#1
I am doing an indie/shoegaze project and need an amp that is up to the job. I have £300 to spend. 2nd hand amps are fine.
I would just have the amp set clean then use pedals when required.
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I would like a tone like the band yuck. A sound like in their songs Get away or Rebirth.

I was looking at a vox ac30vr or a marshall ma100c.
Does anyone have any experience with these amps or could recommend something in my price range?
#2
Quote by danielmclaren
I was looking at a vox ac30vr or a marshall ma100c.
Does anyone have any experience with these amps
Yeah.
Don't get any of them.

I'd say a used AC15c1 could do the job.
Not the vr.

Or you could just skip the guitar amp and get a power amp + a cab...
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
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#3
What is the benefits of the ac15? Yeah I would get a head and cab but it's the same situation that I wouldn't know what to get that would be good for shoegaze in my budget
#4
Quote by danielmclaren
What is the benefits of the ac15?
The tube AC15 sounds better than the hybrid AC30.
Also that band sounded like it was using some fairly distorted british style amp mixed with the clean signal mixed with a signal distorted and not passed through a guitar cab.
Quote by danielmclaren
Yeah I would get a head and cab
No, not a guitar amp head.
A power amp.

Like the Carvin TS100 and the Yamaha P2500S.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#5
Yeah I thought a British sounding amp would be good. I considered a tiny terror head with a cab but was not sure if it could achieve the sound needed. It would need to be loud enough to practice with a band not mic'd up. Then possibly used at gigs most likely mic'd up.

Sorry, I never read it properly! I will have a look at them
#7
Quote by danielmclaren
It would need to be loud enough to practice with a band not mic'd up.


For that you would really need something that's at least 100 watts, otherwise you won't be able to get an actual clean tone at rehearsal volume. Get an used Roland JC120.
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#8
If ever there was a case for a Pod and a powered wedge, shoegaze would be it.
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#10
Quote by godgrinder
For that you would really need something that's at least 100 watts, otherwise you won't be able to get an actual clean tone at rehearsal volume.
Please stop spreading this kinda disinformation.

Guitar amps power ratings are made up, and even if they weren't, power would be one among different factors determining the max clean output volume of a setup.

Or, if TL;DR, please stfu.
Quote by Cathbard
If ever there was a case for a Pod and a powered wedge, shoegaze would be it.
This would work good as well, yes, if you want convenience that's what you wanna get TS.

Convenience as in something you can play at night with headphones, something with a shit ton of nice sounding fx and routing possibility, something relatively light and something easily expandable and easy to integrate in a much bigger setup.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
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#11
The jc120 looks good! It's slightly over my budget but I could probably stretch to buy one of them. Am I correct in thinking that they are similar to the fender twin reverb?
#12
I love my Ampeg GVT52-112 for shoegaze stuff, maybe give that a look.


I'm also a fan of Yuck, great band. But I kinda missed Daniel's vocals on the last album. Not that the new lead singer doesn't do a great job, but it just isn't the same.

Quote by danielmclaren
Am I correct in thinking that they are similar to the fender twin reverb?

Not at all. It's a completely different beast, it definitely doesn't sound like a Twin Reverb.
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Last edited by Linkerman at Sep 29, 2014,
#13
Ampeg is another shoegaze favourite. Although I really don't think it matters too much, you just need a loud clean amp and pedals right?? Therefore a twin reverb would be great but perhaps over budget.. JC-120's can be found used for below $500USD regularly. Although nowhere near as loud as a twin reverb.
Linkerman - big fan of yuck here too! And I agree, the vocals were a bit lacking. 'Somewhere' is a good song from the new album IMO. They are the most depressed looking band live.
#14
I think the gvt52 is harder to come by now! Not sure if they are still making them and I haven't seen any on ebay.
Yeah I know what you mean! They are still really good but it just isn't the same. Saying that operation was one of my favourite songs from the first album and it was max singing on that!
#15
Here in the UK I've seen the jc120 and fender twin reverb go for about the same price 2nd hand occasionally
#16
If a Twin and JC120 are the same price, buy the Twin. It's a no-brainer if you ask me.
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#17
Quote by Spambot_2
Please stop spreading this kinda disinformation.

Guitar amps power ratings are made up, and even if they weren't, power would be one among different factors determining the max clean output volume of a setup.

