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#1
Hoi!

So I've been thinking of buying (a) pedal(s) like Wah and such. The thing is that I actually know nothing about them. I know what wah pedals do etc. but then the other pedals just aren't something I know. If I've understood correctly looper pedals record your playing to be played in the background?

What I'm looking for is a pedal to get sounds like in the song "Apocalyptic love" by Slash. I'm not sure what I should be looking for. The pedal should be 135€ as the maximum price.

http://m.thomann.de/gb/guitar_and_bass_effects.html

All those delay and phaser pedals, are they for fast switching between channels/effects or are they "enhancing" the sounds and the effects?

What pedals should I get to make sounds like Slash? In other words, what is required for a playing style influenced by Slash?
Last edited by Billie_J at May 2, 2015,
#2
to start with what have you got? to be totally honest with you lots of guys want to sound like Slash but few really can. there is no budget pedal that will magically give you his tone. there are some that can help though. first thing though is amp and guitar. if those aren't in the ball park then pedals will do you no good.

so what gear do you currenty have?
#3
Line 6 Spider IV 150w, Gibson LP Studio 50s tribute and 7 years of playing behind.
#4
Quote by Billie_J
Line 6 Spider IV 150w, Gibson LP Studio 50s tribute and 7 years of playing behind.


you need a better amp. many pedals don't play nice with modelling amps for starters. your amp has built in fx so getting pedasl that do the same thing really won't help much. a wah would be the on exception.

i'm sure you know that Slash uses Marshalls which are of course tube amps. so a tube amp is the place to start. your guitar should work ok so no issue there. i'm a little confused though as if you have been playing for 7 years and have an amp choked full of fx the why don't you understand their use?
#5
Try a multi effects pedal that can act as single effect or can be used create pedal combinations (patches). The Zoom G3X might be a good start and is close to your budget.
#6
Quote by Marsden
Try a multi effects pedal that can act as single effect or can be used create pedal combinations (patches). The Zoom G3X might be a good start and is close to your budget.


he has that ability with the amp already. good idea othewise though.
#7
Quote by monwobobbo
he has that ability with the amp already. good idea othewise though.

But with the Zoom, he can make it sound good

TS - as said earlier, if you want to improve your tone you really need a new amp.
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#8
Your first step would be to get a better amp. The spider is good to experiment and learn what kinds of tones you like, but outside of that not so much. You probably have a slash-emulating patch on it however.

So yeah. A Marshall tube amp. I'm not too knowledgeable on them, but I think the usual recommended amp is a DSL40. Kinda pricy compared to your original budget, you might could find one used for cheaper.

You could just keep your money and use what the spider has to offer. But you'll get just what the spider can do, which is just really a guess with incompetent electronics compared to a real tone.

Pedals do a lot of different things, depending on the pedal. Some add gain (distortion, clipping) structures to your tone. Some delay your signal and send it back in with your dry tone, giving you an echo of sorts. Some emulate reverberation as if you were playing guitar in a large concert hall. Others mess with your equalization in interesting ways.

For playing slash-esque, get a Marshall tube along with a Tubescreamer, a wah, and maybe a delay pedal.
Last edited by Will Lane at May 2, 2015,
#9
i am on board with everybody else, the amp has to go, it is the weak link.

also, as will said you will likely need an OD, wah, and delay.
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#10
Just saying that I'm not aware of the technical side of amps etc.

I really can't understand the differences. The amp I have is diversebso what makes this obstacle?
I have money but the only Marshall amp I know for sure to be neat is JVM410H but this costs like 1600€.. I can easily afford that but I'll have to pay for the up coming driver's licence and possibly a car (I'm 17) so investing 1600€ in amps wouldn't be too wise.

https://m.thomann.de/gb/marshall_jvm410h_bundle_3.htm

And even if I was to get a wah pedal, would that be enough to make the sounds in apocalyptic love? Or does that require a whole new amp? ._.
Last edited by Billie_J at May 3, 2015,
#11
Quote by Billie_J
Just saying that I'm not aware of the technical side of amps etc.

I really can't understand the differences. The amp I have is diversebso what makes this obstacle?

