Page 1 of 3
#1
I posted a thread a few days ago about whether or not I should get an AC30 and the general consensus was yes, immediately.

The next step is to get a transparent OD pedal that I can leave on to effectively simulate the sound of the AC30's natural overdrive but without any increase in volume. Ideally, it also needs to work as a solo boost when stacked with my Big Muff.

I thought about using a clean boost but the point is to have the gain coming before my modulation pedals because they tend to sound better going into a clean amp (I don't like FX loops) and as far as I can tell, with a clean boost I'd still be getting the gain from the amp. I've tried a few overdrive pedals as well but none of them have the richness and responsiveness of the amp's natural overdrive.

What do you suggest?
#3
£70-80 maximum. I'm happy to buy second hand and clones are fine as well, if they're decent.
#5
You said it best: "none of them have the richness and responsiveness of the amp's natural overdrive."

A good overdrive will bring out the best of a good amp. Trying to find a $100 foot pedal to have all the lovely crunch, grind and harmonics of a $1k tube amp will probably end in disappointment.

FWIW, I like the TS9 and OCD to drive the front of a Vox or Fender tube amp.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#6
I've been using a soul food to boost my ac30 lately. Just need to cut the treble a little on the pedal really.
Gear:


Fender American Hand Stained stratocaster
Fender 72' Telecaster Deluxe FSR

Squier Vista Venus

Boss TU-3
Boss OD-3
Pro co Rat 2
EHX Big Muff Nano
EHX Small clone
Boss DD7
Hardwire Supernatural


Vox AC30cc1
Blackheart Little Giant stack
#7
Why do you need an overdrive that sounds like the amp? The AC30 has a very good master volume, if you want it to sound like an overdriven AC30 you can do that at nearly any volume, you don't need to use a pedal.

It sounds like you should be using the effects loop. What don't you like about them? They were invented for exactly the problem you have, you really shouldn't be looking at buying more pedals to fix a problem that doesn't really exist given the equipment you have.
#8
The reason I don't use effects loops is because of the switching system I use; I have a custom built true bypass looper on my board with two loops - one for my fuzz and one for the OD pedal and all my modulation. I can disengage one loop and turn the other on or turn on both at once all with one tap, which means that I can switch between pretty much any combination of pedals really easily. If I had some pedals in an effects loop, I'd lose all that functionality - even if it was a switchable loop. Plus, my Big Muff doesn't work in front of a dirty amp. So all my pedals have to be in front of the amp and the amp has to be clean(ish). That's why my gain needs to come from a pedal.

I've heard that tubescreamers have a mid hump but not much bass and are quite compressed so that's put me off a bit. Do they clean up well? The closest I've got to an OCD is the amplitube version and that didn't really work for me. I can usually get a good clean sound just by switching to my neck pickup but with the OCD, that didn't happen.
#10
Yeah that sounds perfect actually. Quite expensive though, and difficult to get in the UK. Do you know of anyone who does a good clone of this?
#11
Dude its $119 USD that's like 77GBP, they ship to the UK also
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#12
Look up Creation Audio Labs, it's called Mk 4.23 clean boost. It is $150 U.S. They claim it is the most transparent boost pedal on the planet. I'm getting one.
#13
Paul C Timmy - already mentioned for a reason.

IMO it works best with british voiced amps. very cheap, bet you can find on the used market for around $100 usd.
Gibson 58 VOS, Gibson Rich Robinson ES-335, Fender Strat, Fender RoadWorn 50's Tele, Gibson LP Jr Special

Marshall JTM45, Fender BJR NOS
#14
Yeah but with the cost of shipping, plus VAT, the total would be about £120 and I can't really justify spending that much on a pedal.
#15
Quote by wardyh
Yeah but with the cost of shipping, plus VAT, the total would be about £120 and I can't really justify spending that much on a pedal.

If you have a good amp/cab and guitar, trust me it is worth it
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#16
Nothing in that price range is going to do what you want, honestly. The Timmy is probably about as good as you'll get unless you want to bump up to some of the pricier FET pedals.

