#1
So, all's well and good, been playing acoustic for nearly a year, and it's time to move up to the electric. I've auditioned a Fender Strat, a Tele, and a 335-esque copy, and the Strat really charmed me (and not the semi, to my surprise, since I loved them aesthetically and sonically). Thing is though, I really like the music of artists who typically play Les Pauls, such as Gary Moore and Noel Gallagher. I will audition a LP, too, but I'm skeptical about its weight, higher fret access and neck. I know it's unrealistic to expect that kind of tone from the Strat, but can I get a thick tone out of it, stock? Also, I have my sights set on a Fender Blues Junior and a Vox AC15 if it helps. Feel free, of course, to recommend good tube combo amps! Thanks in advance!
Last edited by CostasNoir at May 16, 2014,
#2
Gary moore was Marshall, so look for a used JCM2000 DSL401 (Gary used a DSL100 head).

Some people like certain guitars while others can't stand them. Try them all out and get what you like the best. Same goes with amps
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#3
Appreciate the advice. But the amp is mainly for home use and jamming with friends, so isn' t 40W of tube power kind of overkill? I am saying this because my budget doesn't allow pedals, so I need to get a driven sound with just the amp. Now, I know that that's what the gain knob is for, but I will have to move the amp around quite a lot, and I am not the most muscular guy there is, so 20 kg seems like a lot. Can you please recommend any similar amps? Thank you.

EDIT: Maybe the DSL15C?
Last edited by CostasNoir at May 16, 2014,
#4
Just because you like music from people who play certain gear doesn't mean your gear should necessarily reflect that. If the sound of a Strat through an AC15 is doing it for you, there's no reason why you shouldn't get that. If a x guitar through y amp inspires you because it sounds good, get it.
#5
Quote by JELIFISH19
Just because you like music from people who play certain gear doesn't mean your gear should necessarily reflect that. If the sound of a Strat through an AC15 is doing it for you, there's no reason why you shouldn't get that. If a x guitar through y amp inspires you because it sounds good, get it.


I understand this, but my concern is with the Strat sounding thin with overdrive. I really want a smooth overdrive, although this guy here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6q7fbhypPI can make it work, but he's playing through a stack... Sorry if I seem like a dick, but I have a lot to learn about the electric...
Last edited by CostasNoir at May 16, 2014,
#6
Quote by CostasNoir
I will audition a LP, too, but I'm skeptical about its weight, higher fret access and neck.


Depending on your budget, the offerings from the Gibson brand are slim. The Gibson Axcess actually covers your bullet points fairly well, but it's relatively expensive, and Gibson really hasn't gotten around to doing the same basic guitar in a cheaper model.

If you can find one in your area, check out the L6S reissue. Body is wider, thinner, flat. Neck heel is nearly non-existent, and the guitar has 24 frets (it was Gibson's first-ever 24-fret guitar back in the '70's) in the wind. I have an original, which has slightly different electronics, and love it.

Carvin (hard to get to from Greece) has a slightly thinner body and is now available in a 24-fret model (http://www.carvinguitars.com/customshop/24fretcarvedtop.php), and has a very smooth (though not sculpted, like the Axcess) neck heel, great neck profile, a slightly wider cutaway. You can load it up with options before you get anywhere near the price of an Axcess.

Agile (also hard to get to from Greece) has the neck-through AL-3200 model, which has the same sculpted neck heel as the Axcess, has a tummy cut, has a slightly stubbier horn (which actually makes for better upper-fret access) and has neck profile options. The base neck profile is a decent '60's-size neck (I'm not at all a fan of '50's baseball bat necks). There's also a "thin" or "slim", which is 17mm thick at the 1st fret and around 21mm at the 12th. And there's a "wide", which is 1 3/4" wide at the nut, tapering back to standard widths at the bridge. But you're still looking at substantial weight.