A modeling amp is kind of like a buffet. It is diverse, but the only things you can get are the things the cooks have decided to make that day.

A standard tube amp is more like a room full of ingredients, pots and appliances- what you get depends on what recipes you use. Recipes here being analogous to pedals.
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Last edited by dannyalcatraz at May 3, 2015,
#12
Screw the car, driving is for sissies and wusses, get the JVM or some other all tube Marshall stack. yolo. A typical car can't carry a full stack and drum kit anyways, they're pretty much useless.
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#13
As tempting it is to buy one but just can't ._.
Someday? Why not? But again, if you listen to the song, is a wah pedal enough?

And Danny, you can use the effects etc however you desire and you get to edit things like feedback, speed, mix etc with the amps "HUD". It's probably more diverse on Marshall's though.
#14
Quote by Billie_J
As tempting it is to buy one but just can't ._.
Someday? Why not? But again, if you listen to the song, is a wah pedal enough?

And Danny, you can use the effects etc however you desire and you get to edit things like feedback, speed, mix etc with the amps "HUD". It's probably more diverse on Marshall's though.

Yeah, it's a wah pedal being used on the song. Just run it into a distorted tone on your amp (for now).
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#15
Quote by Billie_J
As tempting it is to buy one but just can't ._.
Someday? Why not? But again, if you listen to the song, is a wah pedal enough?

And Danny, you can use the effects etc however you desire and you get to edit things like feedback, speed, mix etc with the amps "HUD". It's probably more diverse on Marshall's though.


dude you don't have to get a marshall. look at Jet City amps. point was that you needed a tube amp with a marshally tone to get in the neighborhood for Slash.

as for not knowing the difference well you will when you hear it. modeling amps (except for the really high end stuff) just haven't managed to capture the true sound of a good tube amp.
#16
My understanding is that Slash doesn't really use effects besides wah (used in the intro and leads of Apocalyptic Love). His tone comes from his Les Paul plugged into a Marshall amp.

Most people don't have effects on all the time (other than reverb, which is most of the time built into an amp). They are usually used for spicing up the tone at certain parts. Most of the tone comes from the amp. Of course there are distortion, OD and pre amp pedals that can make your amp do tones that would normally require another amp (but OD pedals won't sound good through a bad amp).

You have effects built in to your amp. Experiment with them. Though they won't give you Slash tones, because Slash doesn't really use effects like phaser or flanger. Delay can work well with your lead tone. The effects in your amp should give a good idea of how the different effects affect your tone and should help you with future pedal purchases.

But yeah, to get close to the Slash tone, you should really get a new amp. Your amp does have two Marshall amp models in it (Crunch Red and Hi Gain Red), so maybe try playing around with them if new amp is not an option. But really, you won't sound like Slash without being Slash. If you are just after a similar tone, plug your guitar straight into a Marshall tube amp.
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#17
Ok, I'm gonna tell you something that NO ONE ever said on this site. EVER.
If they did, they probably got perma banned.


To sound like Slash, you need money. Lots.
A good Marshall stack.
You're gonna have to try them out cause its not likely Slash's amps are stock, so you will just have to get as close as you can.
Get a wah
Get and OD of some sort, tube screamer, Boss SD-1, etc.

Ok, no for the reality check (either for you or the loss of mine).

Keep your Spider for now.
Yes I said that.
If you aren't gigging, it doesn't really matter at this point.
Yeah, its a crap amp.
But it does have a lot of effects on it.
Save your money up while you play around with the effects in the Spider.
By the time you figure out which types of effects you like, you may have saved enough money to get an amp that will get you in the neighborhood of where you want to go.
Plus, if you are lucky, you might have some money left over to get some effects pedals. that give you the type(s) of sounds you have been experimenting with on the Spider,
but much better sound with the pedals into a good amp.
Last edited by CodeMonk at May 3, 2015,
#18
Might sound lazy but could you help choosing a fitting wah pedal from the site I linked. I don't want to fk up this purchase by buying something that isn't even something I wanted. I assume they don't come with cables so I'll have to buy one too? (Unless my old cables are fitting)
#19
Quote by CodeMonk
Ok, I'm gonna tell you something that NO ONE ever said on this site. EVER.
If they did, they probably got perma banned.


