#1
Hi all, I'm currently a student looking to purchase a laptop. My biggest priority is school related things, but I also want something that can run music editing software (currently running Ableton Live) and basic video editing software as well. Also, I'm on the internet quite often (specifically forums, email, and ebay for the most part), so it needs to be rather quick for loading web pages. as well. I've narrowed it down to these three, two of which are "older" (2011's I think) upgraded MacBook Pros on eBay, the other being an HP Pavilion at BestBuy. I'm more of a guitarist than I am audio engineer/ computer technician, so I'm not very hip as to what to look for, what laptops are good or bad, etc. so I was hoping you wiser ones could help me. From a specs perspective it looks like the HP is the winner, but I've heard that the MBP is the best computer for basically everything, so I was looking for more opinions. Due to being a student, I am rather low on spending cash, so I'd rather not spend more than these. Please have a look at each and tell me which one looks best for my purposes: Thanks

http://www.ebay.com/itm/201240032294?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&rmvSB=true

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231431352255?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&rmvSB=true

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/hp-pavilion-15-6-laptop-intel-core-i7-6gb-memory-750gb-hard-drive-natural-silver-ash-silver/9724649.p?id=1219431368730&skuId=9724649
#2
MBP and never look back. You pay a little more and you get what you pay for. Also no viruses ever.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#4
My MBP is from 2009 and I just upgraded ram to 8G and added a SSD. Lightening quick and Garageband loads instantly. I can recommend it for recording and music production.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#5
Yes get a book pro, it works better.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#6
I'm gonna say get the 15" MBP. Only issue is a lot of software isn't working with OSX 10.10 yet (which is why I'm running 10.9.5).

At the same time, I would also advise finding a higher spec laptop. Those things are super outdated (except for the HP, which still needs more RAM and a faster hard drive).

Quote by Cajundaddy
My MBP is from 2009 and I just upgraded ram to 8G and added a SSD. Lightening quick and Garageband loads instantly. I can recommend it for recording and music production.

Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
Ibanez RG3120 Prestige (Dimarzio Titans)
Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz V
Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
Last edited by oneblackened at Dec 27, 2014,
#7
Quote by oneblackened
I'm gonna say get the 15" MBP. Only issue is a lot of software isn't working with OSX 10.10 yet (which is why I'm running 10.9.5).

At the same time, I would also advise finding a higher spec laptop. Those things are super outdated (except for the HP, which still needs more RAM and a faster hard drive).


Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything.


Is there anything that you'd suggest that's in that price range? I don't have too much more room in my budget, so I"m not sure what else I could do, but if there''s better options out there in that budget I'm all for it.
#8
Windows Surface Pro 3. Mac's suck and eventually break and then you get ass raped by the Apple "Support".
Quote by Charles Ives
Stand up and take your dissonance like a man. I don't write music for sissy ears.

Quote by Béla Bartók
Competitions are for horses, not artists.


Ambient Symphonic Depressive Southern Melodic Blackened Death/Doom Metal
#9
^ what?

Anyway, you don't want a surface for that stuff TS.

First off they cost as much as mac's but they run windows so they're not stable, then have little data interfaces (only one USB port and nothing else IIRC), the screen isn't big and the majority of DAW's don't integrate that well with touch screens.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#10
Quote by oneblackened
I'm gonna say get the 15" MBP. Only issue is a lot of software isn't working with OSX 10.10 yet (which is why I'm running 10.9.5).

At the same time, I would also advise finding a higher spec laptop. Those things are super outdated (except for the HP, which still needs more RAM and a faster hard drive).


Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything.


Wow! spoken like someone who has never spent time with it. After working with Roland VS systems for many years and going over to ProTools, I am back to preferring Garageband for most projects. It is simple, intuitive and can do essentially anything a musician might want. Especially a self professed non-techie such as the TS.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#11
HP doesn't make the best laptops but I would take that one with the i7 and 6 gigs of ram before I would take that used macbook with the i5 and 4 gb.

