#1
Hi, I was watching my favorite episode of Squidbillies and trying to replicate the first part of Early's guitar solo (the first part where he plays an E Minor chord so crazy and fast, it makes a laser sound with his guitar). I'm curious if it's possible to replicate that part. I've already had someone transcribe the rest of the solo so this is the only part I'm stuck on. I've heard it involves glissando on that E Minor chord but how do you accomplish that?

A link to the solo in question
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZptg1uUgcE

Also I was continuing my quest for a new tonality by messing around and stringing different 16th note arpeggios together into one piece. I'm curious what key my experiment is in and what tonality would fit it? Here's a link.
http://www.mediafire.com/download/56lj4jmo1ptljkk/Wilder_Arpeggio_stream.mid

I know these are unrelated but I'd like advice on either one.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#2
Laser chords...? You mean the first part that's obviously been sped up?
#3
1. it's actually an Open E Major chord... and nope (no laser effect) even if you string the guitar to an Open E Chord your still not gonna get that exact sound because it's electroniclly raised, altho you could get fairly close just trying to match the chromatic chord changes to eventually running your fingers up the strings above the sound hole when appropriate.

2. Closest I got was the Key of A... but even that's highly debatable.
utilising A dorian, E minor Pentatonic and a few chromatics...
then there's that sudden chromatic switch using F minor triad to Ebm to F#maj7b5?
(perhaps natural Minor in A sharp there)... before returning to the original theme...

maybe google voice leading, chromatic modulation, non-diatonic changes or something??? (I don't even know if they are the right terms but I think you get the idea???) lol (at least I gave an answer) double lol

Hopefully someone else might expand on my answer a bit more
Last edited by tonibet72 at May 25, 2014,
#4
The solo is obviously sped up. The raising pitch is the result of speeding up a recording.

And the tonality you found? You found something that sounded horrible. The two "melodies" didn't fit each other at all. All notes sounded random. I wouldn't call it a "tonality". Your "piece" doesn't resolve anywhere. It just sounds random. Make some real music with that "tonality" and we can tell you what it is.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#6
Your insults are ... completely justified. I only made my "Wilder Arpeggio Stream" because I was frustrated at all my previous attempts being in a minor or major key. It actually isn't as random as you think but kinda sounds like serialism gone horribly wrong. That Resident Evil link sounds both crappy and more resolved than my piece.

I do have a better piece with some atonality (it's actually more coherent and makes use of motifs). It's my Broly (DBZ) tribute "Enraged Legend". I've been told multiple times by friends that it's really good. Here's another link (please listen to it).
http://www.newgrounds.com/audio/listen/565086

I get the Squidbillies solo though (still curious how to use a glissando on a chord though) and decided to let someone else cover it. Do you guys have any better approaches to my tonality problem? If I wanted to sound funky, I'd use some pops/snaps and heavy hammer-on.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#7
^ That's not atonal. You can hear clear key centers. If you want to write atonal music, I think it's better to focus on other things than melody. Atonal music isn't something I would call melodic.

But I don't think songs in minor or major are boring at all. Don't go and blame "boring" keys. Blame yourself. As my signature says, there are no boring scales, just boring players. Good guitarists can make really good sounding stuff with just the minor pentatonic scale. Beginners try to find more "exotic" scales that don't really sound good other than over certain chords. And after using them for a while they start sounding boring and people start looking for new scales.

The thing is, you need to learn to use the minor and major scales. It's all about learning to use stuff. Minor and major aren't boring if you can use them right.

Sometimes simple is good. Try writing simple songs and make them sound good.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#8
I know you can do a lot in normal keys but I can be rhythmically interesting on guitar(pops/snaps from funk and unique rhythms that remain in 4/4). I'm trying to find a new tonality to sound for something fresh and new that people don't hear every day. My hero in guitar is Buckethead and I'm trying to be weird like him. Writing simple stuff is boring and tired (which I'm trying to avoid). I've mentioned my love of the Minor/Aeolian scale already though.

