#1
I'm sorry about my last thread I started and don't want any trouble. That said, I'm curious what techniques are used in Norwegian Black Metal (with a gothic twist). I'm trying to get the "Voltaire meets Emperor" Tone and thus need to learn the required techniques. I tend to use my fingers instead of a pick to increase my accuracy (I know that sounds weird). I also want some amp settings to get me started (mess with your amp a little). Note the Voltaire song is mostly for Atmosphere.

Here's a Dimmu Borgir song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMchdQRS4MM

This is an Emperor song called "The Majesty Of the Nightsky"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_0qDWRlnAs
And here's Voltaire's "Riding a Black Unicorn"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjJDBP292rM

This time I'm looking more for techniques and tips than tone. Assistance is greatly appreciated.
#2
Not sure what you mean, you usually find regular metal guitar techniques in this style. Lots of tremolo picking/strumming, palm mutes, powerchords, sometimes technical riffs with plenty of string skipping. I can't imagine how you're effectively going to play this style without using a pick. BM typically has a bit more complex chords than most metal and as you can hear in that Emperor song they use higher strings and let ring a lot more in rhythm guitar than what's typical. Lots of minor chords and strange progressions not found in mainstream music.
The Dimmu song posted has completely standard metal guitar. If you're new to this stuff then it's a good idea to find some easy metal songs to learn and get the basic techniques down.
#3
Do you mind suggesting an easy metal song that would help (Not "Iron Man"). I'm terrible with palm muting (it's so cryptic and difficult). Got any suggestions?
#4
Dimmu Borgir is simple. Just tremolo picked single notes and power chords, typical metal stuff. It rides more on the keyboards than guitars anyway. But as fanapathy said there are a lot more to black metal than usually meets the eye.

Not too big on Emperor but just check out what kind of stuff Immortal (Abbath era especially) contains.

You may find these two videos interesting. The current guitarist of Carcass Ben Ash goes through what makes Immortal tick, on both Demonaz and Abbath eras.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5uc5mHp4lE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3agZ5myP18U


BTW, you need to use a pick on this kind of music. It just doesnt work with fingers, not to mention you will make a bloody mess. You can use finger picking for clean parts using the middle, ring and pinky fingers though.

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Last edited by MaaZeus at Nov 19, 2013,
#5
Interesting videos, thanks for showing them to me. However you're wrong about picking in metal. I'm both faster and more accurate with my index finger than with a pick. I also was tremolo picking double stops/Power Chords (with a bassy C major thrown in) with said index finger for 30 minutes (in 16th note and 8th note triplets) and not a scratch on me.

Anyway I'm sorry if I sounded rude but I'm actually a moderate beginner and believe we shouldn't substitute our greatest strengths. By the way, how do you quickly palm mute? Also I can't believe I got into Black Metal (I'm a Christian but like the guitar playing and artistic values).
#6
Quote by RonaldPoe
Interesting videos, thanks for showing them to me. However you're wrong about picking in metal. I'm both faster and more accurate with my index finger than with a pick. I also was tremolo picking double stops/Power Chords (with a bassy C major thrown in) with said index finger for 30 minutes (in 16th note and 8th note triplets) and not a scratch on me.

Anyway I'm sorry if I sounded rude but I'm actually a moderate beginner and believe we shouldn't substitute our greatest strengths. By the way, how do you quickly palm mute? Also I can't believe I got into Black Metal (I'm a Christian but like the guitar playing and artistic values).


You're welcome.

I'm not doubting the speed, its the sound. And I've never seen or even heard one play high gain metal with their fingers and frankly have a problem wrapping my head around the subject. I'd really like to see a video of someone doing that out of curiosity.

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Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
#7
Quote by MaaZeus
You're welcome.

I'm not doubting the speed, its the sound. And I've never seen or even heard one play high gain metal with their fingers and frankly have a problem wrapping my head around the subject. I'd really like to see a video of someone doing that out of curiosity.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbOsBy7QqVg

Boom.
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#8
Quote by MaaZeus
You're welcome.

I'm not doubting the speed, its the sound. And I've never seen or even heard one play high gain metal with their fingers and frankly have a problem wrapping my head around the subject. I'd really like to see a video of someone doing that out of curiosity.


I didn't think you were doubting my speed or finger technique (and forgot it was you). Anyway check your EQ thread, I got you some lovely advice on it. Also I'd love to show you some finger-picking Extreme Metal (once I learn some that is). I also enjoy bass, do you have any technique pointers for Black Metal bass playing?

To Zaphod_Beeblebr, I pride myself with my skills at the Chromatic scale and chromatic trills. I know you're just trying to help and thank you for that. Hope you have a nice day too.
#10
Quote by Zaphod_Beeblebr


It looks like he's using a yellow thumb pick for the faster sections. I'm not sure a fiingerpicking style can work in Black Metal due to the tone and the constant tremolo on the chords.

I'd love to proven otherwise, though.

OT: So, you want to combine Emperor and Voltaire...

