#1
I just watched the BBC dokumentary "The Harp" with Catrin Finch, on youtube. At the very end and into the end credits she plays an electric harp with something that resembles a shimmer effect. To me it sounds like a double delay: normal delay of the clean tone and an octave-up delay that comes later than the normal delay. Please correct me if I'm wrong :-)

I know that the electric guitar sound is different, but I thought that the effect was really nice and would like to simulate it. Delay pedals with shimmer like the Line 6 Verbzilla makes sort of the same effect, but to me the octave-up sounds more muddy and not as crystal clean as the harp effect in the video. That's not bad if you want a U2 sound or maybe Sigur Ros. I'm also not sure if you can make a double delay with these kind of pedals.

Somewhere I read that you could split the signal from the guitar with a cheap jack-splitter, to get a clean sound on one line and an octave-up sound on the other. I have a Digitech Whammy 5, two small Zoom effects pedals and a Cube 40XL amp. Maybe I could have a delay on each line and the whammy on one of them. In the harp video it sounds like the octave-up delay is coming after the normal delay so I would still have to have a device (maybe one of the effects pedals) that delays the whammy sounds so it doesn't repeat at the same time as the normal delay. Does that make sense?

Could I simulate a similar sound with what I've descriped or do I need other pedals to make it work?

Thanks in advance :-)
#2
Does the zoom fx has a stereo output?
In case, it would be like so:
__________________________whammy -> delay
Guitar -> global fx -> zoom fx <________________> amp
__________________________delay ---------------

With the delay applied to the lower channel in my chart by the fx, and the upper delay coming from a pedal.
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#3
Yes, both ZOOM pedals has stereo output. But how can I make the upper channel begin later than the lower? According to your diagram both channels echo out right from the start, or am I missing something?
#4
I think you might be talking about a ping pong delay. You would need two speakers at least for it to sound right (and probably two amps too).
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#5
In my diagram, the delay would be coming from the zoom only to the lower channel.
You would need either a ping pong delay as Offworld suggested, or another delay pedal to put after the whammy on the upper channel.

So you would keep the whammy raising your non delayed signal's pitch, and then you would delay it with another pedal set to a different tempo.

If your multi fx thing has a ping pong delay option you can try and see if you're satisfied with that.
A ping pong delay is a delay that acts different in the two channels, but since you would make the two channels sound different before going into the amp you wouldn't necessarily need two amps, just a splitter cable/box used the other way around.
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#6
Quote by Spambot_2
In my diagram, the delay would be coming from the zoom only to the lower channel.
You would need either a ping pong delay as Offworld suggested, or another delay pedal to put after the whammy on the upper channel.

So you would keep the whammy raising your non delayed signal's pitch, and then you would delay it with another pedal set to a different tempo.

If your multi fx thing has a ping pong delay option you can try and see if you're satisfied with that.
A ping pong delay is a delay that acts different in the two channels, but since you would make the two channels sound different before going into the amp you wouldn't necessarily need two amps, just a splitter cable/box used the other way around.

Just trying to wrap my mind around it. If the Zoom-pedal before the split is set to delay, doesn't it affect both channels? Or is it capable of sending the delay out of left or right stereo channel only? Instead can't I just split the kable with a jack-splitting-adapter right from the start and have one Zoom-pedal making the delay on the lower channel and the other making the delay on the upper channel, after the Whammy?

I'm still not sure how the upper channel is time delayed/offset so it doesn't ring out right from the start as the main sound does? Sorry if I'm a little confused :-/
#7
Quote by Xerophthalmia
Just trying to wrap my mind around it.
1. If the Zoom-pedal before the split is set to delay, doesn't it affect both channels? Or is it capable of sending the delay out of left or right stereo channel only?
2. Instead can't I just split the cable with a jack-splitting-adapter right from the start and have one Zoom-pedal making the delay on the lower channel and the other making the delay on the upper channel, after the Whammy?

