#1
So I was messing around with the notes of D Major and made an odd scale. It goes: D, E, F, F#, G, A, B, D. What would this scale be called? I made it by taking D Major, removing the 7th (C), and adding the minor third (F). This way it would have both thirds but no seventh (what tonality would that be?). I'm also wondering what kind of chord progression would go with this D scale (why have a scale that can't be harmonized?) and retain its flavor. I think this scale could spawn quite a few unique solos and riffs (it could come in handy).
I'm sorry for starting this thread but I must know what this new scale is called. I'm kinda wierd and have OCD (especially when it comes to music). TMI, I guess. Have a nice day.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#2
There are a few ideas that come to mind when I see this.

Personally I would use this over an A minor because I love using those 6ths for flavor. You can use it chromatically. And a bunch of other things.

Also, D major blues you can use this for. But most of the time, when I mean most of the time i mean 99%, use your ear



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#3
All you're realisically doing is adding a minor 3rd accidental, and not playing the 7th. The 7th hasn't disappeared, it will be inferred from the tonal context of the song.

The best name for this scale is "the major scale with a b3 accidental" although you could also get this scale by using a combination of both the major and minor pentatonic scales.

The scale appears to be based on the major scale, so it will fit with chord progressions in a major key.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#4
So are you saying it still has a D Major tonality (how disappointing)? I still wonder if you guys could give me a chord progression with this sound. Guess it's back to the drawing board with my oddball theories and quest for unique tonality. Thanks for your answers anyway.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#5
Quote by RonaldPoe
So are you saying it still has a D Major tonality (how disappointing)? I still wonder if you guys could give me a chord progression with this sound. Guess it's back to the drawing board with my oddball theories and quest for unique tonality. Thanks for your answers anyway.


Ronald, I admire your go getting spirit.

Why don't you come up with a chord progression that goes with this? What information are you missing? It's all there, and after all, I thought you're teaching yourself theory? What are you lacking, that makes you unable to do this yourself? Just take one chord made from the root of each note you have?

Best,

Sean
#6
Quote by RonaldPoe
So are you saying it still has a D Major tonality (how disappointing)? I still wonder if you guys could give me a chord progression with this sound. Guess it's back to the drawing board with my oddball theories and quest for unique tonality. Thanks for your answers anyway.


Yes.

I'm not going to give you a chord progression to go along with it. If you are at the point where you are searching for unique tonalities, you should be able to make a chord progression to fit the non-unique tonality this scale.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#7
I think I've got one that goes with this chord progression. D, Em, A (Can be substituted with G major if you feel like it), Bm (can be substituted with Dm for pizazz and this scale). I know this will give you a D Major feel (or this scale if you took the last suggestion). I think I'm getting better at this and kinda harmonized it myself. Still wondering if my scale has a name.

Also I feel that the A Scottish (A, B, D, E, F#, G, A) scale is technically a Dorian Pentatonic (look at the notes and structure to see). Is there a guide for making chord progressions with the sound of (or at least to fit) exotic scales and harmonies.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#8
Quote by RonaldPoe
I think I've got one that goes with this chord progression. D, Em, A (Can be substituted with G major if you feel like it), Bm (can be substituted with Dm for pizazz and this scale). I know this will give you a D Major feel (or this scale if you took the last suggestion). I think I'm getting better at this and kinda harmonized it myself. Still wondering if my scale has a name.


So...D, Em, A (or G), Bm (or Dm). Fits to me.


If your scale has a name, then no one here yet knows it. The thing about scales is...the name doesn't actually matter, beyond "Oh, cool...(insert person's name here) called this scale (insert scale name) in the year (insert year)".
A name doesn't change the intervals or function of a scale.

Also I feel that the A Scottish (A, B, D, E, F#, G, A) scale is technically a Dorian Pentatonic (look at the notes and structure to see). Is there a guide for making chord progressions with the sound of (or at least to fit) exotic scales and harmonies.

