#1
Hey guys!

https://soundcloud.com/DENTSmusic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8npwr6PBCTc


So I basically recorded this demo; the recording is by no means perfect, but it'll do for now.

Now, basically this piece needs to be seen as an atmosphere; the guitars are low volume, the solos are too, bass & drums (vst's) high volume etc. It's not meant as an average listening piece. Also, I want to add vocals to it as well (in the same fashion; as another instrument, as opposed to a lead instrument), but I don't have the guy to do it yet. Maybe in the near future.

Anyways, thanks in advance for the comments and the critique; it's very much appreciated!
Last edited by DENTS at May 26, 2015,
#2
This is an awesome composition and I when I listen closely, I can hear exceptional guitar technique and syncopation.

Might I suggest that it is not the mixing which makes the genre of Atmospheric Metal... it's use of heavy effects and supporting or padding instrumentation. Consider the Scandinavian groups like Nightwish, Stratovarious, Sonata Arctica etc... even Devin Townsend (Canada), they have the guitars forward in the mix with big verb or keys... X Japan use Piano and a philharmonic orchestra. Alternately, the atmosphere you're wanting to create is that of a scene or sound scape e.g. Blind Guardian or Rhapsody with their medieval or fantasy inclusions.

Sorry to bore but I love this genre.

And well done on the piece.
#3
Quote by andyrooj
This is an awesome composition and I when I listen closely, I can hear exceptional guitar technique and syncopation.

Might I suggest that it is not the mixing which makes the genre of Atmospheric Metal... it's use of heavy effects and supporting or padding instrumentation. Consider the Scandinavian groups like Nightwish, Stratovarious, Sonata Arctica etc... even Devin Townsend (Canada), they have the guitars forward in the mix with big verb or keys... X Japan use Piano and a philharmonic orchestra. Alternately, the atmosphere you're wanting to create is that of a scene or sound scape e.g. Blind Guardian or Rhapsody with their medieval or fantasy inclusions.

Sorry to bore but I love this genre.

And well done on the piece.


Thanks so much! Really means a lot.
Don't worry about boring me, I love talking about all music; although I must admit that I personally don't even listen to much atmospheric metal. I do love Devin Townsend btw, but I mostly listen to Meshuggah and that type of stuff (next to some other genres on the totally different side of music; i.e. classical on piano, blues, jazz etc).

Anyways, I'm really trying to make it sound like those guys, but it sure is harder than it looks to make it sound solid in the mix haha. Maybe one day i'll get there.

But for now, thank you very much and I'll definitely take a look at those bands; im sure I can learn a thing or two from them
#4
Really liking the mix here, even if it's a bit raw. I despise it when the bass is mixed to inaudibly low, and love it when it's huge and ever present if you know what I mean. At first I thought that the drums might be a bit loud, but they're actually quite pleasing. Even though they're loud, they're not harsh, which is a huge plus. The part at 3:15 or so where there's a keyboard and a guitar solo playing simultaneously is pretty amazing, and the following outro is great as well. The rest of the track is a bit monotone, but has a great atmosphere. And I guess that's what you were aiming for? And as a guitarist, I have to say that I really, really like everything guitar related on this piece. Great work.

By the way, what vst are you using for the piano parts? Is it just a stock one that comes with the DAW?
#5
Quote by Kevätuhri
Really liking the mix here, even if it's a bit raw. I despise it when the bass is mixed to inaudibly low, and love it when it's huge and ever present if you know what I mean. At first I thought that the drums might be a bit loud, but they're actually quite pleasing. Even though they're loud, they're not harsh, which is a huge plus. The part at 3:15 or so where there's a keyboard and a guitar solo playing simultaneously is pretty amazing, and the following outro is great as well. The rest of the track is a bit monotone, but has a great atmosphere. And I guess that's what you were aiming for? And as a guitarist, I have to say that I really, really like everything guitar related on this piece. Great work.

By the way, what vst are you using for the piano parts? Is it just a stock one that comes with the DAW?


