#1
Hi all,

My gear:
JCM800 2203 + JCM800 1960 cab
Gibson Explorer (496R & 500T pickups) tuned in B !

amp settings:
presence 10; bass 6; mid 10; treble 10; master 10; preamp gain: 10

(the amp is modified to 15 watt, so I can boost the master up to max!)

I'm rhythm guitarist, so I really need a HEAVY tone, and that's exactly what I get with this rig, but I'm somehow lacking detail in the high notes. When I add a distortion pedal just for that little extra gain + sustain, it's even worse! When I put a Boss overdrive pedal in front I lose heaviness...

With a tab like this f.i.

e---7---10---9---7---
B---0----0----0---8---

the sound of the high notes drowns in the overall sound.

Is there something I can do to get more detail in the high notes without losing the overall heaviness? besides improving my skills
#2
Are the settings you listed out of 10 or are they based on the positions of a clock ("10" means 10 o-clock)?

I'm just trying to determine if your EQ is way out of whack. If "10" means maxed out, you may have a problem there, especially if your gain is maxed out.

I've found that an EQ pedal in the loop is one of the most useful tools on my pedalboard. OD pedals do neuter your low-end a bit, but I find them necessary to tighten up the sound and bring out some 'bite.' What an EQ pedal in the loop can do for you is to add back some of the low end you lost with the OD pedal, but after the preamp. You can also add whatever else you find lacking and/or reduce undesired frequencies. I find with my amp that cutting some of the highest highs really allows the low end to breathe a little, and there's still plenty of cut in a mix situation. I don't know if that helps...
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
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#3
Less gain is usually the answer here, but the amp may just not be right for the tones you're trying to dial in. The JCM800 has more of a classic rock/80's metal vibe to it, doesn't do heavy modern tones all that well IMO. The fact the amp is modded down to 15 watts isn't helping either. Generally you don't want power tube saturation when dialing in heavy tones, so maybe try turning down the master.
#4
1, Turn it down.
2, Buy more interesting sounding gear...
Shut up and play your guitar!
#5
Thanks for the quick feedback guys!
10 = maxed out, yes.

The amp is modified to 15 watt, because on 100w it's just waaayyy too loud, leaving hardly any distortion and sustain. Two things I really need, since we're playing old school Doom/Death.
If I put the amp-gain lower, then I lack sustain & distortion, so then I need a dist pedal to crank it up.

so I'm somehow in dubio here...

Our lead guitarist plays with an Orange rocker combo + Zilla 2x12" cab (+ seymour duncan guitar-picks in a Gibson flying V) and has a great bright tone and long sustain. He lacks some of the low heaviness, but that's where I come in.

Yet sometimes we both play leads, and that's when I am hardly audible in the high parts.
#6
Quote by plbrynt
1, Turn it down.
2, Buy more interesting sounding gear...
Troll or idiot, either way, go away.


EQ pedal. MXR 10 band is a good one.
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#7
Turn the gain down a bit and put an overdrive pedal in front and boost the amp to hell. (very high volume and low gain on pedal)

Also you do not want too much (if any) power tube saturation in metal so the fact you have modded it to 15w is not a good thing. Your clean headroom is seriously compromised and the power tubes start to distort when you want to play loud. The distortion should come from the preamp tubes.

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#8
since you seem happy with your "chug" then I´m recommending an equalizer pedal (boss is exceptional) to pick up your high´s when going lead.

.....And as already stated...less gain=lessmudd=more tonal distinction
I believe in god, jesus and the holy ghost.....or as i call them Angus, Kirk and Lemmy
#9
Turn down your high a little bit.

Also agree 15W is no good.

An EQ is always good to have.
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
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(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

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#10
I'm going to check how I can optimize my sound first by replacing my cab & put it on 40 watt. Then check for an MXR EQ an optimize further... thanks guys!
#11
H M Doom, one thing you also have to realize is that a lot of doom bands usually have a more defined setting for leads and phrases that need to be articulate and then when it calls for the super heavy saturated tone, they use a fuzz. take all the advice above, get your tone sounding good without the fuzz, then pick up a good fuzz pedal (black arts toneworks makes several awesome options) and then you'll have the best of both worlds, should you need it. But when the fuzz is on, your highs and high mids seem to get eaten up by the fuzz circuit, depending on how you have it dialed in and what pedal you're using. So im not sure if you'll be able to "have your cake and eat it too" in this case, but you will have the ability to choose at will, which setting you want.
_______________________________________________

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#12
Quote by arteestic1
H M Doom, one thing you also have to realize is that a lot of doom bands usually have a more defined setting for leads and phrases that need to be articulate and then when it calls for the super heavy saturated tone, they use a fuzz. take all the advice above, get your tone sounding good without the fuzz, then pick up a good fuzz pedal (black arts toneworks makes several awesome options) and then you'll have the best of both worlds, should you need it. But when the fuzz is on, your highs and high mids seem to get eaten up by the fuzz circuit, depending on how you have it dialed in and what pedal you're using. So im not sure if you'll be able to "have your cake and eat it too" in this case, but you will have the ability to choose at will, which setting you want.


