#1
Hey guys, been a while since my last post here. Hope you guys doing fine.
Well, here my thing. I've been thinking of assembling a pedalboard to go only into the front end of my 6505+ 112. The reasons: less cables and connections and the FX Loop itself making the amp sound like shit whenever is being used. I know I can more or less solve this issue by dialing an EQ, but that is something I'm trying to avoid as I really think it's bet tone can only be achieved when nothing is connected to that damn FX Loop. On the other hand, the lead channel only sounds good to me with my maxon od-808 boosting it, which means that I must make a double-tap everytime I want to change from clean/berserk ou berserk/clean.
Now, I know there are some great distortion pedals out there, but they were designed to go with a clean channel - the cleanest, the better - and, as you know, the clean channel of the 6505+ 112 isn't exactly your pristine cristaline clean sound.
My question is: any of you guys ever tested a distortion pedal through it's clean channel?
#2
Its a ghetto solution, but a board over the switch of the 808 and the amps foot switch can eliminate the tap dance.

I only mention it because I think you'll be supremely disappointed going from the peavey's gain channel to a distortion pedal through the clean channel. There are also midi solutions to your problem, but they are not nearly as simple or cheap as what you're looking at currently.
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#3
I haven't, but I would have another solution for you.

Either turn the clean gain down and keep the 808 on the whole time or place something like a small piece of wood/metal/plastic that stays in place over the switches of both pedals and press it whenever you have to change channel.

Getting a 6505 and not use its distorsion channel is a bit of a waste of money.
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#4
Quote by Kevin Saale
Its a ghetto solution, but a board over the switch of the 808 and the amps foot switch can eliminate the tap dance.
.


Clown shoes.
#5
Quote by dspellman
Clown shoes.


That is another solution, put the pedal next to the switch and turn your foot sideways to hit both switches.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#7
Just about every dist channel sounds better with an 808 pushing it! (<-opinion, and somehow still fact)
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#8
Using a distortion pedal with a 6505 instead of an overdrive is like going to Paris not for The Louvre, but for the local hospitality.
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Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Apr 8, 2015,
#9
I had this exact problem. I just put the overdrive and the footswitch very close together, so i can simply step on both of them at the same time. It works well. I actually have the eq and delay set the same way, to i can switch both of them on for the leads. Just try this before you try any other complicated or expensive solutions.
Joža je kul. On ma sirove z dodatki pa hambije.
#10
I can help you fix the FX loop if you're not afraid of a little soldering. It takes about 10 minutes total and a $.75 capacitor. I just did it a couple weeks ago and now my tone is essentially the same whether I use the FX loop or unplug it. Of course, it's still better yet with my EQ in the loop.

I got by for a bunch of years with my EQ in the loop trying to add back in the low end and cut the nasty "solid-state" effect that the FX buffer does to the tone. Was actually pretty happy with the tone. But with the FX loop mod I just did -- the amp is a MONSTER now.

--I've not heard a distortion pedal through any clean channel that will match my amp's lead channel.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
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#11
With a 6505, using a distortion pedal on the clean channel is NOT the way to get good cleans. You're going to be sacrificing the entire reason of using that amp.

The best way would be a multi-fx unit. How much money do you have to spend on this?

Jackson RR3 Rhoads and DK2M Dinky
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-Digitech RP1000
#12
You need to step your tap game up.

Turn the OD off 1 second before your channel change, then change channels. And vice versa.

The audible difference is totally negligible in that one beat with/without OD.


Otherwise leave the OD on all the time. I could make it work with a 6505 - if you can't make it work with the separate EQs on the 6505+, you need to work on your dialing skills.
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Last edited by Offworld92 at Apr 8, 2015,
#14
You actually use the clean channel on this one?

I'd stay with the overdrive, honestly nothing else will get you that good of a sound. You can try Blackstar HT-Dual maybe...but still amp overdrive is probably best.

I think the trick is to play with the overdrive on and volume rolled off on the guitar, then just bump it up when changing channels...or look at something like Voodoo Labs amp /pedal switchers.
#15
Quote by KailM
I can help you fix the FX loop if you're not afraid of a little soldering. It takes about 10 minutes total and a $.75 capacitor. I just did it a couple weeks ago and now my tone is essentially the same whether I use the FX loop or unplug it. Of course, it's still better yet with my EQ in the loop.

