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#1
I have always wanted a Les Paul after having a '99 Gibson SG for so many years, and I wanted to know if paying several grand was worth it for a REAL Gibson rather than a 500 dollar Epiphone. Is there any crucial differences between the two guitars that would cause the price to increase by a thousand (or more) dollars? I plan to use the Epiphone in lots of gigs, which is why I like the lower price. I wouldn't have to worry if I bumped a $2500 Les Paul of it's stand, because hey, 400 or 500 for a good Epiphone isn't dreadful to replace.

Also, yeah this thread probably already exists but I am busy, so I am posting this now rather than hunting down another thread.
\m/ (-_-) \m/
Last edited by DRMguitar at Nov 21, 2013,
#2
Too lazy to hunt down the thread that essentially right below this one? By Odin, that has to be a record.


*cough* Anyway, it is worth the money you shell out. Or, so I've heard. I've only played one Gibson LP, and while it sounded awesome, I didn't like feel of the neck too much.
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#3
Epiphone < Gibson < The Searchbar
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Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Nov 21, 2013,
#4
How much do you care about the nitro finish and having a Gibson logo on the headstock? Because that’s where most of the money is going.
#6
I've heard fairly often about them coming really badly set up from the factory, or with random defects. If you get one without any problems they are really good, but not 5 times better than an Epiphone, despite costing 5 times more. I think thats pretty much true across the board though, just to varying degrees. You're going to have to pay at least $1,000 for a really good quality guitar, but the difference in price isn't really linearly related to how much better it is.
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#7
Gibson quality has turned to shite, just like ESP.

Get an older one.
RIP Tom Searle.
#8
I've got a lot of Gibsons, and my first guitar was a Gibson. If you'd asked me this question a significant amount of time ago, I probably would have said, "Well, of course it is."

I noticed, a while back, that all but one of my Gibsons are from pre-1980. With the most recent one, which ran a bit over $4K a few years ago, the question really didn't come up, and even now I figure that it is what it is, it costs what it costs, and if I really want it, that's what I have to pay. It's like a lot of luxury goods.

But if the question is, "Is it worth the money?" Thirty years ago? Maybe. Now?
I think the answer would be "no."
We've seen a LOT of posts determined to justify the expense somehow. "Better woods?" No. "Better Hardware?" Nah, it mostly uses decent hardware originally sourced in Asia and shared with a whole ton of other guitars. "Better workmanship?" No. We've seen far too many miscues and Gibson has recently tried way too hard to put out under $1000 junk with virtually no labor in it and try to get a premium price for it against better competition. Truth be told, if you wade into the "worth the money" discussion, you have very little to stand on.

But that goes for a lot of things, and we still buy them. We want what we want when we want it and we've always purchased some things for the status we think it affords us or for whatever other reason that we find acceptable to part with money for the privilege of ownership.

If you're looking for a guitar that will be a very good professional-quality instrument that will last for a very long time, you can spend about $500 and the job is done.
#9
If you like the guitar and want it, then it is worth it to you if you are willing to part with that amount of money
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#10
I always used to listen to people who'd write dissertations on why Gibson sucked and why Agile was so amazing and better, and as such, I bought half a dozen of mid-range guitars that I really liked.
I decided in the end to take a leap and bought a LP Traditional, and yes, it is much better than I expected it to be. Just try one and see, if you don't like it, don't buy it, but in the end, what anything is worth is going to be subjective and will be relative to the amount of disposable money you have and your interest in having a stellar guitar.
#11
Buy a used LP standard. You'll save more money and many people are selling them to get money for the holidays. I recently purchased an 07 LPStandard for 1200 in CA. I would never buy a brand new les paul standard or any other guitar. If you're concerned about money, try the guitar you'd like at a local guitar shop and search for it on the classifieds. Guitars very from guitar to guitar and owner to owner. If you're patient enough, you'll score a gem. Good luck.
#12
Thanks. Today, I visited the local shop, and tried out both Gibsons and Epi's. Overall the only differences I noticed were in the finish, some more bells and whistles on the Gibsons (that managed to work their way onto the higher end Epiphone's) a VERY slight difference in the tone, and of course the price tag
\m/ (-_-) \m/
#13
If you can afford a Gibson and you like it better than the Epiphones you play, get it. If you can't afford a Gibson there are a lot of less expensive guitars, such as Epiphones, that will serve you quite nicely.
#14
I didn't read all the responses but you can now get a 2013 Les Paul Standard for $1,800.00 there about or a Traditional for $1,400 on something like Musician's Friend. I'm ordering mine tomorrow morning. I'll post a picture when it gets in.