Or, if TL;DR, please stfu.


Yeah they are made up to a certain degree, and yes the actual clean headroom depends on how the tubes were biased etc. But it usually ends up around the ballpark of the "claimed" power rating. Of course there's the speaker sensitivity thing coming into play as well, but the power rating is still a quick and easy indication. It's still pretty safe to say the JC120 would stay clean at a louder volume than the AC15 you recommended. A 15 watt amp is not going to stay clean at the volume level needed for an unmic'd rehearsal with real drums.

BTW it seemed like you are too drunk with your 3rd hand forum knowledges.
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#18
Hot Rod Deluxe or DeVille, Twin, Peavey Vintage 30 .

Shoegaze heaven.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#19
If I was playing shoegaze (which isn't likely) I would definitely go the Pod type thing. Shoegaze guys end up with huge pedalboards if they don't go MFX. You never know what sort of stage you may end up on. That's why I bought a GT-100, my pedalboard was getting in everybody's way when I was playing covers.
I have an RM100 so amp modelling (shutup greg) wasn't needed but unless you already had a trick amp like mine, then a HD500X and a wedge would be the go - especially for shoegaze. You can have all your different effects settings ready to go without screwing around. Hit a button and everything changes.
As you aren't really needing anything much more than a clean amp even using pedals, a HD500 is exactly the right tool for the job. Add a nice wedge to the equation and you've got a pro sounding shoegaze rig.
Gilchrist custom
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Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#20
Quote by Cathbard
If I was playing shoegaze (which isn't likely) I would definitely go the Pod type thing. Shoegaze guys end up with huge pedalboards if they don't go MFX. You never know what sort of stage you may end up on. That's why I bought a GT-100, my pedalboard was getting in everybody's way when I was playing covers.
I have an RM100 so amp modelling (shutup greg) wasn't needed but unless you already had a trick amp like mine, then a HD500X and a wedge would be the go - especially for shoegaze. You can have all your different effects settings ready to go without screwing around. Hit a button and everything changes.
As you aren't really needing anything much more than a clean amp even using pedals, a HD500 is exactly the right tool for the job. Add a nice wedge to the equation and you've got a pro sounding shoegaze rig.

You're not cool in shoegaze world unless you have a big ugly mess of rejected pedals from the 90's on your pedalboard.
#21
Quote by 7thString
You're not cool in shoegaze world unless you have a big ugly mess of rejected pedals from the 90's on your pedalboard.


Yep, a DME pedal would be entirely too organized and precise.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#22
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#23
Quote by godgrinder
Quote by Spambot_2
Please stop spreading this kinda disinformation.

Guitar amps power ratings are made up, and even if they weren't, power would be one among different factors determining the max clean output volume of a setup.

Or, if TL;DR, please stfu.


Yeah they are made up to a certain degree, and yes the actual clean headroom depends on how the tubes were biased etc. But it usually ends up around the ballpark of the "claimed" power rating. Of course there's the speaker sensitivity thing coming into play as well, but the power rating is still a quick and easy indication. It's still pretty safe to say the JC120 would stay clean at a louder volume than the AC15 you recommended. A 15 watt amp is not going to stay clean at the volume level needed for an unmic'd rehearsal with real drums.

BTW it seemed like you are too drunk with your 3rd hand forum knowledges.

+3,1415

Luca, you went a bit too far. What godgrinder said isn't particularly wrong.
If I needed a pristine clean tone coming straight from the amp at loud volumes, I wouldn't take anything less than 50 watts tube/100 watts solid state.
The power ratings exist for a reason; even if not 100% accurate, they still give you an indication of the amps' performances.
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#24
Quote by godgrinder
Yeah they are made up to a certain degree, and yes the actual clean headroom depends on how the tubes were biased etc. But it usually ends up around the ballpark of the "claimed" power rating. Of course there's the speaker sensitivity thing coming into play as well, but the power rating is still a quick and easy indication.
Though the AC30cc2 is louder than a lot of 100w tube amps.
Quote by godgrinder
It's still pretty safe to say the JC120 would stay clean at a louder volume than the AC15 you recommended.
Likely, yeah.

