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#1
Hey ,

Thought I would ask the question , what is the best mid priced les paul in terms of quality of build and sound quality ? Pre-owned doesn't count has to be brand new as otherwise you can get higher priced guitars in as "mid priced".
Mid priced i see as anything from about 500 to about 999 (1000 up is premium to me) so what is it in your opinion? Also post a link to the guitar if you can and state what genre you feel it best suits
#2
Depends on the features you want on that guitar. Find a good LP studio/faded and your good if you want a classic LP guitar. There are lots of other decent LP shaped guitars these days:
LTD EC range
Agile
Epiphone
Vintage
it just depends on what you want
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#3
The Electra Omega is one of my favorite LP clones. The Omefa Prime has more interesting finishes, but are @$150-200 outside if the stated budget.

The Reverend Rick Vito signature is a tone monster. The hardtails are right at the top edge of your budget, the Bigsby models are @$200 over.

The Malden Karma is a pretty LP, and its sibling, the Bad Karma is voiced and dressed more for harder genres of music.

The Dean Zelinsky Zenyatta is a wonderfully ergonomic take- its body is big, but very, very thin.
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#5
I've heard a lot of good things about Epi Tribute Plus too. Gibson electrics and a real carved maple cap. Maybe I should check one out next time I'm shopping for new axe...

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#7
Quote by Ippon
A MIJ copy!





Keyword was..... (no pre-owned)

and this....
Mid priced i see as anything from about 500 to about 999 (1000 up is premium to me)
#9
PRS SE 245 and LTD EC1000 are two really nice LP-ish guitars in that pricerange. But it should be noted that while they are sort of similar in looks to a Les Paul, they are not copies of a Gibson and will not feel even remotely similar to play.

If it is a Gibson Les Paul you want, I think there are few options that come close, and most of them are not nearly as widely available as the two models I have mentioned. I would look at a Les Paul Studio in that case. Or an Epiphone Les Paul Tribute.
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#10
Quote by paruwi
Keyword was..... (no pre-owned)

and this....
Mid priced i see as anything from about 500 to about 999 (1000 up is premium to me)

Actually, some of those MIJs are still in production- just not with the "lawsuit" headstocks.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#11
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Actually, some of those MIJs are still in production- just not with the "lawsuit" headstocks.


and probably out of the wanted price-range....
or not easily available outside of Japan...
#12
Burny and ESPECIALLY their sister company Fernandes are definitely producing LP copies in that price range, available in the USA.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#13
Quote by paruwi
and probably out of the wanted price-range....
or not easily available outside of Japan...

Why don't you find out yourself?

Quote by dannyalcatraz
Burny and ESPECIALLY their sister company Fernandes are definitely producing LP copies in that price range, available in the USA.


Yes and I do not know about Tokai, but they totally do guitars in your price range that are available here in Finland. Not MIJs though, MIKs... or MICs.
You can add Schecter to the list of X shape made in Korea.

Quote by PhilDuggan

Mid priced i see as anything from about 500 to about 999 (1000 up is premium to me) so what is it in your opinion?


No opinions given about that. I see that guitars that are 1000 euros, new or not, are 1000 euros. Your way of saying this, I don't understand why you need this opinion.
Gear pics

Quote by Cathbard
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Last edited by Sakke at Oct 12, 2014,
#14
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Actually, some of those MIJs are still in production- just not with the "lawsuit" headstocks.



Quote by dannyalcatraz
Burny and ESPECIALLY their sister company Fernandes are definitely producing LP copies in that price range, available in the USA.


MiJ
#16
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Actually, some of those MIJs are still in production- just not with the "lawsuit" headstocks.


They are very much still in production with the lawsuit headstocks.
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#17
Well, I just learned something.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#18
Quote by paruwi
MiJ

Point- I should have said LP copies by Japanese companies, not MIJ. MOST in that price range will be MiKs. You still can get MIJs here...just not usually under $1K.

As for the availability of those MiKs from Japanese makers, they're easy enough to find on eBay, like these Burny guitars:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLC-55JS-Black-Mirror-Pickguard-312048100-/280860445379?pt=Guitar&hash=item4164964ac3

www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLG-55-VLD-Lemon-Drop-High-Cost-Perfomance-312085400-/280839694420?pt=Guitar&hash=item416359a854

Even for lefties:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLC-55JS-Black-Left-Handed-/290675762055?pt=Guitar&hash=item43ada02387


...and some makers, like Fernandes, Ibanez and ESP/LTD are actually are sold by American retailers.

