#1
Hey guys,

Just looking to ask a few questions about my pedal board. It currently looks like this:

Dr Z Maz 38 NR - 20ft Cable - Vox V 487 Wah - Wampler Ego Compressor - Akai drive 3 OD - Wampler Paisley OD - TC Electronic Flashback Delay - TC Electronic HOF Reverb.

At current they are all being powered by batteries but i've just made a purchase of this power supply:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=380794633325&ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:GB:3160

While i wouldn't usually buy cheap gear made in China, i have 2 buddys who bought this and swear by it, saying it's as good as the voodoo Labs pedal power so I intend to give it a go.

Anyway, i'm looking to get some advice on setting up my board properly aswell as getting a buffer for the board. I notice a loss in treble and some tone when plugged into the pedal board so i'm just looking to see what buffer you guys would recommend and where in the chain to place it.

My understanding is both TC electronic pedals have the option for true bypass and buffered bypass.


Any assistance would be great

Thanks!
Gear:

- Martin 00-18V
- Fender Tele (Sunburst)
- Fender Strat (Candy Apple Red)
- Goldtone CC Banjitar
- Appalachian Strings 'The Woodrow' Dulcimer
- DR Z MAZ 38 Senior NR Head
- DR Z 1x12 Cab x 2
#2
first off, YOU HAVE A GREAT SETUP. dayum. congrats.

i am going to assume that the pedals i dont know are true bypass, where the TCs have a good buffer ( i have both, and they seem great, and im going to assume the wah has a very mediocre/ bad buffer....like most normal wahs do).

20 ft oc cable from the board to the amp? how much to the board from the guitar? also a key factor.

also - that amp has an effects loop. i strongly recommend that you put them both on the loop, reverb first and then delay. this may involve some frustration with marginal benefit to you.

for example, if you are running 20 feet from the board to the amp, then you probably need atleast 20 feet (like 25 feet) to get back to the board into the back of the amp to the effects loop jacks.

generally, amps have a buffered (good buffer) or tube driven loop that does not require a buffer, and those TCs have a good buffer anyways. i recommend the buffer on, especially with large cable lengths, but MOST OF ALL because they have a spillover feature, so that when you turn them off, your delay repeats slowly trail off naturally.

that being said, if it were me, i would probably go:

guitar>wah>tuner>compressor.

that is debatable. all of these you want as close to the natural guitar signal as possible. ny logic here is that if you do compressor before wah, then you are COMPRESSING the usable signals the wah has available to SWEEP and work with, so....why would you do that? wouldnt that narrowly focus your wah?

perhaps you want that. i dunno. to me, i figure let the wah see all available frequencies without alteration, then tuner for maximum tuning accuracy, and then compressor.

you dont have a tuner. buy a tuner. you obviously can pay for nice stuff. If you are on a budget, i have this are it ROCKS! 45 dolla.
http://www.guitarfetish.com/NEW-GFT90-Footpedal-Tuner-ALL-NEW-CIRCUITRY-THE-BEST_p_1084.html

OD pedals - they are both very good. it depends how you use them and how you stack them. 100% dependent on you.

i would recommend a short cable from the guitar to the board. 10 feet. buy a cable with as thick of an internal guage as possible (that means a low guage number) and good jacks. that is of course you dont run around like angus young.

now the buffer.......lots on the market. list can go on for days. i recommend one that is TINY. some are on the market that are only an inch or so squared, and are always on, just kinda like screw down into your board type option. may be a good way to go. low maintenance. plug in and forget its there.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
#3
I have a tu-3 wich has a buffered output. It's not the best thing but in my case it brings back like 85% of treble loss. I have shorter cables and less pedals too, but just a though. On board tuner is always usefull.
#4
try this guy

http://this1smyne.com/shop/mb-mini-buffer/

aparently this is local to the charleston, SC area where i sued to live. friend referred me. good lists of artists using them,

but most of all, the buffer is customizable with different layout and options, ONE SUITED ESPECIALLY FOR DR Z AMPS!!! how cool is that!?

from this online interview
http://www.effectsdatabase.com/interviews/brands/t1m

Which of your pedals makes you most proud?

I'm really happy with the success of the Mini Buffer, just a remarkable little device.

Which of your pedals is the most popular?

