#1
(I know it's a long post but it doesn't take as long as you would think and I really need hellp=Hello everyone I am in a band and last saturday my band played their first gig(I had done acoustic shows previously but this was my first full band show). It's me, one other guitarist(who is also the lead singer), a bassist and the drummer. Because I needed another amp I got a fender super champ before the gig and was pretty happy with it but was worried about the gig being outside(I know valves don't like to be in the cold and then immediately played through) and that the amp wouldn't be loud enough. I got through the gig okay but before I bought the super champ I had also looked at the mustang iii and fender champion 100. Today I went to my nearest guitar center to make sure I had made the right choice(I also invariably have buyers remorse after pretty much anything) and tried out the other two. My band plans on doing as many gigs as possible and I would rather not have to worry about never being heard-and reliability is also a big concern since I might not always have a backup. At guitar center I found that I quite like the fender champion 100 but the appeal of being able to plug into my computer to get presets like I would with the mustang has me wondering, portability is also a concern since I will be using this at practice which is at the other guitarists house. The mustang sounded a bit electronic to me and i preferred the champion 100 but I believe that may have just been the presets. I hate the thought of returning my super champ x2 but I will if necessary-it tends to be on pretty much as loud as it can go and I have a tendency to not turn up enough. Sorry for the long post and I need a decent clean sound out of the amp, I play rock/blues rock(think of everything from hendrix to led zep to maybe some white stripes stuff and maybe some rory gallagher and bb, freddie and albert king), I mostly play a strat but also quite like my les paul. Let me know if you need any more information. Again sorry for the long post and thanks for any help
#2
Just stick a mike in front of your amp and you'll be fine. Tubes don't care about the outside world being cold, they used to use them in tanks in Russian winters. You aren't playing anywhere as cold as that are you?

And please, man - paragraphs. That was painful to read.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#3
Quote by Cathbard
Tubes don't care about the outside world being cold, they used to use them in tanks in Russian winters.


No, but the circuit isn’t going to be happy if the amp heats up too quickly and water condenses inside the amp.
#4
Thank you for your help, but mikes may not always be an option, also if the other guitarist decides hes gonna play slightly louder than normal I'll be totally out of luck-same deal with the drummer. Also my band might be going to a nearby town for a few days where I do not know what type of places we will be playing and I also would probably have a hard time getting a replacement valve for a tube amp. And I'll try to take your advice on paragraphs if I ever write anything that long again.
#5
Hey what now? Heat causes condensation? In what universe?
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#6
Quote by Lazy Cake
Thank you for your help, but mikes may not always be an option, also if the other guitarist decides hes gonna play slightly louder than normal I'll be totally out of luck-same deal with the drummer. Also my band might be going to a nearby town for a few days where I do not know what type of places we will be playing and I also would probably have a hard time getting a replacement valve for a tube amp. And I'll try to take your advice on paragraphs if I ever write anything that long again.



Then you tell your other guitarist to turn down. Youre in a band, you have to work with your mates. If you are worried about tubes going out, buy some now to keep with you. What kind of venues would you be playing that wouldn't be miced? That is a bit unusual these days for any sort of club/bar situation...

If you are playing without miccing up it may be worth it to get a louder amp, but I don't know how loud the Super Champ will get soo I couldn't say for certain.

If you have replacement valves I wouldn't worry too much about the Champ going down on you (anymore than another amp).
I'm just a kickin' and a gougin' in the mud and the blood and the beer.
#7
Why aren't mikes an option? There has to be a PA of some type. You only need one channel.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#8
Well in situations like saturday it was a place that normally only has quieter acts, but the other guitarist talked to the owners about maybe playing with a full band on their back patio area-so there was no PA and we had to bring all of our own stuff, and I would not be surprised if this is a recurring theme. We are probably going to be playing anywhere we can.
#9
You'll still need a PA. What's the singer gonna use? I play gigs where I have to supply the PA. It's not uncommon - but you need one, even if you have to hire it.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#10
Quote by Cathbard
Hey what now? Heat causes condensation? In what universe?


Warm air + cold surface = condensation. Like windows in winter.
#11
The chassis warms up too.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#12
Is this the amp?
http://www.themusiczoo.com/product/12965/Fender-Super-Champ-X2-Amplifier/

I don't think that is valve and the fact that it isn't loud enough also points in that direction.
Not a big deal if you do outside gigs, if you look at touring acts most have valve amps. Just make sure there are no sudden extremes in temperature, ie if you take it from the car to giug, make sure you plug in and let it warm up.