IOW, finding them isn't that big a deal.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Oct 12, 2014,
#19
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Point- I should have said LP copies by Japanese companies, not MIJ. MOST in that price range will be MiKs. You still can get MIJs here...just not usually under $1K.

As for the availability of those MiKs from Japanese makers, they're easy enough to find on eBay, like these Burny guitars:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLC-55JS-Black-Mirror-Pickguard-312048100-/280860445379?pt=Guitar&hash=item4164964ac3

www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLG-55-VLD-Lemon-Drop-High-Cost-Perfomance-312085400-/280839694420?pt=Guitar&hash=item416359a854

Even for lefties:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BURNY-by-Fernandes-RLC-55JS-Black-Left-Handed-/290675762055?pt=Guitar&hash=item43ada02387


...and some makers, like Fernandes, Ibanez and ESP/LTD are actually are sold by American retailers.

IOW, finding them isn't that big a deal.


The OP prefers new ones.....

and he is located in Ireland
#20
All three of those Burnys I listed are new.

As for his location, it wasn't mentioned, and near as I can tell, neither was currency until you brought up euros.

Anyway, for anyone in the USA who is on the same hunt as the OP, Carvins can be found forum dee $1000, too.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/guitars-in-stock/123438
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#21
I agree with Ippon. MIJ is where it's at at that kind of money, at least based on what I've played (and in my opinion, obviously). I'm guessing they should just sneak in (new) to the upper end of that budget, but I could be wrong.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#22
and he is located in Ireland


And I just checked- that seller ships worldwide.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#23
Epiphone les Paul standard is priced nice there great guiatrs
#24
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Oct 12, 2014,
#25
Remember though that shipping costs from USA are not cheap. Plus we get about 20-25% taxes slammed on top of all that. The final price jumps over 1000€, over ~1200$ that is.

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#26
yeah. sometimes you can still get a good deal if you import. but a lot of the time most of the savings are eroded by shipping, VAT, customs etc. (or at least enough of them that it's debatable if the extra risk is worth it).

shouldn't be that hard to get tokais in ireland, though.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#27
Quote by Dave_Mc
yeah. sometimes you can still get a good deal if you import. but a lot of the time most of the savings are eroded by shipping, VAT, customs etc. (or at least enough of them that it's debatable if the extra risk is worth it).

shouldn't be that hard to get tokais in ireland, though.



Tokai's are quite common in here in Finland so I bet thats the case for the rest of the Europe too. Now the MIJ ones like LS-95, which are basically clones of Gibsons, can cost 800€ and above but they are damn good guitars.

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#28
Quote by MaaZeus
Tokai's are quite common in here in Finland so I bet thats the case for the rest of the Europe too. Now the MIJ ones like LS-95, which are basically clones of Gibsons, can cost 800€ and above but they are damn good guitars.


I believe Finland is one of the only countries in the EU where Tokai is a common brand. Gibson has lost the rights to the Les Paul-trademark in Finland (which in itself is a hilarious story, because they sued a dealer for using the Les Paul name to advertise Tokai and called Tokai "inferior" - which ended with Gibson being sued by Tokai for insulting their products, which Tokai won). They have it in pretty much every other country. They are putting pressure on the dealers and basically being an authorized Gibson-dealer, which most stores are, makes it impossible to carry Tokai at the same time.

I do not have the info on how they are doing that, they could have some sort of agreement straight on or they could force the stores to stock so many Epiphone and Gibson guitars that it is impossible to stock other similar stuff.
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#29
Quote by HomerSGR
I believe Finland is one of the only countries in the EU where Tokai is a common brand. Gibson has lost the rights to the Les Paul-trademark in Finland (which in itself is a hilarious story, because they sued a dealer for using the Les Paul name to advertise Tokai and called Tokai "inferior" - which ended with Gibson being sued by Tokai for insulting their products, which Tokai won). They have it in pretty much every other country. They are putting pressure on the dealers and basically being an authorized Gibson-dealer, which most stores are, makes it impossible to carry Tokai at the same time.

