#1
Hey guys, im a huge van halen fan and i gig quite a lot, im looking for an amp that will give me a "brown sound" at club gigging volume and also a bedroom volume, budget is about 600, head is preferd but not nessecary, thanks
#3
st louis area, moving to nashville soon, i can chuck out a bit more dough if i must.
#5
on the St. Louis craigslist I see a Marshall DSL40 combo, a 6505+ head, an Eganter Vengeance, a Bogner Alchemist, a Carvin V3M, and then I found this:


http://stlouis.craigslist.org/msg/4677550832.html


Do it. I would.


Barring that - get this:
http://stlouis.craigslist.org/msg/4660446351.html
#6
A couple more in STL

Aug 13 Jet city JCA22H $350 (st.charles) pic map musical instruments - by owner

Aug 12 Peavey JSX 120 combo amp $375 (St. Louis Co.) pic map musical instruments - by owner


Now. Nashville:

http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4670888457.html 6506 +cab
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4671435842.html Mesa F50
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4645219938.html Mesa TransAtlantic
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4679212189.html Peavey JSX
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4643775299.html Egnater Renegade
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4645782949.html Peavey Vypyr 60
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4644902048.html Peavey Ultra
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4642333636.html Marshall JCM 900 SL/X
http://nashville.craigslist.org/msg/4670441298.html Traynor YCV80 combo
#7
Look for a used JCM2000 DSL 50 or 100 and use the classic channel
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
Last edited by Robbgnarly at Sep 22, 2014,
#8
Id scrap together 650 for a randall rm, very good amp get it.
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#9
Well, it depends which era VH are we talking about. His early era tone is kinda hard to get without Plexi head. I guess closest would be the Carvin listed above. You can also look into Carl Martin Plexitone pedal and try running that in a clean amp like a Fender Deville or something like that or maybe even your amp at the moment. Add analog echo in the fx loop, the verb from the Deville and you're pretty much set.

His later tone is basically his sig. guitar and his EVH III amp...but I bet you mean the early tone.

Here's a link to mp3 with the Plexitone with some sounds:
http://www.houstonmusicreviews.com/GearReview/DistShootout/carlmartinplexitone.htm

Also look up Sansamp Plexi, it got some stellar reviews.
http://www.tech21nyc.com/products/effects/plexi.html
Last edited by diabolical at Sep 22, 2014,
#12
and thank you everybody so much for all the suggestions, ill look into them.
#13
basically nothing on earth will do what you want for under about 1000 to sound convincingly like van halen brown sound spot on.

perhaps the cheapest via all natural amp no pedals may be a splawn amp which can be had for under 1500.

for 600 or under, your best bet may just be a pedal. i basically have one of the best amps 600 or under on teh market with is a v3m, and its no spot on brown sound. not by a long shot. close? meh. perhaps. convincing for a drunk guy at a gig. is it the tone? nope. sorry go home.
Carvin CT624
Walden G630ce Acoustic
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(crybaby, Fairfield circuitry Comp, GFS tuner, Vick Audio 73 Ram's Head, Xotic AC booster, lovepedal trem, TC Flashback, PGS Trinity Reverb, Walrus Audio Aetos power)
#14
Quote by ikey_
basically nothing on earth will do what you want for under about 1000 to sound convincingly like van halen brown sound spot on.

i know that, i just want a "brown sound" dont need it to be exactly like eddie, just somewhat like it.
#16
I'm not one to suggest them, but the newer Bugera 1960 is basically a plexi with the Randy Rhoads PPIMV mod built in. If you just have to have that plexi sound. A used peavey Windsor would also be worth a look.

Actually here you go, a Krank Chadwick series 1 which is a hot rod plexi head and it is only $499
www.guitarcenter.com/Krank-Used-Krank-Chadwick-Tube-Guitar-Amp-Head-110120731-i3800454.gc
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#17
Quote by diabolical
What do you have now?

i have just a cheap spyder, my 5150 busted beyond repair, which really sucks.
#18
Check out the krank I linked that would be perfect and they are made very well
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#19
The RM 311 linked is the obvious choice. Two different Marshall models, surely one will do the trick... And it's just an awesome amp for $650.
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#20
Quote by tubetime86
The RM 311 linked is the obvious choice. Two different Marshall models, surely one will do the trick... And it's just an awesome amp for $650.

another vote for the RM100. it's killer: loud, toneful, and a fricken beast. and then when you get a little more cash, send off a module or two to rob at jaded faith for him to finetune for you. http://www.jadedfaithmods.com/mts-mods.html
#21
^ that RM would be a great amp, I missed that one
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#22
There's a Brown module for the RM100 too which is Randall's attempt at the EVH sound. I had one in my Randall but I didn't like it. It did sound very EVH'ish though - just wasn't my type of sound. I had it modded into a Mark II module.
Gilchrist custom
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Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#23
Okay, heresy time:

It's NOT the amp.

