#1
Might've been posted already, but I didn't see it anywhere. Forgive me if I'm late on the party

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xS9mgbSwAFg

Take a listen, see if you can tell which is which. Results are in the second video - don't post the results, so as to ruin it for others. Think you may be surprised...
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#2
Quote by MatrixClaw
Might've been posted already, but I didn't see it anywhere. Forgive me if I'm late on the party

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xS9mgbSwAFg

Take a listen, see if you can tell which is which. Results are in the second video - don't post the results, so as to ruin it for others. Think you may be surprised...
I think you posted the wrong vidya. I somehow got linked to the 2nd video :C

The third example sounded best to me. It may have just been louder and EQ'd better. I also noticed that some of the examples weren't fairly dialed in, some had delay, verb, etc. and others didn't. But I thought the third had the best, amp-like tone.

actual spoiler
surprisingly, the third was from the ipad app. wow. i even knew which was which. again, that could be from the EQ and added effects. but from just what i heard, the ipad app did it better.
Last edited by Will Lane at Feb 18, 2015,
#3
Quote by Will Lane
I think you posted the wrong vidya. I somehow got linked to the 2nd video :C


Yeah, I also got sent to the 2nd vid. Matrix probs noticed and edited it quickly

Spoiler alert:
I thought the comparison was interesting - all the demos sounded good to me. The Kemper and AxeFx sounded far more natural to me, Bias was quite in-your-face. I'm actually keen to check out Bias , might be useful to make demos with. And I'll probably be able to afford it unlike the other two
#4
Before seeing the results I'm gonna post my preferences.

Dirty: 3,1,2
Clean: 3,2,1

Now off to see the 2nd video.
#5
Quote by UnmagicMushroom
Yeah, I also got sent to the 2nd vid. Matrix probs noticed and edited it quickly

Yeahhhhhhh... epic fail on my part. Thought I had the first video up when I copied the address. Noticed it as soon as I hit submit
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#6
Yeah you're kind of late

I was sure the second one was the kemper and I got the axe and bias switched.

I really didn't like the vid - the amps sounded very different and the third one had a shit ton of fx that seemed to be put there to make that third part stand out/sound better than the rest.

Also the axe sounds pretty bad there.
I'm not a fan of it but I had made axe's sound better than that.

The kemper was dialed too dark.

Bias had sooo much more gain in the distorted part, and the funny fx, and the clean part had a lot more attack.

I personally didn't like either much but between the three I'd sure go for the kemper.
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#7
The dirty between the Axe and the Bias were different enough that either could be better depending on the type of music and the sound you were trying to get. So it really wasn't that informative unless you only wanted to use just one of those tones. The Kemper seemed to just be muffled or muddy. The cleans were IMO not that significantly different to say any was clearly better than the other for the purpose of picking any of the three for purchase.
#8
Interesting thoughts so far...

To me, the Axe-FX instantly stood out. It has the same tonal qualities I hear on every single Axe-FX recording. Doesn't necessarily make it bad; clearly it fits well in some music, but personally I don't dig it. Was kind of surprised by the cleans, they were pretty sterile and boring; this is where I've always felt the Axe-FX really excelled, even on the factory presets.

It was a toss-up for me on the distorted tones of the Kemper and Bias. To me, Bias sounds really saturated and I had actually thought it was the Kemper until I A/B'd the cleans. I feel like the Kemper could've done better in the distorted territory, but still doesn't change the fact that I was very impressed by Bias for being such an inexpensive route. For me, the Kemper sounds more realistic here, but I actually think I preferred the over-saturated and compressed tone from Bias.

The cleans easily went to the Kemper. No contest. They were the most dynamic and realistic sounding of the three. Originally, Bias really stood out here until I listened between the two several times and realized how much dynamics stood out on the Kemper track.

Overall, I wish he'd included the Axe-FX II as well. The II was definitely a step-up in modeling and I don't think this was really a fair comparison, giving that the Axe-FX Ultra is several years older than the other two modelers used. If I were to buy an Ultra it'd mostly be for the super flexible routing for live use and for the effects, not necessarily for the amp modeling.
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#9
Thanks for posting the vid. I still like the Kemper Profiler the best. Going to have to look at my budget for this summer, to see if I can swing one. It's a very impressive unit.

Here's a video on how to configure the Kemper to obtain the famous Gilmour sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VotjQ3y8v0
#10
like teh dirty sound on amp 2 the best and the clean on amp 3. overall they all sounded really good though.
#11
Quote by Will Lane
I think you posted the wrong vidya. I somehow got linked to the 2nd video :C

The third example sounded best to me. It may have just been louder and EQ'd better. I also noticed that some of the examples weren't fairly dialed in, some had delay, verb, etc. and others didn't. But I thought the third had the best, amp-like tone.

actual spoiler
surprisingly, the third was from the ipad app. wow. i even knew which was which. again, that could be from the EQ and added effects. but from just what i heard, the ipad app did it better.

