#1
I play in a 2 piece rock band and I'm sure its out there but I was wondering if there is a pedal that I could use to make it sound like we have a bass, without taking away from my guitar tone. A very long time ago someone told me that Jack White used a pedal that imitates a bass, so it made me wonder if such pedal exists for the average consumer. The most important thing I would need in the pedal would be for it to not take away from my overall guitar sound, but maybe just add a sound a few octaves lower to make it sound like we have a bass. Thanks.
#2
Quote by Biedermannn
a pedal that I could use to make it sound like we have a bass, without taking away from my guitar tone.


You would have to use a bass amp for that sub-octave signal so it won't interfere with your original signal. Get an EHX Micro Pog, use the dry out into your guitar amp and the effect out into a bass amp.
EGC Baritone | ESP M-I | Gibson LP Jr
BC Rich USA ST3 | Fender Telecaster
VHT/Fryette GP3 | Verellen Meatsmoke pre | Mesa 2:90
Soldano HR50+ | Marshall 2203KK | Krank RevJr 50 | Holden 50
Orange PPC412 | Laney GS412 | Mesa Thiele 112 | Alron 115
#4
Quote by Biedermannn
maybe just add a sound a few octaves lower to make it sound like we have a bass. Thanks.


A four-string standard bass is one octave below a guitar.
#5
Pogs are sweet but really you just need a simple octave pedal. Combine that with a looper and you can do all kinds of crazy shit...and simple stuff too. Especially with two amps.
Fender Mustang/Derfenstein DST> Boss Power Wah> Pedal Monsters Klone> Bogner Uberschall> Walrus Audio Janus> Randall RM20> Line 6 M9> Randall RM20
#6
Is there a pedal that, (cause I play mostly barre chords), when I play lets say an A, would simulate an A being hit on the bass?
#7
A guitar octave lower won't sound like a bass guitar, even though a bass amp.

You could get a guitar synth - you can change the tone of individual strings.

Getting an octave pedal would be a problem if you wanted to play full chords. It would work for single note riffs (it would still just sound like a guitar an octave lower and not like a bass) but for full chords it would just make your sound really muddy.

You could get bass pads. Your drummer could use them or you could control them with your feet. Of course that would require really simple basslines.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#8
Poly mode on OC-3

Edit:
A guitar octave lower won't sound like a bass guitar


And yea he's right
Last edited by Taz9 at Jun 13, 2014,
#9
Quote by Biedermannn
Is there a pedal that, (cause I play mostly barre chords), when I play lets say an A, would simulate an A being hit on the bass?


i have a device called a sonuus I2M that works with my computer software. it takes an input from a guitar (or any instrument) and substitutes the note with a midi instrument note.

other midi instruments like a midi guitar can do the same thing

i know of no standalone pedals that do this though
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#10
Many pitch shifters will double up your note with a note one or more octaves down. It won’t sound like a bass. But that doesn’t matter because most people have no idea what a bass really sounds like. Just find a sound that gives you the low end you need and you’ll be fine.
#11
i know they are up there in the price range, but is that something that Eventide pitch factor could do (i want one)

the tc gmaj2 from clips has the smart pitch shifter/harmonizer you tell it which key and which harmonys it will play them, but again pricey.

i could be off base, but maybe one of these could do it.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#12
Quote by gumbilicious
i have a device called a sonuus I2M that works with my computer software. it takes an input from a guitar (or any instrument) and substitutes the note with a midi instrument note.

other midi instruments like a midi guitar can do the same thing

i know of no standalone pedals that do this though

Doesn't a guitar synth, for example Roland GR55, do that?

It's not that expensive either. I can't really tell about the sounds though but I think it would work for this purpose. It has synth and other instrument sounds but it does also have guitar and bass models and you can change the sound of individual strings.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
Last edited by MaggaraMarine at Jun 14, 2014,
#13
Quote by MaggaraMarine
Doesn't a guitar synth, for example Roland GR55, do that?