Just listen to his (Buckethead) cover of the "Star Wars" theme. I'm curious how to be strange and clever like that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7kjAoLcLkU

Also it seems both my experiment and "Enraged Legend" are in the G Major family/E Minor (according to KeyFinder). It seems I've failed again. Got any suggestions on how I should go about making a unique tonality that actually sounds decent and interesting (either a scale/mode or chord progression). I'm still learning but my progress is going pretty well.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#9
I'm surprised you like buckethead, because his songs are in keys. But then again:

Quote by RonaldPoe
Also it seems both my experiment and "Enraged Legend" are in the G Major family/E Minor (according to KeyFinder). It seems I've failed again. Got any suggestions on how I should go about making a unique tonality that actually sounds decent and interesting (either a scale/mode or chord progression). I'm still learning but my progress is going pretty well.


You don't know how to determine whether a song is in a key, so you wouldn't have known that.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#10
You are fast achieving infamy status.

Like Liampje - but, the boy eventually understood, went out and did it right, and now, is very competent...took a couple of years, his head was harder than a billy goat, but when he finally wore himself out, the boy did well. I have hope, that eventually you will too.

Best,

Sean
#12
You are thinking way too technically. Just write music. You shouldn't care too much about being/not being in a key. Because in the end that doesn't matter. What matters is if it sounds good or not. As Alan said, Buckethead's music is in a key.

So just write music. Hear something in your head and write it. That way you'll be happy with the result. The best ideas are in your head.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#13
Quote by RonaldPoe
I know you can do a lot in normal keys but I can be rhythmically interesting on guitar(pops/snaps from funk and unique rhythms that remain in 4/4). I'm trying to find a new tonality to sound for something fresh and new that people don't hear every day. My hero in guitar is Buckethead and I'm trying to be weird like him. Writing simple stuff is boring and tired (which I'm trying to avoid). I've mentioned my love of the Minor/Aeolian scale already though.

And that's your problem right there, you're trying too hard to be clever when you don't know enough.

There's an old saying - You have to know the rules before you can break them.

You're trying to break them before you understand them properly, and that's never going to work. When things sound "weird" it's usually because the person composing the piece carefully chose when to break from convention and do something a bit left of field. Weird things sound their weirdest when there's something "normal" to contrast with.If you're just trying to be "weird" with your limited knowledge and experience you'll most likely just end up with a mess.

Actually called Mark!

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#15
I get what you're all saying and thus I'm forced to postpone my goal. I'm still avoiding writing simple but motifs should be enough for now. Right now I'll just go back to writing music and remixes. I'm still curious about how you glissando a chord though. Thanks for putting up with my wild-goose-chase.

Also I admit I never learned to apply basic theory and just read enough to think I could go advanced.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
Last edited by RonaldPoe at May 26, 2014,
#16
Quote by RonaldPoe
I get what you're all saying and thus I'm forced to postpone my goal. I'm still avoiding writing simple but motifs should be enough for now. Right now I'll just go back to writing music and remixes. I'm still curious about how you glissando a chord though. Thanks for putting up with my wild-goose-chase.

Also I admit I never learned to apply basic theory and just read enough to think I could go advanced.

You can glissando a chord by speeding up the tape. And that's what they did in the video. You could also tune your guitar to open tuning and use slide.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#17
**** all the haters ITT OP

"I certainly had no feeling for harmony, and Schoenberg thought that that would make it impossible for me to write music. He said, 'You'll come to a wall you won't be able to get through.' So I said, 'I'll beat my head against that wall.' And I did, literally, and the rhythm that came out of it was my music."