As for the difference between a Gibson and an Epiphone Les Paul. In my humble estimation the Epiphone pick ups sound generic. What does generic sound like? It sounds dull with little crunch something any guitar can do. Also, the length of holding a note is short. I can bend and hold a Gibson note for quite some time. The tonal range is different with the Gibson offering more tonal range than the Epiphone. But really you have to get into the store and play one. I'm guessing you can switch out the pick ups for about $200.00 more. So you are looking at about investing something like $800.00 for an Epiphone with better pick ups.

If you are worried about theft on your Les Paul because you gig you can get theft insurance from a company for some marginal monthly price. That's what I would do with all my gear if I gigged.

I'm not a brand name kind of guy. If an Epiphone sounded like a Gibson I would buy the Epiphone. However, from my tens of hours in guitar stores switching them out back and forth in my humble estimation they don't.

Of course, you always have to worry about QC with a Gibson. That's why I know I'm taking a risk buying online. However, that is the risk I'll take. I hope this helps.
#15
I played a Bonamassa Studio LP and it was worth$ 1400. I think and also the resale on that would be pretty good...,800 ,to 1100 right ? As used ?
Last edited by robertkoa at Nov 23, 2013,
#16
One of the obvious ways to get a Gibson *closer* to "worth the money" (on an objective basis) is to buy used. Get all squinty on price and overall quality and then strike.
#17
I played a Bonamassa Studio LP and it was worth$ 1400. I think and also the resale on that would be pretty good...,800 ,to 1100 right ? As used ?

However of you simply want a very good playing LP TYPE there are much better options per dollar.
#18
Quote by antics32


If you are worried about theft on your Les Paul because you gig you can get theft insurance from a company for some marginal monthly price. That's what I would do with all my gear if I gigged.


I have "marine" insurance on my gear. Protects from all hazards wherever the gear is. It's not "marginal" at all (but then I have a LOT of gear). Theft isn't always the biggest hazard (breakage and water damage, usually, according to my insurance agent).

Replacement doesn't get you back the same guitar you lost. You simply get a stack of money and now have to go out and try to replace it. If it was difficult to source in the beginning, imagine going through all that again. "Hey, Nik Huber, you remember that absolutely perfect custom guitar you built me ten years ago? I need you to do that again and yes, I realize you have a two-year waiting list and an 18-month build time..."

There's much more to it than that -- if you're not made of money and if you value what instruments you own, you're going to be far less likely to take out an expensive guitar once you have a bit of gigging experience under your belt. Once you've seen your gear bumped down a stair, seen your guitar slide off the top of a 4x12 as it gets pushed across a parking lot, seen your guitar collecting rain and snow while a roadie chats up a hot chick, seen someone's guitar driven over by a drunk pickup truck driver in that same parking lot or seen the same pickup truck driver pull forward into the Hammond B3 when he realizes what he's done to the guitar, you'll begin to change your thinking patterns.
#19
^+1 I typically do not bring my PRS to a gig, I use "cheaper" guitars, but they play and sound great. Besides 99% of people could give a shit what your playing, they only care if your good or not.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#20
I had an Epiphone. Bought a Gibson for four times as much. Yes, it is worth it. The right guitar always is - but I don't for a second pretend that I have not tried Gibson's I didn't like.
"Your signature can not be longer than 250 characters."