Quote by rickyvanh
Look up Creation Audio Labs, it's called Mk 4.23 clean boost. It is $150 U.S. They claim it is the most transparent boost pedal on the planet. I'm getting one.


Everyone claims the most transparent boost. In reality, any op amp based boost is extremely easy to design such that it's completely transparent in the audio range, and most are successful at doing it. Also doesn't sound like the OP wants a boost.
E-peen:
Rhodes Gemini
Fryette Ultra Lead
Peavey 6505
THD Flexi 50

Gibson R0 Prototype
EBMM JP13 Rosewood
Fender CS Mary Kaye

WTLT

(512) Audio Engineering - Custom Pedal Builds, Mods and Repairs
#17
Yeah I think the Timmy is what I'm looking for so I'll definitely keep my eyes peeled for a used one on ebay but bearing in mind that I currently stack shelves in a supermarket for a living, I would prefer something a bit cheaper! I mean, this AC30 is going to practically wipe out my bank balance until someone buys my Marshall. There must be an independent builder somewhere in the UK that could make something similar for a fraction of the price?
#18
Quote by wardyh
Yeah I think the Timmy is what I'm looking for so I'll definitely keep my eyes peeled for a used one on ebay but bearing in mind that I currently stack shelves in a supermarket for a living, I would prefer something a bit cheaper! I mean, this AC30 is going to practically wipe out my bank balance until someone buys my Marshall. There must be an independent builder somewhere in the UK that could make something similar for a fraction of the price?

Actually most of the Timmy clones go for as much or more than the actual PCA version, but the real Timmy is not very plentiful and used you will pay more than that one new
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#19
Exotic RC boost is very transparent.
Mesa Boogie Single Rectoverb 50 series 2 combo
Randall RM100
Peavey 5150 4x12
Peavey XXX 2x12 combo
Pedals
#20
What are everyone's opinions about the Centaur? Obviously a real one would be way out of my price range but the reason I ask is I've seen a lot clones around ebay that go for a lot less.
#21
Quote by wardyh
What are everyone's opinions about the Centaur? Obviously a real one would be way out of my price range but the reason I ask is I've seen a lot clones around ebay that go for a lot less.

EHX Soul Food is a Klone, and a very good sounding one for the price ($63new)
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#23
Would the soul food or other klone work well as a standalone overdrive that I can just leave on? I've read some reviews and it sounds more like a clean boost type thing
#24
a Klon is not really transparent. I have never played an original because i dont want to spend $1200+ on a pedal on the low end. I have played several Klon Klones but they all have a distinct flavor to them. A little mids.

I think for the price the Timmy is still the way to go based on what you are describing. Brand new they are $129 or something of the sort and the used market used to be about $180-200 but there are an over-saturation of "boutique" pedals and a lot more Timmy's on the market and I have seen a bunch for around $100 used.

Quote by wardyh
Would the soul food or other klone work well as a standalone overdrive that I can just leave on? I've read some reviews and it sounds more like a clean boost type thing
Gibson 58 VOS, Gibson Rich Robinson ES-335, Fender Strat, Fender RoadWorn 50's Tele, Gibson LP Jr Special

Marshall JTM45, Fender BJR NOS
#25
A good friend of mine has an AC15 that I've screwed around on quite a bit. I've tried several pedals with it (more than he has, literally) and imo the Boss Blues Driver is frickin' sweet with an AC15, I'd bet it would be great with an AC30 too. The Soul Food works well too but the Blues Driver is a better compliment to the AC, imo, ymmv.