But wait, there's more from Agile -- you can order up a semi-custom from them that can include a chambered upper bout (assists but does not solve the weight issue; these are still full-thickness LP style guitars), stainless frets, 24-fret necks and even longer scale (such as 25.5", etc.), Floyds, etc. www.rondomusic.com (check under "custom orders").

Oh, and if you have a tight budget, check out the AL-2000 Floyd. 24 frets, a tilted neck heel, stubby horn, Floyd, jumbo frets, etc. The weight thing is still there, but it's a helluva player.

I think Epiphone has a Matt Heafy Custom (http://www.epiphone.com/News/Features/Features/2013/Ltd-Ed-Matthew-K-Heafy-Epiphone-Les-Paul-Custom.aspx ) that has the Axcess neck heel and a good fairly slim '60's neck. It's also got EMG active pickups, which I'm not overly fond of. Probably heavy; see what you can find.

I've got three of the Agiles (including the AL-2000 Floyd and a Custom-built neck-through) and an Axcess Custom (like a standard Axcess, but done up in the black finish,multi-layer binding, ebony fretboard, MOP inlays, etc. ). I've also got some other Gibson LPs in storage.

One last thing: If you get a chance to try out a '70's Gibson L5S, do. I've had one for a very long time. It's a spectacular guitar, made of solid maple, probably too heavy for your taste, but it's one of those guitars that you have to experience at least once.
#7
Quote by CostasNoir
Appreciate the advice. But the amp is mainly for home use and jamming with friends, so isn' t 40W of tube power kind of overkill?


I'm using a Line 6 Pod (one of several, including both floor and "bean" models, in both older XT and current HD models). Acres of gain, acres of FX. At one practice environment, I plug into a small mixer that's driving a PA-style speaker. Everything's there.

You can get anything you need from a strat with this arrangement, and you can get it at any volume level including home practice with headphones or decent powered recording monitors.
#8
Quote by CostasNoir
So, all's well and good, been playing acoustic for nearly a year, and it's time to move up to the electric. I've auditioned a Fender Strat, a Tele, and a 335-esque copy, and the Strat really charmed me (and not the semi, to my surprise, since I loved them aesthetically and sonically). Thing is though, I really like the music of artists who typically play Les Pauls, such as Gary Moore and Noel Gallagher. I will audition a LP, too, but I'm skeptical about its weight, higher fret access and neck. I know it's unrealistic to expect that kind of tone from the Strat, but can I get a thick tone out of it, stock? Also, I have my sights set on a Fender Blues Junior and a Vox AC15 if it helps. Feel free, of course, to recommend good tube combo amps! Thanks in advance!


Strats are the best guitars for the money (price/quality). A decent Les Paul will run you into the thousands.

A strat can sound very thick through the right amp. You may want to get an HSS strat - that would give access to a humbucker, which would be a decent compromise. You don't need to upgrade the stock pickups on the current Strats.

A strat can sound very fat through the right amp - see Stevie Ray Vaughan or Jimi Hendrix.
#9
I must say from my own experience that a Strat is not very good for most of Noel Gallagher's music. I own a copy Les Paul (can't afford a real one) and it works great for Oasis stuff. I also have a Strat but I can pretty much get the same sound with my copy LP as the Strat and some other sounds. The Les Paul in my opinion is more versatile. With my copy LP I can play stuff from Nirvana (they are known for playing Fenders) to the Beatles, Oasis, some of Jeff Buckley to Rolling Stones to Pink Floyd. Don't get me wrong though, Strats are still very versatile and you could probably make one work But remember that the most important thing is to get one that feels right for you. Some people might mostly play Gibsons while others hate them. It is just the how it feels for you personally. Not what someone else tells you. Les Pauls are more bulky and heavy than a Strat. Just remember to get the one that feels best to YOU not what your favorite guitarists play. And try out as many guitars as possible. DO NOT SETTLE for one that may have issues or doesn't feel right for your first electric. You will only be fighting with it if you settle.
#10
Quote by CostasNoir
Appreciate the advice. But the amp is mainly for home use and jamming with friends, so isn' t 40W of tube power kind of overkill? I am saying this because my budget doesn't allow pedals, so I need to get a driven sound with just the amp.