Not to sound like a dick, but the best "guide" is your ears. What I mean is, listening to songs that use exotic scales/harmonies is the best way to figure out some common things that happen with different exotic scales.
Last edited by crazysam23_Atax at May 19, 2014,
#9
Pretty sure the Scottish pentatonic scale has another note in it. The note "I".
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

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#10
It just looks like GMaj/EMin to me but with an F as a "blues note" or w/e it's called. or it could even be just C Major or A Minor with an added F#.
#11
Quote by KillerPhail
It just looks like GMaj/EMin to me but with an F as a "blues note" or w/e it's called.

F would be a b7 in Gmajor, or a b2 in Eminor. A blue note is a b5.


or it could even be just C Major or A Minor with an added F#.

What? The scale doesn't even have a C note included. It can't really be defined as either of those without that C.
#12
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
F would be a b7 in Gmajor, or a b2 in Eminor. A blue note is a b5.


What? The scale doesn't even have a C note included. It can't really be defined as either of those without that C.

I didn't notice that lol
#13
Quote by RonaldPoe
I think I've got one that goes with this chord progression. D, Em, A (Can be substituted with G major if you feel like it), Bm (can be substituted with Dm for pizazz and this scale). I know this will give you a D Major feel....


Because you're just playing a chord progression in D major.

I don't understand why you don't want to make major or minor progressions. You obviously really don't want to make them otherwise you'd know when you were playing one.

Quote by RonaldPoe
Also I feel that the A Scottish (A, B, D, E, F#, G, A) scale is technically a Dorian Pentatonic (look at the notes and structure to see). Is there a guide for making chord progressions with the sound of (or at least to fit) exotic scales and harmonies.


It has 5 notes, so cannot be pentatonic.

And you can just call it the dorian scale, or the minor scale with a major 6th. Before you have a scream that there's no C note so it can't be dorian, please note that when you play this in the context of a song, the 3rd will be inferred (inthird?) from the harmonic context of the song.

Harmonizing the scale and making a chord progression out of the resulting chords will most likely end up with a chord progression in A minor, but I cannot be confident that you will know that it's in A minor.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#14
Come back liampje all is forgiven...even Galvanise69 can come back!
Actually called Mark!

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#15
You do know that I LOVE the Minor Scale (which I feel is essential for a guitarist to learn) and use it constantly in my own music. That's why I'm trying to move on and be more progressive. I'm a metalhead with diverse taste and that might have something to do with it. I feel the Minor Scale is overused in Metal but the Major Scale isn't right for the genre. This has me in a dillemia. I want a new sound so badly I'm almost willing to settle with a Dorian chord progression and call it a day.

Also the A Scottish really is what the A Minor Pentatonic would be if in Dorian rather than Minor (at least that's how it seems) and is near interchangable with A Dorian. So that was the point of my statement and I'm not mad about that scale being in Dorian.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#16
You're putting the cart before the horse.

Make music that you like the sound of, you can figure out what kind of monster you've created after you've created it.
Actually called Mark!

Quote by TNfootballfan62
People with a duck for their avatar always give good advice.

...it's a seagull

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i wanna see a clip of a recto buying some groceries.


stuffmycatswatchontv.tumblr.com
#18
Quote by steven seagull
You're putting the cart before the horse.

Make music that you like the sound of, you can figure out what kind of monster you've created after you've created it.

Exactly! Don't worry about the notes you're using until after you have a great riff/song/etc. Then, if there's one or two notes that could change, change them. Once you're 100% happy with what you got, that's when you sit down and figure out what kind of animal it is.

My songwriting improved almost overnight once I understood this principle. It's not about "fitting to a scale" or playing something similar to what everyone else has played. Don't worry about either of those things. The only thing that matters is that you play what you want to play. Figuring out key, notes, chords, and so on is secondary.

Quote by Myshadow46_2
The carthorse scale is the chromatic scale without the b5, yes?
lol, get out of here. Silly you.
#19
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
Exactly!
My songwriting improved almost overnight once I understood this principle. It's not about "fitting to a scale" or playing something similar to what everyone else has played. Don't worry about either of those things. The only thing that matters is that you play what you want to play. Figuring out key, notes, chords, and so on is secondary.



