#1
I''ve been itching for a Les Paul...and I want a Gibson, but I don't wanna spend the money, because I'm cheap...deal with it I've played the LTD's and they feel like toys, I don't want the Epiphones because I don't like their headstock designs, and the Chibsons have the same hardware. For 280 bucks I dont know if I can really lose, I've seen these things on YouTube and they all look awesome, but I'm worried about playability, does anyone have any experience with these things at all?

EDIT: I removed the link just in case Mods dont think its appropriate, the guitar in question is an R9 with a highly figured flame maple top.
Gear:
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Last edited by RBM01991 at Oct 2, 2014,
#2
Wouldn't one of those class as a counterfeit?
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#3
Well its not illegal to buy them in the US....its just illegal to sell them, so I can't buy em off another person, I have to order one :/
Gear:
1987 Charvel Model II
2010 Carvin ST300C
1990 Charvette 100
1991 Ibanez RG560M
2006 Fender Mexi Strat
Jackson/Charvel Star W/ Custom Graphics.
Ovation CP 247 Acoustic
Line 6 POD HD Pro X
Pro Tools 9

Tutorial: Studio Quality Programmed Drum Sounds
#4
I'd buy an R9 clone for that cheap! I just would let everyone know it's a fake. Who cares if it plays well and looks killer?
OBEY THE MIGHTY SHITKICKER
#5
If you want a Gibson, buying a Chibson will not satisfy that urge. If you want a Gibson, only a Gibson will be enough. Dreams cannot be achieved through cheating, you will always know that it's not the real thing and eventually the urge for a real Gibson will come back to haunt you.

If you want a good guitar, and suspect a Chibson may be the answer, then go ahead.
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#6
Quote by RBM01991
but I'm worried about playability, does anyone have any experience with these things at all?

Which 'things'?
It's not like there's only one factory pumping these out. There's a wide range of quality but it trends heavily towards bad. I would not expect the truss rod (if there is one) to work and I would not expect the frets, nut, or electronics to be finished properly or have any longevity. On the other hand some of these are perfectly good instruments after a bit of setup work so if you get lucky then you've gotten a great deal.

I haven't played a ton of fakes but from what I've seen on here and the ones I did play, you are taking a serious risk of getting a guitar with serious structural issues. I would not order one of these guitars without first accepting that you may never receive a usable product. That's not a gamble I would make if it was my entire budget for a new guitar. I've seen a few that were pretty good, so you can definitely get a nice guitar on the cheap, but you're gambling. You can certainly lose.
#7
Quote by GaryBillington
If you want a Gibson, buying a Chibson will not satisfy that urge. If you want a Gibson, only a Gibson will be enough. Dreams cannot be achieved through cheating, you will always know that it's not the real thing and eventually the urge for a real Gibson will come back to haunt you.

If you want a good guitar, and suspect a Chibson may be the answer, then go ahead.


....Its not that serious though I would love to have a Gibson, but I'm not spending the money they want for em, absolutely not...If I wanted a Gibson Killer, I'd spend 1600 bucks and buy a Carvin CS. I've always wanted an R9 but I'm not paying 6k for one.

As far as playablity what I'm talking about is neck wise, is it wide? is it short, fat, that kinda thing. If I have to refret the whole neck, fine. I'm already counting on one of these to come with a bad fret job and lousy electronics from the factory anyway and still....fixing up one of these would still be cheaper and a real R9.
Gear:
1987 Charvel Model II
2010 Carvin ST300C
1990 Charvette 100
1991 Ibanez RG560M
2006 Fender Mexi Strat
Jackson/Charvel Star W/ Custom Graphics.
Ovation CP 247 Acoustic
Line 6 POD HD Pro X
Pro Tools 9

Tutorial: Studio Quality Programmed Drum Sounds
#8
Quote by RBM01991
As far as playablity what I'm talking about is neck wise, is it wide? is it short, fat, that kinda thing. If I have to refret the whole neck, fine. I'm already counting on one of these to come with a bad fret job and lousy electronics from the factory anyway and still....fixing up one of these would still be cheaper and a real R9.