I was indeed going for the monotonality. I wanted to have a single pattern and work that one out throughout the piece. The piano serves as a sort of rhythmic ostinato. But yeah I can totally understand why it would sound monotone; I just love it like that haha!

And thank you! I was thinking the same thing drums- and basswise, although I must admit that afterwards I kinda feel like it made it a bit ''too'' messy overall.

Oh and I used truepianos! Although you can't beat an actual piano; there's a MASSIVE difference due to the lack of dynamics, rubato, etc (I only have an sm57 to record my piano with, and it sucked ass, so I just kept it at the vst's for now haha). But anyways: truepianos is imo the way to go for realistic pianos; they have everything ranging from classical to pop pianos and from raw to studio pianos. You can change the reverb, dynamics etc too; check it out man!
#6
Quote by Kevätuhri
Really liking the mix here, even if it's a bit raw. I despise it when the bass is mixed to inaudibly low, and love it when it's huge and ever present if you know what I mean. At first I thought that the drums might be a bit loud, but they're actually quite pleasing. Even though they're loud, they're not harsh, which is a huge plus. The part at 3:15 or so where there's a keyboard and a guitar solo playing simultaneously is pretty amazing, and the following outro is great as well. The rest of the track is a bit monotone, but has a great atmosphere. And I guess that's what you were aiming for? And as a guitarist, I have to say that I really, really like everything guitar related on this piece. Great work.

By the way, what vst are you using for the piano parts? Is it just a stock one that comes with the DAW?


oh and by the way: I'd love to check out some of your pieces or covers. If you have some, send em through
Last edited by DENTS at May 27, 2015,
#7
I only have one uploaded track, and it's kind of an overall recording test/upload experiment. It has some things going on for it that I like, and on the other hand it's still very much a work in progress. Kind of random to be honest. I don't have a thread for it since it's not really a track that I'm actively looking for criticism on (probably due to it's beta status), but of course I have nothing against people checking it out.

https://soundcloud.com/tk95/paahde
#8
Quote by Kevätuhri
I only have one uploaded track, and it's kind of an overall recording test/upload experiment. It has some things going on for it that I like, and on the other hand it's still very much a work in progress. Kind of random to be honest. I don't have a thread for it since it's not really a track that I'm actively looking for criticism on (probably due to it's beta status), but of course I have nothing against people checking it out.

https://soundcloud.com/tk95/paahde


I commented on the track itself. Love the progression
#9
Quote by DENTS
I commented on the track itself. Love the progression


Yup, the progression is the heart of the track. The leads are a like a limp noodle and the production is horrid, but I have to say that I had an unusually bright moment with the chords.

Just to gather some more info, I'm actually looking forward at doing some ambienty-electronicy-jazzy-fusiony stuff and I'm just looking for ways to add more to my tracks than just guitar. So could you share some details about the DAW and the production? What program did you use, and do you use some outsourced plugins? Any tips on vst's aside from truepianos? Thanks for the comment
#10
Yo dude,

The general atmosphere (heh) of the song is pretty cool. Its very quirky, I like it. I dunno if I entirely agree with the concept of quieter solos and guitar to make it sound more atmospheric, if I didnt know you did it on purpose I would say the mix needs work, but as you have done it for effect I reckon the mix is pretty well balanced. The changing time signatures/pulse sound cool. Theyre not predictable, but nor are they completely batty and random. The piece has a nice feeling of roundness too, you recycled some material at the end and it gives the piece a complete feeling. If I were you I would do that a little more; manipulating an idea, for example the beginning piano line, is the heart of composition. Or at least in a Western art sense :p

C4C? https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1677368
#11
Quote by Kevätuhri
Yup, the progression is the heart of the track. The leads are a like a limp noodle and the production is horrid, but I have to say that I had an unusually bright moment with the chords.