Quote by emad
jthm_guitarist
Warned for trolling!


Quote by metal4eva_22
Didn't you say that you had a stuffed fox that you would occasionally fuck?

Quote by Axelfox
It's not a fox,it's a wolf.
#12
If the Macs were more closely specced to the HP, then the Macs would win, no doubt. Ease of use, great user interface and it just works. You can't really mess with anything so breaking something won't be an issue.

Quote by Cajundaddy
MBP and never look back. You pay a little more and you get what you pay for. Also no viruses ever.


Macs can and do get viruses. Stop spreading rumors.

As long as TS doesn't visit shady sites (i.e. Mostly porn) he should be fine on a Windows machine. All I'm running is Microsoft Security Essentials. The Surface Pro would also be a bad choice because like Spambot said, not much input ports.

Also 1st and 2nd generation Core i5s vs a 4th gen Core i7. The i7 is going to run faster no matter how you look at it. 6GBs for RAM should be enough for most things. If I can run Reaper on a 1st gen i3 with 2GB of RAM then TS should be fine.

The only con I see in getting the HP is Windows 8. Good on touchscreens but not on anything else. It works but it's not as good as Windows 7.
#13
Quote by Cajundaddy
Wow! spoken like someone who has never spent time with it.
I have spent time with it and I do concur - it doesn't do much.

Sure it can do the simple stuff, but when you talk to me about in depth midi editing or built in fx processors (since you can't load plugins) or on the fly audio editing, it looses to most of the DAW's out there.
Quote by Cajundaddy
After working with Roland VS systems for many years and going over to ProTools, I am back to preferring Garageband for most projects.
That's 'cause pro tools sucks, try logic
Quote by darrenram1
Macs can and do get viruses.
Only virus worthwhile mentioning is the one that was java's fault, and now they fixed it.

Can't you find any mac using a last gen i3?
i3's and i7's have hyperthreading and DAW's love hyperthreading.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#14
Decided to get the 13.3" MBP with 8GB RAM and 250gb SSD and then I"ll upgrade the processor down the road.
#15
Quote by randomguitar56
Decided to get the 13.3" MBP with 8GB RAM and 250gb SSD and then I"ll upgrade the processor down the road.


I don't think that you can upgrade the processor at all. Even on most non-Macs, the processors are soldered to the motherboard; and Apple is notorious for locking things down.

250GB is not much in today's standards. So you might want to get a bigger external hard drive for storage. Keep the SSD as your boot drive/for things you want to load quickly
(eg. Your DAW)
#16
Quote by randomguitar56
Decided to get the 13.3" MBP with 8GB RAM and 250gb SSD and then I"ll upgrade the processor down the road.


This is essentially what I have and it rips. Add a 1TB external firewire drive if you find you are using up storage.

Ignore the DAW cork-sniffers and dig into using Garageband. For non-techies it rocks and if you ever find yourself doing soundtracks for film scores you can just transfer your tracks to another heavier DAW.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#17
Quote by randomguitar56
Decided to get the 13.3" MBP with 8GB RAM and 250gb SSD and then I"ll upgrade the processor down the road.

You can't really upgrade the processor in laptops. They're almost always BGA (Ball Grid Array) - which means they're soldered to the motherboard.

Quote by Cajundaddy
This is essentially what I have and it rips. Add a 1TB external firewire drive if you find you are using up storage.

Ignore the DAW cork-sniffers and dig into using Garageband. For non-techies it rocks and if you ever find yourself doing soundtracks for film scores you can just transfer your tracks to another heavier DAW.