To sound like Slash, you need money. Lots.
A good Marshall stack.
You're gonna have to try them out cause its not likely Slash's amps are stock, so you will just have to get as close as you can.
Get a wah
Get and OD of some sort, tube screamer, Boss SD-1, etc.

Ok, no for the reality check (either for you or the loss of mine).

Keep your Spider for now.
Yes I said that.
If you aren't gigging, it doesn't really matter at this point.
Yeah, its a crap amp.
But it does have a lot of effects on it.
Save your money up while you play around with the effects in the Spider.
By the time you figure out which types of effects you like, you may have saved enough money to get an amp that will get you in the neighborhood of where you want to go.
Plus, if you are lucky, you might have some money left over to get some effects pedals. that give you the type(s) of sounds you have been experimenting with on the Spider,
but much better sound with the pedals into a good amp.



BANNED. burn the heritic !!!!

Slash has a signature cry-baby wah so that would be a good place to start. if you feel a little adventurous then look at Morley wah's either a classic or a power wah. personally i greatly prefer them to cry-baby's (used a vintage one for years).

and you will need an extra cable to go from the pedal to the amp (guitar plugs into wah). doesn't have to be all that long.
Last edited by monwobobbo at May 3, 2015,
#20
I agree with Codemonk

keep your spider, use the marshall settings (Crunch setting). You may also want to look at getting the L6 FBV Express or Shortboard. these allow you to use all the built in FX and channels of the amp. They also give you a wah/volume pedal. If you get the shortboard you can select individual FX to use, it also gives you a looper which is a great practice tool for any guitarist.

www.thomann.de/gb/line6_fbv_express_usb.htm
www.thomann.de/gb/line6_fbv_shortboard_usb.htm

The spider series is an ok practice amp (way better than I had in the early 90's) but it isn't anything special. But it should get you close enough to what your wanting.
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Last edited by Robbgnarly at May 3, 2015,
#21
Quote by Robbgnarly
I agree with Codemonk

keep your spider, use the marshall settings (Crunch setting). You may also want to look at getting the L6 FBV Express or Shortboard. these allow you to use all the built in FX and channels of the amp. They also give you a wah/volume pedal. If you get the shortboard you can select individual FX to use, it also gives you a looper which is a great practice tool for any guitarist.

www.thomann.de/gb/line6_fbv_express_usb.htm
www.thomann.de/gb/line6_fbv_shortboard_usb.htm

The spider series is an ok practice amp (way better than I had in the early 90's) but it isn't anything special. But it should get you close enough to what your wanting.


2 posters saying keep a LIne 6 spyder. quick check the temperature in hell. pretty sure this is one of the signs of the apocolypse (not the slash kind).

actually they are right. you'll need to spend some real money (even if you went say the Jet City route) to cop anything close to the tone you want. this is a sad fact of tone chasing. the truth is that there rarely (if ever) is a cheap quick way to get guitar hero tone. take some time with your amp to work on getting good or at least useable tones. what you learn will help you a great deal down the road when you do have the money to upgrade your amp. we all have been there.
#22
Quote by monwobobbo
2 posters saying keep a LIne 6 spyder. quick check the temperature in hell. pretty sure this is one of the signs of the apocolypse (not the slash kind).

actually they are right. you'll need to spend some real money (even if you went say the Jet City route) to cop anything close to the tone you want. this is a sad fact of tone chasing. the truth is that there rarely (if ever) is a cheap quick way to get guitar hero tone. take some time with your amp to work on getting good or at least useable tones. what you learn will help you a great deal down the road when you do have the money to upgrade your amp. we all have been there.




Yeah in TS current situation it just seems the best, most economical thing to do and it will get him close to the tone he wants.
I have much less hate for L6 than most here and have owned several L6 amps including an original spyder 15yrs ago.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#23
Why the better amp suggestion? For now he only needs a wah, he is learning and he already has an amp that is gonna help him on that, no matter its quality.

I recommend you get a versatile wah like an Ibanez Weeping Demon, Dunlop CFH or something like that, a proper power supply and an extra cable.