It's not that expensive either. I can't really tell about the sounds though but I think it would work for this purpose. It has synth and other instrument sounds but it does also have guitar and bass models and you can change the sound of individual strings.


yeah, it is one of those 'midi instruments' i was referring to. the roland has a lot more control than my I2M as well, my I2M only really does monophonic conversion while the Roland could do full chords.

the sounds will be as good as midi sounds you use, whatever library you are pulling those sounds from.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#14
Quote by Biedermannn
I play in a 2 piece rock band and I'm sure its out there but I was wondering if there is a pedal that I could use to make it sound like we have a bass, without taking away from my guitar tone.


AHA, now there's the trick. The Octavers work across the entire guitar, and any pedal will definitely screw with the upper strings.

Use a VARIAX.

I do what you want to do routinely. I have three Line 6 Variax guitars -- two old ones and one new one. ALL of them will let you set an alternate tuning (without ever changing the actual tension on the strings) that you can simply switch to. You can set an alternate tuning for each string individually, and will allow you to set up to an octave down (perhaps more, I haven't tried). So I've set the bottom two strings an octave down and left the top four alone. With a bit of creativity, I can be bass and rhythm.

No extra-low strings necessary, etc. Check out, say, a Variax 500, 600 or 700. These are the older models and available for as little as $350 (make sure they're in good working order).

Here's a 500:

#15
Doesn't Jack White use a Digitech Whammy pedal?
I thought I heard at onetime he did.
Or maybe I was just drunk.

According to this page he does:

http://equipboard.com/pros/jack-white#

I just Googled this:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Digitech+Whammy&oq=Digitech+Whammy&aqs=chrome..69i57&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=122&ie=UTF-8#q=Digitech%20Whammy%20Jack%20white
Last edited by CodeMonk at Jun 14, 2014,
#16
Simplest and best solution would probably be to just find a bassist for your band
#17
Quote by CodeMonk
Doesn't Jack White use a Digitech Whammy pedal?


At this point there are probably more effects Jack White has used than hasn’t. He’s musically prolific and sonically promiscuous.
#18
Quote by MaggaraMarine
A guitar octave lower won't sound like a bass guitar, even though a bass amp.


The Variax does.

There are, of course, differences between the usual bass that we're used to, and a guitar -- including heavier strings and a longer scale. Both of those, however, are to generate clarity in the lower registers, because a set of magnetic pickups on a guitar will generally muddy things up when you get low. The Variax doesn't work like a standard guitar, of course -- it works off piezo saddles and internal electronics to produce the sounds it does. And since each saddle's signal is independent of the others (unlike the guitar's magnetic pickup setup), two strings can be set up to output as bass strings, the other four as a strat, or a tele, or an LP, or a banjo or a 12-string, etc..

BTW, the reference was simply to clarify that it wasn't a case of dropping "several octaves" to get to the bass region -- there was never any claim that a guitar would necessarily sound like a bass. Bass frequencies on a four string bass are, indeed, just one octave below the bottom four strings on a guitar.
#19
Quote by 7thString
Simplest and best solution would probably be to just find a bassist for your band


Not necessarily.

I played keyboards in bands for years, and often subbed for bass players by playing bass with both feet, heel and toe, on pedals. And just to clarify -- if you've ever seen a classical organist, you'll be more than aware that they do far more than "simple bass lines." With the Variax, I've done both bass and rhythm (in admittedly fairly simple song structures) and really haven't missed a bass player there, either.