--John Cage


If you want to use harmony in a "normal" way, you will need to learn the rules tho
Last edited by bassalloverthe at May 26, 2014,
#18
Quote by bassalloverthe
**** all the haters ITT OP

"I certainly had no feeling for harmony, and Schoenberg thought that that would make it impossible for me to write music. He said, 'You'll come to a wall you won't be able to get through.' So I said, 'I'll beat my head against that wall.' And I did, literally, and the rhythm that came out of it was my music."

--John Cage


If you want to use harmony in a "normal" way, you will need to learn the rules tho

I think learning theory will help OP in both cases (if he wants or doesn't want to use harmony the "normal" way). Because I think he doesn't really know what he wants to do. I agree that experimenting is great but he just doesn't seem to understand if something is in a key or not. And he doesn't seem to udnerstand that you can do lots of more odd sounding things with tonal music (just like Buckethead). It doesn't need to be atonal or outside of minor or major to not sound generic.

I'm pretty sure all the atonal composers knew theory really well.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#19
Quote by RonaldPoe
Hi, I was watching my favorite episode of Squidbillies and trying to replicate the first part of Early's guitar solo (the first part where he plays an E Minor chord so crazy and fast, it makes a laser sound with his guitar). I'm curious if it's possible to replicate that part. I've already had someone transcribe the rest of the solo so this is the only part I'm stuck on. I've heard it involves glissando on that E Minor chord but how do you accomplish that?

A link to the solo in question
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZptg1uUgcE

Also I was continuing my quest for a new tonality by messing around and stringing different 16th note arpeggios together into one piece. I'm curious what key my experiment is in and what tonality would fit it? Here's a link.
http://www.mediafire.com/download/56lj4jmo1ptljkk/Wilder_Arpeggio_stream.mid

I know these are unrelated but I'd like advice on either one.



Dude forget all that bullshit and just start playing your guitar. and I mean music, not stupid shit that you think will make you unique or weird. Seriously
Last edited by GuitarMunky at May 27, 2014,
#20
First here's the best theory guide I could find (ironically on this very site)
http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/lessons/for_beginners/learning_music_theory_the_beginning.html

Also I discovered an odd scale (sorry couldn't help myself) called "Phrygian #4" and I believe it goes like this in B; B, D, F, F#, G, A, B. Are those the right notes because I just added a sharpened 4th to B Phrygian. I heard it's related to the 16-TET scales (which include "Super Diatonic" scales) but is that true (this scale is also called "Super Phrygian" according to a couple sources)?

Speaking of John Cage (hope this doesn't bring up a flame-war), what key is the climax of "In The Name of The Holocaust" in? I know I said I would stop this but I realized that if I give up, nothing new will be accomplished and this will all be for nothing (Can't have that). I'm stubborn but so were guys like Thomas Edison, J.S. Bach, and John Cage himself (they each accomplished a lot). I learned not to give up no matter the opposition (unless I'm getting arrested) and I will balance my songwriting and tonal goals together.

Here's a link to the climax of "In The Name of The Holocaust" by John Cage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q865x7K_QP4

Have a nice day everyone.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#21
^ The key of that piece doesn't matter. I wouldn't even try to find the key. The piece is about making different kind of sounds/noises with the piano. The "melodies"/"harmonies" aren't the point of that kind of music so I wouldn't do a harmonic analyze on it. You could play almost any notes and it would sound almost the same. The point of that piece isn't in the notes you play. It's in the dynamics and the sounds you make with the instrument. It's about taking the advantage of the timbre of the piano and describing feelings with it. Again, the notes don't matter so finding the tonality is pointless.

Also, I think phrygian #4 would be a phrygian scale with the perfect fourth replaced with an augmented fourth. So the formula of the scale would be 1, b2, b3, #4, 5, b6, b7. And B phrygian #4 would be B, C, D, E#, F#, G, A. I wouldn't call it a new scale. I would call it something with accidentals. As I've said before, I see no point in trying to fit every note in a song into one scale. That's not understanding it musically. Some notes are more important than others. Some notes are just passing tones, some are chord tones. If you have a lot of non-diatonic chords, I wouldn't try to build a scale from every note used in the song. You need to understand which of the chords are non-diatonic.

