#1
Hello,
I'll set up a gig to play with my friends in the close future. I needed a new amp anyway, this is the right moment to do the upgrade. My amp should:
- be a head and cab design
- be focused to heavy metal and distortion
- be able to handle low frequencies because I play in C standard
- be able to hold up with drums
- the cost of the head and the cab should be max 1200-1300 which means used I will be able to get it for around 600-700

PS I live in italy, just in case it matters. I'm really close to austria though and it would not be a problem if it is available there

Thanks
#2
What bands are you into? That would really help. Because I could mention a 6505 but that might be wrong for what you're wanting.
Bass Gear:

Mensinger: Speesy
Fender Precision 1989 (CIJ Rosewood)
Fender Steve Harris (CIJ)
Lakland J Sonic 5
Epiphone Explorer
Maruszczyk (custom) Jake

Ashdown CTM 100
#3
Hey! At that price range you have a pretty decent selection of good mid range amps! I would suggest a peavey 5150, or a Laney ironheart, blackstar has some nice stuff, and you might be able to score a jcm 800 in that range, note that all of these amps will be in your budget if bought used.

Also I'm going to go ahead and suggest that maybe you look at combos? You can save a little money, and stacks are quickly becoming a thing of the past as clubs, bars, and most gigs are requiring you to run through a PA so your volume can't be very loud as is.
#4
I second the Ironheart, I have one I love to death. I think Killswitch Engage uses them too?
#5
Check out Essemusic.it if you can't get down there in person! It's literally massive, they have pretty good prices and will definitely ship stuff to most places in Italy. I don't know what amp to recommend to you but definitely check the place out if Montebelluna isn't too far
#6
They bands I'm into are children of bodom, arch enemy and in flames mostly.
#7
600-700€ for a 1/2 stack for metal is kinda hard but I'd say Jet City JCA50/100/100HDM and a Harley Benton G212 vintage cab and grab an EQ and an OD pedal to boost the amp
Laney Ironheart is a decent suggestion, so is the Laney GH50L/100L/100TI/100S ( the S and TI models have an extra gain stage)
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
Last edited by Robbgnarly at Dec 14, 2013,
#8
Quote by Jayerrr
Hello,
I'll set up a gig to play with my friends in the close future. I needed a new amp anyway, this is the right moment to do the upgrade. My amp should:
- be a head and cab design
- be focused to heavy metal and distortion
- be able to handle low frequencies because I play in C standard
- be able to hold up with drums
- the cost of the head and the cab should be max 1200-1300 which means used I will be able to get it for around 600-700

PS I live in italy, just in case it matters. I'm really close to austria though and it would not be a problem if it is available there

Thanks


Head:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/engl_fireball_e625_gitarrentopteil.htm

Cab:
http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_g212_vintage.htm
[..BLACKFIRE..]
#9
Why a head and cab?

The only reason I have a head and a cab is because I saw it for £400...and because I don't own a coffee table.
Woffelz

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Ibanez RG2550Z/SRX430
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I'm a student. I've got no time or space for an amp!
#10
because I can customize it, I can change it and I've never seen a 120W combo
#11
Quote by Jayerrr
because I can customize it, I can change it and I've never seen a 120W combo

Well you obviously haven't looked too hard, there are a lot of 100+ watt combos for metal
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#12
I'm sorry I'm kind of new to tube amps. Can you link me some good ones?
#13
Peavey JSX 2x12
Peavey 5150 2x12
Peavey 6505 2x12
Krank Rev/Rev+ 2x12
Krank Krankenstein/K-stein+ 2x12


And just so you know, a 50 watt tube head will be louder than you will most likely ever need. I have a 20 watt Krank 1980 Jr and it is really loud, I never have volume problems when I use it and we are a loud band (ampeg svt3 and 8X10 cab, Mesa dual Recto 1/2 stack and drums) and the 20 watts is plenty
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#14
I have a 20W fender mustang I and when I play with my friend (drummer) you can't hear the guitar at all
#15
20W Tube is a hell of a lot louder than a 20W SS amp. I've got a 6W Fender Champ that I play along with a drummer no problem. If your aim is focused metal I would be looking in the 50-100W range of amps though, they will keep the power section from distorting as much (you want preamp distortion with metal) and the bigger iron will make your guitar sound 'bigger'.