I do not have the info on how they are doing that, they could have some sort of agreement straight on or they could force the stores to stock so many Epiphone and Gibson guitars that it is impossible to stock other similar stuff.



Really? Learn something new everyday... That is a shitty and coward practice from Gibsons part. Yeah Tokai still uses the "lawsuit" headstock but still. Really lame Gibson, really lame. If they really are trying to control Tokais availability that is.

*edit* Hah, thanks to you instead of checking the Epi Tribute Plus I might take a look at MIJ Tokai instead. Damnit tax returns, hurry up!

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Last edited by MaaZeus at Oct 13, 2014,
#30
Quote by HomerSGR
I believe Finland is one of the only countries in the EU where Tokai is a common brand. Gibson has lost the rights to the Les Paul-trademark in Finland (which in itself is a hilarious story, because they sued a dealer for using the Les Paul name to advertise Tokai and called Tokai "inferior" - which ended with Gibson being sued by Tokai for insulting their products, which Tokai won). They have it in pretty much every other country. They are putting pressure on the dealers and basically being an authorized Gibson-dealer, which most stores are, makes it impossible to carry Tokai at the same time.

I do not have the info on how they are doing that, they could have some sort of agreement straight on or they could force the stores to stock so many Epiphone and Gibson guitars that it is impossible to stock other similar stuff.



Gibson's legal department even forces stores not to list other 'LesPaul type' guitars as 'LesPaul' - they had to re-name it to 'other Single Cut guitars'
The same happened to some other forums, the 'Other LesPaul' section had to be re-named to 'Other SingleCut guitars'....

and here is some more information about the case in Finland

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55111784/2014/Les%20Paul%20Finland%20Court%20Judgement%20VS%20Gibson.pdf

#31
Quote by paruwi
Gibson's legal department even forces stores not to list other 'LesPaul type' guitars as 'LesPaul' - they had to re-name it to 'other Single Cut guitars'
The same happened to some other forums, the 'Other LesPaul' section had to be re-named to 'Other SingleCut guitars'....

and here is some more information about the case in Finland

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55111784/2014/Les%20Paul%20Finland%20Court%20Judgement%20VS%20Gibson.pdf



Aaand it seems like Gibson became a sore loser because Musamaailma has a shit ton of Tokais and not a single Epi and Gibson which is odd for one of the biggest finnish instrument retailers.. Well, one used Epi is available...

Also now that you mentioned things being getting relabeled, i remembered something. In Thomann les paul type guitars were clearly in category called "Les Paul", which also indicates that thomann too considered word Les Paul a descriptive name for a guitar style and not a trademark. It was like this for years. Now few months ago the category was renamed Single Cuts. Same thing with SG. Work of Gibson or just internal decision?

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#32
Don't hate the playa, hate the game- ya gotsta defend your trademarks or you lose 'em. You'll see the same kinds of actions taken by Kleenex, Xerox, Victoria's Secret and other corporations.

Bayer used to have "Asprin" as a trademarked name, but they didn't defend it, and the name became genericized.

And, humorously, McDonalds has won every battle to defend their trademarks save one: they lost in South Africa. Turns out, there was a burger chain there that was decades old before the megacorp we all know started seriously expanding overseas, and THEIR claim to the trademark was deemed superior to the American company's. After losing, McD's USA reached an out of court settlement with McD's SA so they could get into that market.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Oct 13, 2014,
#33
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Don't hate the playa, hate the game- ya gotsta defend your trademarks or you lose 'em. You'll see the same kinds of actions taken by Kleenex, Xerox, Victoria's Secret and other corporations.

Bayer used to have "Asprin" as a trademarked name, but they didn't defend it, and the name became genericized.

And, humorously, McDonalds has won every battle to defend their trademarks save one: they lost in South Africa. Turns out, there was a burger chain there that was decades old before the megacorp we all know started seriously expanding overseas, and THEIR claim to the trademark was deemed superior to the American company's. After losing, McD's USA reached an out of court settlement with McD's SA so they could get into that market.


Oh, I know you have to defend your trademarks but i just have no respect for sore losers. To me they are like kids after a fight, "i wont play with you anymore". Damnit you lost, now eat it up like a man!
Now, it could be that it was Musamaailma who stopped selling Gibsons out of principle, but more likely it was the Gibson who got sand in their groin after the issue.