Though what you wrote was
Quote by godgrinder
For that you would really need something that's at least 100 watts, otherwise you won't be able to get an actual clean tone at rehearsal volume.
And that is so inaccurate I can't even say it's false.
Quote by godgrinder
A 15 watt amp is not going to stay clean at the volume level needed for an unmic'd rehearsal with real drums.
This falls in the same category as the previous quote.
Quote by godgrinder
BTW it seemed like you are too drunk with your 3rd hand forum knowledges.
Or experience
Quote by Linkerman
If I needed a pristine clean tone coming straight from the amp at loud volumes, I wouldn't take anything less than 50 watts tube/100 watts solid state.
This either means you think tube amps are louder than solid state amps 'cause of magic, or you agree power ratings in guitar amps are made up.
Quote by Linkerman
The power ratings exist for a reason; even if not 100% accurate, they still give you an indication of the amps' performances.
Power ratings in guitar amps aren't made up in the sense that they write 30w even if the amp can produce a bit less power than that while staying clean, it means the power ratings are close to being meaningless if they don't come with other specs, and other than that being inaccurate you can't predict the max clean volume without knowing at least some specs of the speakers.

Guitar amps' power ratings exist to impress guitarists.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#25
Quote by Spambot_2
This either means you think tube amps are louder than solid state amps 'cause of magic, or you agree power ratings in guitar amps are made up.

Nope. This simply means that, in my experience, I perceive a tube amp of a lower wattage as louder than a solid state amp of a higher wattage.

Quote by Spambot_2
Power ratings in guitar amps aren't made up in the sense that they write 30w even if the amp can produce a bit less power than that while staying clean, it means the power ratings are close to being meaningless if they don't come with other specs, and other than that being inaccurate you can't predict the max clean volume without knowing at least some specs of the speakers.

Guitar amps' power ratings exist to impress guitarists.

After years of playing different amps, you can have a general idea of how an amp will perform (how loud it will be and what kind of headroom to expect) judging from the power rating. I can't believe you don't feel that way.
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#26
Quote by Linkerman
Nope. This simply means that, in my experience, I perceive a tube amp of a lower wattage as louder than a solid state amp of a higher wattage.
So the power ratings are either made up or tube amps are louder because of magic.

Or you can't hear when tubes clip as soon as you can hear transistors clip, but I'm guessing you can tell the difference if you pay close attention to it.
Quote by Linkerman
After years of playing different amps, you can have a general idea of how an amp will perform (how loud it will be and what kind of headroom to expect) judging from the power rating. I can't believe you don't feel that way.

I feel twin's are louder than 6505's and AC30's are louder than single recto's.

That + experience brings me to the conclusion that power ratings in guitar amps are not only inaccurate but also made up a lot of times.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#27
I think you're wrong. Agree to disagree, I guess.
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#28
I wouldn't get a POD for Shoegaze. That's not really in the spirit of the genre, I don't think.

But if you do, make absolutely sure you get the HD500X. The non X version WILL hit the DSP limit FAST if you're trying to stack FX.

Honestly I think the Boss GT-100 would be a better choice than the HD500X for Shoegaze. It's not like you need high gain amp distortion modeling, which is pretty much the pivotal selling point of the POD HD.

The more I play with my HD500X, the more I miss the FX from the Boss GT-10 I used to have. They just did what I want a lot better. Besides the delay and reverb which I am in love with, the regular modulation stuff the Boss just does a lot better IMO.
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Last edited by Offworld92 at Sep 30, 2014,
#29
Quote by Spambot_2
Though the AC30cc2 is louder than a lot of 100w tube amps.


Yes, it can get very loud when it enters power amp overdrive, but its clean headroom would still be around 30 watts. A 100 watt amp, even with very overstated power rating, would have more clean headroom than that. And because almost all manufacturers overstate their power ratings, it becomes somewhat referable again, albeit not accurate. I used to have a 20 watt and a 30 watt amp, they can get quite loud, but compared to my 90-100 watt amps they definitely had considerably less clean headroom.

I have a non-MV "50 watt" amp that has 45 watts of clean headroom and 105 watts maximum output. It can get as loud (or even louder) than my other "100 watt" MV amp with 85 watts clean headroom (160 watts maximum output) when they are both distorted, depending on how the 100 watter was set up. But the 100 watter definitely stayed clean at higher volume. These wattage data I mentioned were measured by a tech when he retubed and biased these amps for me, not from manufacturers' claims.

These were all tested through the same 412 cab.

