#1
I'm looking for a sound similar to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4nV8WV-EDY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIFgDJ9sy7k

I'm either looking into a mesa or marshall jcm 800 and already have an hm-2 that i'm probably going to use. Which one should I go with? What are the differences i'll encounter?

here's what I've learned from mesas after hours of research :: I think the bottom end is very tight. like punchy for metal. However, I want a loose thick boomy bottom end. (like I like my ladies to have) I really like the note clarity of the mids and highs as well. I wonder how this amp would handle an hm-2. Anyone try? I see Nails uses a Mesa live with an hm-2 frequently. Could I get this with different eq'ing with a mesa?

BUT THEY ALSO USE A MARSHALL AS WELL.


I want an amp I won't ever want to sell. I'm trading in my 5150 for something darker, louder, more low end / less mids. Thanks.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
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Dealbreaker
Last edited by TylerKSchrute at Jan 20, 2015,
#2
Technically I'd buy the JCM800 with some sort of boost, but that's just me. I'm generally biased towards Mesa, because they're assholes to us here in Europe.
Oh, and a dumb question, do you use the HM-2 as a overdrive, or as a Distortion?
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#3
i didn't check out the videos for more than a minute, but the doom metal tone commonly comes from a marshall valvestate and an HM-2 with every knob dimed on the pedal. that is THE sound

a marshall valvestate is hybrid, and for anything else it is kind of mediocre.

mesa recs have a loose thundery bottom, if set to tube rectifier mode and set on loose. i have a trem-o-verb and love it.

the JCM800 is a great amp. totally different tone than the mesa. pick your poison.
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#4
Quote by Fryderyczek
Technically I'd buy the JCM800 with some sort of boost, but that's just me. I'm generally biased towards Mesa, because they're assholes to us here in Europe.
Oh, and a dumb question, do you use the HM-2 as a overdrive, or as a Distortion?


With the marshall i'd probably use it mostly as a distortion. or with a mesa probably more of a boost i'd say. I honestly haven't tried either yet with the hm-2 so I can't tell you a specific answer.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#5
Quote by trashedlostfdup
i didn't check out the videos for more than a minute, but the doom metal tone commonly comes from a marshall valvestate and an HM-2 with every knob dimed on the pedal. that is THE sound

a marshall valvestate is hybrid, and for anything else it is kind of mediocre.

mesa recs have a loose thundery bottom, if set to tube rectifier mode and set on loose. i have a trem-o-verb and love it.

the JCM800 is a great amp. totally different tone than the mesa. pick your poison.


Hmmm, could you record your tones with your mesa? On youtube everyone has awful tones with it but then I see bands using it and I think it sounds great. I can't tell if I like it or not haha.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#6
I wouldn't use a bloody distortion pedal with a bloody JCM800. Imo they're the second best metal amp Marshall made(the first being a VS8100 of course). You should get something like a Digitech Bad Monkey or a Maxon OD to get the best out of the Marshall.

Oh, and one more question, do you prefer a more British voiced tone, or a American one?
Because if American, then look into a Mesa Mark V, not a Rectifier.
Well, you can call me crazy
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#7
Quote by Fryderyczek
I wouldn't use a bloody distortion pedal with a bloody JCM800. Imo they're the second best metal amp Marshall made(the first being a VS8100 of course). You should get something like a Digitech Bad Monkey or a Maxon OD to get the best out of the Marshall.

Oh, and one more question, do you prefer a more British voiced tone, or a American one?
Because if American, then look into a Mesa Mark V, not a Rectifier.


I'm not sure of the difference between American/british. Also the hm-2 into a Marshall is a very specific tone that the Marshall amp wouldn't produce on it's own. Hence, using the distortion pedal is a necessity. And the Marshalls crunch / slight gain compliments it well.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#8
Quote by Fryderyczek
I wouldn't use a bloody distortion pedal with a bloody JCM800. Imo they're the second best metal amp Marshall made(the first being a VS8100 of course). You should get something like a Digitech Bad Monkey or a Maxon OD to get the best out of the Marshall.

Oh, and one more question, do you prefer a more British voiced tone, or a American one?
Because if American, then look into a Mesa Mark V, not a Rectifier.


