing, but not his vocals. If he doesn't listen, have someone listen to him that could take him in a fist fight tell him how awful he is.
MaggaraMarine
Slapping the bass.
Join date: Oct 2009
3,411 IQ
#33
Quote by Rockford_rocks
Tell him you think he needs to improve before taking on such a large role.

Then recommend him a vocal teacher if you know one, if not just tell him a teacher can help solidify his technique or some "you're almost there" bullshit. Then he/she can tell him that he sucks so he can hear it from a professional.

Bam.

This. Though I wouldn't say "you're almost there" because that's just BS. I would say something like "if you want to be the lead singer, you need to be better at singing. But if you want it so much, get a teacher and you'll get better."

I mean, if he really wants it so bad, he should be ready to improve his singing.

And yeah, record him singing and he'll hear that he's not as good as he thinks he is.

Quote by Snake™
Don't tell him he sucks, just say he shouldn't ever ever ever ever ever try to sing

I don't like comments like this because that's just BS. Everybody can learn to sing. Though I'm not completely sure which of the posts in the thread were jokes.
Quote by AlanHB
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samuelzz10
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2013
267 IQ
#34
Find a lead singer who he thinks sounds really good to join the band. Then, he'll want him to sing.
TheHydra
Registered User
Join date: Aug 2011
421 IQ
#35
Quote by AlanHB
Don't step around the subject - hit it head on.

Mate, I like your bass playing but I want a singer who is better than you for this band.

This, honestly. If he's not mature enough to handle that, he'll most likely cause problems at some point. Unless he's the greatest bassist ever, it's not worth it.
HotspurJr
Registered User
Join date: Jul 2011
191 IQ
#36
You MUST be honest here. You will do far more harm to your relationship by trying to dodge here. Yes, people's egos get in the way, and he may leave for a band where he can sing. If that's what he wants, then you can't do a thing about it.

"I love playing with you, and think you're a great bass player, but honestly your vocals just aren't where they need to be for this band. You're not on pitch, and your technique is very poor. If those problems got fixed, I can't say that you'd be the right singer for this band because so much of being a singer is about how you connect with an audience, but right now your singing just isn't where it needs to be to even consider it."

Then listen and nod to his excuses, and say something along the lines of:

"I understand that this is hard to hear, because singing is something that we all feel is a really personal thing, and being told our singing isn't good enough feels like we're being rejected personally. But I'm not rejecting you. I like you. I like your bass playing. I think you bring a lot to the band. But you can't be our singer. I understand if you want to find a band where you can sing, but I would love for you to stay with us as a bass player."

At some point you may want to say something like, "From everything I've been told, singing is something you have to learn just like you have to learn an instrument. You've put years into being a bass player, and that's part of why you're so good at it. If you want to be as good a singer as you are a bass player, that's going to take years of work, too. I'd love to see you take that journey, to see where you end up, because I think you have a lot of musical talent. But without that dedicated training, that talent isn't expressing itself through your singing."

Don't lie. Don't pussyfoot around. Be honest, but nice while you're being honest. (That is to say, if anything I wrote in those quotes above is not true, DON'T SAY IT.)

Understand that he may snap or say something rude or act like he's been personally attacked. If he wants to stomp out of the room and call you names, let it wash off your back - remember that he's likely to feel like you just told him he lacked value as a person. A day or two later reach out to him and say something like, "Hey, just wanted to say hi, see how you're feeling," but don't push him. If he's a distant, give it a week or two and maybe email, "Hey, just wanted to see if you wanted to be our bass player. We'd love to still have you but understand if you want to go elsewhere. We're going to have to start looking for someone else if you don't want to be with us."

If his ego is still hurt, even after this approach, then he was never going to be able to stay in the band anyway.
Ian_the_fox
Banned
Join date: Feb 2011
2,990 IQ
#37
^This is actually really helpful.


While most of these replies are helpful, the problem with the responses saying "we're looking for better vocals more suited for the band" is that, well, I'M the vocalist. And by saying that, I'd be saying "I think I'm better than you" which sounds pretentious as shit. Even if it is true.

I mean, for the longest time I hated my vocal skills, and I STILL hate claiming anything like "I'm a good singer", but others have told me I'm really good as well as asking if I could teach them. So that itself speaks in place of me.

And since most "vocalists" I've auditioned in the past were pretty much jokes (but nowhere NEAR as bad as this guy), I've just decided to take role of vocalist and guitarist for this band.
TheHydra
Registered User
Join date: Aug 2011
421 IQ
#38
Quote by Ian_the_fox
^This is actually really helpful.


While most of these replies are helpful, the problem with the responses saying "we're looking for better vocals more suited for the band" is that, well, I'M the vocalist. And by saying that, I'd be saying "I think I'm better than you" which sounds pretentious as shit. Even if it is true.

I mean, for the longest time I hated my vocal skills, and I STILL hate claiming anything like "I'm a good singer", but others have told me I'm really good as well as asking if I could teach them. So that itself speaks in place of me.

And since most "vocalists" I've auditioned in the past were pretty much jokes (but nowhere NEAR as bad as this guy), I've just decided to take role of vocalist and guitarist for this band.

What are your bandmates' opinions?
Ian_the_fox
Banned
Join date: Feb 2011
2,990 IQ
#39
Quote by TheHydra
What are your bandmates' opinions?
He hasn't attended a practice yet, I've just jammed with him one on one. So far just my guitarist heard my imitation of him which I feel I've managed to get pretty spot-on. As you can imagine cringes were induced.