The Mini Buffer is probably the most popular overall, and followed by mini taps and the E3D. The mini buffer as itself is a unit that in appearances does nothing, but when plugged in transforms your entire tone, it's been a secret weapon to many a guitarists board.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
Last edited by ikey_ at Feb 11, 2014,
#5
if the TCs have the option for buffered bypass, try setting them to that and see how it sounds. if it sounds good, great, job done.

only slight problem is you'd probably put them at the end of your chain, so the guitar cable before them will still be loading down your signal. So i suppose if things still sound a bit dark compared to plugging straight in you could get a buffer to put at the start of your pedal chain (or maybe after the wah assuming you put the wah first and if the wah doesn't like being after a buffer).
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#6
the V487 is buffered already. i am guessing that is one of the first pedals in your chain (i run my wah before anything else). that should provide all the buffering you need.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#7
I have kept my chain all analog and true bypass until recently. First thing was I turned on the buffer in my Hall of fame (fx loop) and put a decimator noise gate near the front (always on acts as buffer). I run probably close to 80 feet of mogami instrument/patch cables and there wasn't anything "wrong" with the tone I was getting. Sounded good. But with the 2 buffers it added a bit of brightness and presence. I now enjoy it as much as I enjoy eating cheesefries.
Last edited by cheesefries at Feb 12, 2014,
#8
Quote by gumbilicious
the V487 is buffered already. i am guessing that is one of the first pedals in your chain (i run my wah before anything else). that should provide all the buffering you need.


didn't realise that that vox was was buffered. yeah if it's at the front that might well be fine.

Quote by cheesefries
put a decimator noise gate near the front (always on acts as buffer).


yeah the decimator buffer is pretty nice. if you have pedals which are buffered where the buffer is good there's not much point in forking out extra for standalone buffers. conversely if you have all TBP pedals you might decide a standalone buffer takes up less space and lets you get one you like the sound of.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#9
Guys, thanks so much for the wonderful feedback and replies. I really appreciate it. I'm not sure the old V487s are buffered? Isn't the V487a (The newer model) the buffered one? I'm noticing alot of treble loss in my current set up with the Wah running at the start of my pedal board. I assumed a buffer at the beginning and then one of the TC electronic pedals set to buffer add the end would do the trick. But please correct me if i'm wrong

I've been told often to use the delay/reverb in the loop but reading through DR Z forums, many people say don't bother as they work great up front with the DR Z.

Thanks again for all of the wonderful feedback. I sure do love this forum.
Gear:

- Martin 00-18V
- Fender Tele (Sunburst)
- Fender Strat (Candy Apple Red)
- Goldtone CC Banjitar
- Appalachian Strings 'The Woodrow' Dulcimer
- DR Z MAZ 38 Senior NR Head
- DR Z 1x12 Cab x 2
#10
in general, people recommend time based effects in the loop, but its 100% setup and amp and music styles specific. for a higher headroom and a lot lot of cleaner music you are fine. if your are getting a lot of your crunch from heavy gain in the preamp, most likely not.

most DR amps are not multi channel and non master volume and very clean, so in that case yeah they are probably better amps to run time based effects into the pre-amp.
____

yes, most wahs these days have buffers, including cry babys. most peoples complaint is that its a poor quality buffer. i suppose that depends on the pedal. i consider my wah to have a minute tone suck, and why a lot otehr more expensive wahs make efforts to fix this or are true bypass.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
Carvin V3M, Avatar 2x12 WGS Reaper, vet 30
(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
#11
If you run the amp clean, than I'd probably avoid putting effects pedals in the loop. It's kind of amp and pedal dependent though. Some effects loops are meant for line level signals, others are for instrument level. Most effects pedals are for instrument level, and not all handle line level well.

I have no experience with the TC pedals you have, but my TC nova repeater works fine in front of the amp or in the loop, so either way will probably work well in your case

Try setting one of the TC pedals to buffer mode first. That'll probably help. If the rest of your pedals (excluding wah) are true bypass, than consider a tuner with a buffer. If you don't want a tuner, and also don't want any other overdrives or anything, than look seriously at a standalone buffer. But really, I'd only get one of them if it's the only thing lacking from the board.

Having a buffer before the majority of your effect pedals (excluding those that hate buffers like some fuzzes) is usually recommended (that's why tuners and od's with buffers are popular). But the buffer in the TC pedals may be enough, so definitely try that first.

I'm slightly dubious about power supplies that take 18V in and claim to be completely isolated. Most good ones take wall power. Instead of being completely isolated, it makes me think it's just got some kind of filtering circuit. But I'm no expert on this, so I may be wrong.
RIP Gooze

cats
#12
Quote by Tim_Miles
Guys, thanks so much for the wonderful feedback and replies. I really appreciate it. I'm not sure the old V487s are buffered? Isn't the V487a (The newer model) the buffered one?


No problem

Easy way to check if it's buffered is to remove your power supply or battery. If you still get sound when the pedal is bypassed then it's not buffered.

If it's not buffered then a buffer before or after the wah (try both to see which helps the most and also to check it doesn't interact adversely with the wah) would likely help, yeah. If the wah is half-assed bypass then a buffer should help a fair bit with that treble loss, hopefully.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?