Yeah, no. Garageband is decent at best for demos and is nearly useless beyond that. The midi editing is poor, audio editing is nonexistent, it can't import or export MIDI... The list goes on.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
Ibanez RG3120 Prestige (Dimarzio Titans)
Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz V
Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
Last edited by oneblackened at Dec 28, 2014,
#18
Alright, so if I can't upgrade the processor, would it be better to go with:

New HP Pavilion

1) 4th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-4510U processor (is only dual-core, and it's on the low end for an i7, average CPU Benchmark score of 3981)

2) 6GB DDR3L SDRAM

3) Ugrade the Hard Drive to a Samsung - 840 EVO 250GB Internal Serial ATA III Solid State Drive for Laptops

For a total of $670 + tax

Or


2011 Used MacBook Pro

1) Intel Core 2nd generation 2.4GHz Core i5 (2435M) ( Average CPU Benchmark score of 3215)

2) 8GB 1333 MHz DDR3 RAM

3) 250GB SSD

For a total of $593

This is making me heavily consider the HP if it had a new drive in it. However, I"m looking for more opinions which are probably wiser than mine.
#19
Quote by randomguitar56
Alright, so if I can't upgrade the processor, would it be better to go with:

New HP Pavilion

1) 4th Gen Intel® Core™ i7-4510U processor (is only dual-core, and it's on the low end for an i7, average CPU Benchmark score of 3981)

2) 6GB DDR3L SDRAM

3) Ugrade the Hard Drive to a Samsung - 840 EVO 250GB Internal Serial ATA III Solid State Drive for Laptops

For a total of $670 + tax

Or


2011 Used MacBook Pro

1) Intel Core 2nd generation 2.4GHz Core i5 (2435M) ( Average CPU Benchmark score of 3215)

2) 8GB 1333 MHz DDR3 RAM

3) 250GB SSD

For a total of $593

This is making me heavily consider the HP if it had a new drive in it. However, I"m looking for more opinions which are probably wiser than mine.



Wait, it's a dual core i7?

LOL, get the mac. No question then. If you can find something with a quad core i7 then grab that.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
Ibanez RG3120 Prestige (Dimarzio Titans)
Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz V
Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#20
Quote by oneblackened
Wait, it's a dual core i7?

LOL, get the mac. No question then. If you can find something with a quad core i7 then grab that.



Why would he get the Mac? The Core i5 in it is an older one and it's also a dual core.

TS, are you in America? Maybe you could check this notebook out. It has the same CPU as the HP, 8gb RAM and 1TB of storage space and it's cheaper. You could get an SSD with the money you save.

Lenovo Ideapad G50

EDIT: http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4510U-vs-Intel-Core-i5-2435M

TS, that's the CPU comparison between the Mac and the HP/Lenovo.
Last edited by darrenram1 at Dec 28, 2014,
#21
Quote by Cajundaddy
Ignore the DAW cork-sniffers and dig into using Garageband.
Much like you would ignore a GTR 'cause a prius can do everything just fine with less complications.

Garageband works and it's good if it does everything you like, but don't go around calling DAW corksniffers the people who say it's hella limited.
'cause it's hella limited.
Quote by randomguitar56
Alright, so if I can't upgrade the processor, would it be better to go with
*computers specs*
It's not like one would be much better than the other considering what you wanna do with them.

I'd take the mac any day 'cause of Mac OS.
Quote by darrenram1
Why would he get the Mac?
The only reason people used to get mac's for - it runs Mac OS instead of win.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#22
Quote by darrenram1
Why would he get the Mac? The Core i5 in it is an older one and it's also a dual core.

TS, are you in America? Maybe you could check this notebook out. It has the same CPU as the HP, 8gb RAM and 1TB of storage space and it's cheaper. You could get an SSD with the money you save.

Lenovo Ideapad G50

EDIT: http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4510U-vs-Intel-Core-i5-2435M

TS, that's the CPU comparison between the Mac and the HP/Lenovo.


I see no point in paying for a low power dual core branded as an i7.


Also, I'd take the mac instead of the PC, because having used both, I have WAY fewer problems with OSX than I did with Windows.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA6R42B29881 This is a true quad core i7 with 8GB of RAM and a 1TB drive. Blows the 4510U out of the water.

Or, if you want a solid state drive, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA5YV2CZ2454 The processor is a little older, but again it's a true quad core with 8 GB of RAM.