Again, these fake guitars come from a really wide variety of places so we can't tell you what the neck on yours will be like. These fake sites are usually just like eBay, so you're not ordering an "Alibaba" brand guitar, you're ordering a "Sweatshop Special" from someone with no name or company.

This is exactly the risk you're taking by ordering one. You're not going to know what the neck (or the rest of the guitar, several people have gotten models completely different from what they ordered) is like until it shows up in your hands. It's a total crapshoot.
#9
Quote by RBM01991
I''ve been itching for a Les Paul...and I want a Gibson, but I don't wanna spend the money, because I'm cheap...deal with it I've played the LTD's and they feel like toys, I don't want the Epiphones because I don't like their headstock designs, and the Chibsons have the same hardware. For 280 bucks I dont know if I can really lose, I've seen these things on YouTube and they all look awesome, but I'm worried about playability, does anyone have any experience with these things at all?

EDIT: I removed the link just in case Mods dont think its appropriate, the guitar in question is an R9 with a highly figured flame maple top.



Sure you can. You can pay 280 bucks for something that ends up being fire wood.


The thing is (like what people have already said) that so many different factories are producing these fakes and there's no real way to gauge their quality until it gets to your door. You have no warranty or anything that can make sure you aren't going to get a dud or receive a broken axe or at least compensate you for it either. Sure, a few people in YT videos don't have a problem with some of the guitars they receive but then again, how much do these people care about having a good guitar in the first place (especially considering what they want to buy)? How many of these people ended up modding the things to make them playable (I'd be willing to guess a pretty high number of them)? That 280 dollar guitar turns into a 500 dollar guitar pretty quick when you start swapping tuners, hardware and pups. At 500 bucks, you could get a way better guitar that wouldn't even have to be a fake.


If the Epiphone headstock trips you out then check out the cheaper Burny/Bacchus/Tokai guitars. At least you know it won't be complete junk that way.
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#10
Just having the knowledge of owning a fake is too off-putting for me to ever want to buy one. While it's legal to buy these guitars in the US, I don't consider it ethical.

Plus these guitars usually need a lot of work to get them up to par. Microphonic pickups, very crappy hardware overall, terrible nut (usually) and usually poor quality woods with lots of discolouration. Not good. $280 is very cheap, but you usually have to put that amount of money into it to get a guitar that's playable.

Getting a fake is an absolute minefield too. You could end up getting an entirely different kind of les paul from what you originally ordered. I don't find that acceptable whatsoever.

If you want to take a risk (and let's be clear, it's a big risk), then go ahead. But if I were you, I'd at the very least not have a licensed name written on it.
Quote by TheSennaj
And well yes, I'll enjoy the carpal tunnel and tendonitis, because trying to get one is clearly smarter than any word you have spoken thus far.
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Oct 2, 2014,
#11
Quote by RBM01991
I''ve been itching for a Les Paul...and I want a Gibson, but I don't wanna spend the money, because I'm cheap...deal with it For 280 bucks I dont know if I can really lose, I've seen these things on YouTube and they all look awesome, but I'm worried about playability, does anyone have any experience with these things at all?


I've got hands-on experience with just two, and it was very short term, and they belonged to friends.

I've actually considered buying a couple, but not as players (I've got real Gibsons) -- I see them as wall art and burglar misdirection. I'd shove about three of them in plex cases with some "memorabilia". Hopefully burglars will snag those and miss the more difficult to find pieces.

The ones I've seen haven't been too bad, though I haven't, of course, been able to see much in reference to the construction quality. At a distance of more than five feet, they look reasonable, but that's all you're really going for with these guitars -- they're a poseur prop. Same as any counterfeit.
#12
Agile makes pretty good LPs for really reasonable prices for the quality.

however you feel about fakes, I don't feel they can come close to a regular guitar, price for quality in those price ranges if you know what to buy. keep an eye on craigslist too
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#13
If you say that Ltd feel like toys then a chibson is going to feel like absolute shit. If you invest money into getting the frets levelled and maybe change some of the hardware (ie. tuners, bridge and definitely p'ups) maybe, you might have something on par with a mid-level epiphone. But to do so would cost much more than what its worth.