I just want something dark / deep / massive / wall of sound / thumpy / loud. I want to strum an open and have the faces of my enemies blown to shreds.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#9
JCM800 for sure then. Or possibly an ENGL. Where do you live? Because in Europe ENGL's aren't as expensive as in The US.
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#10
I remember you asking about running the HM-2 with the 5150. I think if you're looking for something with more low end and less mids then a Marshall may not be your best option. A JCM has a great overall tone but the low end is in no way comparable to your current 5150 (depeding on your cab of course). If anything I would suggest you try and swing the Mesa direction and study as to how their rig was set up with that. I can't really comment more because that's a tone I've never chased after.
#11
Quote by JBailey23
I remember you asking about running the HM-2 with the 5150. I think if you're looking for something with more low end and less mids then a Marshall may not be your best option. A JCM has a great overall tone but the low end is in no way comparable to your current 5150 (depeding on your cab of course). If anything I would suggest you try and swing the Mesa direction and study as to how their rig was set up with that. I can't really comment more because that's a tone I've never chased after.


Hmm. Thanks! I still haven't tried a 6505 with the pedal since others have had success in doing so. my 5150 for some reason just does NOT like that pedal. I'll definitely check out mesa's. Why do you suggest against the marshall?
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
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#12
Quote by TylerKSchrute
Hmm. Thanks! I still haven't tried a 6505 with the pedal since others have had success in doing so. my 5150 for some reason just does NOT like that pedal. I'll definitely check out mesa's. Why do you suggest against the marshall?

Marshalls don't have that low end that a Mesa has. That's the main difference TBH.

EDIT:If you want Mesa, the Mark V is their best amp.
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#13
Quote by Fryderyczek
JCM800 for sure then. Or possibly an ENGL. Where do you live? Because in Europe ENGL's aren't as expensive as in The US.


I live in the U.S. Engl's are very expensive and I honestly haven't looked too much into them. Could you give me a Marshall vs Engl comparison briefly if you're able to? Why do you say the Marshall over the Mesa? What are the characteristics I would find in the Marshall that the Mesa would lack in or that I would find ideal. Thanks!
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Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
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#14
Quote by Fryderyczek
Marshalls don't have that low end that a Mesa has. That's the main difference TBH.


I see. Why do youtube videos of Mesa heads sound so punchy and not explosive? I want something with a ton of resonance, to be floor shaking. Their low end in the video sounds clinky and short lived and not powerful. Is that the mesa sound or do they maybe not capture the sound well / eq it poorly?
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Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#15
Quote by TylerKSchrute
I live in the U.S. Engl's are very expensive and I honestly haven't looked too much into them. Could you give me a Marshall vs Engl comparison briefly if you're able to? Why do you say the Marshall over the Mesa? What are the characteristics I would find in the Marshall that the Mesa would lack in or that I would find ideal. Thanks!

I'm just pissed off Mesa's are so expensive here(Poland).
Besides, Marshall is more of my sound.

Marshalls compared to Engl have that instantly recognizable tone you hear on a lot of classic records. From Megadeth to Van Halen to Cannibal Corpse, you can hear them almost everywhere.
They don't have that low end something like a Mesa or an ENGL or Randall have. That's why people like Kerry King have an EQ to compensate for the lack of the low end.

Whilst ENGL are the definition of Anger. If you set the gain on full on one of them you can torture people during interrogations with your menacing metal riffs. Mille Petrozza of Kreator and the dude at Dying Fetus use them. They have a very Angry "German" tone similar to something like a Randall RD or the Thrasher.


Quote by TylerKSchrute
I see. Why do youtube videos of Mesa heads sound so punchy and not explosive? I want something with a ton of resonance, to be floor shaking. Their low end in the video sounds clinky and short lived and not powerful. Is that the mesa sound or do they maybe not capture the sound well / eq it poorly?

If you want resonance then the Mesa would be better for that.
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Last edited by Fryderyczek at Jan 20, 2015,
#16
Quote by Fryderyczek
I'm just pissed off Mesa's are so expensive here(Poland).
Besides, Marshall is more of my sound.

Marshalls compared to Engl have that instantly recognizable tone you hear on a lot of classic records. From Megadeth to Van Halen to Cannibal Corpse, you can hear them almost everywhere.
They don't have that low end something like a Mesa or an ENGL or Randall have. That's why people like Kerry King have an EQ to compensate for the lack of the low end.