I think that is part of the problem. TS wants to play something that he can say is new and orginal, but he is trying to bend a well established theory to his will so that he can call it original.

Learn the theory. Learn some songs. Write some songs. It's an ongoing process and the only way to really develop your playing style.
#20
Im going to chime in and support Dmaj

added b3 is so ****ing common bro. Its a blues move of choice. Funk uses it all the mother-funking time. If you want, Ill literally take out the Bach partita Im working on and be able to show you at least 5 places with a 3 and b3 in the same measure of music. Except Bach is using it to imply a diminished tetrachord

Whats also common is to use b6 the exact same way b3 is used (as an accidental leading tone to natural 6). This is another funk/blues move
Last edited by bassalloverthe at May 20, 2014,
#21
Hey Myshadow46_2, I like your band's epic song, "At The End Of The Scene, The Walls Are Black And She Is Gone, And He Is Alone". Do you have any Post-Rock songwriting tips and stuff? I know I'm failing at being innovative with theory. Guess I should concentrate on my original Anime and Video Game character tributes (I use those inspirations to write songs based on the essence of the character in question).

Here's one for Broly (DBZ) called "Enraged Legend".
http://www.newgrounds.com/audio/listen/565086

I also enjoy making game remixes (which I use to help me write songs). Here's "Maiden of Velvet Room". It's a remix of "Aria of the Soul" (Persona 3) mixed with "Ice Cap Zone" (Sonic 3) and my own music (mostly for atmosphere though).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq5oe3TwclA&feature
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#22
Quote by crazysam23_Atax

lol, get out of here. Silly you.


that was much worse/better than my crappy "joke"
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#23
Quote by Dave_Mc
that was much worse/better than my crappy "joke"
\
lol, yeah

Quote by Myshadow46_2
I think that is part of the problem. TS wants to play something that he can say is new and orginal, but he is trying to bend a well established theory to his will so that he can call it original.

Learn the theory. Learn some songs. Write some songs. It's an ongoing process and the only way to really develop your playing style.

Based on his past threads, he knows some theory. He's just into finding odd scales. Thing is, this scale isn't really odd. As Bassalloverthe said, b3 and 3 in the same bar/phrase is fairly common.


But see...the thing is, you shouldn't worry about whether it's new or original. Just write. Notate the music theory later.
For instance, I wrote a deceptive cadence last night. I didn't start off by going, "I want a deceptive cadence". I played a few chords and then went, "Huh, it almost looks like a deceptive cadence. What if I changed this and this?". I then proceeded to experiment with different chord voicings, because I also thought it would cool to have some voice leading in there.
Point is, just let the music flow. If it looks similar to something, then you can change a few things. Or don't change anything. It all depends on the piece.
Last edited by crazysam23_Atax at May 20, 2014,
#24
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
\
lol, yeah


dang i just thought up a good (bad) one over dinner there

that carthorse scale... i think it's a misconception it's mostly chromatic. it's just the bog standard major scale, but a lot of people use a lot of neighbouring passing tones with it so some people incorrectly think it's mainly chromatic.

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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#25
Quote by Dave_Mc
dang i just thought up a good (bad) one over dinner there

that carthorse scale... i think it's a misconception it's mostly chromatic. it's just the bog standard major scale, but a lot of people use a lot of neighbouring passing tones with it so some people incorrectly think it's mainly chromatic.


That's so bad that it's chuckle-worthy.
#26
yay
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#27
It's the D Poe scale.

But seriously why not get really familiar with and proficient at using the wheel before trying to reinvent it.
#28
Quote by RonaldPoe
Hey Myshadow46_2, I like your band's epic song, "At The End Of The Scene, The Walls Are Black And She Is Gone, And He Is Alone". Do you have any Post-Rock songwriting tips and stuff?


Thankyou. That track's chord progression is just i VII v in the Key of E minor. Em, Dmaj, Bm. The solo just uses the E Minor Pentatonic scale.