Buy an Edwards or Agile. Chibsons are wall art, nothing more.
Last edited by 12ie at Oct 5, 2014,
#14
The Chinese clones are almost all junk. There are some Chinese factories that can do a good custom build clone, but cost+shipping on those is as expensive as a nice Epiphone.
#16
I played a Chinese Gibson acoustic at a blue grass jam I went to. It was nice, however there was a ton of work put into it after he got it. So like stated above a 300 dollar guitar turned out to be like a 600 dollar guitar. Bite the bullet and buy a the real deal, it may hurt up front but you wont regret it. Guitar Center in the states is having a Gibson month right now so its got like 18 month financing and such. Maje sure its a 14 and not a 15 because all les pauls except the supreme come with gforce....
#17
There are so many affordable decent LP clones out there- new or used- I simply don't see the point in getting a Chinese counterfeit which may not be playable without significant upgrades...if ever.
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#18
Get over your problems with the Epiphone headstock and get one of those. If you have more money to spend and want a spot on clone get an Edwards.
#19
I will tread lightly on this subject because I have learned that online discussions on this subject tend to foster very strong opinions. Some come from many legitimate angles like the legality of buying a counterfeit, import of foreign goods, trademark infringement and mostly a deep commitment to the Gibson brand name. I get all of that and this is not an attempt to marginalize anything.

The original question was “Does anyone have experience with these things?” I own two of them. Here’s the good and bad of it. The first one was purchased because I planned to tear it apart and rebuild it. It didn’t matter what it was like when I bought it because I had a certain goal in mind. I had never rewired a guitar, changed pups, done a complete fret dress, changed a nut or filed anything on a guitar and I didn’t want to do it on one of my regular guitars. For just over $200.00 I bought one (an R9 clone). I did just what I wanted to do by tearing it down, completely rewiring the guitar with new pickups and switches (from Stu-Mac), put on USA Gibson Deluxe tuners, changed and filed the nut with new nut slots and leveled and fret dressed the neck. It was a great experience. Yes, in all it cost a total of about $500.00 and you could say that it would have been better to buy a new Epiphone Les Paul but that would be ignoring the point of why I got it in the first place. The hands on knowledge I gained was what was important (and I already had two Epiphone Les Paul’s at that time and have recently bought two more used on Ebay to fix up). Was the guitar good to start with? It was OK, just OK. Now it is very good, not as good as a Gibson LP Standard but still pretty good and certainly gig worthy. I bought another one earlier this year. It was a big improvement over my first one and I haven’t felt the need to make any changes on it at all. Now I’m done with it. I will never sell them or try to pawn them off as real Gibson guitars. I don't regret it and I had fun and learned from them.

Many of the comments here are valid. Remember that you are taking a change buying one because the web sites that are posting these guitars are not the people who are actually selling them and sending them to you. These sites are like online flea markets where people pay to post their ads. They are on the site today but may be gone tomorrow. Their merchandise varies and some are very good some not. You also have to consider that you run the risk of having your package confiscated by U.S. Customs Inspectors and if that happens you probably won’t get anything back. No guitar and no money, no refund, no nothing. That’s the risk you take so if you can’t afford to risk losing your money, don’t do it and forget about the idea of sending it back if you don't like it. The cost is well over $100.00 to ship it back and as I said the seller doesn't work for the site you bought it on. They are all independant sellers.

There is a lot of incorrect information out there and I am certainly no expert on this. Some of it may have been true at one time 5-6 years ago when this whole thing started but much of what I heard isn’t true anymore. I’ve heard everything from “they have no truss rod, the finish is a lacquered picture (it’s really a veneer), there is no maple cap at all etc. etc. I can only say that in my experience none of this is true but over the years the Chinese makers have really paid attention and each time someone posts something on line about problem or a difference between a Chibson clone and a real Gibson, the people making them make in China have responded so that little by little the differences have become harder and harder to see or hear. Recently I saw a listing for a Chibson that was around $500.00 that fixed three of the last really obvious visual differences. The top was a full maple cap (not a veneer), the binding on the neck went over the fret ends and the bridge pins were smaller with no screw like slots (just like a normal Gibson tune-o-matic bridge). Visually it will harder and harder to spot the differences in the future.
Last edited by Rickholly74 at Oct 6, 2014,
#20
Also, (Edwards has also been mentioned) I can also vouch for Tokai.. not all of them! But take some time to read around about the different Love Rock Les Pauls if you're interested.