1. I thought it made sense that a signal processor with a stereo output was able to apply an effect to one channel only, though I'm not really sure it's doable.
What pedal is it exactly?
2. Yeah you could do that, I suggested the other idea not to have to use more than one splitter cable/box.
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#8
Usually in MFX units the ping pong setting is a single delay effect, that just bounces the repeats between the L and R outputs. That is, as far as I know, how all ping pong delay effects work.

So, take one of the sides, run that into an octave up effect, and then mix that signal down with the unaffected side to mono and run that to your amp. You'll get a delay effect in mono, but every other repeat will be an octave up.
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#9
Quote by Offworld92
Usually in MFX units the ping pong setting is a single delay effect, that just bounces the repeats between the L and R outputs. That is, as far as I know, how all ping pong delay effects work.

So, take one of the sides, run that into an octave up effect, and then mix that signal down with the unaffected side to mono and run that to your amp. You'll get a delay effect in mono, but every other repeat will be an octave up.

That makes sense of course. The only thing is that the effect in the harp-video sounds like the delays come in small bursts. Something like 2-3 echos of main sound, followed by 2-3 echos of the high-pitched sound (maybe there's some overlap). It's not alternating every echo. That's why I suggested some sort of "delay" for the pitched delay, if that makes sense.

It's a Zoom G1XNEXT and a Zoom 505II. I have to check the manuals for options. I know that at least one of them has action delay (maybe it's called something else), where the volume builds up gradually after picking the striings. I don't know if that effect could be applicable in any way.
Last edited by Xerophthalmia at Dec 12, 2013,
#10
If you could link a video it would make this a lot easier.
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

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Line 6 Pod HD500X
#11
^ amen to that :P
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#13
It sounds to me like she's playing with backing track

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#14
Quote by Tremolo Bum
It sounds to me like she's playing with backing track

I'm not sure that's the case. It's an electric harp and you see the camera panning over some kind of effect system. The blinking button very much looks like the delay on my Roland Cube. If you listen carefully the two delays are very consistant like I described. It's most noticeable at the very beginning where she only picks one string at a time. Starting around 56:12 or something.
#15
Awwwwwww!

That's two delays set in a very creative way.
The one on the right is a reversed delay, and the one on the left is one octave higher.
Lemme see if I can make a good use of paint, I'll be back in a sec.

Edit: here you are.
Name's Luca.

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Last edited by Spambot_2 at Dec 13, 2013,
#16
Quote by Spambot_2
Awwwwwww!

That's two delays set in a very creative way.
The one on the right is a reversed delay, and the one on the left is one octave higher.
Lemme see if I can make a good use of paint, I'll be back in a sec.

Edit: here you are.

Is the reversed delay affecting the octave-up? Or does the diagram show the Zoom pedal which only sends out the reversed delay via left or right in stereo?
#17
No wait I ****ed up.
Gimme another two minutes.

Edit: so this should do.
I'll try this today so I can so I can be 100% sure it works, but it should.
You have the guitar going both in the reverse delay and the octaver.
The signal gets delayed from the reverse delay and goes into the amp and gets raised together with the non-delayed signal.
Now both the raised signal go into another delay and then to the amp so you hear them both raised and delayed.
Name's Luca.

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Last edited by Spambot_2 at Dec 13, 2013,
#18
Quote by Spambot_2
No wait I ****ed up.
Gimme another two minutes.

Edit: so this should do.
I'll try this today so I can so I can be 100% sure it works, but it should.
You have the guitar going both in the reverse delay and the octaver.
The signal gets delayed from the reverse delay and goes into the amp and gets raised together with the non-delayed signal.
Now both the raised signal go into another delay and then to the amp so you hear them both raised and delayed.

Thanks a lot. If your setup works could you take a photo and post/send it? It would really help a lot. If it's not too much trouble of course :-)
#19

If that does not confuse you even more, it'll probably give you an idea of how it's done
Just try it for yourself, and see what settings you like best.
Mine were: low feedback, 100% mix on every delay.
Be advised that you'll need to split your signal in 3 if you want to hear the clean one.
Just send it to the amp together with the reverse delay and octaver.
If you wanna make a really funny sound instead, just don't let your clean signal through :P
This is how it sounds with the settings I used.
Name's Luca.

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