2x12 combo amps are ****ing heavy btw, more than I wanna carry and I'm a big guy. I'd recommend a head and 2x12 cab for portability and cost. 2x12's sound just fine and are easier to move around than a 4x12. I have no idea what stuff costs in Italy, so I can't really help with specific amp recommendations
Endorsed by Dean Guitars 07-10
2003 Gibson Flying V w/ Moon Inlay
2006 Fender All-American Partscaster
SVK ELP-C500 Custom

1964 Fender Vibro Champ
1989 Peavey VTM60

[thread="1166208"]Gibsons Historic Designs[/thread]
Last edited by Flux'D at Dec 14, 2013,
#16
Quote by Jayerrr
I have a 20W fender mustang I and when I play with my friend (drummer) you can't hear the guitar at all


Not counting in the fact that Fender Mustant I is not exactly meant for band situations you cant really compare tube watts with solid state. Watt is a watt thats true but SS and tube behave very differently. Solid state outputs its advertised power only at minimum speaker load it can handle (Typically 4 ohms, sometimes 8), anything higher and the power drops.

Also when you crank SS amp as you approach the limits of the amp it starts to sound worse so you dont even want to crank the damn thing. Thats why big SS amps need higher wattage just for the sake of clean headroom. Tube amps sound great when cranked and unless power tube saturation is a no-no (which for metal it usually is, the distortion should come from the preamp) less watts can be desireable.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
Last edited by MaaZeus at Dec 14, 2013,
#17
so you are telling me that a 60W is better then a 120W tube amp? just to understand, I'm a bit new like i said
#18
Quote by Jayerrr
so you are telling me that a 60W is better then a 120W tube amp? just to understand, I'm a bit new like i said

Not better, different. Just be aware that you don't have to have a huge wattage tube amp. But after saying that, there are amps that are not made in a lower wattage, so 100 watts is all you get for some of those

But a lower wattage tube amp will save you a little money when it comes time to retube the amp
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#20
Quote by Jayerrr
so you are telling me that a 60W is better then a 120W tube amp? just to understand, I'm a bit new like i said



No. Neither is better than the other. Actual max volume difference between 60W and 120W is actually quite small (its not double, only couple of decibels) but 120W has more clean headroom. It stays cleaner before breaking up when you crank it. However 60W tube amp is already very loud and you will destroy your ears and windows in your house before you get to power tube saturation levels...

There is also a mainteance thing you have to count in. 50/60 watter has an added benefit of having just 2 power tubes where as 100/120 watter comes with 4. Whenever you need/want to change the power tubes getting a matched quad of power tubes is not cheap. Luckily they last a long time but I'd rather just get a matched pair and instead buy beer with the rest of the money.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
Last edited by MaaZeus at Dec 14, 2013,
#21
what can changing tubes effect?
Thanks a lot guys, I'm learning a lot!
Thanks for your time
#22
+1, always save money for beer. More beer is always better than less beer.
Endorsed by Dean Guitars 07-10
2003 Gibson Flying V w/ Moon Inlay
2006 Fender All-American Partscaster
SVK ELP-C500 Custom

1964 Fender Vibro Champ
1989 Peavey VTM60

[thread="1166208"]Gibsons Historic Designs[/thread]
#23
Quote by Flux'D
+1, always save money for beer. More beer is always better than less beer.





what can changing tubes effect?


They do have an effect on how the amp sounds in general. I cant really say much about power tubes, for me as long as they work its fine. I have not cared about rolling them and trying different brands.