I'm not saying Tokai is good just because I have one, I have one because it's good.
Phrases Label
The Bohemes
---
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#21
I love the chibson les pauls. It's like you bought a $20k guitar (jimmy page #2 I think it was) for like $100 plus like $80 ems. Then like say you don't want a brand name on the guitar, some places (and the ones I seen do it for free) will put your own brand name and symbol, colors,serial stamp thing,etc on there for you. Then that takes like month and they send you photos along the way and if you don't like the picture of the finished product they'll start all over until your satisfied. I haven't looked around but it'd cost a ton for all that anywhere else I'd guess

edit:
its only a crap shoot if you don't read the feedback of the guitar and seller before you get one (use google translate if you have to), and they aren't always exact 100% copies. I got a new slash model that was identical to the one I compared it to except the serial decodes to 2000 and its stamped 2013 below it.. lol that was the only difference
Last edited by darkriven at Nov 1, 2014,
#22
Quote by darkriven
I love the chibson les pauls. It's like you bought a $20k guitar (jimmy page #2 I think it was) for like $100 plus like $80 ems. Then like say you don't want a brand name on the guitar, some places (and the ones I seen do it for free) will put your own brand name and symbol, colors,serial stamp thing,etc on there for you. Then that takes like month and they send you photos along the way and if you don't like the picture of the finished product they'll start all over until your satisfied. I haven't looked around but it'd cost a ton for all that anywhere else I'd guess

edit:
its only a crap shoot if you don't read the feedback of the guitar and seller before you get one (use google translate if you have to), and they aren't always exact 100% copies. I got a new slash model that was identical to the one I compared it to except the serial decodes to 2000 and its stamped 2013 below it.. lol that was the only difference

You are an idiot plain and simple
#23
Quote by Robbgnarly
You are an idiot plain and simple


An idiot who just happened to join this forum today and join this conversation
Pretty sure this "member" is a shill for the counterfeiters.
#24
Quote by KenG
An idiot who just happened to join this forum today and join this conversation
Pretty sure this "member" is a shill for the counterfeiters.



Yeah totally. Probably will start posting youtube videos of the 'quality production' that goes into them fakes too.
#25
Quote by H4T3BR33D3R
Yeah totally. Probably will start posting youtube videos of the 'quality production' that goes into them fakes too.

No that was the guy that was here last week posting videos of the factory, that proved they had great QC because they were indeed made in a factory
Last edited by Robbgnarly at Nov 1, 2014,
#26
i got one $300au set it up plays really well sounds good its not perfect ie slot screws on bridge and toggle switch upside down i play proffesionaly am a luthier started at 14 am now 57 gibson fender and many others are useing these sweatshops to so why pay so much when you can get the same thing for less
#27
Quote by dirtyoldmen
i got one $300au set it up plays really well sounds good its not perfect ie slot screws on bridge and toggle switch upside down i play proffesionaly am a luthier started at 14 am now 57 gibson fender and many others are useing these sweatshops to so why pay so much when you can get the same thing for less



1) Necro-bumping an old thread = bad manners.

2) There is no such thing as a "sweat shop" Gibson guitar. All Gibson guitars are made in the U.S. by U.S. workers. Same goes for Fender American and Custom Shop guitars. You should know that if you are actually a Luthier.

3) You can't justify purchasing counterfeit musical equipment, sorry. Maybe in your mind it isn't a big deal. But, for honest hard working people, it's a big deal. Your chibson, not only is pretending to be something it is not, it also hurts employees of Gibson, and it also creates a situation where someone could get scammed or ripped off down the line when that chibby leaves your hands. And at some point it will, unless you vow to burn it before you kick the bucket some day. I don't care if you like your chibson, you're an arse and I hope you realize it one day.
Gear: Gibson Les Paul Studio, Gibson SG Special, Fender Stratocaster, Fender Telecaster, Fender Jazzmaster, Gretsch Pro Jet, Carvin C350, Epiphone ES-339 P90, Epiphone ES-335 Pro. Peavey 6505, Sovtek MIG-100, Vox AC30, Peavey XXX.