I agree, why not have all the same dry tone instead of adding all the extra FX.

This is why I don't like the comparisons I have seen, they are not done equally which can make a huge difference
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#12
As noted, they all sounded reasonably good, with the tonal differences being subjective as much as anything.

The REAL difference?

The first two will set you back $1500-$2500 depending on new, used etc.

The last one, even including a new iPad Air2 and Jamup Plug HD can be had for less than $500. And you can surf porn UG on the iPad, something neither of the others can do.

If you already have the iPad, less than $75...

Technology marches on!
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Last edited by Arby911 at Feb 18, 2015,
#13
Quote by Arby911
As noted, they all sounded reasonably good, with the tonal differences being subjective as much as anything.

The REAL difference?

The first two will set you back $1500-$2500 depending on new, used etc.

The last one, even including a new iPad Air2 and Jamup Plug HD can be had for less than $500. And you can surf porn UG on the iPad, something neither of the others can do.

If you already have the iPad, less than $75...

Technology marches on!

For sure, I can remember when the Line 6 Axis came out in the late 90's and it was an amazing piece of gear for the time. But even with all the advances in modeling, they still sound good Hell my POD XT sounds better than most amps I could afford in the mid 90's.

I think a huge part of the people who nitpick about modelers these days, never grew up when most amps made sound and you were happy plugging a DOD Grunge/DS-1 pedal through it (or worse). They have had good cheap modelers since they started
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#14
Quote by Arby911
As noted, they all sounded reasonably good, with the tonal differences being subjective as much as anything.

The REAL difference?

The first two will set you back $1500-$2500 depending on new, used etc.

The last one, even including a new iPad Air2 and Jamup Plug HD can be had for less than $500. And you can surf porn UG on the iPad, something neither of the others can do.

If you already have the iPad, less than $75...

Technology marches on!

Bias also has a desktop version now, so you can run it inside your recording software of choice
Quote by Dave_Mc
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#15
Quote by MatrixClaw
Bias also has a desktop version now, so you can run it inside your recording software of choice


Yeah, I saw that.

Crazy thing is, I still WANT a Kemper. I don't NEED one, nor can I justify one currently but I still want one.

I think I'll buy the Jamup/Bias apps and see how they work with my current setup, maybe that will cure me...
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
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#16
Quote by Robbgnarly
For sure, I can remember when the Line 6 Axis came out in the late 90's and it was an amazing piece of gear for the time. But even with all the advances in modeling, they still sound good Hell my POD XT sounds better than most amps I could afford in the mid 90's.

I think a huge part of the people who nitpick about modelers these days, never grew up when most amps made sound and you were happy plugging a DOD Grunge/DS-1 pedal through it (or worse). They have had good cheap modelers since they started


90s amp, Luxury . interesting comment. i can remember when a DS-1 was new and exciting. there is much to be said about what you came up with as a player and how that shapes your thoughts on things.
#17
I guessed all 3 correctly! hahaha. They do all sound good, though.
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#18
Jumping straight to Reply without reading anything or seeing the Second Video.

Amp 1 was probably my favorite
Amp 2 was my least favorite (but seemed to be dialed back a bit or something)
Amp 3 sounded really cool and could be my favorite...

but the Delay and such seemed to be overly pronounced vs the first 2.

I wish there was no delay and reverb and whatever else is mixed in there.

(Now I'll watch the second video and read everyone's comments)
#19
Wow.


I expected to like the Kemper the most and it was my least favorite of the bunch. That said, I have heard some Kemper clips (some of the Quick Rod) and they were phenomenal. So close, there is no way you could tell. Interesting that I liked the Axe tone best even though I was guessing it was the Amp 3 due to the FX. Noisy though right

Bottom Line - Positive Grid won in 'THIS' demo. Great bang for the buck too. My bet is that all three of those could be tweaked to sound better or worse and the fact that the player doing the demo didn't spend that much time dialing them in means that this demo is now worthless to me


*He also made a comment that the BIAS he was using had the HD interface that isn't out yet?



For the benefit of the thread here is Part II

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sIE1RFQx7E
#20
hmmm.... just watched 2nd vid. i think a big mistake was made by not using the same amp sim for each one. i would have to figure that all 3 must feature at least a few (if not a ton) of the same amps which would make for a far more fair comparison. i did relisten and the clean on amp 3 does feature fx that vary from the other 2 which once again skews things a bit.
#21
Wow, interesting. I picked them all right, as MC mentioned, the Axe always has a distinct sound that I can usually pick out (given there is no post production/mastering). The clean gave it away for me on the Kemper, the clips I've heard always sound so real.