Whilst ENGL are the definition of Anger. If you set the gain on full on one of them you can torture people during interrogations with your menacing metal riffs. Mille Petrozza of Kreator and Dying Fetus use them. They have a very Angry "German" tone similar to something like a Randall RD or the Thrasher.


That's what i'm talking about. Now I'll have to do my research on them as well. What is the most bad ass Engl to look into first?

Also, Cannibal Corpse uses Mesa. There's a video of them talking about their gear.
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Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#17
Quote by TylerKSchrute
That's what i'm talking about. Now I'll have to do my research on them as well. What is the most bad ass Engl to look into first?

Also, Cannibal Corpse uses Mesa. There's a video of them talking about their gear.

Actually, very early Canibal Corpse used Marshalls(JCM800's I think). I read that somewhere like 4 years ago.

Engls:
Powerball
Fireball
Screamer
Invader
Thunder

That's like the most popular ones. There are a couple of different versions of these amps, so be sure to look around Youtube and choose what you like best.
Well, you can call me crazy
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Fly on, fly on
#18
Quote by TylerKSchrute
I still haven't tried a 6505 with the pedal since others have had success in doing so. my 5150 for some reason just does NOT like that pedal. I'll definitely check out mesa's. Why do you suggest against the marshall?


The 6505 is basically the same as the 5150 so there's a good chance you wouldn't get anywhere by trying it. On the other hand I've played a rig identical to my 6505+/1960a setup at guitar center and it sounded worse than a spider so who knows...worth a shot I suppose.

Main reason I'm suggesting against a Marshall is that I own a JCM2000 and I've played an 800 numerous times. Side by side against my Peavey the Marshalls aren't ground shaking amps. They're loud and they sound great but their tone lives in their mid-range. Mesas are a little bit better on the low end.
#19
Quote by JBailey23
The 6505 is basically the same as the 5150 so there's a good chance you wouldn't get anywhere by trying it. On the other hand I've played a rig identical to my 6505+/1960a setup at guitar center and it sounded worse than a spider so who knows...worth a shot I suppose.

Main reason I'm suggesting against a Marshall is that I own a JCM2000 and I've played an 800 numerous times. Side by side against my Peavey the Marshalls aren't ground shaking amps. They're loud and they sound great but their tone lives in their mid-range. Mesas are a little bit better on the low end.


Is there a head you'd suggest? I'm looking to get something heavier than my 5150 essentially.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#20
Quote by Fryderyczek
Actually, very early Canibal Corpse used Marshalls(JCM800's I think). I read that somewhere like 4 years ago.

Engls:
Powerball
Fireball
Screamer
Invader
Thunder

That's like the most popular ones. There are a couple of different versions of these amps, so be sure to look around Youtube and choose what you like best.


I see. Currently they run Mesa with an mt-2 as a boost. Nails the first video I posted used a Mesa with a hm-2 up front live and it was HUGE.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#21
That's a tall order if you're talking gain wise. What Mesas were Nails using? That's a good start as any. I'll agree with Fryderyckek about the Mark V suggestion. Great amp, whether it's good for what you want is the question.
#22
Quote by JBailey23
That's a tall order if you're talking gain wise. What Mesas were Nails using? That's a good start as any. I'll agree with Fryderyckek about the Mark V suggestion. Great amp, whether it's good for what you want is the question.

Thanks for ****ing up my username.

Tyler, for something heavier than a 6505, ENGL is the only way to go.
Well, you can call me crazy
You can call me wrong, 'cause
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Fly on, fly on
#24
Quote by JBailey23
DAMN IT...I even triple checked it while I was typing it!

Polish words are hard for non-polish people to get right. I once tried to teach my friends back in England to swear in Polish. It was horrible.
Well, you can call me crazy
You can call me wrong, 'cause
See I was born a liar, albatross
Fly on, fly on
#25
Quote by JBailey23
That's a tall order if you're talking gain wise. What Mesas were Nails using? That's a good start as any. I'll agree with Fryderyckek about the Mark V suggestion. Great amp, whether it's good for what you want is the question.