Go to wamplerpedals.com and take a look (and listen) to the Pinnacle.
Doesn't matter all that much what you plug this thing into; it's Eddie In A Box.

Quote by ikey_
basically nothing on earth will do what you want for under about 1000 to sound convincingly like van halen brown sound spot on.


I'm thinking that the Pinnacle does far more than any of the amps so far mentioned. Not only that, but it allows you to do it at apartment volumes (run it into the "Park" amp model in a Pod HD and put on a good set (Sony 7506, AKG 240, BeyerDynamic 770, Sennheiser 280) of headphones).

http://www.wamplerpedals.com/aiab/pinnacle/

Lots of videos, including this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoIsbgmfiv0
Last edited by dspellman at Sep 23, 2014,
#24
Not gonna happen. Good luck, though!
- Fender, Taylor, Martin, Ibanez, Ramirez, Marshall, Boss, Morley, Mesa/Boogie, Univox, Shure, Monster, Dunlop, Seymour Duncan, DiMarzio, Lace, Sperzel, DW, Tama, Zildjian, and a little Johnnie Walker
#25
Quote by dspellman
Okay, heresy time:

It's NOT the amp.

Go to wamplerpedals.com and take a look (and listen) to the Pinnacle.
Doesn't matter all that much what you plug this thing into; it's Eddie In A Box.

i had a pinnacle for a while. it was pretty picky about what i ran it into. it sounded horrible through my XXX, and pretty good through my classic 50, but only when the amp was set crystal clean. it turned into mush as soon as the amp was even slightly dirty.

edit: TS, seriously, get the RM.
Last edited by NakedInTheRain at Sep 25, 2014,
#26
I can't believe no one has simply suggested going up another $250 & getting a 5150 iii 50w head. That's as close as you'll get for cheap. Dial in a bit of phase & flange & echo. Good to go if you can dial in the swing rhythm & aggressive attack. I'll try to find this cool link for great cheap VH tone.


Edit: here's a cool cheap vh tone. Not the greatest unmic'd & loud, but low to moderate volume & mic'd sounds pretty decent. I used to have one of those Crate amps he uses.

http://jfrocksguitarlessons.com/jfrocks3/jfrocks/brownsound.html
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Last edited by riffhog at Sep 26, 2014,
#27
Toss the Spider off a bridge and you are halfway there. I like the Wampler pedal into a clean Fender amp like a BJR or HRD and that guy does a pretty good job covering EVH signature licks.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#28
Quote by NakedInTheRain
i had a pinnacle for a while. it was pretty picky about what i ran it into. it sounded horrible through my XXX, and pretty good through my classic 50, but only when the amp was set crystal clean. it turned into mush as soon as the amp was even slightly dirty.


The XXX is a pretty...uh..."opinionated" amp.
There's really no point in running the amp dirty if you're running the pedal; it supplies all the dirt. Why would you do that?
#29
Quote by dspellman
The XXX is a pretty...uh..."opinionated" amp.
There's really no point in running the amp dirty if you're running the pedal; it supplies all the dirt. Why would you do that?

you know when the amp is still clean, and will just slightly break up when you whack the strings really hard? that kind of dirty. i don't play crystalline clean, as everything sounds sterile and lame. so the pinnacle let me down in that department.

and yeah, i didn't really like the XXX that much in the end. pretty thin-sounding and buzzy at times. but it goes to show that pedals won't magically transform your amp.
#30
Some people like their tone coming from pedals
Some people like their tone coming from their amp

I'm in the amp camp.

Hey that rhymes.

I like the back and forth/give and take nature of a tube amp. Maybe that Pinnacle pedal is really great but I'd rather have the amp do it personally. That's just me.


This is one of the closest early VH tones I've ever heard. It is a Cameron modded Ceriatone Chupacabra in a Marshall headshell. Coincidently, the Chupacabra is a clone of a Cameron CCV. I think. It's complicated

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-tU8tSOmOI
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Sep 26, 2014,
#31
Quote by NakedInTheRain
you know when the amp is still clean, and will just slightly break up when you whack the strings really hard? that kind of dirty. i don't play crystalline clean, as everything sounds sterile and lame. so the pinnacle let me down in that department.
.



One of my amps is a Carvin Belair. 50W, four EL84s, two channel.

As it comes from the factory, the clean channel is gorgeous -- I'd stack it against a Fender any day.