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Last edited by Perverockstar69 at May 3, 2015,
#25
Quote by Perverockstar69
Why the better amp suggestion? For now he only needs a wah, he is learning and he already has an amp that is gonna help him on that, no matter its quality.

I recommend you get a versatile wah like an Ibanez Weeping Demon, Dunlop CFH or something like that, a proper power supply and an extra cable.


better amp suggestion cuz that is the actual answer to the ?. it's tough when guys want to go tone chasing with gear that clearly isn't going to really do the job. just getting a wah won't make him sound like Slash so i kinda think more needs to be said. after the 3rd or 4th time of having someone come back and call you an asshole for giving bad advice you kinda learn that more needs to be said. it can be tough to explain to new players that getting "guitar hero" tone is more than just throwing a pedal or two in front of any old amp.
#26
I'm not gonna argue with you man, not gonna lose my time.

Billie_J, that is a start. You should go to a store and try some wahs. I used to do that even when I just started playing and it really helped me a lot. IT ALWAYS HELPS!

Good luck!

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Last edited by Perverockstar69 at May 3, 2015,
#27
Quote by Billie_J
Now that we're all best friends forever, what do you think about this https://m.thomann.de/gb/dunlop_cry_baby_gcb95.htm?ref=mal_a_17

Might be someone of you suggested this but anyways.


will do the trick and is one of the better cry-baby wahs. some cry-baby's have issues with shielding the electronics so they pick up radio broadcasts but i think that one probably won't.
#28
Quote by Perverockstar69
I'm not gonna argue with you man, not gonna lose my time.

Billie_J, that is a start. You should go to a store and try some wahs. I used to do that even when I just started playing and it really helped me a lot. IT ALWAYS HELPS!

Good luck!


no argument here. you asked why i answered. never said you were wrong at all. just relaying my experience when it comes to this subject. obviously others agreed with what i said so it's not just me.

anyways we're good
#29
Uh, last question. Do I need a patch cable or a guitar cable D:
I'm going to buy the pedal after I've solved this
#30
Quote by Billie_J
Uh, last question. Do I need a patch cable or a guitar cable D:
I'm going to buy the pedal after I've solved this


just another guitar cable. it doesn't need to be all that long. to play at home i usually just have a 3 foot cable from pedals to the amp with a standard 10 ft cable from my guitar into my fx. when playing live longer cables are often used. the only time you'll need a patch cable is if you have more than one pedal going. in the case the shorter the better.

ask all the ?s you want that's what this forum is here for
#31
Lmao, more coming up! I just checked the particular pedal. So patch cables are only for linking multiple pedals together into the amp? Or do they also work like guitar cables?
Now before I buy a new guitar cable for the pedal, can you, again, help me choose one?

Last time I bought a cable, it appeared to be a cable which gets curled all around and the time before that I bought a cable whose plug in part was thick as fk. Bad memories..
Last edited by Billie_J at May 3, 2015,
#32
Budget for your cable?

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Yamaha THR10
PRS Swamp Ash Limited Custom 24
LTD Viper 500 with Duncans
#33
Well I'll try to stay below 120€ with the total cost. Freight charges make it 101€ with the pedal. Rather a cheap cable as it's only for the pedal but should still be working just fine.
#34
Quote by Billie_J
Lmao, more coming up! I just checked the particular pedal. So patch cables are only for linking multiple pedals together into the amp? Or do they also work like guitar cables?
Now before I buy a new guitar cable for the pedal, can you, again, help me choose one?

Last time I bought a cable, it appeared to be a cable which gets curled all around and the time before that I bought a cable whose plug in part was thick as fk. Bad memories..


they all have standard guitar plugs on them so in theory could be used. i have used a 1 foot cable that i normally use between pedals to plug an overdrive into my amp (pedal sits on top of amp where the input is. for a wah that would be really impractical.

i'd suggest getting a 3-5 foot cable to start with however if you want to be further from your amp then a 10 footer would be fine as well. really what ever works for you is fine. as far as brands just get the best cable you can afford within reason. no need for gold plated tips etc just for sitting at home. (for the record i use Conquest but they are locally made so not likely available where you are. i also like Planet Waves which may be available where you're at. i'm in the US)
#35
I'm mainly concerned whether the cable fits in the pedal.. That's the main worry
#36
Quote by Billie_J
Lmao, more coming up! I just checked the particular pedal. So patch cables are only for linking multiple pedals together into the amp? Or do they also work like guitar cables?
Now before I buy a new guitar cable for the pedal, can you, again, help me choose one?