Well, yes & no.

I don't gig or anything like that, and I have found that my 40w Fender HRD combo IS a bit powerful for our home use. On the other hand, if I ever do play a gig, I'll be good to go.

What you might do is identify what 40w+ amps you like the sound of, then see if you can find a smaller version of the same. That way, you'll get the core of the same tone you're chasing at a lower wattage...and at a lower price, meaning you can get a pedal or three.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#11
Quote by CostasNoir
I understand this, but my concern is with the Strat sounding thin with overdrive. I really want a smooth overdrive, although this guy here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6q7fbhypPI can make it work, but he's playing through a stack... Sorry if I seem like a dick, but I have a lot to learn about the electric...

That is a very straty sound in the video so if you're happy with that sound, go for it.

A tip though, most beginner bedroom guitarist that are looking for a very high gain/distorted sound tend to set their amp at high gain but low volume and are unable to get the tone they want and end up thinking it's the amp. What I'd suggest you do while trying out guitars and amp is crank up the volume and adjust the gain afterwards. You'll get a good crunchy tone without need a hefty amount of gain.

As for guitars and amps, I always go by the rule you can play anything with anything. It's all about the sound. You can use a schecter to play blues or a gretsch to play heavy metal. Don't ever restrict a guitar sound to a particular genre. If you like the sound of a strat, then play the songs you like, say Gary Moore, with it and see if you like it. If you like it then all good, if not then keep searching! It's more about whether you enjoy playing with that sound or not rather than I want to sound like or play the same gear as said artist.

But good luck on your search
#12
Thanks everyone! You have all been extremely helpful! From your feedback I decided to do this: Keep the Strat on top of the list. Take a Les Paul for a spin, see how it feels/plays/sounds. Try out a Marshall combo amp. And maybe save some money for a Tube Screamer - esque pedal.
Last edited by CostasNoir at May 16, 2014,
#13
try some strats with humbuckers
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#15
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at May 16, 2014,
#16
Quote by Arron_Zacx

(a) A tip though, most beginner bedroom guitarist that are looking for a very high gain/distorted sound tend to set their amp at high gain but low volume and are unable to get the tone they want and end up thinking it's the amp. What I'd suggest you do while trying out guitars and amp is crank up the volume and adjust the gain afterwards. You'll get a good crunchy tone without need a hefty amount of gain.

(b) As for guitars and amps, I always go by the rule you can play anything with anything. It's all about the sound. You can use a schecter to play blues or a gretsch to play heavy metal. Don't ever restrict a guitar sound to a particular genre. (c) If you like the sound of a strat, then play the songs you like, say Gary Moore, with it and see if you like it. If you like it then all good, if not then keep searching! It's more about whether you enjoy playing with that sound or not rather than I want to sound like or play the same gear as said artist.


(a) But if he's always (or mostly) going to be playing at bedroom volume, he needs something which sounds good at those volumes. There's not much point in his trying a plexi at deafening volumes, pronouncing the resultant sound as "awesome", and then buying it for bedroom playing and wondering why it doesn't sound the way he wants.

(b) I disagree. I work on the basis of getting the best tool for the job, because that's normally how you get the best results- and if you're struggling to get tones you want then seeing what people normally use for those tones is a good start. The old "you have to know the rules before you break them" cliché.

Don't get me wrong- I'm not saying you shouldn't experiment or anything like that, and if something "works" for you then that's great. Just I'm not sure the time to be trying out leftfield options to see if they work is when you're beginning.

(c) That being said, I agree. If you like, say, how a strat sounds for things which most people would use a les paul for, then absolutely go with that. Again, though, that ties in with the "you have to know the rules before you break them" thing. If you know that you like less usual kit for certain tones, then that's different.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?