Sorry for the off topic discussion TS but this is too interesting.

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#34
Quote by MaaZeus
Aaand it seems like Gibson became a sore loser because Musamaailma has a shit ton of Tokais and not a single Epi and Gibson which is odd for one of the biggest finnish instrument retailers.. Well, one used Epi is available...

Also now that you mentioned things being getting relabeled, i remembered something. In Thomann les paul type guitars were clearly in category called "Les Paul", which also indicates that thomann too considered word Les Paul a descriptive name for a guitar style and not a trademark. It was like this for years. Now few months ago the category was renamed Single Cuts. Same thing with SG. Work of Gibson or just internal decision?


By demand of Gibsons legal department

The funny thing is....

Even Gibsons and Epis are now listed as 'Single Cuts' or 'Double Cuts'

Last edited by paruwi at Oct 13, 2014,
#35
Quote by dannyalcatraz
You'll see the same kinds of actions taken by Kleenex, Xerox, Victoria's Secret and other corporations.


I sometimes find that what I was doing just before I make a forum post inadvertently influences what I type.

I really have to wonder what the heck you were just doing before you typed this post.

o_O

Quote by MaaZeus
Tokai's are quite common in here in Finland so I bet thats the case for the rest of the Europe too. Now the MIJ ones like LS-95, which are basically clones of Gibsons, can cost 800€ and above but they are damn good guitars.


yeah. sometimes you can get deals on them, too- though the prices aren't as good as they once were, unfortunately.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#36
Anything that says Gibson on the headstock for under $1,000 isn't worth $1,000. Why is it you're against getting used?
OBEY THE MIGHTY SHITKICKER
#37
Quote by Dave_Mc
I sometimes find that what I was doing just before I make a forum post inadvertently influences what I type.

I really have to wonder what the heck you were just doing before you typed this post.

o_O

Yes.

Ô_Ô
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#38
Mainly due to comeback, a guitar could be as screwed as could.be eg.stripped screws and bolts, cracked, chipped, nut shattered, truss rod adjustments do nothing and of course things like incorrect assembly like nut being uneven or fretboard being uneven. If it was pre owned then money is wasted and I'd be stuck with a couple of hundred euros worth of crap but with new if I got that from shipping I could call them on it and get a full replacement or a refund. I don't trust pre owned especially over seas pre owned. Also I like the idea of being the "first" person outside the assembly line to play it also I like opening up the packaging haha
#39
Right now, I own more than 20 guitars. About a quarter of them were purchased used. And most of my guitars had to be purchased sight unseen because they were not available locally.

Most commercial dealers in used guitars take care that they don't buy utter crap in the first place because that would be bad for business. Hard to resell, and bad for the rep if they do. At least, if they're not up-front about it- look for tags saying things like "as-is" coupled with a no refund policy.

Private sellers have less motivation to avoid shady dealing, but even so, more people are honest than dishonest.

Pretty much, buying used is not so risky if you stick to reputable sellers and really pay attention to what you're being told/sold. More often than not, buying used is a great way to stretch your budget.

As for enjoying the "new guitar smell", well, who can argue with that?
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#40
^ Yeah if you buy used from a shop you normally have some comeback. I think you normally get a 3 month warranty (in the UK, anyway- that might well be EU-wide).

Big problem is buying used from a shop erodes a lot of the savings of going used since shop prices are higher (I think they have to charge VAT in a shop on the profit, plus they're a shop with overheads).

I generally prefer new, too. If you know you prefer new (even if you accept it's maybe silly), it doesn't make much sense to let other people talk you into buying used. You're the one who has to live with the purchase, not those other people.

I also sometimes wonder how many of the people who act like I'm stupid for preferring new drink or smoke. Cos, you know, that's a much more sensible way to spend your money.

Don't get me wrong- I don't care less how anyone else spends his/her money (well, within reason- if they're funding a "let's reopen auschwitz!" kickstarter campaign I wouldn't be best pleased), but if they feel qualified to comment on how I spend mine, I reserve the right to query just how sensible all of their purchases are...

Quote by dannyalcatraz
Yes.

Ô_Ô


I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 14, 2014,
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