The "Soak" (gain) channel was designed by Allan Holdsworth, and is very smooth for legato-type runs, etc.

Not exactly what I was looking for, but there's a guy named Richard L Hassebrock who has a popular series of mods (the "Hasserl" mods) that take the blanket off the gain channel and make it sound "like a vintage Marshall, but with more gain than any vintage Marshall ever had."

Most of the mods don't touch the clean channel, but he adds what he calls a second "presence" control. This one controls the negative feedback to the power tubes. Carvin ordinarily uses a high setting that keeps everything very clean. If you use the control, you can dial it anywhere from the stock amount to zero, where you get an amp that's a lot more touch sensitive, that has even more gain, and that will give you that "hair" on the clean channel when you really dig in.

If you run the Pinnacle, and you want *that* sound, you leave the clean channel pretty (as Tina Turner puts it, "Nice....and easy") and let the Pinnacle do the work. When you want that "digging in" sound, you turn off the Pinnacle and dial back the negative feedback and let the amp do its thing. And when you want that vintage Marshall sound, you switch to the gain channel.
#32
Quote by riffhog
I can't believe no one has simply suggested going up another $250 & getting a 5150 iii 50w head. That's as close as you'll get for cheap. Dial in a bit of phase & flange & echo. Good to go if you can dial in the swing rhythm & aggressive attack. I'll try to find this cool link for great cheap VH tone.


He's looking for early VH tone though, the new amp doesn't really do that well.
#34
Quote by dspellman


Most of the mods don't touch the clean channel, but he adds what he calls a second "presence" control. This one controls the negative feedback to the power tubes. Carvin ordinarily uses a high setting that keeps everything very clean. If you use the control, you can dial it anywhere from the stock amount to zero, where you get an amp that's a lot more touch sensitive, that has even more gain, and that will give you that "hair" on the clean channel when you really dig in.
How does the other presence control work? Presence usually alters how much top end is fed back to the tail of the PI (ie. it affects the power tubes). The more you feed back, the less of it there is in the output. There are some amps where the presence control is merely another tone control but it's very rare.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#35
Quote by dspellman
One of my amps is a Carvin Belair. 50W, four EL84s, two channel.

As it comes from the factory, the clean channel is gorgeous -- I'd stack it against a Fender any day.

The "Soak" (gain) channel was designed by Allan Holdsworth, and is very smooth for legato-type runs, etc.

Not exactly what I was looking for, but there's a guy named Richard L Hassebrock who has a popular series of mods (the "Hasserl" mods) that take the blanket off the gain channel and make it sound "like a vintage Marshall, but with more gain than any vintage Marshall ever had."

Most of the mods don't touch the clean channel, but he adds what he calls a second "presence" control. This one controls the negative feedback to the power tubes. Carvin ordinarily uses a high setting that keeps everything very clean. If you use the control, you can dial it anywhere from the stock amount to zero, where you get an amp that's a lot more touch sensitive, that has even more gain, and that will give you that "hair" on the clean channel when you really dig in.

If you run the Pinnacle, and you want *that* sound, you leave the clean channel pretty (as Tina Turner puts it, "Nice....and easy") and let the Pinnacle do the work. When you want that "digging in" sound, you turn off the Pinnacle and dial back the negative feedback and let the amp do its thing. And when you want that vintage Marshall sound, you switch to the gain channel.



did you do the mod to your Belair ?? ... if so how do you like it ?? ...... your the third person in the last couple weeks I've heard say the Carvin Belair can match a Fender for cleans
#36
Quote by Cathbard
How does the other presence control work? Presence usually alters how much top end is fed back to the tail of the PI (ie. it affects the power tubes). The more you feed back, the less of it there is in the output. There are some amps where the presence control is merely another tone control but it's very rare.


I dunno -- never use it (the other presence control). Haven't poked into it, either.
I got this Belair as a wreck, cheap, eBay. No tolex, bashed cabinet, nothing over bedroom volume (new ribbon cable took care of that), messed up tubes. Cab was painted flat black, as were the chicken-head knobs. I gave the chassis to Richard to fix, and my job was to repair the cabinet. I decided to cover it with *real* tweed (mistake -- it's WAY thicker than tweed tolex, so the corner hardware had to be modified). Then I lacquered the hell out of it, and at this point that stuff is structural. Other cabinets fear it. It then went on the road, where it proved to be adult beverage proof, too. At this point if you set it next to a stock faux tweed Belair, it looks like Brock Lesnar standing next to Screech.
#37
I've been contemplating using real tweed on something myself. Lots of lacquer, huh? Good thinking. It'd be something I'd be making myself.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#38
Quote by Fumble fingers
did you do the mod to your Belair ?? ... if so how do you like it ?? ...... your the third person in the last couple weeks I've heard say the Carvin Belair can match a Fender for cleans


Hasserl Hissownself (Richard L Hassebrock) lives right down the road in Fullerton, and he put in the Stage II Hasserl Mods for me. He's got a personal Nomad (single 12 version) with a Tonker in it. He's also got a garage full of amps and a Chevelle SS with a monstrous engine sits in the driveway with a tarp over it. He has priorities.