For example if I we take the progression of "Forget You", it's G-A-C-G. If we build a scale using every note used in the progression, it would be G A B C C# D E. But if you understand something about theory, you may notice that the A major chord is a non-diatonic chord. It doesn't belong to the key signature. I see no point in trying to build a scale from all notes in the song. It doesn't tell anything about the music.

Also, it wouldn't sound good if you played G A B C C# D and E over all chords in the song. Some of those notes only work over some chords. playing C# over the C chord will sound bad. Playing C over the A chord will sound bad. The "scale" we got doesn't tell about the music (because we don't see the contet the notes were used - thus we don't know the function of any of the notes) and there's no point in trying to name it.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
Last edited by MaggaraMarine at May 27, 2014,
#22
If your talking about Cee Lo Green's "Forget You", that song has C Major written all over it (not that it's a bad thing). Also John Cage's "harmonies" are mostly sounds and noise for the sake of it with improvisation thrown in (as shown in that example along with "Water Walk"). I was just curious what the first answer would be.

Did you know Hans Zimmer is fond of D Minor (he's awesome and far from ordinary). For example, "Why So Serious" (The Dark Knight) is based on a chaotic D note. Meanwhile Frank Zappa's favorite mode was Dorian. Point is that people can have a favorite scale/mode and still sound like nobody else.

I'm also curious if it's possible for there to be a Phrygian #4 chord progression (one with that scale's sound). I think Augmented Forth is another way to say "tritone" (a interval of six half-steps). Anyway now I'm just rambling so have a nice day.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).
#23
^ Yeah, of course I meant C, not G. I just thought the song in another key but it doesn't matter. G-A-C-G = C-D-F-C

I'm not sure if you are getting my point or not. What I'm saying is that it makes no sense to analyze every single note in a piece and try to fit every note in the same scale. That's why I used "Forget You" as an example. It uses a non-diatonic chord. And if you build a scale from all notes used in the piece, it doesn't tell anything about the function of the notes. The F# note in the D major chord is a chord tone. I don't think it should be included in the scale.

There was one thread where somebody asked about some Moomin music and what scales it used and things like that. The piece used a secondary dominant (V/V) and somebody went and said that the scale it used was the blues scale. Yes. Blues scale does have enharmonically the same notes but it was definitely not the blues scale the piece used. The tritone in blues scale has a different function than the third of the V/V chord. That's my point - you shouldn't look at all notes in a song and build a scale from them. You need to look at the context.

And yeah, some composers tend to use certain note choices a bit more often. But it's not all about the note choice. There's so much more to style than just scales. You can write in the style of Frank Zappa by using any scale or key. That's why "what scale do I need to use to sound like [insert a guitarist]" questions are so stupid. You can use whatever scales to sound like somebody. Yes, certain guitarists do have their signature licks. But think about it. If Steve Vai plays a song in G major and another song in D minor, in both cases he would sound like Steve Vai. Style is more than note choice.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
Last edited by MaggaraMarine at May 28, 2014,
#24
You're exactly right. Distinct style comes from not just note choice but also rhythms, tone, and articulation. It's more useful to learn the artist's "pet licks" (my term for phrases that an artist often uses) and their songs than just their favorite scale. Voltaire mainly uses the chords Am, Em, and B7 but just knowing those isn't going to get you a gothic whatever sound. Meanwhile Steve Vai adores Lydian but as many have pointed out, that's just a small piece of his music. I just find it interesting to find out what key a piece is in.

Still wondering about getting a B Phrygian #4 flavor from a chord progression though (It'd be very interesting to know). Also accidentals don't always determine the key but need to be resolve.
"I don't know what you're trying to suggest. There's no shame in taking what you need to hold your position!"

Super Buu (DBZ) on assimilation (it could also apply to blues guitar and guitar soloing in general).