#1
Guitar World sent me the Alchemical Guitar. I'm applying Loyd's theory of out of the box pentatonics to the chromatic because I do everything in Chromatic. In this diagram I've done two keys only F and G.

It sounds musical but is it good theory? My only guide post is that I start at F or G and end F or G and I did mark that. Tell me what you think. Any advice? What am I doing here?



Here is the seven pattern Chromatic I use currently and I'm working on getting out of the box right now.

#2
I don't understand what you are trying to say. I don't see anything chromatic anywhere. Those are just basic scale shapes in F major.

There's no such thing as "good theory" or "bad theory". Theory is theory.

Explain better.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#3
Thanks for the response. The second diagram is the chromatic scale all seven boxed shapes. You can find the Lead Chromatic Scale in Guitar Grimoire-Scales and Modes. However, it is the lead scale and I box mine in.

The problem I run into while improvising is that I cannot, until now, zip across the chromatic scale. I go from one chromatic box to the next.

Now, I'm trying to move in diagonals in all keys. That way I can zip across the neck. I think this is good theory as it is musical and Chromatic. I just haven't had the time to apply it yet as I have only done it in two keys.

If it's good theory I'll do all seven natural keys in both directions and post it.

What do you think? What is Chromatic to you? Does this make sense? Does anyone else think this is not chromatic?
#4
Chromatic scale has all 12 notes. Your shapes have just seven notes. It's not the chromatic scale, it's the F major scale. I think you are using wrong terms. I think you are talking about shapes? Or what? What do you mean by chromatic?

I mean, as I said, chromatic scale is all 12 notes (C, C# ,D, D#, E, F, F#, G, G#, A, A#, B) and I see nothing chromatic in those pictures. The scale you have there is F major scale.

What you have done in the first picture is just connected some boxes to be able to move up the fretboard. But the problem I see with your shapes (in the first picture) is that it skips some notes. Yes, you go from F to F but when you move from the low E string to the A string, you skip Bb. Then on the A string you skip E note. And when you move from the D string to the G string and from the B string to the high E string, you skip C.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#5
Chromatic Scale means all 12 notes, you're thinking Heptatonic Scale which is 7.
Last edited by Malchius at Dec 5, 2013,
#6
Well, as the previous poster have stated, you're using the major scale in the diagrams, not the chromatic scale. A chromatic scale contains all 12 notes in music while the major scale contains only 7.

From the look of things, it's good practice to figure out where all the given in a key are onthe fretboard. Doing this will allow you to know where the "in key" notes are on the neck. You're on a great path if you continue this and apply it to guitar itself. Just remember, when you're improvising, don't rely on just going up and down the shapes.
Skip the username, call me Billy
#7
Thanks. I got it now. I'm using the Major scale which is fine as I don't think you can make music using all twelve notes without any order.

I just tried the theory over practice track music and it works. I'll keep doing it. If you want I can post how it sounds. I zip from one area of the neck to the next then go to the boxes then zip again.

Any more feedback?
#8
^ So you are playing a scale over a backing track and it sounds OK? Well, isn't that pretty obvious? I mean, if you play F major scale over F major backing track, of course it will sound good. Because you are using the notes in F major. Of course notes in F major work over a backing track in F major.

I don't see how there's any "theory" in what you do. I wouldn't say knowing the notes in a scale (on your fretboard) would be theory. OK - it's really basic theory. But every guitarist does what you do - they play notes in a scale over a backing track (of course they may not think about the shapes or the scale, they may just play, but the notes they are playing are in some scale) - if I understood you correctly.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#9
This is what it sounds like. I use a real slow metal song to capture the diagonal movement. I go from one box three boxes down and then continue. It's just a small snippet but I'm posting to show it is some pretty good theory.

The track is in Am. It's very slow since I don't have the pattern down and I do make a mistake but that's fine I'm not nit picky.

Here it is:

https://soundcloud.com/henry-faith/diagonal-exercise


The theory I'm following is off of the alchemical guitar but Richard Lloyd applies it to the pentatonics. I'm applying it to the major or what have you. More notes more fun in my opinion. The idea is to structure diagonal movements in all seven patterns that way you can zip across the neck without having to stress too much. Less memorization more fun.

Tell me what you think.
#10
I think you should stop looking and start listening instead
Actually called Mark!

Quote by TNfootballfan62
People with a duck for their avatar always give good advice.