Btw, imo, the Soul Food doesn't really shine as a stand-alone overdrive pedal. It shines by making what you already have louder, quieter. What the SF does is highly dependent on how you have your amp dialed in.
Fender Mustang/Derfenstein DST> Boss Power Wah> Pedal Monsters Klone> Bogner Uberschall> Walrus Audio Janus> Randall RM20> Line 6 M9> Randall RM20
Last edited by lucky1978 at Feb 9, 2015,
#27
Quote by wardyh
What about the Crowther hotcake?


they're like $50 more than the Timmy someone listed earlier..
mojostompboxes.com
#28
Soul Food (might want JHS mod)
Tone City Black Tea (AC30 in a box)
Arc Effects Klone V2

Quote by lucky1978
Btw, imo, the Soul Food doesn't really shine as a stand-alone overdrive pedal. It shines by making what you already have louder, quieter. What the SF does is highly dependent on how you have your amp dialed in.
I'll say that the SF stock definitely has some low-end problems, but if you can work around that, they are very smooth and transparent. I do agree, recommend, and almost suggest that they require a bit of spark from the amp to do real work.
Last edited by Will Lane at Feb 9, 2015,
#29
I won't be setting the amp completely clean, just clean enough that it doesn't muddy everything up when I turn on a fuzz or a delay pedal. So the soul food could be an option, as long as most of the gain is coming from the pedal and not the amp because as I said before, the whole point is to get a good natural tube overdrive sound BEFORE my modulation.
#31
Quote by forsaknazrael
I love how people think that "transparency" is some magical property that is hard to obtain. It's the easiest thing to duplicate and signal and amplify it.

The problem is, that's not what people usually want. They think that it somehow works to turn your amp volume down, then inject that distortion right back in with a pedal without adding volume, which is somehow magically supposed to sound like your amp's distortion. That's what a lot of people think 'transparency' is which is why a lot of pedals that are not transparent at all get called transparent. The pedal just happens to sound like their amp.

What gets called "transparent" is more often actually just a neutral sounding OD.
#33
I already mentioned that I can't use effects loops because of the switching system I use. Plus, my fuzz pedals also work best in front of a fairly clean amp. But I always like a bit of dirt in my sound so I need a stand alone, always on overdrive that will sound like my amp when it's turned way up, but without actually overdriving the amp.
#34
rearrange your pedals. everything will be fine once you use the loop for mod and time based effects. loopers aren't expensive to make, just some jacks switches and a switch or two.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#35
Quote by trashedlostfdup
rearrange your pedals. everything will be fine once you use the loop for mod and time based effects. loopers aren't expensive to make, just some jacks switches and a switch or two.


A good looper costs almost as much as I'm willing to pay for an overdrive and not everyone has the tools or the skills to make one themselves.

But as I've already tried to explain, even if I did put my modulation in the effects loop the amp would still have to be fairly clean because my fuzz pedals turn to mud in front of a dirty amp. Plus, I'd have to go back to stepping on up to five pedals all at the same time whenever I want to change a sound and that's just not practical.

The only way using the effects loop would work would be if the whole board, including fuzz pedals, would be in it. And correct me if I'm wrong but that doesn't sound like a good idea. This is the whole reason I'm wanting a pedal that will effectively bring the majority of the distortion in my base tone to the very front of the chain. This is also why boosters won't work; they'll just cause the amp to overdrive and would basically have the same effect as turning up the gain on the amp.
#36
Quote by wardyh
A good looper costs almost as much as I'm willing to pay for an overdrive and not everyone has the tools or the skills to make one themselves.

But as I've already tried to explain, even if I did put my modulation in the effects loop the amp would still have to be fairly clean because my fuzz pedals turn to mud in front of a dirty amp. Plus, I'd have to go back to stepping on up to five pedals all at the same time whenever I want to change a sound and that's just not practical.

The only way using the effects loop would work would be if the whole board, including fuzz pedals, would be in it. And correct me if I'm wrong but that doesn't sound like a good idea. This is the whole reason I'm wanting a pedal that will effectively bring the majority of the distortion in my base tone to the very front of the chain. This is also why boosters won't work; they'll just cause the amp to overdrive and would basically have the same effect as turning up the gain on the amp.
You're more than likely doing it wrong. You don't have the AC30 yet, so don't discredit it. It will work. You really do not need very much distortion from the amp for fuzz and overdrive pedals to work best.