Thanks for your input, but no fuzz! You're talking about Stoner/Psychedelic & Sludge here.
Traditional & Doom/Death Metal don't use fuzz at all... and neither are we.
#13
Quote by H M Doom
I'm going to check how I can optimize my sound first by replacing my cab & put it on 40 watt. Then check for an MXR EQ an optimize further... thanks guys!

Your cab isn't an issue. Actually, I think the '60 cabs are nice for heavy stuff. I'm assuming it has the G12T-75's in it, unless it's been modded.

I'm guessing that the amp has some sort of switch to go from the 15 watts you're using to higher (40/100?) settings? I would run at at least 40, if that's an option, and run a fair amount of gain on your amp, but not enough to make your tone muddy. From there, boost with OD/Distortions to get to your desired level of gain/sustain/etc. It seems you have two different drive pedals at your disposal, so this should not be hard to achieve.

Adding an EQ pedal to your rig, either using it in your amp's effects loop or on your pedalboard, will give you more tone shaping options. Personally, if I were you, I would opt to use the EQ on my board for a solo tone/lead boost. Set the EQ so you get the articulation you need for leads, and turn it on as needed.
Quote by Zeppelin71
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#14
Quote by sjones
Your cab isn't an issue. Actually, I think the '60 cabs are nice for heavy stuff. I'm assuming it has the G12T-75's in it, unless it's been modded.

I'm guessing that the amp has some sort of switch to go from the 15 watts you're using to higher (40/100?) settings? I would run at at least 40, if that's an option, and run a fair amount of gain on your amp, but not enough to make your tone muddy. From there, boost with OD/Distortions to get to your desired level of gain/sustain/etc. It seems you have two different drive pedals at your disposal, so this should not be hard to achieve.

Adding an EQ pedal to your rig, either using it in your amp's effects loop or on your pedalboard, will give you more tone shaping options. Personally, if I were you, I would opt to use the EQ on my board for a solo tone/lead boost. Set the EQ so you get the articulation you need for leads, and turn it on as needed.


Yep, the switch is inside the amp (no damage to the backplate) and can be switched with a small screwdriver. At first I was thinking to buy a hotplate, but this 15-40-100watt mod had all the advantages. It's electrically safe, it doesn't change the sound of my amp at lower watts, no extra material to bring on gigs & it was more than half cheaper!

Replacing the cab could however help optimizing my sound though. We're still working on improving our rehearsalplace with bass/corner-traps, carpet, diffuser, etc.

All in all, adding an EQ pedal will probably get me on track for the least amount of money.
#15
Due to circumstances, I played with my SG standard last week. As result my tone was a good tinge brighter (but less heavy & less sustain)!
So without pedals it is a matter of guitar/pick-ups, and not the 15w - 40w mod apparently!

Next rehearsal I'm gonna check out some pedals: DS-1, MXR + and Ibanez 808 screamer... on 40 watt.
#16
goddamn, that is a ton of highs. and presence. turn them down a little bit, bring the mids to 8 and maybe a tiny bit more bass.

edit: do you even want powertube distortion for what you are doing? you need a boost as well, that will help it out. TS or something similar.
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Last edited by trashedlostfdup at Dec 3, 2013,
#17
I'd dial out some of those mids. They always seem to clutter my sound. I generally tweak the highs and lows to my liking then add in just enough mids to keep the detail while maintaining the clarity.
#18
Quote by MAYNARD
I'd dial out some of those mids. They always seem to clutter my sound. I generally tweak the highs and lows to my liking then add in just enough mids to keep the detail while maintaining the clarity.



? trolling?
_______________________________________________

'08 PRS singlecut
'11 Gibson Les paul studio
'83 Gibson es-335 dot
'11 Taylor 114 ce
Bogner Ubercshall
Hughes and Kettner Triamp cab