If you have really efficient speakers like Eminence Wizard (103dB sensitivity) paired with the 30 watter and something really inefficient like Heritage Greenback (96dB sensitivity) with the 100 watter then yeah they probably gonna have pretty similar maxim clean volume output. But the more common speakers (V30, T75, Chinese Greenback etc) are usually around 97-100dB, that could offset the wattage difference between 50 and 100 watters, but not enough to offset the differences between a 15 or 30 watt amp with a 100 watter.

What I was saying was a quick and general rule of thumb when people want to be on the safe sides of things. Assuming that they are not using super low or high sensitivity speakers. You were just saying "ohh but there could be special cases". Yes there are special cases, but that doesn't really conflict with a general rule of thumb.

Quote by Spambot_2
Or experience

Last time I checked you play the following gear:
Quote by Spambot_2
Joyo: Pocket Metal
Alesis: NanoCompressor
Xaviere: XV-835 Telecaster
Blackheart: BH5H
Various: cables and picks
Harley Benton: G212 Vintage


Unless you've upgraded significantly since then, I wouldn't count too much on your "experience". Trying things out at a music shop or hearing other people playing them is pretty different from using them for an extended period of time under various circumstances and volume levels.

Quote by Linkerman
Nope. This simply means that, in my experience, I perceive a tube amp of a lower wattage as louder than a solid state amp of a higher wattage.


That probably has more to do with ohms. Solid state amps are usually rated at 4ohm, when you plug it into your usual 16ohm cab they put out a lot less power. Tube amps usually don't have that problem.
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Last edited by godgrinder at Sep 30, 2014,
#30
Playing slide guitar on an RM100 loaded with expensive boutique modules isn't really in the spirit of punk either - but it works really well.
Well, then again, maybe it is in a way - punk's all about telling everybody to "**** off and don't tell me what to do."

The GT-100 probably would be ok except that the HD500X does a better Fender Twin sound. IMO the GT-100 is only good with the amp sims turned off and run into a good amp. It's a great effects processor, mediocre modeler.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


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My band
#31
Lotta misunderstandings about amplifier power in this thread. About par I guess.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#32
Quote by Cathbard
Playing slide guitar on an RM100 loaded with expensive boutique modules isn't really in the spirit of punk either - but it works really well.
Well, then again, maybe it is in a way - punk's all about telling everybody to "**** off and don't tell me what to do."



I'm of the opinion that "punk" is anything but punk. Modern so called "punk" has a dress code and strict guidelines to follow in order to be "punk". That doesn't sound too punk to me. I thought punk is supposed to be, "**** you, I'll do whatever the **** I wanna do, however I wanna do it" and not "like, oh my god, that guy has Wal-Mart jeans on, they look comfortable, and he doesn't listen to Blink 187, what a loser". Modern "punks" are absurdly cliche and very much conformists to that cliche. At least its funny.
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#33
We're old school punk, man. Real punk, not that modern crap that has been sanitized and absorbed back into the system - or as Johnny Rotten put it, "the shitstem." We subscribe to the Sex Pistols philosophy of punk being about doing your own thing and to hell with everybody else.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#34
Definitely an AC15 of some sort. That or, if you can afford it, an AC30.

With that said, I have a Fender Blues Deluxe and the OD channel is actually pretty throaty. It can get some good shoegaze tones, especially when you throw in a good OD or fuzz and reverb.
.

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#35
Quote by godgrinder
[...]What I was saying was a quick and general rule of thumb when people want to be on the safe sides of things. Assuming that they are not using super low or high sensitivity speakers. You were just saying "ohh but there could be special cases". Yes there are special cases, but that doesn't really conflict with a general rule of thumb.
I pointed out that what you wrote was greatly inaccurate, not that most guitar amps rated at 100w weren't able to reproduce cleans at higher volume than most 30w amps.
Quote by godgrinder
Unless you've upgraded significantly since then, I wouldn't count too much on your "experience". Trying things out at a music shop or hearing other people playing them is pretty different from using them for an extended period of time under various circumstances and volume levels.
I have a lot of friends with a lot of amps.
Quote by godgrinder
That probably has more to do with ohms. Solid state amps are usually rated at 4ohm, when you plug it into your usual 16ohm cab they put out a lot less power. Tube amps usually don't have that problem.
Every tube power amp has an output transformer, so they don't ever have that "problem".
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
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