I got by for a bunch of years with my EQ in the loop trying to add back in the low end and cut the nasty "solid-state" effect that the FX buffer does to the tone. Was actually pretty happy with the tone. But with the FX loop mod I just did -- the amp is a MONSTER now.

--I've not heard a distortion pedal through any clean channel that will match my amp's lead channel.


KailM, always in the right place at the right time when it's about the 6505+ 112 You're probably the one guy who knows exactly what I'm talking about. To the rest of the guys I'll try to explain better what's going on.

Right, here the chain as I'm going right now:

Guitar -> Crybaby Classic -> Tuner -> OD 808 -> Noise Supressor -> Amp Input -> FX Send -> Chorus Pedal -> Delay Pedal-> EQ Pedal ->FX Return

Now, the reason why I use that EQ in the effect loop (always on) is precisely due to the fact that when using the Loop of this amp, the sounds becomes fizzy solid-state-like, but since I'm using modulation and time based effects I have no choice but to put these on the loop (using the amp's rhythm and lead channels for my playing).
What I was trying to figure out was a way to use all my pedals into the front end of the amp. As all of you know, modulation and time effects must be placed AFTER your gainy stuff, or it will be a freaking mess. Why, then, would I want I to put everything into the front of the amp? Well, besides that fact that I wouldn't need to plug 2 cables in, 2 cables out of mypedal board, the objective is to free my EQ pedal from the "always on work" (to mask that solid-state feel) so that I could use it to shape the sound of my solos (more mids!). So I had this ideia of buying a good distorion pedal to do the work.
The guys saying it's a waste not to use the amps own distortion... well I agree, as long as you don't put anything in that ****ing loop! Having said that, it's also important to say that these amps aren't quite as good as their american big brothers, the 6505 and the 6505+ heads. Unfortunately, it's a fact. Those are a lot more ballsier and rich in tone. And have a PROPER FX LOOP.

Kind regards my good people!
#16
Yeah, I know the Chinese production of these amps cut a lot of corners. If the loop is bad - I think a guy suggested a mod, either do that or ditch the loop altogether. I'd rather have good distortion than delay on my leads, but if it is a deal breaker - I understand. Get rid of the amp!
It is just impossible to get good distortion to work with it in front as the clean is not really clean, you'll get some crunch on it. Maybe it is just time to trade it in for something else?
#17
KailM, I would really appreciate any help I could get, my lad. How did you do the mod? I don't have that much experience on soldering and stuff, but I could give it a try! Do you have the schematics? Any photos? Thanks in advance!
#18
Quote by diabolical
Yeah, I know the Chinese production of these amps cut a lot of corners. If the loop is bad - I think a guy suggested a mod, either do that or ditch the loop altogether. I'd rather have good distortion than delay on my leads, but if it is a deal breaker - I understand. Get rid of the amp!
It is just impossible to get good distortion to work with it in front as the clean is not really clean, you'll get some crunch on it. Maybe it is just time to trade it in for something else?

Oh man, but I really, really think this amp has tons of potential. Just want to make it more practical, that's all. And it has a great sentimental value, my dad helped me turning it into a head... I see your point though. Thank you for the input!
#20
I understand. I'm in similar predicament with my Tiny Terror as I can't use anything in the loop as it has no loop ;-)
So I apply the fx in post. Check out "High Energy Fracture" to hear the post fx on the lead (all Orange TT):
http://reverbnation.com/egregoreband
#21
It sounds just like it should, nice singing lead work, man. It reminded me of Arcturus lead sound. The playing itself is very very good. Don't mind me saying, but this sounds very european! Overall, excelent job dude, really digging it! Maybe the drum sound could be a bit improved, but I've heard (and enjoyed) music with a much worse drum sound than this.

Keep going man!
#22
Quote by Kivenkantaja
It sounds just like it should, nice singing lead work, man. It reminded me of Arcturus lead sound. The playing itself is very very good. Don't mind me saying, but this sounds very european! Overall, excelent job dude, really digging it! Maybe the drum sound could be a bit improved, but I've heard (and enjoyed) music with a much worse drum sound than this.

Keep going man!


Thanks! That's what I get with ezdrummer, every new song gets a touch better but still no cigar.
#24
Quote by Kivenkantaja
KailM, I would really appreciate any help I could get, my lad. How did you do the mod? I don't have that much experience on soldering and stuff, but I could give it a try! Do you have the schematics? Any photos? Thanks in advance!