...it's a seagull

Quote by Dave_Mc
i wanna see a clip of a recto buying some groceries.


stuffmycatswatchontv.tumblr.com
#11
Quote by steven seagull
I think you should stop looking and start listening instead


Well, here's some more stuff I've done just through the major and by ear.

https://soundcloud.com/henry-faith/angels-in-space


I do look at the diagonal movement and that is why I'm slow, but I have the major memorized and usually just play it over practice track. Thanks for the feedback. Do tell me what you think of Angels in Space. I'm new to metal my girlfriend wants me to get into it. So, I get into it.

Also, my theory is that just like there are only seven major patterns there are only seven ways to perfectly diagonal across the neck in one direction.

I just wrote out all seven so if anyone wants it I'll post it.
#13
You seriously need to improve your bends and rhythm. (Also pay attention to the "rhythm" of the bends - I mean, you can do fast and slow bends - you need to learn to control them.)

Using your ears doesn't only mean that you play something and listen to it. It also means that you know how what you are going to play will sound like - you need to listen to the sounds in your head and play what you hear.

I'm not really good at it but I can play by ear, at least if it's slow enough and I'm in the right mood. But it's a skill that you can improve. So as steven seagull said, stop looking and start listening.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
Last edited by MaggaraMarine at Dec 5, 2013,
#14
Quote by antics32
Well, here's some more stuff I've done just through the major and by ear.

https://soundcloud.com/henry-faith/angels-in-space


I do look at the diagonal movement and that is why I'm slow, but I have the major memorized and usually just play it over practice track. Thanks for the feedback. Do tell me what you think of Angels in Space. I'm new to metal my girlfriend wants me to get into it. So, I get into it.

Also, my theory is that just like there are only seven major patterns there are only seven ways to perfectly diagonal across the neck in one direction.

I just wrote out all seven so if anyone wants it I'll post it.

That's the point i'm trying to make though - why do you care whether or not you're moving "diagonally"?

Playing guitar isn't a physical exercise, it's a musical instrument. Yes knowing your theory is useful and you obviously need to know where things are on the fretboard but that needs to all be in the context of playing music.

Decide what you want to hear first, before you worry about where you need to go to play it.

Here's a far more useful paper exercise - take your scale pattern that you've drawn out and superimpose the chords of the corresponding key over it. That will give you a very visual demonstration of how the relationship between chords and scales, showing you which notes they share which in turn helps you identify your "safe" notes so you know where to head back to when you want to reslove things.
Actually called Mark!

Quote by TNfootballfan62
People with a duck for their avatar always give good advice.

...it's a seagull

Quote by Dave_Mc
i wanna see a clip of a recto buying some groceries.


stuffmycatswatchontv.tumblr.com
#15
Quote by steven seagull
That's the point i'm trying to make though - why do you care whether or not you're moving "diagonally"?

Playing guitar isn't a physical exercise, it's a musical instrument. Yes knowing your theory is useful and you obviously need to know where things are on the fretboard but that needs to all be in the context of playing music.

Decide what you want to hear first, before you worry about where you need to go to play it.

Here's a far more useful paper exercise - take your scale pattern that you've drawn out and superimpose the chords of the corresponding key over it. That will give you a very visual demonstration of how the relationship between chords and scales, showing you which notes they share which in turn helps you identify your "safe" notes so you know where to head back to when you want to reslove things.


That's awesome advice. I will superimpose the chords. At the moment I am working on my ears by tuning by ear and other methods but this will take time. Thanks for the advice.
#16
This is all seven keys. It helps me move in diagonal movement across the major. I don't know if it's good theory wise but I can move in diagonal fashion and end up in a new box.

I've been trying to work on a slided version but no such luck. I'm just applying the knowledge in Alchemical Guitar to the major. That's it.

#17
Here is the best slided version I came up with.

Here is the idea. I slide over the root at all times.

I only do F, G and A because F starts out whole then G is half , then A is whole, half on the low E string. This capture all the possible patterns with a slide movement. Remember, there are only seven patterns. I play it and it sounds musical. The only problem is you have to do an inward slide. That's the best I can come up with for a slided movement at this time. I really don't know if it is workable but I'll play with it and post it on Sound Cloud. If anything this helps me memorize the fretboard and the major.


#18
How would it be bad theory-wise? Nothing is against music theory. Theory just explains music. And if it's music, it can be explained. And what you are doing is pretty simple - it's just moving up and down the fretboard. If it works for you, good. But there's nothing strange in what you do. It's good if you can play outside of the box shapes because IMO you shouldn't be limited to play in some boxes. You are just playing notes in a major scale and that's really basic stuff. Nothing strange in it and lots of people do it. It doesn't matter which area of the fretboard you use - it doesn't make the music sound any different.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#19
That's my last diagram...I don't want to be a diagram guy I'm just going to practice it in both directions now. When I get better at it I will post it on soundcloud.