Also, the AC30 (or at least the current production) have effects loops. And no, you don't put all your pedals in the effects loop, especially not distortion boxes.

You generally put distortions, preamp boosters, polyphonic synth stuff, etc. in front of the amp. Time based effects and db boosts go in the effects loop. You'll have to use the "4 cable" method.

If you can't do the effects loop because of your switching or something, then that's a bummer :/ Are you using midi switching? Or a looper? Running everything into the front of a crisp AC30 will not sound too good. Putting an OD to get overdriven amp tones in front of an amp while in a large chain might not be too rad. Stomping on multiple pedals to change tones isn't that difficult when you're prepared and you know what you're doing before hand.

Tbh I'm a bit confused. If you're using a looper station for all of your pedals, you could potentially use two stations. One for before the amp (distortion, synth, etc.) and the other for in the effects loop (time-based, clean boosts, etc.).
Last edited by Will Lane at Feb 10, 2015,
#37
I don't think his setup is right or wrong but it is so different than most of us he may have to figure it out on his own. Nothing wrong with being different if you find the tone you seek. This may just be a case of overthinking the problem.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#38
I'll explain it all again. It's not actually as complicated as it seems. Basically, everything is going through a custom looper pedal (similiar to the A/B/Y Sooper Løøøper here: http://weelushfx.webs.com/loopers, but with a momentary feedback switch instead of the master bypass). My "clean" loop contains all my modulation and my OD and my "dirty" loop contains my fuzz and boosts and stuff. I usually have the clean loop engaged with the OD on for all my clean and rhythm tones but then can switch to the dirty loop to go to a heavier sound or a lead with one stomp. I can also turn both loops on together with one stomp.

The looper is a key component of my rig, not just because it means that I can instantly switch on any combination of effects without having to tap dance but because it also helps to reduce tone sucking and features a feedback loop which I use all the time for noise-making. I won't part ways with it.

Putting some of the pedals in the effects loop would mean that switching between sounds would be a major hassle in a live situation, plus I'd lose the feedback loop, plus I wouldn't be able to cut pedals out of my chain to reduce tone sucking.

Admittedly, I haven't played the AC30 yet but with my current amp, my fuzz does not work with any gain coming from the amp and if that's the case this time, the amp would have to be clean anyway so putting some pedals in the effects loop would be pointless.

Using two stations wouldn't work either because the whole point is to have everything running through one looper pedal so that the whole chain can be manipulated with one switch.

Hence the need for an always-on overdrive! I should clarify again that the amp won't be completely clean - the OD pedal will just be for adding ADDITIONAL gain BEFORE the rest of the chain. In other words, the amp will be set clean enough so that my delays don't sound like shit but with the most amount of gain that I can get away with. The pedal will make up the rest of the gain I need for my base tone but without masking the sound of my amp.

I can't explain it in any more detail than that!
Last edited by wardyh at Feb 10, 2015,
#39
Get an OCD and see if you like it. You are in uncharted waters.
"Your sound is in your hands as much as anything. It's the way you pick, and the way you hold the guitar, more than it is the amp or the guitar you use." -- Stevie Ray Vaughan

"Anybody can play. The note is only 20 percent. The attitude of the motherfucker who plays it is 80 percent." -- Miles Davis

Guthrie on tone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmohdG9lLqY
#40
Is my setup really that weird? Haha, I never knew! As I said before, I wasn't blown away by the OCD or Tube Screamer models on Amplitube but obviously the real pedals could be very different, as could the real AC30 when it arrives, so I'm definitely willing to give them a try. The Timmy looks good but could be out of my price range. I've seen some demos on Youtube and I'm actually starting to warm to the Soul Food. Everyone seems to say that it works best as a clean boost but the gain does sound really transparent so I don't see why it won't work as a stand alone drive.
Page 1 of 3