These pics are terrible, sorry. But really, this mod is about as easy as it gets. You just need to buy a .022 uF microfarad capacitor from an electronics store (I bought a package of two at Radio Shack for $1.50). All you have to do is pull out your amp's chassis a little; just enough to get to the circuit board just behind the effects loop jacks. On the board just behind the effects loop "send" jack there is a resistor marked "R 86". All you have to do is wire one lead of your capacitor to one side of R 86, and the other lead to the other side of R 86 (you'll have to trim the capacitor's leads to length, otherwise it may not fit into the chassis). It will basically look like the two components are "piggy backed." The only difficulty is that it's a pretty tiny area in which to solder. I tinned the leads of the capacitor and the leads of R86 first so they would "stick" without having to add much solder afterward.

**Warning: there are components in your amp that could shock the $%#$ out of you, even if it's not plugged in. I don't think you could get shocked by touching anything on the effects loop circuit board, but I'm not positive on that. It's the main circuit board for the amp that you'd need to watch out for, which you don't really need to access to do this mod. However, for safety's sake, don't risk anything. I've found that my amp completely discharges its capacitors if I warm it up and play it for awhile and then walk over and unplug it from the wall in the middle of playing. After checking it with a multimeter, the voltage was gone every time after doing so. But if you're unsure, get a multimeter and check before working.


Pics:


.022 uF Microfarad capacitor soldered in parallel to the R 86 Resistor:


Here's a video that does a much better job of showing the mod:

Anyway, this will fix your effects loop problem. I know exactly what you're talking about -- you want to use your effects (delay, reverb, etc.) in the loop, but using the loop kills all the good tone you have on the lead channel. It's a catch-22. But this mod basically neutralizes the offending buffer in the FX loop. There is still a slight difference in tone between using the FX loop or not, but it's barely noticeable. It's probably good that there's still some buffer effect in there, actually, in case you add a lot of pedals in the future. I now actually enjoy the tone with or without my MXR 10-band engaged. It doesn't rob the low end out of the tone, and doesn't add that fizz that sounds terrible. Before, the MXR was mandatory in getting a good tone. Good luck, and let me know if you need any more help.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
#25
Thanks, man! Really, really helpful! I will give ir a try!

Just out of curiosity: for how long have you owned your 6505+ 112? It's kinda hard to get rid of this thing, isn't it?

Once again, thanks dude. Cheers!
#26
I've had it for about 4 years. It has served me quite well, and after doing the FX loop mod it's WAY better than ever before. That's really the biggest flaw this amp has, but it's an easy fix. A lot of people complain about the cleans, but I've figured out how to make those a lot better too. I honestly don't know what amp I'd get, even if I had a ton of money. I haven't found one yet that sounds quite as pissed-off/brutal as this one -- which is exactly what I need for my music.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
#27
Quote by KailM
I honestly don't know what amp I'd get, even if I had a ton of money. I haven't found one yet that sounds quite as pissed-off/brutal as this one -- which is exactly what I need for my music.


Original 5150 USA?
#28
Quote by Kivenkantaja
In case you guys are wondering about what it can do, check out this cover I made recently.

And yes, it's Cradle of Filth. The good old stuff though Check it out!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03It4-6XqWs


Sounds good, maybe a little dark (tone-wise) for the original concept?

I haven't heard Arcturus mentioned in a long time, extra kudos for that
#29
Quote by diabolical
Original 5150 USA?


My next project is to mod the lead channel to 5150 specs.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
#30
Quote by diabolical
Sounds good, maybe a little dark (tone-wise) for the original concept?

I haven't heard Arcturus mentioned in a long time, extra kudos for that


I know what you mean. The idea was to give the song a more modern sound, but it may have ended up a tad dark, yes. I kinda like that way, though
#31
Quote by KailM
My next project is to mod the lead channel to 5150 specs.


Jesus Christ man, will you ever stop? You think you can do it?
#32
About the issue, I think I'm gonna try a Wampler Triple Wreck, just out of curiosity. They say it's a killer distortion pedal for the metal player, so I'm kinda wanting to mess with some toys Also heard heard about the Okko Dominator and the Weehbo Morbid Drive. All top notch. Anyone heard of them?

Watch this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap8GYVohVbE
#33
Quote by KailM
My next project is to mod the lead channel to 5150 specs.