Don't Mark V's have low watts? I'm in need of something very loud. I am trying to make everyone deaf. Also, I'm not sure tbh. I just saw the head and couldn't see the letter words to see what model exactly but it was a rectifier for sure. I could send you the link if you'd like?
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#26
Quote by TylerKSchrute
Don't Mark V's have low watts? I'm in need of something very loud. I am trying to make everyone deaf. Also, I'm not sure tbh. I just saw the head and couldn't see the letter words to see what model exactly but it was a rectifier for sure. I could send you the link if you'd like?

Dude... 90 watts....
You can buy a 25 watt version if you want, but that's defeaning as well.
Well, you can call me crazy
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See I was born a liar, albatross
Fly on, fly on
Last edited by Fryderyczek at Jan 20, 2015,
#27
Ehhh, my work computer is about like dial-up if its a video, it'll probably be useless. Look up who all uses the Mark series. Lamb of God swears by them...I was never a huge fan but I've always enjoyed their tone. As far as their rectifiers just google which one they had. I'm sure the info is out there.


Quote by Fryderyczek
Polish words are hard for non-polish people to get right. I once tried to teach my friends back in England to swear in Polish. It was horrible.


I'm Texan so we can probably only imagine the difficulty.
#28
Quote by Fryderyczek
Thanks for ****ing up my username.

Tyler, for something heavier than a 6505, ENGL is the only way to go.


I'll check them out! For a very bassy, full of resonance, loud, dark, cutting tone. Which would you suggest?
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#29
Quote by Fryderyczek
Dude... 90 watts....
You can buy a 25 watt version if you want, but that's defeaning as well.


as in I'm used to my 120 watt head and I even turn that up to 8-9 sometimes. I wouldn't want to get anything that's too much lesser. Even if it's a tonal upgrade. I love volume.
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#30
Quote by JBailey23
Ehhh, my work computer is about like dial-up if its a video, it'll probably be useless. Look up who all uses the Mark series. Lamb of God swears by them...I was never a huge fan but I've always enjoyed their tone. As far as their rectifiers just google which one they had. I'm sure the info is out there.


I'm Texan so we can probably only imagine the difficulty.


I haven't been able to find it. However if I were to get a recto it'd probably be the dual solo head.
LTD EC-1000 CTM
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Dealbreaker
#31
Quote by TylerKSchrute
I'll check them out! For a very bassy, full of resonance, loud, dark, cutting tone. Which would you suggest?

All of them!
That's the only answer. Even the gigmaster(This 15 watt little cute Mother-Fokker) is a beast.
Well, you can call me crazy
You can call me wrong, 'cause
See I was born a liar, albatross
Fly on, fly on
#32
Quote by Fryderyczek
All of them!
That's the only answer. Even the gigmaster(This 15 watt little cute Mother-Fokker) is a beast.


My guitar center for some reason has like no amps in when I went in yesterday. Maybe remodeling. They just have dozens of combo amps now. So now I can't even easily try them.
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Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#33
Quote by TylerKSchrute
My guitar center for some reason has like no amps in when I went in yesterday. Maybe remodeling. They just have dozens of combo amps now. So now I can't even easily try them.

Don't be scared of Combos!
Engl thunder Combos are great and not that expensive.
Well, you can call me crazy
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Fly on, fly on
#34
Quote by Fryderyczek
Don't be scared of Combos!
Engl thunder Combos are great and not that expensive.


If I didn't already have a cab and ideas for different speakers I wouldn't be afraid of them.

Also, I'm seeing that engl is more tight and compressed than a mesa?

WHAT IS THE LOOSEST BOTTOM END HEAD
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#35
Quote by TylerKSchrute
If I didn't already have a cab and ideas for different speakers I wouldn't be afraid of them.

Also, I'm seeing that engl is more tight and compressed than a mesa?

WHAT IS THE LOOSEST BOTTOM END HEAD

Dual/Triple Rectifier.
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#36
Quote by Fryderyczek
Dual/Triple Rectifier.


*Smashes face on keyboard*
LTD EC-1000 CTM
Peavey / Marshall / HM-2 / SKB
Dealbreaker
#37
Quote by TylerKSchrute
*Smashes face on keyboard*

What? It's true. Or a Rectoverb.
Well, you can call me crazy
You can call me wrong, 'cause
See I was born a liar, albatross
Fly on, fly on