Just to gather some more info, I'm actually looking forward at doing some ambienty-electronicy-jazzy-fusiony stuff and I'm just looking for ways to add more to my tracks than just guitar. So could you share some details about the DAW and the production? What program did you use, and do you use some outsourced plugins? Any tips on vst's aside from truepianos? Thanks for the comment


sure! I use cubase (7), but reaper will do the job. For EQ'ing I use reaper's EQ (from the site, free download). I use superior drummer for the drums and for the bass trillian. Both pretty expensive, but oh well. I use ozone for mastering and omnisphere for the synth. I also use East West Quantum Leap for realistic violins. After that it's just a matter of mixing and mastering
#12
Quote by TommyGunUk
Yo dude,

The general atmosphere (heh) of the song is pretty cool. Its very quirky, I like it. I dunno if I entirely agree with the concept of quieter solos and guitar to make it sound more atmospheric, if I didnt know you did it on purpose I would say the mix needs work, but as you have done it for effect I reckon the mix is pretty well balanced. The changing time signatures/pulse sound cool. Theyre not predictable, but nor are they completely batty and random. The piece has a nice feeling of roundness too, you recycled some material at the end and it gives the piece a complete feeling. If I were you I would do that a little more; manipulating an idea, for example the beginning piano line, is the heart of composition. Or at least in a Western art sense :p

C4C? https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1677368


thank you very much for the thorough analysis haha! Yeah, I can totally understand why you would think it's badly mixed and kinda dull variety-wise, I worked with the piece for weeks, so I don't hear it as it actually is, so I really appreciate all the feedback I got from you guys. I will seriously take it in consideration next time I'm composing!

And of course; I'll check it out!
#13
Wow! This is a really awesome piece. Some very interesting rhythms going on in places and really cool mix of styles too. The bass and piano work around 3min was really enjoyable and had a kinda jazzy sort of feel to it.

I wish had some useful crit but theres nothing I can find to offer. Given what you said you were trying to achieve - it just works.

If you like to C4C - heres my (far less impressive) work - https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1677842

Cheers
#14
Quote by RabidBadger
Wow! This is a really awesome piece. Some very interesting rhythms going on in places and really cool mix of styles too. The bass and piano work around 3min was really enjoyable and had a kinda jazzy sort of feel to it.

I wish had some useful crit but theres nothing I can find to offer. Given what you said you were trying to achieve - it just works.

If you like to C4C - heres my (far less impressive) work - https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1677842

Cheers


Thank you very much; that seriously means a lot. And yeah, that jazzy feel was exactly what I was going for there

I'll check it out!
#15
Thanks for the critique man, love the piano and strings interplay, it's very beautiful, the sound of the guitar and drums entering are really cool, I really enjoy the fills at the end with the tremolo guitar, did you use a killswitch for that? I think it would sound really good with vocals added. The bass is really punchy. I was blown away at 2:03 where the whole ensemble comes together. I love the call and response/dual solo.
Overall great track man, I look forward to hearing more from you
#16
Quote by Poisonouspot
Thanks for the critique man, love the piano and strings interplay, it's very beautiful, the sound of the guitar and drums entering are really cool, I really enjoy the fills at the end with the tremolo guitar, did you use a killswitch for that? I think it would sound really good with vocals added. The bass is really punchy. I was blown away at 2:03 where the whole ensemble comes together. I love the call and response/dual solo.
Overall great track man, I look forward to hearing more from you


Nah, I just tremolopicked that part haha! Yeah, I would love to get a vocalist sometime, but that's not in the picture as of now unfortunately. I want a vocalist that does raspy clean vocals with some grunts in there

Thanks man! Likewise!
#17
Oh, and by the way; is it allowed to post tracks without guitars on this forum, or is it a guitar-only type of deal? Because I have a prelude to this EP that only consists of piano (and the same ensemble).
#18
Quote by DENTS
Oh, and by the way; is it allowed to post tracks without guitars on this forum, or is it a guitar-only type of deal? Because I have a prelude to this EP that only consists of piano (and the same ensemble).


shoulld be alright
#19
okay, thanks! posted it
Last edited by DENTS at Jun 3, 2015,