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#21
are gibsons good? i think the answer is universally yes.

has thier quality control gone down since the old days? i think if you really study, most people will tell you yes.

is their price - dollaor for dollar, feature for feature worth it? many will say yes. but i would be willing if you pair it will select guitars, such as music man, and compare build for build spec for spec everything.....

dollar for dollar a gibson is about the lowest value instrument in the industry.

i realise that is is a flamefest worthy statement but i dont think my tastes are a factor. take a music man. lay them side by side. look at every detail. take a prs, do the same thing. take a Ibanez J custom.

the list goes on. when you start getting into a 2500 dollar range, gibson does nothing really above average. its fact. just look. play them all.

i paid 1600 dollars for my carvin and it is a breathtaking work. i am blown that you can manufacture soemthing like this for 1600 when you walk into guitar center and see comparatively garbage for 1600 from some brands. my Carvin in wood wuality and build quality compares to PRS guitars 2-3 x its price tag.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Last edited by ikey_ at Nov 24, 2013,
#22
There are certainly brands that give more value for money than Gibson, but I'm not sure if I would say Gibson is the worst in that regard. Fender has a whole line of guitars between $400 and $1000 (used, between $200 and $600) that are all basically MIM instruments with various amounts of special stuff added. So you have Fender guitars competing with semi-custom models like the Carvin Bolt and MiA G&L guitars.

The "big" guitar companies just don't give as good dollar-to-quality ratios because they don't have to. But I don't feel that Gibson is a special example, really. Gibson has their Studio lines, which seem like pretty good values on the 2nd-hand market. Fender has their American Special and Highway lines. Same idea. Once you get above $1500 in price, I think you're going to see a lot of variation in quality among all of the brands.
Last edited by samuraigoomba at Nov 24, 2013,
#23
Hey..if you've always wanted one then you're always gonna want one untill you finally cough up the doug they command. ..of course they're not actually worth that much cash we all know it ! But all those epiphonies & other Gibson wannabes won't stop you wanting to own the real thing. .you know it.we all know it. That's why people buy & sell them again. .or maybey you'll keep yours..I kept mine !
#24
ಠ_ಠ

Why haven't the mods deleted that post yet?
Roses are red
Violets are blue
Omae wa mou
Shindeiru



Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
#25

That's a 1st
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#26
why waste the time discussing this topic. The OP has already tried them and can't see/feel much of a difference. I say let him buy the Epi and he'll be fine. I'd say don't even waste the money on an Epi STD just get an LP100 for $200
Moving on.....
#28
In my opinion?
If you like burning money? Yes.
If you want something you will keep for 50 years in hopes it will be a valuable family heirloom? Yes.
If you feel you need appearances to launch your musical career? Not really.
If you want something you can play without worry of theft or depreciation? NO
A high end Epi, Agile, LTD etc are just fine IMO Or Tokai, Burney or Epiphone Elitists if you can find them.

Gibson's are hit and miss and I'm sick to death of the snobbery.
#29
hey mod - can you get that BS off here.....

i mean really. i dont get the enjoyment. and im sure that took a few minutes etc to plan that out and do it. sad.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
#30
Quote by ikey_
hey mod - can you get that BS off here.....

i mean really. i dont get the enjoyment. and im sure that took a few minutes etc to plan that out and do it. sad.



Agreed, lets keep this place clean please. if we want to see that, we can go elsewhere
#31
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
ಠ_ಠ

Why haven't the mods deleted that post yet?

Why do you think?

We delete things as soon as we get a report, or see it. We can't have a mod reading every new post, 24 hours a day. Whining in the thread, which keeps bumping it to the top, doesn't help anything. Report it and move on.
#32
Quote by Roc8995
Why do you think?