But preamp tubes are a different story. If we would compare two popular tube brands, JJ and Tung Sol, the JJ's tubes that I have owned were darker and warmer sounding where as Tung Sol was brighter. Its not even nearly as dramatic difference as what messing around with EQ would cause but there is a difference.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
#25
Quote by Jayerrr
is every tube compatibile with every amp?

no, they are not. However some types of tubes are interchangeable with others
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#26
Quote by Jayerrr
is every tube compatibile with every amp?



No, it has to be same type or something from same family. For example as far as preamp tubes go usually guitar amps come with ECC83/12AX7 tubes (they are the same). It is compatible with 12AT7 but it has less gain though it can be a great tube as phase inverter (the tube closest to power tubes) in some amps.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
Last edited by MaaZeus at Dec 14, 2013,
#27
i saw in a video about a cabinet and the guy said the you could the cab in 8 ohm stereo 4 ohm mono or 16 ohm stereo and 8 ohm mono.
Can someone explain that to me?
#28
Quote by Jayerrr
i saw in a video about a cabinet and the guy said the you could the cab in 8 ohm stereo 4 ohm mono or 16 ohm stereo and 8 ohm mono.
Can someone explain that to me?

that means the cab is switchable from 16ohm or 4 ohm mono operation or 2 8ohm inputs. When you use the stereo option you would still run your cab at 4ohms because your running two 8ohm loads in parallel (which equals 4ohms).

Most people run these cabs in mono mode though.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#30
Quote by Jayerrr
i got that but what difference does it make?

it makes it so you can run the cab with just about any amp

and you can run 2 amps at once in stereo mode if you want
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#31
Thanks a lot!
What are some other things I should avoid or look for on tube amps?
Thanks again for your time!
#32
Quote by Jayerrr
Thanks a lot!
What are some other things I should avoid or look for on tube amps?
Thanks again for your time!



One important thing. NEVER EVER turn it on without speaker attached. Majority of solid state amps do not care if you turn them on without load but for tube amps that is disasterous. The output transformer goes boom.

Some tube amps do have artificial load built in so you can do some recording from simulated cab output or something but thats more exception than a rule. I have made a habit for myself to connect the speaker cables first before putting in the power cable, just in case the amp is accidentally on.

Also let the amp warm up a minute or two in standby mode before you start playing.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
Last edited by MaaZeus at Dec 15, 2013,
#34
You said you liked Bodom and In Flames, the last I was aware Bodom were using Engl's now and In Flames were using the Marshall Mode 4? (It was on the Marshall site, I'm not a huge In Flames fan)
Bass Gear:

Mensinger: Speesy
Fender Precision 1989 (CIJ Rosewood)
Fender Steve Harris (CIJ)
Lakland J Sonic 5
Epiphone Explorer
Maruszczyk (custom) Jake

Ashdown CTM 100
#35
I am a bit confused right now. I don't really know what to look for in an amp or a cabinet. There are so many and to me, they are the same. Then I look into forums and opinions are always split. Some people say they love it, but then others say it's terrible. Same thing with a cab.
#36
Quote by Jayerrr
I am a bit confused right now. I don't really know what to look for in an amp or a cabinet. There are so many and to me, they are the same. Then I look into forums and opinions are always split. Some people say they love it, but then others say it's terrible. Same thing with a cab.

Well you'll get that. The absolute best advise I can give you now is go to a few music stores and try every amp/cab that is in your price range.

I personally don't like me playing out of certain amps, but I have heard others that sound great through them.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#37
so that would be the only way to test them? and then maybe buy them online after to save some money
#38
Quote by Jayerrr
so that would be the only way to test them? and then maybe buy them online after to save some money

Yeah, unless you just want to go by youtube videos and advice from total strangers . These days most retail shops will price match online retailers also. If not www.thomann.de has really good prices in europe
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#40
No worries, good luck
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate