#1
I'm finally starting a band up and realised I don't have anything I could gig with. I've always played metal so I only own guitars for that singular purpose. At the moment I own a Jackson rr5, Ltd h-1001 and a schecter blackjack and none of these really cut it for rock/blues/indie sorta stuff.

I have a budget of about au$600. I need something I can play blues like old cream to rock like AC-DC, guns and roses and Wolfmother to indie like Artic monkeys. Something that really covers most bases.

The guitars that came to mind were Mexi strats, or Japanese starts like Greco or tokai, epiphone les pauls or a prs se. I'm leaning towards strats at the moment mainly because prs are hard to come by and epiphone quality has been hit and miss for me.

Any input on these guitars or possibly other guitars I've missed?
Last edited by zach9600 at Jan 16, 2015,
#2
I'd go for a mim strat either SSS or HSS depending if you need a humbucker or not.
#3
Ultimately, it's up to what sound you're after. For Cream, obviously a strat would sound best, but at the same time it wouldn't work for Guns N Roses. It really depends on what sound you want, but I could give you some recommendations.

I personally do not like strats, single coils in general really. Some songs call for that thin sound, but it just feels less versatile to me. I always tend to gravitate toward Les Pauls, and I think they'd best fit what you're looking for.

Epiphone quality can suck, if you buy a low end product, however, the Standard PlusTop Pro, or any of the higher $499 ones are amazing. For the price, those guitars are near Gibson quality. For what you're looking to play, the Les Paul would do a great job.

The quality is amazing, almost unreal for the price, so if that's your main concern, they will not disappoint. On top of that, the coil tap feature allows for more versatility. You could dial in the perfect Guns N Roses tone, kick up a fat ACDC tone, and then still be able to achieve the single coil Stratocaster tone without being limited to it.

Great guitars for the price.
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#4
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

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#5
Thanks for the input everybody. I'm still kind of against the les Pauls necks, they felt way to fat and sticky for my tastes. The only epiphone I've played and liked was in a natural wood finish with a clear Satin neck.

I'm really torn between the a stratocaster and a les Paul at the moment, I like the way a strat plays as well the fat guns and roses-ey sounds you can get out of a les Paul. That's why I was looking for something sort of in the middle. From the looks of it that's what these PRS SE guitars appear to be, but I've never actually played one and none of my stores locally carry PRS.

Can anyone give an opinion on a PRS SE. Or If that wouldn't cut it, what about a fat strat? A mim stratocaster with a split SD JB in the bridge would in theory be pretty versatile wouldn't it?

Thanks
Last edited by zach9600 at Jan 16, 2015,
#6
@Dannyalcatraz those guitars look pretty nice, but for nearly 300 to get th shipped to me it's a bit out of my price range Haha
#8
#9
If you want that blues/distorted Cream sound I'd go with a Les Paul style guitar. For old Cream stuff you need humbuckers. When Clapton was with Cream he played a Les Paul (that got stolen early on) then went to an SG Standard (Todd Rundgren owns it now) and then Clapton alternated with his cherry ES-335. Cream was all about humbuckers and Gibson. Jack Bruce even played a Gibson bass most of the time in Cream.
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Last edited by Rickholly74 at Jan 16, 2015,
#10
Quote by Rickholly74
If you want that blues/distorted Cream sound I'd go with a Les Paul style guitar. For old Cream stuff you need humbuckers. When Clapton was with Cream he played a Les Paul (that got stolen early on) then went to an SG Standard (Todd Rundgren owns it now) and then Clapton alternated with his cherry ES-335. Cream was all about humbuckers and Gibson. Jack Bruce even played a Gibson bass in Cream.
True.
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#11
That's the reunion concert and I don't think Clapton came close to his old Cream tone at that concert though of course he plays incredibly well.
#12
I could be wrong but as a big fan of Cream I have never seen a picture of Clapton with a Strat in his cream days. In the Yardbirds it was a Tele and his ES-335 but he knew when he left the yardbirds that he was looking for a different tone so he got the LP with John Mayal and carried that sound into Cream.
#13
greco or tokai strat.
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#14
Quote by zach9600
I'm finally starting a band up and realised I don't have anything I could gig with. I've always played metal so I only own guitars for that singular purpose. At the moment I own a Jackson rr5, Ltd h-1001 and a schecter blackjack and none of these really cut it for rock/blues/indie sorta stuff.

I have a budget of about au$600. I need something I can play blues like old cream to rock like AC-DC, guns and roses and Wolfmother to indie like Artic monkeys. Something that really covers most bases.

The guitars that came to mind were Mexi strats, or Japanese starts like Greco or tokai, epiphone les pauls or a prs se. I'm leaning towards strats at the moment mainly because prs are hard to come by and epiphone quality has been hit and miss for me.

Any input on these guitars or possibly other guitars I've missed?


Strats for sure. Best value for the money at that price.
#15
Well Clapton uses his signature Stratocaster with mid boost!

So no need for a Gibson for the Cream reunions.

If the problem is fatness in the sound you could get a Stratocaster MIM and change pickups to fat 50s or other. Or had a EC mid boost installed. Or otherwise use an effect to make the sound match with the guitar and amp.
#16
Quote by zach9600
Thanks for the input everybody. I'm still kind of against the les Pauls necks, they felt way to fat and sticky for my tastes. The only epiphone I've played and liked was in a natural wood finish with a clear Satin neck.

I'm really torn between the a stratocaster and a les Paul at the moment, I like the way a strat plays as well the fat guns and roses-ey sounds you can get out of a les Paul. That's why I was looking for something sort of in the middle. From the looks of it that's what these PRS SE guitars appear to be, but I've never actually played one and none of my stores locally carry PRS.

Can anyone give an opinion on a PRS SE. Or If that wouldn't cut it, what about a fat strat? A mim stratocaster with a split SD JB in the bridge would in theory be pretty versatile wouldn't it?

Thanks


If you can get one, a PRS SE is a pretty good guitar.
They have a wide-thin or a wide-fat neck on most of the SE models (from what I can recall). The wide-thin will most likely be the closest match for the sort of necks you've been playing. When i say closest match I mean closer than Epi or Fender necks too. I played a Schecter not too long ago that reminded me very much of the wide-thin on my own PRS. Not exactly the same, but pretty close.

The PRS SE wide-fat neck (just to establish a baseline) feels to me like a slightly thinner version of a Les Paul, and the wide-thin is thinner than that. Not quite in shred territory but very comfortable imho.

If you track down a PRS SE Custom 24 then you'll have that wide-thin neck, a usable tremolo (as long as you're not trying to divebomb all the time), and humbuckers that have a coil-split. There are many other models in the SE line as well, but the Cu24 seems like it might suit you.
Last edited by paul.housley.7 at Jan 16, 2015,
#17
I've owned a PRS SE Custom 24 for a year, and I will advise you to play the guitar before buying. The wide-thin neck shape is very odd. Compared to other thin necks, you usually have a flatter back and a shoulder, but on this one the rounding-off starts right at the side of the neck so there's very little shoulder on the neck to get a grip on. On top of that, the neck is of course wide.

There's a possibility they have changed the neck shaped for these guitars in 2013, since I have a friend with the exact same model but with a very different feeling neck.

Except for that, the quality of PRS SE's are great. I would recommend you a Fender Standard Strat HSS before that however. Great guitars, and since you already know what they play like it's a much safer choice. Few things can beat a HSS Strat for versatility, and the pickups are easy to change for single-coiled-size humbuckers without any modification other than soldering.
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#18
If you prefer the feel of Starts and want humbucker tones, just get a HSS Strat. I don't know if it's made any more but Fender also made a HH Strat (Blacktop series).



If you don't like the feel of a Les Paul, don't get one. Feel can't really be improved. But you can always change pickups.
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#19
Honestly, any of your choices are fine.
If it's me, and I want the most versatility, I'd be grabbing one of my H-S-H guitars with a 25" scale, 24 frets, a five-way and a couple of miniswitches that select single-coil/humbucker modes on the two "H" pickups. A basic strat-style trem is sufficient and you're good to go.

Mine are neck-through (I have some bolt-necks, but I think their neck heel is clunky and uncomfortable in the upper fret reaches). They balance well in a strap, they're not excessively heavy, etc.
#20
If it were me, I would just get a different set of pups to put in the Schecter or LTD. The Schecter and LTD you have both make great classic rock machines when fitted with the proper pups. They make so many different styles of HB sized pups these days that you can squeeze about any tone you want out of those guitars. This is all assuming you already have an amp that pumps out the tones you like.
#21
+1 for the pupgrade. I can get a workable metal tone out of my very single coil Mustang and vintage Fender flavored amp with a couple of pedals. Your amp and pups have a lot more to do with the sound than the shape of your guitar.
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#22
But it does sort of make you seem like the guy who'd rather be somewhere else playing a Schecter Blackjack on stage in a blues outfit.
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#23
Quote by HomerSGR
But it does sort of make you seem like the guy who'd rather be somewhere else playing a Schecter Blackjack on stage in a blues outfit.


Haha thats sorta what im getting at, i wanted a dedicated gig guitar to play songs everyone would recognise. My ltd has got split SD Custom/Jazz combo in it atm and i can physically make it sound bluesy or soft with the split and my multi-effects pedal. Same goes for my jackson. I played Lenny for my year 9 assessment piece last year on my pointy shaped jackson it justdidnt look or feel right.

Anyways I think I'm gonna start my search for the right HSS strat now, thanks everybody
Last edited by zach9600 at Jan 16, 2015,
#24
Quote by zach9600
Haha thats sorta what im getting at, i wanted a dedicated gig guitar to play songs everyone would recognise. My ltd has got split SD Custom/Jazz combo in it atm and i can physically make it sound bluesy or soft with the split and my multi-effects pedal. Same goes for my jackson. I played Lenny for my year 9 assessment piece last year on my pointy shaped jackson it justdidnt look or feel right.

Anyways I think I'm gonna start my search for the right HSS strat now, thanks everybody


I've kinda learned this too, the look of the guitar is part of the performance. It will look silly if you are playing old school rock n roll with this guitar


I'd say Strat all the way too.
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#25
Quote by jcarlos007
I've kinda learned this too, the look of the guitar is part of the performance. It will look silly if you are playing old school rock n roll with this guitar


I would probably be the one who would carry that one into church for a P&W gig. As it is, I have that Fender Squier Skull bass with the skull and crossbones graphic that DOES go to church occasionally. Old school rock and roll has been pretty tolerant of random guitars. Besides, you can always tell everyone you're doing it *ironically*.
#26
Quote by zach9600
I have a budget of about au$600. I need something I can play blues like old cream to rock like AC-DC, guns and roses and Wolfmother to indie like Artic monkeys. Something that really covers most bases.


Ever thought about an SG? I mean, the SG is a rock guitar if I ever played one, AC/DC wouldnt be the same without it, and it does blues pretty well too. Its light weight is great for gigging too.
Last edited by Knarrenheino at Jan 16, 2015,
#27
TS, what amp do you have right now? I think that the amp plays a more important part in your sound, while the guitar does affect how you play, and the nuances in your sound. But thats me.

If I were you, I would save up a little longer. I would sell the guitar that you use the least, or that you might not actually "need" to give you more options to get the sound you want. But thats if you think you need a new amp as well as a new guitar.

I played just about everything I could with my PRS SE, including ambient solo guitar post-rock, rock and roll, and punk rock, accompanying high school singers with a full band mostly playing radio-rock, and also some metalcore. I did find the sound of the guitar too muddy at times though. The note definition wasn't entirely there, but that was only a concern with me playing lead with the metalcore group.

But I will admit a bias because I love my PRS', and I recommend you get one if you can. I think of them as just a touch brighter than a Les Paul, with the Strat ergonomics.

HOWEVER, due to you being in Australia, I think an HSS Stratocaster would work well because you get so many tonal options, but I also think something like a MiM Tele with a P90 in the neck could be a good guitar too.

EDIT: Or an SG. An SG would be a great guitar too. They're pretty bright and brash, but if you use your tone knob you should be able to tame some of the brightness out, if need be.
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Last edited by AWACS at Jan 16, 2015,
#28
Quote by AWACS

HOWEVER, due to you being in Australia, I think an HSS Stratocaster would work well because you get so many tonal options, but I also think something like a MiM Tele with a P90 in the neck could be a good guitar too.


I know you weren't talking to me, but I'm really curious about what the connection is between Australia and a HSS' tonal options
#29
Quote by zach9600
Haha thats sorta what im getting at, i wanted a dedicated gig guitar to play songs everyone would recognise. My ltd has got split SD Custom/Jazz combo in it atm and i can physically make it sound bluesy or soft with the split and my multi-effects pedal. Same goes for my jackson. I played Lenny for my year 9 assessment piece last year on my pointy shaped jackson it justdidnt look or feel right.

Anyways I think I'm gonna start my search for the right HSS strat now, thanks everybody

Blues or classic rock on your Jackson (or a guitar like that BC Rich) would look a bit strange but the other two guitars aren't that pointy looking. They are just a bit "modern" looking. I don't think anybody would be offended if you played blues on your LTD or Schecter. I mean, they are both basically Strats - just a bit more "modern" looking.

But yeah, if you want a new guitar, get a new guitar.

Also, this is why classic guitar shapes like Strat, Les Paul, Tele and SG are great - they work in any genre.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#30
Quote by Knarrenheino
I know you weren't talking to me, but I'm really curious about what the connection is between Australia and a HSS' tonal options


Haha might've been taking availability into consideration. Where i am at least there's a pretty poor range of guitars for sale, and i think i mentioned how hard a PRS is to come by.

Idk ahaha

But thinking about it, it should be acceptable to play AC/DC or Guns and Roses on my Jackson. Despite its pointyness the JB/Jazz combo are amazing tonally, if i ended up with a Les Paul or SG I'd probably swap stock p'ups for them anyway.

Its just the single coil twangyness I feel like I am missing out on, that and the fact that Strats are probably going to be more gig friendly.

Quote by MaggaraMarine
Blues or classic rock on your Jackson (or a guitar like that BC Rich) would look a bit strange but the other two guitars aren't that pointy looking. They are just a bit "modern" looking. I don't think anybody would be offended if you played blues on your LTD or Schecter. I mean, they are both basically Strats - just a bit more "modern" looking.

But yeah, if you want a new guitar, get a new guitar.

Also, this is why classic guitar shapes like Strat, Les Paul, Tele and SG are great - they work in any genre.


I would use those other guitars but I've decided to get rid of the Blackjack to accommodate a gig guitar and the Ltd is set up in Drop C for Human Abstract and other heavier prog type stuff, so I cant really use that either.

You're right about classic shaped guitars too, every genre you can think of you will find artists using classic strats or les pauls, thats why they are so much more recognisable at gigs and in general.
Last edited by zach9600 at Jan 17, 2015,
#31
Oh and the amp I use is a Peavey Envoy 110 with a Boss ME-70 multieffects pedal. The clean channel on the amp is crystal clear so all my tone is coming out of my pedal. I know its not the most expensive and best sounding option, but i can get alot of sounds out of it and for the moment I'm happy with it.

I've gigged multiple times with it at school and around and its always sounded great mic'd up.
Last edited by zach9600 at Jan 17, 2015,
#32
I don't know anything about guitar availability in Australia, but I would definitely try to find a PRS SE Custom 24. Also other PRS SE models to definitely consider would be the SE Santana, the Tremonti SE Custom, an SE Singlecut Tremolo or stop tail. Almost any of those SE models would be a great guitar for a blues/rock group. These SE's are incredible guitars and I don't think you can find anything else that will come near their quality for the money - around here anyway.

Strats can be very thin sounding and even with a full sized humbucker they won't sound like an LP. Epiphone makes an LP "Tribute Plus" that has Gibson USA '57 Classic and Plus pickups - this is an incredible guitar with locking Grover tuners, top grade electronics and switches, controls, wiring, etc. It is probably the best Epi made, in my opinion. This guitar would probably hold its value. A PRS SE would probably be a better choice, in general, but if they are unavailable and you can buy brand new Epiphones, the Tribute should be easy to find at a very decent price, considering you plan on putting it to work in a paying situation. I would not go for one of the cheaper Epiphones; I'd wait for a PRS SE to show up. You are probably not going to find a cheap nice SG in your range, but if you could find one the SG is definitely going to be incredible for the intentions you have. A Fender would make a great back up guitar for you in this situation, but I agree with the others that you would be well off with a traditional dual humbucker type guitar.

I'd stay away from showing up on stage with a guitar that really didn't get with the vibe of the music, especially if the band is definitely happening and will be playing regular gigs every week and develp a fan following, etc.

A trans black Epiphone Tribute Plus LP would probably look super cool on a blues/rock stage, if you know what I mean.

In the end you have to do what you want to do for yourself and your own happiness. Look over the available options and try to make a very well thought out decision, not some decision made by the salesman pushing his guitars, or someone else besides yourself. This way you will be digging it and not wishing you went with what you really wanted.

Get the real guitar that will really let/help you get into the type of music you'll be playing.

Good luck.

What amp are you expecting to be using?
#33
I'd be inclined to get a HSS Strat, but I'm biased towards Strats.
If you'll be gigging, touring, and have a tight budget, I'd say a Strat would be your best option. They're super durable workhorses. I've seen too many threads on Gibsons and Epiphones with broken headstocks, even though they were in cases.