#1
Hey Guys,

I' m thinking of buying a new (used) Amp. I'm currently playing with two different Bands,
one is in the Style of 80ies Rock/Hair Metal Bands, and the other one is a mixture of more extreme Metal-Styles.
So I just stumbled upon the JCM 2000 DSL on "willhaben.at" the Austrian version of Craigslist.
Some people say that it is a pretty good Amp for Classic Rock (and Hair Metal), and I've also read that you can also get a more extreme Metal Sound with an Overdrive Pedal.

So my question is: Can I really achieve these tones or would another Amp be more appropriate?
My budget is around 600/700 € (~900$), and I have no problem with used Amps.
I hope that I didn't forgot anything.
#2
I would say yes. The green channels are more or less voiced after hot rodded JCM800 (youtube for comparison), and the red channels have enough gain for very brutal stuff even without boost though as always its better with tubescreamer up front.

The biggest problem with the amp is that the both channels are voiced so differently from each other and yet they share the EQ. A one good EQ setting on one channel doesnt sound as good with the other one. It is easily moddable though, just snip one leg from the C12 cap (or remove it completely. The cap causes the infamous treble spike) and it brings both channels closer together. If you want to read about it, google JCM2000 C12 mod.

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Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

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Last edited by MaaZeus at Jan 24, 2014,
#3
Used ENGL fireball or Ironball will do all you need extremly well, but I don't know how expensive they are in Austria.
Used Blackstar serie 1 would work too.
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#4
Thanks for the fast answers.
You mentioned Engl, there is also an offer for a used Engl Screamer Head (400&euro, any thoughts on that one?
I always thought that the Fireball is just for the really heavy stuff.
#5
I have one of the old DSL 100 it can do just about any style and do it well. I would suggest getting a TS pedal for a boost for the more modern stuff, but it should cope just fine.

The JCM DSL is way better than the Screamer IMO
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#6
Elaborate on what you mean by "extreme".

The old DSLs are good at what they do, and they are excellent for getting classic Marshall crunch with good cleans, but they are not a substitute for something like a Peavey JSX and the range that has. DSLs are not inherently modern high gain amps. They have a lot of gain, but the voicing isn't right, the low mid oomph isn't there for modern sounds.

A Tubescreamer will go a long way, regardless. An EQ pedal in the loop will go far as well.

Youtube is your friend, really.
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
Fractured Instinct
(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

Ibanez RGA42E
Ibanez S420
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Ibanez RG520
Peavey Predator USA
Douglas Grendel 725
Line 6 Pod HD500X
#8
Quote by Offworld92
Elaborate on what you mean by "extreme".

The old DSLs are good at what they do, and they are excellent for getting classic Marshall crunch with good cleans, but they are not a substitute for something like a Peavey JSX and the range that has. DSLs are not inherently modern high gain amps. They have a lot of gain, but the voicing isn't right, the low mid oomph isn't there for modern sounds.

A Tubescreamer will go a long way, regardless. An EQ pedal in the loop will go far as well.

Youtube is your friend, really.


But then again a lot of oldschool death metal, the thrashier kind (Death and such) is hollow in the lower mids. Oldschool voicing, just taken to extremes.

Since TS is asking about 80s hair metal stuff my instincts tell me the classic voicing is what he is looking for extreme styles. Thats what i personally like too.

As you said, it depends on your definition of extreme. TS, what kind of stuff do you play in the extreme band?

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
Last edited by MaaZeus at Jan 24, 2014,
#9
Ever try a JCA 100? Two channels, same eq, but they are voiced the same. No reverb, at least mine doesn't. I just bought one with a hard case of CL for 200, spent all day with it, and it beat my DSL. Not Marshally, but it had this low end mid rangey grind that just worked so well. Less gritty, not that the DSL is overly gritty. has TONS of gain. like seriously, a preposterous amount of gain. It handles hard rock and metal great. Maybe someone else can give you more insight about this amp.
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#10
Thanks again for the answeres.
I can't exactly explain what we are playing, its a mixture of death metal sometimes
a little bit of black metal and also thrash influenced.
The other guy in my band plays the Peavey Triple X, and it works pretty
good for our music, but i don't really know if that one would also work for more classic tones.
#11
Quote by ultexx
Thanks again for the answeres.
I can't exactly explain what we are playing, its a mixture of death metal sometimes
a little bit of black metal and also thrash influenced.
The other guy in my band plays the Peavey Triple X, and it works pretty
good for our music, but i don't really know if that one would also work for more classic tones.