AFAIK this is just a capacitor swap. I did it in mine, but I don't know if the combo version is different. With the head, the capacitor swap can be done by either using 1 cap or bridging two of them. I don't remember the capacitance off the top of my head, but my local tech suggested trying the bridging method with one cap first, then two if it wasn't enough.
After doing the mod, it added a little more bass than I wanted, but I didn't bother to change it. You could consider the bridging method 1 cap at a time and see how you like it both ways. Just advice from someone that has done it.

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#34
About the issue, I think I'm gonna try a Wampler Triple Wreck, just out of curiosity. They say it's a killer distortion pedal for the metal player, so I'm kinda wanting to mess with some toys Also heard heard about the Okko Dominator and the Weehbo Morbid Drive. All top notch. Anyone heard of them?

QUOTE]


Those sounded okay. Better than most distortion pedals, actually. But do that FX loop mod if you can. With a boost and an EQ in the loop your amp will beat those pedals. Without even trying too hard.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
Last edited by KailM at Apr 14, 2015,
#35
Quote by Tremolo Bum
AFAIK this is just a capacitor swap. I did it in mine, but I don't know if the combo version is different. With the head, the capacitor swap can be done by either using 1 cap or bridging two of them. I don't remember the capacitance off the top of my head, but my local tech suggested trying the bridging method with one cap first, then two if it wasn't enough.
After doing the mod, it added a little more bass than I wanted, but I didn't bother to change it. You could consider the bridging method 1 cap at a time and see how you like it both ways. Just advice from someone that has done it.


Yeah, I know how to do it with the 120 watt head version, but my 112 is a little different. It might be the same caps that get replaced/bridged, but I need to research it a little more. A guy on Youtube told me he did it to his 112; but I haven't heard back from him on what exactly he did. Not that many people have done it with the 112, in any case.

I more or less just want to see how it sounds, and I may end up going back to the way it is. More low end/less tightness would be okay with me because I've got the EQ pedal and I could always back off the bass if necessary. But right now it sounds absolutely ridiculous when cranked. It definitely doesn't need more low-end, but I want to hear what the 5150 mod will do for its character, as I've always heard the original is a bit more aggressive.

Sorry if I hijacked this thread, Kivenkantaja!
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
#36
KailM, won't your amp squeal like a modafoca when your lead channel is boosted? Mine has always done that. If I bring the post above 3, it's certain, it squeals real bad. But only when boosted. Without the boost, it almost won't squeal (can be tamed).

My settings on the lead channel:

Post - 3
Treble - 6
Mids - 4
Bass - 7
Pre - 3

Maxon OD808:

Drive - zero
Volume - 3 o'clock
Tone - 3 o'clock

I find myself unable to use my maxon boosting the lead channel in a band situation where high volumes are needed...
Is anything wrong with the amp? Does it happen with your amp?

Cheers mate
#37
^^^Not too bad. But I mute with both hands when I'm not playing. But yes, it will squeal if I don't mute with both hands. I also have a Boss NS-2 which completely eliminates that, but I don't use it that often. Almost any amp turned up that loud will feedback pretty quickly if you don't mute, and palm muting alone is not enough. I would guess mine at "3" is considerably louder than yours as well, because I'm playing through a 4 X 12 loaded with some of the loudest speakers made. I did notice, however, that my TS-9 causes feedback more easily than my MXR M77. And they both boost the amp equally, or so it seems.

If yours is squealing between palm-muted chord strums, then you may have a problem with a microphonic tube.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

Pestilential Flood
#38
I don't know man, it's happened since I bought the amp new. When I was in my band, it was very awkward. The other guitarist had a loud setup, I had to push the post gain to at least 3 (with a 4x12 with 2 V30s and 2 Swamp Thangs that I sold when I left the band). The pre gain could not be pushed above 5 and using the Maxon was unthinkable, or as soon as I muted the strings (even with both hands) the noise would become unbearable. A crazy high pitch squeal.
I'd really like to be able to use my maxon on live situations, but even with the lead channel gain on 3 and the usual boosting settings on the maxon, it will squeal like a maniac...
Maybe it's the tubes, or maybe it's just a characteristic of this particular model....
#39
Try swapping your pre tubes I just snagged the 6505+ combo today mine had the same sh*t going on popped some better tubes and emi wizard I had laying around in it and its a nice little practice amp now.
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