Remember that you've got to pay that extra person, and that can reduce the number of gigs you can play and/or the number of gigs that you can profit on. You've also got to include that person's schedule in yours when planning practices or jobs, you've also got more gear to haul around, increased chances of cancellation if he gets sick or cranky, etc.
#20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdF8UBA2uNc

first i have ever heard of this band so i don't know anything or any songs, but its a good sounding unit from these clips.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#21
Hey ts I just read an Interesting snippet about one of Scott Lucas'( from Local H) guitars. Local H is a 2 piece band that puts on a killer show, check 'em out if you've never heard of them. Anyways, I've seen him live (met him too) and noticed his guitar looked extremely mangled. Apparently he's got a bass pup under his low e and a strings wired to a separate output that he runs through an octave pedal and a bass amp. It doesn't actually function like a bass guitar, but gives him a much fuller sound. Seeing them live, I was astounded by the righteous thunder 2 guys made on stage.
He has a looper too, which I assumed was how he did it until reading about the bass pup just now. That'd be pretty pimpish if you did that.
Fender Mustang/Derfenstein DST> Boss Power Wah> Pedal Monsters Klone> Bogner Uberschall> Walrus Audio Janus> Randall RM20> Line 6 M9> Randall RM20
#22
he's got a bass pup under his low e and a strings wired to a separate output that he runs through an octave pedal and a bass amp.


Gotta try that!

Edit: But cant you set the OC-3 poly mode for the 6th and 5th string only? I thought you could, but I don't own one, so I cant confirm.
Last edited by Taz9 at Jun 15, 2014,
#23
I have said this before, but do you know why they double track guitars?

It's because even though u play exactly the same, it's the micro variations which makes it sound huge.

With bass it is not that different. The bassist follows the harmony of the guitar, but the slight micro differences make it sound wide and spacious.

If you double ur guitar with an octave pedal it definitely sounds more beefy, but even a normal person will experience this as a beefy guitar sound, but the bass will still be lacking.

It's not a musician thing either. It's the way how our "stereo" ears perceive sound, and micro differences between instruments are registered as a far more natural stereo spread.

I mean it could work, and that white stripes seven nation army song, is like the most straightforward rhythm you can have so he could get away with it there, but it most definitely won't work easily with everything.

You could always try it, and if it doesn't work out an octave pedal is a cool little thing to own anyways.

The "Re-incarnation of Plato" Award 2009
(most intelligent)
The "Good Samaritan" Award 2009 (most helpful)

[font="Palatino Linotype
Who's Andy Timmons??
Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Jun 15, 2014,
#24
Quote by dspellman
The Variax does.

There are, of course, differences between the usual bass that we're used to, and a guitar -- including heavier strings and a longer scale. Both of those, however, are to generate clarity in the lower registers, because a set of magnetic pickups on a guitar will generally muddy things up when you get low. The Variax doesn't work like a standard guitar, of course -- it works off piezo saddles and internal electronics to produce the sounds it does. And since each saddle's signal is independent of the others (unlike the guitar's magnetic pickup setup), two strings can be set up to output as bass strings, the other four as a strat, or a tele, or an LP, or a banjo or a 12-string, etc..

BTW, the reference was simply to clarify that it wasn't a case of dropping "several octaves" to get to the bass region -- there was never any claim that a guitar would necessarily sound like a bass. Bass frequencies on a four string bass are, indeed, just one octave below the bottom four strings on a guitar.

Yeah, but a Variax is basically a "guitar synth". It does the same thing as Roland GR55. It's just built in to the guitar. I was talking about dropping a regular guitar sound an octave. Because of course if you can model a bass sound, it sounds like a bass.

But yeah, a Variax or GR55 or something similar would do exactly what TS is looking for.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#25
Quote by MaggaraMarine
Yeah, but a Variax is basically a "guitar synth". It does the same thing as Roland GR55. It's just built in to the guitar. I was talking about dropping a regular guitar sound an octave. Because of course if you can model a bass sound, it sounds like a bass.

But yeah, a Variax or GR55 or something similar would do exactly what TS is looking for.


FOR **** SAKES man, it's NOT a guitar synth. People need to stop saying it is.

Synthesis is when a sound is generated out of nothing.

The sound coming out of the Variax IS THE SAME as the sound that comes from the strings.

Modeling/Processing sound is not the same as listening to the original sound's pitch and replacing it with a whole new waveform.