I'd go for a 30 watt valve or 60watt solid state amp went playing out, that'd be my minimum.
Last edited by diabolical at Nov 25, 2014,
#13
Oh, have they made another Champ that's nothing like the Champ before it? Again? The Super Champ was always a hybrid, and not a bad one. What is it with Fender regurgitating the same name over and over again on completely different amplifiers. They give me the shits.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#14
It is a valve amp, I can see both the power amp and the preamp valves. And not all PAs handle vocals and guitar very well I thought.
#15
But if we could get back to the topic, what does everyone recommend? Is the mustang just a matter of making/downloading your own presets? Anyone think that the 2x12 champion would be too inconvenient to take around? I will need to be able to use my pedals with these amps as well, I don't have many but I am gonna be getting some more most likely[two most important ones now are a Boss Blues Driver and a Danelectro Fab tone(one of the older ones with the metal housing)].
But I will probably also need a fuzz at some point and I do play a lot of slide so good tones for that would be good too. Thanks
#16
used Fender Hot Rod Deluxe and call it a day. get yourself a couple of pedals abd you'll be good. what amp is your other guitar player using?
#17
I still run into a lot of gigs where the PA is "for vocals only," and the instruments have to hold their own. I ran into one where the vocalist (who was also the band leader) was convinced that if instruments were run through the PA system, it would make him sound bad by distorting "his sound."

Generally a reasonably efficient 30-50W tube amp will hold its own against a hard-working drummer.
#18
I own a Super Champ XD as one of 5 amps including a Mesa and 64 Super Reverb. Is it loud enough to gig? Yes just. With the amp dimed I get pretty good Hendrix tone on voice 8, and channel 1 is pure tube Blackface heaven that takes pedals well. We gig regularly and I usually take the Mesa these days but a Super Champ is enough if you plan well. Get everyone in the band to lock onto the snare drum and match their loudest passages to that. This way you can control volume wars without fist fights and not get thrown out of a bunch of rooms because you are too loud.

If I didn't have the Mesa I would gig with the Super Champ easily because the tone is in there and it is plenty loud enough. For large shows everything gets mic'd, and small shows like out on the patio it is plenty. The SC also has a cab voiced line out which will take your signal to the board without a mic but I have never needed it.

The Super Champ is my favorite grab-n-go practice amp because it sounds great and is easy to haul around, set up and wail. I use it for rehearsal 80% of the time and it runs with the drum kit just fine. Do the Mesa and SR sound better? Yes just. Maybe 10% better at 10x the price.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Nov 25, 2014,
#19
Any reason why we're locked into Fender amps?
I think you'd be much better server by a Traynor, one of the Carvin Tweed amps or AC30.
I wouldn't go for these modelling amps, as pretty soon you'll discover the preset exchange is not a big deal, at least I did. I'd at least go for something more powerful, regardless of the brand.
#20
Quote by diabolical
Any reason why we're locked into Fender amps?
I think you'd be much better server by a Traynor, one of the Carvin Tweed amps or AC30.
I wouldn't go for these modelling amps, as pretty soon you'll discover the preset exchange is not a big deal, at least I did. I'd at least go for something more powerful, regardless of the brand.


Maybe he likes Fender amps. Budget is the sticking point I think. He doesn't have $1k to buy an AC30 but a Peavey Classic 30 or a Carvin used might be viable. I actually think his fears are unfounded and a confident player can gig with the Super Champ or a Pro Jr. every night without issues.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Nov 25, 2014,
#21
Quote by dspellman
I still run into a lot of gigs where the PA is "for vocals only," and the instruments have to hold their own. I ran into one where the vocalist (who was also the band leader) was convinced that if instruments were run through the PA system, it would make him sound bad by distorting "his sound."

Generally a reasonably efficient 30-50W tube amp will hold its own against a hard-working drummer.
Did you slap him furiously about the head and shoulders to demonstrate your disapproval of his stupidity?
The only reason not to mike up an amp is a lack of channels. Most times I don't end up being turned up in FoH but I always give the sound guy the opportunity to do so by shoving a mike in front.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band