You might like something like a Carvin V3, or even a Peavey JSX (it's crunch is very good, IMO, but it will not do/nail the Marshall thing).

A DSL wouldn't be a bad choice, based on what I'm imagining. You'll probably have to boost the shit out of it to keep up with the XXX. But it should compliment interestingly, I think.

Also agree that a Jet City JCA50/JCA100 is worth looking at.
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
Fractured Instinct
(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

Ibanez RGA42E
Ibanez S420
LTD H-301
Ibanez RG520
Peavey Predator USA
Douglas Grendel 725
Line 6 Pod HD500X
#12
I have had a XXX and a DSL, the DSL is the better amp by far. I found the lead ch on the XXX almost unusable, I always used a boost on the crunch ch.

I say go try out the DSL and see if you like it. I use it for just about any kind of music and it works great.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#13
Quote by ultexx
Thanks for the fast answers.
You mentioned Engl, there is also an offer for a used Engl Screamer Head (400&euro, any thoughts on that one?
I always thought that the Fireball is just for the really heavy stuff.


Go for the Fireball, it can do 80's metal and modern metal. Plus over there is a lot cheaper for ENGL products compared to the states, you should take advantage of that. My Ironball is a lil beast.
[..BLACKFIRE..]
#14
Quote by Blackfire.
Go for the Fireball, it can do 80's metal and modern metal. Plus over there is a lot cheaper for ENGL products compared to the states, you should take advantage of that. My Ironball is a lil beast.


The older 60 Watt version or the newer 100 Watt on?
#15
A DSL with a boost would be a great compliment to your others guitarists set-up for metal.

I think it is right up your alley for what you want.

If you were a standalone guitarist in the band it might not cut for the modern and extreme metal, at least for me it was borderline acceptable even with a boost. Pair it with another amp/guitarist and it makes magic.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#16
Quote by ultexx
The older 60 Watt version or the newer 100 Watt on?


Any of the Fireball's will work as long as you can find one in your price range near you. Depends on if you want 60w or 100w also. I'm thinking it will be easier price wise to find a 60.
[..BLACKFIRE..]
#17
Quote by Blackfire.
Any of the Fireball's will work as long as you can find one in your price range near you. Depends on if you want 60w or 100w also. I'm thinking it will be easier price wise to find a 60.



Wasnt the 60w by nature rather scooped amp? It sounded awesome if you are alone or single guitarist in the band but against other amps it had a habbit of getting drowned out and this was something they fixed in the 100w version? This is something I remember reading about it a lot.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
#18
I would look at a JCA50/100. It's like a Marshall DSL in some ways, but it has more balls in the low end. It's a more modern sounding amplifier and it has tons of gain. Both amps are great however. Two of my favs
#19
Quote by MaaZeus
Wasnt the 60w by nature rather scooped amp? It sounded awesome if you are alone or single guitarist in the band but against other amps it had a habbit of getting drowned out and this was something they fixed in the 100w version? This is something I remember reading about it a lot.


Probably user/users error. It can be scooped like any other amp but it doesn't have to be and doesn't sound like it unless you scoop it. Sounds like whoever was using it needs to have their band balance out their volume levels.
[..BLACKFIRE..]
#20
Quote by Blackfire.
Probably user/users error. It can be scooped like any other amp but it doesn't have to be and doesn't sound like it unless you scoop it. Sounds like whoever was using it needs to have their band balance out their volume levels.

He is talking about the 1st series of Fireball that had a more scooped tone by its voicing not the EQ.
Or was that the Powerball

I'm not super knowledgeable on Engl amps
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#21
Quote by Robbgnarly
He is talking about the 1st series of Fireball that had a more scooped tone by its voicing not the EQ.
Or was that the Powerball

I'm not super knowledgeable on Engl amps


Yeah I know. It's just one of those things that people read and it gets regurgitated all over the net. If they can't figure out what is wrong with the amp not cutting through(somehow, because they will be mic'd also) then they don't know what they're doing. The scooped statement is way over-exaggerated(some people just don't like ENGL's tone). They did add a mid-boost not a fix for the 100 and the 60 will cut through live no prob.
[..BLACKFIRE..]