It's a little more than upgrading the HP that OP posted but much more powerful.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
Ibanez RG3120 Prestige (Dimarzio Titans)
Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz V
Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
Last edited by oneblackened at Dec 28, 2014,
#23
Quote by oneblackened


Yeah, no. Garageband is decent at best for demos and is nearly useless beyond that. The midi editing is poor, audio editing is nonexistent, it can't import or export MIDI... The list goes on.


Who actually uses MIDI? Been recording music for 30 years and I never touch the stuff.

DAWs are just tools. Learn to use the tools. For a non-techie like the TS Garageband is the ticket. Next I'm gonna have you guys post your best tracks on your high-end-super-excellent MIDI DAWs to sound cloud and we can compare yours to my favorite GB tracks. We'll take a poll and see who's stuff is tits... or not. Time to put your sound cloud where your mouth is boys.

Hint: I hired a ringer.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#24
Quote by Cajundaddy
Who actually uses MIDI? Been recording music for 30 years and I never touch the stuff.

DAWs are just tools. Learn to use the tools. For a non-techie like the TS Garageband is the ticket. Next I'm gonna have you guys post your best tracks on your high-end-super-excellent MIDI DAWs to sound cloud and we can compare yours to my favorite GB tracks. We'll take a poll and see who's stuff is tits... or not. Time to put your sound cloud where your mouth is boys.

Hint: I hired a ringer.

Lots of people do. Pretty essential if you're using any kind of synth or triggering samples.

I work as an engineer, believe me when I say I'm pretty sure my mixes are better than yours.
Current Gear:
LTD MH-400 with Gotoh GE1996T (EMG 85/60)
PRS SE Custom 24 (Suhr SSH+/SSV)
Ibanez RG3120 Prestige (Dimarzio Titans)
Squier Vintage Modified 70s Jazz V
Audient iD22 interface
Peavey Revalver 4, UAD Friedman BE100/DS40
Adam S3A monitors
Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#25
Quote by Cajundaddy
Who actually uses MIDI? Been recording music for 30 years and I never touch the stuff.
Again, if you don't and the thing works good for you, but people do use midi.
Quote by Cajundaddy
DAWs are just tools. Learn to use the tools.
So are a high end kenwood (itchen appliances) and a whisk.

You can still make bread with both, but you can't mix stuff that good with a whisk unless you wanna spend 10x the time you would spend using the kenwood.
Quote by Cajundaddy
Next I'm gonna have you guys post your best tracks on your high-end-super-excellent MIDI DAWs to sound cloud and we can compare yours to my favorite GB tracks.
So, like, a mixing competition?
'case it's not like people who can't mix don't use big DAW's.

Still though...
https://kiwi6.com/file/8bg0jc2c08
https://kiwi6.com/file/gpcjn79u2p
Quote by oneblackened
believe me when I say I'm pretty sure my mixes are better than yours.
Come on you can't say "believe me I'm better than you", why would anyone believe you, ever?

Provide proof that you're better, else you're just good at talking.
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
Last edited by Spambot_2 at Dec 29, 2014,
#26
Quote by Cajundaddy
Who actually uses MIDI? Been recording music for 30 years and I never touch the stuff.




not sure if trolling or not..

Anyways. I have a Lenova laptop with I7quad 8 gb ram and a dedicated video card.

Compared to mac, having owned 2 Imacs and 1 macbook pro.

Both have no problem doing what you want user wise or power wise. I can unplug my midi and audio devices while they are running in my DAW, plug back in and it works again. No memory problems or DAW crashes. If you get a crash, it reloads anyway with Ableton at the very last edit you did.

As for the Apple devices. They work well, all still broke down after 3- 5 years of heavy usage, not much differences same hardware same wear I guess. Controllers/interfaces tend to be accepted more smoothly by apple. Apple OS and general computing seems to have more stable speed over time.

Basically The Apple OS wins in smoothness but stability wise both work these days.