It's the right thing to do (IMHO) for that amp. The Carvin Forums have campaigned for years to have the Hasserl Mods be incorporated into the stock Belair. I have three favorite tube amps in the herd: the Belair with the mods (and yes, those are some really pretty cleans), the EVJr with the Mercury Magnetics kit (who the hell puts a $400 mod into a $99 head?) and the old rat-fur Carvin XV112B (sometimes XV112E).

The Belair's broken-in V30's are wonderful and it is a flippin' LOUD amp.

The EVJr spends more time away than it does at home; folks want to record with it. Mercury knows its stuff.

The XV112B is a 1x12 combo from '89 or so that looks like a Mesa Mk II clone. Active controls, 5-band assignable EQ, 100W of raucous EL34 grunt, and I've variously had an EV-L and Carvin's 100W "British voiced" speaker in it over the years. It, too, has a surprisingly good clean channel and headroom for days. With the EV-L in it and with the weight of whatever transformers are in it, it's a backbreaker, but for an open back 1x12 combo, it has... authority. For a while I disconnected the internal speaker and ran a pair of 4x12s with it. Those are *really* good transformers. They discontinued the X100B series for a while, then brought it back a decade or so later, but with wimpy transformers and a digital reverb. The reverb is really good, but the transformers sorta suck, and you can't get it as a 1x12. If you can get one of the old ones for $350 or under and it's in good shape, you have one hellaciously good amp.
#39
Quote by NakedInTheRain
you know when the amp is still clean, and will just slightly break up when you whack the strings really hard? that kind of dirty. i don't play crystalline clean, as everything sounds sterile and lame. so the pinnacle let me down in that department.

and yeah, i didn't really like the XXX that much in the end. pretty thin-sounding and buzzy at times. but it goes to show that pedals won't magically transform your amp.


What kinda tubes. I run KT77s in my XXX and it became my main amp over my dual rec. Mids are as thick as i want em too.
#40
Quote by dspellman
Hasserl Hissownself (Richard L Hassebrock) lives right down the road in Fullerton, and he put in the Stage II Hasserl Mods for me. He's got a personal Nomad (single 12 version) with a Tonker in it. He's also got a garage full of amps and a Chevelle SS with a monstrous engine sits in the driveway with a tarp over it. He has priorities.

It's the right thing to do (IMHO) for that amp. The Carvin Forums have campaigned for years to have the Hasserl Mods be incorporated into the stock Belair. I have three favorite tube amps in the herd: the Belair with the mods (and yes, those are some really pretty cleans), the EVJr with the Mercury Magnetics kit (who the hell puts a $400 mod into a $99 head?) and the old rat-fur Carvin XV112B (sometimes XV112E).

The Belair's broken-in V30's are wonderful and it is a flippin' LOUD amp.

The EVJr spends more time away than it does at home; folks want to record with it. Mercury knows its stuff.

The XV112B is a 1x12 combo from '89 or so that looks like a Mesa Mk II clone. Active controls, 5-band assignable EQ, 100W of raucous EL34 grunt, and I've variously had an EV-L and Carvin's 100W "British voiced" speaker in it over the years. It, too, has a surprisingly good clean channel and headroom for days. With the EV-L in it and with the weight of whatever transformers are in it, it's a backbreaker, but for an open back 1x12 combo, it has... authority. For a while I disconnected the internal speaker and ran a pair of 4x12s with it. Those are *really* good transformers. They discontinued the X100B series for a while, then brought it back a decade or so later, but with wimpy transformers and a digital reverb. The reverb is really good, but the transformers sorta suck, and you can't get it as a 1x12. If you can get one of the old ones for $350 or under and it's in good shape, you have one hellaciously good amp.



thanks !! ..... great to know , been thinking of getting a VT50 head to replace my Twin Reverb and Super Reverb do to weight/my back hurts .... also did not know that about X100B , I have seen a few vintage ones on ebay , I might just watch them a little closer after your input ....... is the hassebrock mods something I could do myself ??.... or does it need sent out ??........ seems like Fullerton is a magic place for music
Last edited by Fumble fingers at Sep 27, 2014,