Last time I bought a cable, it appeared to be a cable which gets curled all around and the time before that I bought a cable whose plug in part was thick as fk. Bad memories..


Patch cables and guitar cables are made of of the same things.
The patch cables are shorter because they only need to go between pedals.
Plus shorter cables save space on a pedal board.

A cable going from your guitar to and effect pedal, then another one going from the effect pedal, or a cable going from your guitar to your amp.


In each case they are all the same regardless of length(Given the same manufacturer and model number).


A cable going from an amp head to a cabinet or speaker is a completely different cables.
YOU CAN NOT USE AN INSTRUMENT CABLE FOR AN AMP TO CAB CABLE.
Last edited by CodeMonk at May 3, 2015,
#37
A cable is a cable. Anything in front of your amp will use similar cables. There's no magic - all cables work the same way, and your pedal doesn't know what cable you plugged into it.

Yeah, there are cables for different purposes, but all cables in front of your amp should be instrument cables. So just make sure you buy an instrument cable.
Quote by AlanHB
Just remember that there are no boring scales, just boring players.

Gear

Bach Stradivarius 37G
Charvel So Cal
Fender Dimension Bass
Hartke HyDrive 210c
Ibanez BL70
Laney VC30
Tokai TB48
Yamaha FG720S-12
Yamaha P115
#38
Quote by Billie_J
Uh, last question. Do I need a patch cable or a guitar cable D:
I'm going to buy the pedal after I've solved this


Hi Billy,

For between guitar and amp, with pedals inbetween or not you need guitar cables. These are instrument cables designed for guitar and so typically have low capacitance for use with passive pickup equipped guitars to keep the high end intact. These cables have quarter inch TS (tip sleeve) phone connector jack plugs for guitars, pedals, amps and other unbalanced connections like between some rack units etc. The tip carries the AC signal and the sleeve the grounded shield to get rid of electromagetic interference (noise). Guitar cables need good shielding as a guitar signal is very weak.

Patch cables just mean shorter instrument/guitar cables.

Guitar Cables vs Guitar Patch Cables

If you only have one pedal, then you have a guitar cable to your pedal, and a guitar cable from the pedal to the amp.

If you ever get an amp head, especially a valve one, never use a guitar/instrument cable though from the head to the speakers... you could fry the cable and blow the amp. You would need speaker cable, which has the same connector type but has thick wire to handle the power. So remember that important difference.

Your little modelling amp if fine for practise, and a 100 watt Marshall would have you kicked out of your house faster than you can say 'driving license' ;O) I know one of the UKs top session guitarists and he used to practise unamplified a lot, so don't sweat trying to sound tone wise exactly like Slash without a Marshall cranked in a studio or perhaps a Kemper/Axe FXII etc. Just nail the technique to get the timing and notes clean, and figure out your eq and drive etc on the amp as best you can.

Good luck with the driving etc. and the tone chasing... it's a long journey.

Cheers,

Marc.
Last edited by SHOOTOUT! at May 4, 2015,
#39
Yeah, I apologize if I seemed like I was trying to push a "marshall amp or go home" agenda. I only suggested it if TS wanted to make the investment to have a genuine basis for a classic slash tone. If you don't want to invest in that and you're satisfied with the spider and the wah for the time being, that's fine c:

And the cable: As long as the packaging says something like "1/4 inch instrument cable" you'll be fine.

And also you're going to need to power the wah pedal somehow, I don't know if that was covered. Depending upon the wah you get, it might come with a power adapter already. If so, just plug that into a wall socket. If not, you'll probably be fine with a 9v battery. The wah you posted from Thomann doesn't come with a power supply. Just make sure you unplug the cables from the wah when you're not playing so that the battery doesn't drain. Happy tone chasing, enjoy the wah, it's a fun pedal type c:
Last edited by Will Lane at May 4, 2015,
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