Real problem I find is Screen size. If you record and mix a lot, 13'' inch is most likely way too small, unless your the guy who can live with scrolling a lot.

The "Re-incarnation of Plato" Award 2009
(most intelligent)
The "Good Samaritan" Award 2009 (most helpful)

[font="Palatino Linotype
Who's Andy Timmons??
Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Dec 29, 2014,
#27
Quote by xxdarrenxx
not sure if trolling or not..


Naw, just dispelling a few internet myths. There are some here who seem unable to make music on a DAW without MIDI synth triggers outboard plugins and live editing. I contend that these are useful tools but unnecessary, especially to the TS, an admitted non-techie who is just dipping his toe into DAW waters. Lot's of unfounded Garageband bashing which happens to be my preferred software right now for creating music quickly and easily with no muss and no fuss. It just works.

Comments like these are just nonsense if making great music is the goal:

"Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything."

"Yeah, no. Garageband is decent at best for demos and is nearly useless beyond that. The midi editing is poor, audio editing is nonexistent, it can't import or export MIDI

"Sure it can do the simple stuff, but when you talk to me about in depth midi editing or built in fx processors (since you can't load plugins) or on the fly audio editing, it looses to most of the DAW's out there."

Just balderdash when looking for an easy to use DAW.

Remember that most of the top selling albums of all time were recorded before MIDI DAWs existed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_albums

I contend that these fine gentlemen are focusing too much on shiny gear and long spec sheets but not enough on the music. A widespread and pervasive problem these days.

Anyways, the gauntlet has been thrown. Apparently one of these guys is a pro engineer and the other has a home project studio. I simply suggest they post their finest mix from a full featured DAW of their choice and we will compare them to my favorite Garageband mix. We can all judge with our ears if the simple but effective Garagband DAW can run with the big dogs when it comes to results. Making great music is the point, not the length of our DAW spec sheet. Waiting patiently for oneblackened to throw his hat into the ring.

Sorry for the slight thread detour TS but if you really want to record music at home, you might find these results both interesting and relevant to your gear purchase.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Dec 29, 2014,
#28
If one's using the computer for mixing he may as well get a fairly cheap big monitor.

21+" full HD screens are a dime a dozen these days.
They don't all look good but you can get one good enough for the job for less than $200.

And working with a pair of monitors is sooo much better if ya ask me.
Quote by Cajundaddy
I contend that these are useful tools but unnecessary, especially to the TS, an admitted non-techie who is just dipping his toe into DAW waters.
Indeed.

None of us is saying garageband's not good enough for starters, we're saying that a big DAW might be better considering the lotsa more options it offers.
Quote by Cajundaddy
Comments like these are just nonsense if making great music is the goal:
Why don't you publish your music right after having recorded it with your cell phone?

Music is indeed the most important thing, but options are good, always.
Quote by Cajundaddy
Remember that most of the top selling albums of all time were recorded before MIDI DAWs existed. I contend that these fine gentlemen are focusing too much on shiny gear and long spec sheets but not enough on the music. A widespread and pervasive problem these days.
These albums were recorded by the finest engineers with the finest gear available at the time.

Don't really know 'bout thriller, but the dark side of the moon was mostly tracked by Alan Parson on a Atruder A80 16 track recorder when 8 tracks only were commonly used at the time, through a TG EMI mark IV console at abbey road while some people used to record 2 tracks directly on 1" tape, going from two mic's to the pre's to the recorder.

The gear they used helped shape the sounds on that album and gave the musicians different ways to experiment, hence writing different and arguably "better" music.

Sgt. Pepper's LHCB was recorded at abbey road with George Martin watching over, and there they employed new techniques as well, using the best gear available at the time - in one song for example Lennon wasn't able to play the piano part at the right speed, so they recorded it one octave lower and sped it up.