Raw sound of the strings go into the piezos, go through the CPU to get PROCESSED through algorithms of pickups and body types.


Back on topic:
I can confirm that the Variax does make a convincing bass when it's digitally tuned down an octave through workbench, at least the most convincing guitar pretending to be a bass, but the harmonic content of the tone is a bit muddy. It sounds good in a mix though.


Also, DO NOT use an OC-3 or anything like that, for THOSE are actually synthesizers. They read the pitch and the dynamics of your playing then spit out a filtered square wave 1 and 2 octaves below what you're playing.

Some of you need to learn what synthesis is.


For your problem, a guitar midi setup with assignable strings might be your best bet.
Something like Fishman Triple Play could let you assign your E string to play a bass at the pitch you play without all the other strings making a note.

What you're asking is a bit complicated and limited depending on what you're playing.
Last edited by Clay-man at Jun 15, 2014,
#26
^ Chill out man.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#27
Quote by MaggaraMarine
^ Chill out man.

I'm sorry, but that misconception is everywhere.

It's why playing harmonics and every single nuance of your playing comes through a Variax guitar, because it literally is your guitar signal, just processed through impulse responses to emulate pickups and bodies as well as tone and volume knob electronics being emulated.

The GR-55's modeling is the same.
Both the GR-55 and Variax use special pickups near the bridge/saddles designed to sound more pure than a regular magnetic pickup, basically the sound of how your strings sound when your guitar is unplugged and you're listening to it directly (like an acoustic).


Also as Dspellman said you can set up custom tunings on a Variax to help you simulate a bass. You could make the E string 1 octave lower for a bass string.
After that, you have the option to either tune the 5 other strings to either leave in the root note or note:

E(-1 octave)ADGBE
or
E(-1 octave)EADGB

With the latter, your E string would act like the bass and the other 5 would act like the first 5 strings of the guitar with no high E.

Or the first if you don't care about the guitar playing the root note.

This would work with barre chords.

This would affect your guitar tone since they'd be playing through the same signal. Like I said, your request is incredibly complicated. It's either that or get a guitar MIDI setup with assignable strings. I have no clue if the Roland GR-55 can assign patches to strings but I know the Axon and Fishman can.
Last edited by Clay-man at Jun 15, 2014,
#28
Quote by Clay-man
I'm sorry, but that misconception is everywhere.


that is why i called it 'a midi instrument' (because what i would be using it for would be it's midi abilities), but there is a good reason that misconception is out there: it's how Roland advertises the equipment. they call it the GR-55 Guitar Synthesizer. e-mail Roland and rail them because people are calling the product by it's name and you don't agree with how they named it.

http://www.rolandus.com/products/details/1148

that is incredibly pedantic.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#29
Quote by gumbilicious
that is why i called it 'a midi instrument' (because what i would be using it for would be it's midi abilities), but there is a good reason that misconception is out there: it's how Roland advertises the equipment. they call it the GR-55 Guitar Synthesizer. e-mail Roland and rail them because people are calling the product by it's name and you don't agree with how they named it.

http://www.rolandus.com/products/details/1148

that is incredibly pedantic.


I was talking about the Variax, not the GR-55.
The Variax has absolutely nothing to do with midi or synthesis.


The GR-55 is half synth half modeling.

The thing used to check the pitch of your strings for the synth part, is still a pickup that has an input signal. The modeling part is basically the same as the Variax, the only difference is that:

1) The pickup is magnetic still instead of piezo like the Variax

2) The hardware is external in floorboard effect form instead of inside the guitar.


With the Variax, the misconception is uncalled for because it's people assuming that the pickup emulation is done through sampling or synthesis, when in reality it's still the sound of your guitar, just processed through algorithms and impulse responses to mimic guitars it's modeling.


So, a modeling guitar is what I just described, if the Variax was a midi guitar, then they'd call it.. a midi guitar.