Post-rock is generally more about rythm and timbre than riffs and the like (but that is a massive generalisation). Song structure is less rigid and will tend to move in quiet\loud parts and make use of slow building crescendos. Reverb and delay are very important effects. Tremolo picking is a highly used technique. Chord progressions will tend towards simple chord progressions, usually just 2 or 3 chords, mainly basic triads.
#29
Quote by Myshadow46_2
Thankyou. That track's chord progression is just i VII v in the Key of E minor. Em, Dmaj, Bm. The solo just uses the E Minor Pentatonic scale.

Post-rock is generally more about rythm and timbre than riffs and the like (but that is a massive generalisation). Song structure is less rigid and will tend to move in quiet\loud parts and make use of slow building crescendos. Reverb and delay are very important effects. Tremolo picking is a highly used technique. Chord progressions will tend towards simple chord progressions, usually just 2 or 3 chords, mainly basic triads.


How interesting and helpful. That's more advice on Post-Rock than I've ever seen through internet searches. B Minor seems to haunt me lately (and E Minor before it) which is why I'm trying to departure from them. Thanks for the information and I'd like you to check out the songs I posted above (I want to know if they're actually good). Have a nice day.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#30
Quote by RonaldPoe
You do know that I LOVE the Minor Scale (which I feel is essential for a guitarist to learn) and use it constantly in my own music. That's why I'm trying to move on and be more progressive. I'm a metalhead with diverse taste and that might have something to do with it. I feel the Minor Scale is overused in Metal but the Major Scale isn't right for the genre. This has me in a dillemia. I want a new sound so badly I'm almost willing to settle with a Dorian chord progression and call it a day.

Also the A Scottish really is what the A Minor Pentatonic would be if in Dorian rather than Minor (at least that's how it seems) and is near interchangable with A Dorian. So that was the point of my statement and I'm not mad about that scale being in Dorian.

Look at my signature (thanks to AlanHB ).

Also, not every note you play in a song needs to belong to one scale. You are playing the D major scale but also using the b3 accidental which is really usual, especially in bluesy music (blues mixes minor and major a lot). There doesn't need to be one scale that every note you play fits. You can play a mix of two scales. Or just not think about scales at all. The note choice has a lot to do with the chords. If you play a D major chord, it will sound really dissonant if you play an F over it. On the other hand, if you play a D minor chord (which also fits the scale) and play a F# over it, it will sound really dissonant too. There isn't one chord progression that all notes of this scale would work over.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
Last edited by MaggaraMarine at May 22, 2014,
#31
MaggaraMarine, your signature is what I call "The Pentatonic Minor Scale in a nutshell" (seriously it describes that scale all too well). Also I'll call my call the D Funky Major Scale (because stuff like this is used in Funk and Blues). I also agree that accidentals both add interest and complicate things.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#32
Yeah, call your scale whatever you want. The name doesn't matter, the sound does. But as I said, you need to be a bit careful when using that scale. You can use the F as a passing tone (which is really common) but I would try avoiding playing it over the D major chord and especially playing F# over D minor chord (that will sound really dissonant).
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#33
Quote by GuitarMunky
It's the D Poe scale.

But seriously why not get really familiar with and proficient at using the wheel before trying to reinvent it.


boom.
Anfangen ist leicht, Beharren eine Kunst.
#34
Quote by AeolianWolf
boom.


Hello?

@TC- I think it's nice to focus on exotic scales and harmony, but I'd focus more on what sounds good to your own ears first. Don't worry about the technicalities until after you've written the piece.
#35
I made this just for fun and experimentation. It's just a midi with the leads to my piece, "Price of Glory", in the bass and a bunch of arpeggios and junk in the treble. What keu would this be in and is the second song (the original "Price of Glory") any good. I'm still learning new grounds and will soon release some tips on different styles (discovered through a mixture of research and some song analysis).

http://www.mediafire.com/download/1lpjg8clu2p6rwd/Weirdly+tuned+arpeggios.zip
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).