Short story, even though music matters for sure, gear plays a big part and the albums you posted were all recorded using among the best gear available at the time.
Quote by Cajundaddy
We can all judge with our ears if the simple but effective Garagband DAW can run with the big dogs when it comes to results.
Much like a behringer ultragain pro could run with a 1073 - better music would still be better music, but whatever music it is it will sound better passed through a 1073.

Also I forgot this.
Just to give you an idea of what you can do if you do use midi.
http://kiwi6.com/file/aj3md94zcf
Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
Last edited by Spambot_2 at Dec 29, 2014,
#29
To Cajundaddy

I agree with you on that you can record music in garageband np, though that does not mean it's advanced software. Some things that are considered basic mix mastering things cannot be done in garageband.

Admittedly I don't know the current status at all as far as "where" the software is, but things like EQ, fine audio edits and fine mixing it could not do when I last used it.

I don't think it's fair to compare it to "old times". Admittedly they had no computers, but what they did have though is compressors, reverb units, EQ's of varying quality, + a ton of other (analogue) hardware.

The package might be different as it is today, but the tools and how music mixing is done has not changed all that much as far as the basics go.

A correct analogy would be that tons of bands just recorded their takes, overlapped them and put them out 'as is'. This is not the case.

There is off course the exception of a Live album', which would have the same quality as using basic software, but that's just one type of sound, and their is tons of music not recorded/produced that way.

The "Re-incarnation of Plato" Award 2009
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The "Good Samaritan" Award 2009 (most helpful)

[font="Palatino Linotype
Who's Andy Timmons??
Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Dec 29, 2014,
#30
Quote by xxdarrenxx
There is off course the exception of a Live album', which would have the same quality as using basic software
Live performances that end up on albums are (nowadays at least) recorded on multiple tracks and mixed as much as studio recordings.
Name's Luca.

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Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
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#31
Quote by Spambot_2
Live performances that end up on albums are (nowadays at least) recorded on multiple tracks and mixed as much as studio recordings.


Well you don't have to be selective.., off course there are tons of pseudo-live albums, not too mention I can't even remember the last time I seen a concert dvd with actual unaltered, un dubbed and unmixed audio behind it.

Also to the whole "bullets fired" thing, Cajun might get nice music his way, and one of us nice music through a DAW, that doesn't prove anything.

One might evaluate and says it's good with in the back of his mind judging on the songwriting, and another person would evaluate music based on how well the music is captured or produced.

We are discussing the potential of the tools here right? So stop discussing based on an implied sense of which tools make the better music.

The "Re-incarnation of Plato" Award 2009
(most intelligent)
The "Good Samaritan" Award 2009 (most helpful)

[font="Palatino Linotype
Who's Andy Timmons??
Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Dec 29, 2014,
#32
Well I guess our pro engineer, oneblackened has quietly left the building. No matter. Lets review the question relevant to the OP now: Is GarageBand a viable, useful DAW tool for making great music in a home project studio or is it indeed as suggested, a crippled, nearly useless toy?

Or to use the exact language:
"Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything."

"Yeah, no. Garageband is decent at best for demos and is nearly useless beyond that. The midi editing is poor, audio editing is nonexistent, it can't import or export MIDI

"Sure it can do the simple stuff, but when you talk to me about in depth midi editing or built in fx processors (since you can't load plugins) or on the fly audio editing, it looses to most of the DAW's out there."

Ahemmm, Nonsense!

Here are a few mixes by spambot on a more "high end" DAW
http://kiwi6.com/file/aj3md94zcf
https://kiwi6.com/file/8bg0jc2c08
https://kiwi6.com/file/gpcjn79u2p

And here is one of my favorite GarageBand mixes from 2004. All of the instruments are software based from within the program app including drums, keys, bass, and the Fender amp sim. Nothing fancy, no outboard plugins, just great music recorded very quickly and effectively with a very intuitive interface. Exactly the sort of thing "non-techies" can use to their best advantage when recording music at home in a project studio setting. Unfortunately I can't take credit for this track as it had a little help from John Mayer.

https://soundcloud.com/dave-hockett/garageband-mix-2004/s-CNE9Z

I think you will agree that we can put the cork-sniffing naysayers to rest. GB can certainly get it done in a home studio. If you are mixing major motion picture film scores or recording A-list pro talent for a major release, you will probably need to jump into the ProTools pool, but until then GarageBand can take you far. If you can't get it done at home with GarageBand and a Mac, you don't have a software problem, you have a talent problem.