Well, the best thing to do for Emperor is to study how the guitar and synth lines on Nightside Eclipse all work together, since that's a big aspect of that album and what makes it so great. It will require a lot of tremolo picking and if you can do it without a pick go for it, but I would definitely suggest practicing with a pick.

With Voltaire, however, you'll most likely have to look at the rhythms he incorporates since they revolve around cabaret music and that's what gives most of his music the atmosphere it has. The addition of "traditional" instruments is also a big part of his music, as you are probably aware of already.

An excellent band to look at for a mixture of these two styles, I feel, is Pensees Nocturnes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQgYh_aJWxs
#11
Quote by MaaZeus
You're welcome.

I'm not doubting the speed, its the sound. And I've never seen or even heard one play high gain metal with their fingers and frankly have a problem wrapping my head around the subject. I'd really like to see a video of someone doing that out of curiosity.


I didn't think you were doubting my finger technique or speed. I'd love to show you some finger-picking Extreme Metal (as soon as I learn some). I also left a nice tip in your EQ thread. I like to play Bass Guitar for fun and am wondering if you have any tips for Norwegian Black Metal bass playing.

To Zaphod_Beeblebr, I pride myself with my skills with the Chromatic scale and chromatic trills. I know you were trying to help and thank you for that. Have a nice day too.

To Morphogenesis26, thanks for the advice (it was just what I needed). Do you have any tips for bass playing in this style? You were really helpful and nice. Have a nice day as well.
Last edited by RonaldPoe at Nov 19, 2013,
#12
Quote by RonaldPoe
To Morphogenesis26, thanks for the advice (it was just what I needed). Do you have any tips for bass playing in this style? You were really helpful and nice. Have a nice day as well.


No problem, dude.

I, sadly, have almost zero knowledge of bass playing. All I can really say is that the bass, generally, mimics the guitar in Black Metal and is put on the back burner by many bands.

I would also suggest looking into the albums Far Away From The Sun by Sacramentum, The Sad Realm Of Stars by Odium, and Nachthymnen by Abigor if you are serious about learning how to play this style of music. These albums, along with In The Nightside Eclipse, all compliment each other very well.

You have a nice day, too.
#13
Quote by Morphogenesis26
No problem, dude.

I, sadly, have almost zero knowledge of bass playing. All I can really say is that the bass, generally, mimics the guitar in Black Metal and is put on the back burner by many bands.

I would also suggest looking into the albums Far Away From The Sun by Sacramentum, The Sad Realm Of Stars by Odium, and Nachthymnen by Abigor if you are serious about learning how to play this style of music. These albums, along with In The Nightside Eclipse, all compliment each other very well.

You have a nice day, too.


Checked out Pensées Nocturnes. They are exactly the right mixture of Voltaire style Gothic music, Emperor style Black Metal, and Classical Bombast. I really thank you for telling me about them and the playing tips as well.

Wish I knew how to get a similar tone though (amp settings, amp suggestions, pedals, ect). Also I'd like some tips for Dark Cabaret (Voltaire style) rhythm guitar. Glade only nice people decided to show up (I dislike bullies and trolls).
Last edited by RonaldPoe at Nov 19, 2013,
#14
Quote by RonaldPoe
To Zaphod_Beeblebr, I pride myself with my skills at the Chromatic scale and chromatic trills. I know you're just trying to help and thank you for that. Hope you have a nice day too.


Actually I wasn't, I was just trying to point out that it can be done.

That said... I wouldn't pride yourself on being good with the chromatic scale; it's not exactly a useful skill.
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#15
Quote by Zaphod_Beeblebr
Actually I wasn't, I was just trying to point out that it can be done.

That said... I wouldn't pride yourself on being good with the chromatic scale; it's not exactly a useful skill.


Oh, I didn't understand (I thought you were trying to teach me something I already know). Also the chromatic scale (and by extension chromatics) can be used for both dark sounding licks and playing faster. That being said, I understand that it's not the most useful skill (compared to palm muting, sweep picking, tremolos, quick arpeggios, ect). Thanks for your criticism.

I was curious if anyone has advice for Voltaire-like Dark Cabaret rhythm techniques. I'd like to adapt them into my own playing.

Edit: I can't find any information on Voltaire style Dark Cabaret (or cabaret in general) guitar playing. I've been practicing both bass and guitar tremolo chords. Does anyone want to brave my new topic? https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1623948

Thanks everyone for your help and hope I get more advice soon. Good day.
Last edited by RonaldPoe at Nov 20, 2013,
#17
Don't insult Voltaire, he's my hero (I've been a fan of his for at least 2 years) and makes awesome music. He's not metal but still good music. I was curious how to get the rhythms.

I also have seen that Ishahn video and enjoyed it a lot. Those lessons are very useful and show his technical yet polite side. I agree and would recommend it to anyone learning Black Metal leads. No harm done.
#18
Quote by 2PtDescartes
This is the first I've heard or heard of Voltair and all I can think to say is DEATH TO FALSE METAL!