We delete things as soon as we get a report, or see it. We can't have a mod reading every new post, 24 hours a day. Whining in the thread, which keeps bumping it to the top, doesn't help anything. Report it and move on.

Dude, the guy who made that post was banned by a moderator long before I found it. The mod banned the user, but they didn't delete the post. Did the moderator not search through the user's post history to find out why he's been reported?
Roses are red
Violets are blue
Omae wa mou
Shindeiru



Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Nov 24, 2013,
#33
Moderators can't delete threads outside of their section(s). That user was banned by someone who was not able to delete that particular post.
#34
I guess that's plausible.
Roses are red
Violets are blue
Omae wa mou
Shindeiru



Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
#36
Wood, strings and some magnets. In terms of features of course they're not worth $4000/$5000. But people are willing to pay that much for them so that's what they're worth.
#37
Quote by 2many_hobbies

If you want something you will keep for 50 years in hopes it will be a valuable family heirloom? NOPE!

FTFY

a solid top 1979-1980 Tokai LS-150 on the other hand.
I wondered why the frisbee was getting bigger, then it hit me.
Last edited by gregs1020 at Nov 26, 2013,
#38
I have 2 Gibson LP's now, both studios. Comparing them to my old Epi custom, and the Epi LP Classic I have now, the biggest difference is the sound, and the fact that they have nitro finish instead of car paint. They all more or less feel the same, they pretty much play the same, they all weigh roughly the same within about a lb of each other... The Epi's don't have flaws in their finishes like the Gibsons do, at least none that came from the factory anyway. The Gibsons have the aura of rock god around them more so than anything, which an Epi will never have and I think that this is what you pay for. Its not that hard to get an epiphone to sound like a Gibson at all, I can do it at home with my gear so anyone else should too... To me, this argument is parallel to expensive wine and mid range wine, close your eyes and have a swig of both and you'll push shit up hill to pick the difference. You're paying for the label.
#39
Quote by gregs1020
FTFY

a solid top 1979-1980 Tokai LS-150 on the other hand.


Damn. I thought my GAS was in check after I got my strat, I have been craving a Tokai/Burny/Greco/Burny/Edwards/Orvile for a while now.
Gibson LP traditional and DC standard, PRS S2 Custom 24, MIA Standard Strat, Schecter Banshee 7
EVH 5153, Orange TV50H 2-2x12's
Line 6 M13
#40
I own two moderately priced Schecters, two American Fenders, an imported Jackson, and a 92 Les Paul Standard. Price wise, the Les Paul is my most expensive guitar.

In terms of price verses function, the moderately priced guitars offer the most capability per dollar. I think the price verses function ratio exists as a curve that gradually levels out at the highest price points. You will receive diminished increases in tone quality and versatility per dollar paid the higher you go. Another way of thinking about that is the differences in tone, feel and capability are much more subtle in the higher priced guitars.

For example, a $900 Schecter is going to give you some good tones, reasonable feel and serve as a practical guitar. There is little debate that an American PRS 24 would be a step up from the Schecter, especially in terms of versatility. However, at over twice the price the increase in capability you receive on your extra dollars is much less than the base level capability you receive on the initial Schecter purchase.

As far as the Gibson Les Paul is concerned, it does a given set of sounds extremely well. Its cleans are warm and it can handle jazz, blues, rock and even metal well. In comparison with my cheaper guitars equipped with humbuckers, I find the Les Paul to be a more versatile and tonally stable instrument across the genres I list above. However, it does cost alot more money. The extra amount you are going to pay will give you a diminished increase in functionality per dollar paid than the cheaper guitars.

Is it worth it? Depends on you, your musical tastes, your skill as a musician and how sensitive you are to subtle refinements in tone and feel. Do you get more value from a PRS or an Ibanez? It depends whether you define that value as versatility or the legendary tone that the Les Paul will 100% deliver.

As for me, I want the Les Paul, the Ibanez, the PRS, the Fender, the Schecter........
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