Have a happy New Year guys.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
Last edited by Cajundaddy at Dec 31, 2014,
#33
Quote by Cajundaddy
Or to use the exact language:
"Garageband is intentionally very light. It doesn't do much of anything."
So what does it do much of?
Quote by Cajundaddy
"Yeah, no. Garageband is decent at best for demos and is nearly useless beyond that. The midi editing is poor, audio editing is nonexistent, it can't import or export MIDI
So you're saying this is false because the midi editing is comprehensive, you can do in depth audio editing with this, and you can import midi files?
Quote by Cajundaddy
"Sure it can do the simple stuff, but when you talk to me about in depth midi editing or built in fx processors (since you can't load plugins) or on the fly audio editing, it looses to most of the DAW's out there."
Meaning you still can do in depth audio editing, the built in fx processors are comprehensive and have comprehensive controls, and you can do simple transitions, fade in/out's, time stretches and stuff easily and in little time?
Quote by Cajundaddy
And here is one of my favorite GarageBand mixes from 2004. *words on the mix*
Drums parts are similar and apart from that are all the same in everything, all quantized to grid.
Electric piano parts is the same thing.
Bass part is the same thing.

Everything's pretty damn compressed in the background, you can hear that in the electric piano especially - the attack's not any louder than the tail following right after and the volume's the same for a bit less than a couple seconds, and electric pianos don't sound that way.

Drums are overshadowed by the rest, low in volume and the bass drum's sound is ducked by the bass so that you simply don't hear.

Guitar part's nice, but everything else sounds like what it is - a simple programmed part for the guitarist to play something cool on.

Music is good, mix is plain bad.
Quote by Cajundaddy
If you can't get it done at home with GarageBand and a Mac, you don't have a software problem, you have a talent problem.
So you'd take a frontman 10 over an ODS 'cause the former's front panel is smaller, hence simpler, and it still can get the work done?

If you're a good guitarist you're a good guitarist regardless of the amp you're using, but why limiting yourself?
Quote by Cajundaddy
Have a happy New Year guys.
Happy new year!
Let's hope it's better than the last one and that we'll have fun

Name's Luca.

Quote by OliOsbourne
I don't know anything about this topic, but I just clicked on this thread because of your username :O
Quote by Cajundaddy
Clue: amplifiers amplify so don't turn it on if you need quiet.
Quote by chrismendiola
I guess spambots are now capable of reading minds.
#34
Didn't mean for this to turn into a big DAW argument, I'm all set with a DAW actually... For those still wondering I ended up getting the MacBook Pro and I'll see how it is when it gets here, hopefully tomorrow or Saturday.
#35
I know there is a long running debate about Apple vs. PC and I don't want to get that tired old horse started. They both work and that is the bottom line but the original poster said that the primary reason for getting a new notebook, laptop or whatever the current term is, was "school related". With that issue alone I looked up some on-line stats and mid 2014 estimates (I ignored the ones that came directly from Micosoft or Apple as I assume they are both biased toward their own products). Mac/Apple and the Apple OS systems still hold less that 10% of the world's computer market. The estimate is that Mac OS is currently just over 9% of the world market in computers. If 90% of the world market is using a PC based operating system I think a student would use that as a major consideration in a new purchase. The business world has not embraced Apple OS in any significant way though they are advancing in the personal computer market. Back in 2011 Apple OS was on 5-6% of the computers world wide so it is growing but the reality is that ignoring the DAW market for a minute, a student should consider what they will face in the business world and 9 out of 10 times, it won't be an Apple OS.