Very impressive overall. It just makes me want a high-dollar modeller even more.
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#22
Interesting how our tastes vary so greatly. The first tone was, by far, the worst sounding to me. I've actually been thinking about picking up an Ultra or Standard again just because they're so cheap now, but those tones have honestly really made me second guess myself, as I now remember why I got rid of mine in the first place...
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#23
Quote by Robbgnarly
This is why I don't like the comparisons I have seen, they are not done equally which can make a huge difference

On that note, why don't they use a nice recorder to grab the signal straight from the guitar, then play the exact same signal through each amp?

So the BIAS desktop version is on sale for $74, professional is $174. Hmm.
#24
Huh, I thought the first sounded best and the second sounded worst. Weird.
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#25
Hmmm, I liked the second one the best for both clean and dirty and had the third "dirty" tone pegged almost immediately. I thought all of 'em sounded kinda meh and generic, I may be a bit of a corksniffer but I guess we all can't own Epiphone Electars.

It would make a bit more sense if someone who was familiar with all 3 did the demo. I don't think its a fair gauge to go by, to go buy.
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#26
Quote by Offworld92
Huh, I thought the first sounded best and the second sounded worst. Weird.



It's a taste thing, IMO. I also liked the first the best, and it's pretty identifiably Axe. It's got a thing going on with the mids that Derek dislikes, but I like it quite a bit, at least when I'm playing it. For listening to, I'd go with the Kemper. Third clip was obviously not the Kemper or Axe. The lows were a dead giveaway, as were the meh effects. Bias can be dialed in to sound much better than that (been using it on my iPad for about a year), but man that sounded terrible, IMO.
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#27
Quote by lucky1978
Hmmm, I liked the second one the best for both clean and dirty and had the third "dirty" tone pegged almost immediately. I thought all of 'em sounded kinda meh and generic, I may be a bit of a corksniffer but I guess we all can't own Epiphone Electars.

It would make a bit more sense if someone who was familiar with all 3 did the demo. I don't think its a fair gauge to go by, to go buy.


I have to wonder if you would have thought that if you wouldn't have known they were modelers...preconception is a powerful force.
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#28
Quote by mmolteratx
Third clip was obviously not the Kemper or Axe. The lows were a dead giveaway, as were the meh effects. Bias can be dialed in to sound much better than that (been using it on my iPad for about a year), but man that sounded terrible, IMO.
I thought the second video revealed the 3rd was the Axe, and the 1st was the Bias
#29
Quote by fly135
I thought the second video revealed the 3rd was the Axe, and the 1st was the Bias

First is the Axe-FX, second is the Kemper and third is Bias.
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#30
Quote by Arby911
I have to wonder if you would have thought that if you wouldn't have known they were modelers...preconception is a powerful force.

But my preconception of Axe Fx and Kemper (I've never tried either) is that they are phenomenal amps
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#31
Quote by lucky1978
But my preconception of Axe Fx and Kemper (I've never tried either) is that they are phenomenal amps


Quote by lucky1978
I thought all of 'em sounded kinda meh and generic, .



I'd guess that your preconception was that they are all modelers, and thus meh and generic...

But I may be wrong.

Also, FWIW, I purchased and played with Jamup/Bias on my iPad using an iRig as input device last night and was actually very pleased with the results. It's not 'there' yet IMO, but I think with some more time and tweaks I could be pretty happy with the results.

Honestly I'd not be scared to play a pub gig with it as-is. I suspect most of the patrons would neither know nor care about the differences I'm hearing.
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#32
since the third clip had effects and the first two didn't it kind of ruined it in a way.

all of them sounded decent to me, the first clip cleans were pretty meh but a little verb would have warmed it up for me.



i'm not that picky though. i'd be happy with any of them.
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#34
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
I thought I heard delay on all of them but maybe I need to relisten.


I unfortunately don't have good enough ears to drill down as deep as some of you can. While I can attribute it to a misspent youth it's still annoying at times. ("Just learn it by ear!" Yeah...ummm....fack off!)

So I listen to what you and others say, and take my cues from there.

They all sounded decent to me.
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#35
Just listened again and they definitely have delay on all of them and probably reverb too. To know for sure...listen again to the 'trail off' note and the end of each run.

To me, the last one had too much delay - or it was at least 'turned up more'. Too much in the sense that it clouded the overall demo. The second one had barely any delay - or it was at least very subdued compared to the rest. The first one was just about right.

Similarly,

The last one was just a bit too much - not as natural sounding.
The middle one was pulled back - and still not my favorite.
The first one was just about right - and still my favorite.

That said - all of these could have been tweaked to even out the differences. I'd like to see this guy do it again by getting all the levels closer and rearrange in a different order so we can try again.

Either way, pretty impressive overall. Like it or not - you've got to be impressed with where technology is going. I know I personally come across as a tube snob and a big iron guy but this stuff is unreal.
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Feb 20, 2015,