#1
I've tried various settings on my Ibanez tbx150h. cranked highs, mids, lows, etc. turned up the gain etc. but I can't get the high 3 strings to sound "metal" (like metallica or avenged sevenfold etc.) I know generally you'd have to hear it but every time I play guitar I tend to do riffs that are bluesy and I can't shake it. do I need more effects? I have learned suite a few songs and it sounds close to them but it just feels like the sound is missing something. would a overdrive pedal like a Ibanez tube screamer help? my sound almost sounds heavy but not gritty. btw the amp can have Tons of gain but that just thins out the sound and I want a rich tone that's aggressive and crunchy so I generally don't pump gain too high. I just need suggestions on any type of pedal that might help thanks
#2
I know with my Marshall DSL if it sounds a bit thin I just have to turn the volume up to get the tubes working but I don't know if an SS amp will make any difference by adjusting the volume for the purpose of fattening the tone up.
#3
maybe. personally I think it's missing distortion. it has gain and control over frequencies and overdrive but the distortion on the amp just doesn't cut it for me which might be the problem right?
#4
Quote by ratsrelow
every time I play guitar I tend to do riffs that are bluesy and I can't shake it

Sounds like you need to expand your riff library and learn some other styles of music.
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#5
buy a new amp.


no, seriously.

Bad amps sound bad. You should get a good amp, I hear they sound pretty good


If you can't help but play blues licks try learning some songs via tab or ear and try to pick up on some new licks.


and for the love of god don't listen to kirk hammett for inspiration.


solid states don't usually take pedals well btw, a tube screamer will more than likely sound terrible.
#6
You say you need distortion and that you amp can have tons of gain but that you don't turn the gain up...do you see the problem. Try turning up the gain and playing with the amps EQ to thicken things up or get a better amp or a 'metal pedal' as a cheaper solution.

Also tone is in your fingers, you can have a messa dual rec gained out and still sound bluesy if that is the way you playing. To me it sounds like the biggest issue is your technique, get that working for you before you start switching out your gear or you will keep having the same problem.
#7
^"metal pedals" pretty much suck

look at getting a better amp and learning different styles of playing
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#8
If it sounds bluesy it' because you are playing blues scales and chord progressions. No amount of gain is going to change the intervals between your notes and chords.

You need to learn more theory. Try Pentatonic scales and learn your modes. Techniques like pinch harmonics, palm muting appropriately will help you sound more metal.
#9
Quote by N1ghtmar3C1n3ma
If it sounds bluesy it' because you are playing blues scales and chord progressions. No amount of gain is going to change the intervals between your notes and chords.

You need to learn more theory. Try Pentatonic scales and learn your modes. Techniques like pinch harmonics, palm muting appropriately will help you sound more metal.


this is it pretty much. just piling on distortion won't make it sound metal or like the bands you mentioned. things like palm muting and some scales that aren't pentatonic will help.

you are using power chords right?
#10
Quote by Robbgnarly

look at getting a better amp and learning different styles of playing


+1

(not necessarily in that order )
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#11
i do the Palm muting, I do the harmonics, I can play songs by other artists. the amp itself is quite powerful and why pump tons of gain that ruins the thickness of the sound? it's not a bad amp even though it was 200$ . it's a great solid state and I know it's not my fingers cause I played through effects at a Sam ash and it made a whole world difference on my soloing. it's confusing really because the amp I pit the effects through was a Marshall (smallest one they make) and it worked pretty well. I really just think it has something to do with effects. I just don't know which one to put through that'll provide a thick sound with a sinister sounding solo. I've looked at mxr fullbore (I think it'd be too heavy I'm not looking for a slipknot style) the tube screamer I'm not sure will help . I've looked at krank distortion as my biggest candidate. but that's all I can really think of
#12
also I know some blues licks go hand in hand with metal. some arpeggios and whatnot so I don't think it's a totally bad thing I just think it's the SOUND
#13
And the reason randall and all the other amps sound the way they do is cause they have a prebuilt distortion. some amps have good distortion others don't. it all depends on what you buy.
#14
What amp do you have? Also a tube screamer will help, there is a reason it is the go to drive pedal.

Also high gain amps don't have a built in distortion, they are just high gain amps which drives the tubes harder so they start clipping and breaking up.

Effects won't instantly make you sound more metal.
If you can't crank the gain on your amp to get the desired level of distortion without it turning to shit, trying to brute force it with a solid state metal pedal into a solid state amp won't make it sound any better, probably it will sound worse.
#15
Gonna go ahead and say I get some fairly ballsy metal tones out of my Behringer Vintager 60 AC112 (NOT a metal amp by any means, and it sounds pretty rough when cranked, but it's nice to practice with at home.) by putting my ElectroHarmonix Metal Muff With Top Boost infront of it. I plan on moving away from that when I eventually can find a band that suits me and start playing out of course, but until then, it'll work just fine.
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#16
Quote by N1ghtmar3C1n3ma
What amp do you have? Also a tube screamer will help, there is a reason it is the go to drive pedal.

Also high gain amps don't have a built in distortion, they are just high gain amps which drives the tubes harder so they start clipping and breaking up.

Effects won't instantly make you sound more metal.
If you can't crank the gain on your amp to get the desired level of distortion without it turning to shit, trying to brute force it with a solid state metal pedal into a solid state amp won't make it sound any better, probably it will sound worse.


Also. The kind of distortion pedal you would want in order to not just shove volume into it, would be something that's a "Distortion" not a "Boost". Like most people use an Ibanez TS9 Tube Screamer just for the great boost it gives you combined with a bit of mid boost as well for soloing and such. Where as a "metal pedal" will clip and break up your sound by itself.
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Quote by dannyalcatraz
Style is in the hands. Taste is in the hands. But tone? Tone is in the gear.
#17
my amp is solid state 150 watts. I'm not trying to boost the sound it's got a nice sound like I said before it's just missing that meanness that I think distortion gives it. mistake me if I'm wrong but distortions make their own distinct sound and the tube screamer is great for what it does but I'm not so sure that's what I need it's a drive and my amp has that drive it's just not distorted though. it's straight gain and the overdrive works as a volume boost and thickens it up more
#18
If you can not get the sound you want out of your amp, time for a new amp. It really is that easy if you can already play the licks you say you can
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#19
OP, your TBX ****ing slays. You don't need a new one. Especially for metal.
I'd just type in to google how you can make more metally solos/riffs.

My soloing also sounds a tad bluesy and I think that shit's badass. Perhaps try to expand it more BTW?
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Last edited by Fryderyczek at Jun 13, 2015,
#20
the tbx is badass. I never get to open it up either I can only jeep it at like 1 is that why? I also use a esp ltd m330rfm which it's pickups are a bit lighter (comparable to emg60-60) also I just got this amp. nothing is WRONG with it. the TONE is PHENOMENAL but it's just missing a certain distortion I need. I didn't say the blues stuff isn't badass but it's not coming out through the metal sound. it's hard to explain over this without showing you but I know what I'm looking for I just don't know how to exactly get it.
#21
And also I never said it wasn't powerful. it's just missing an esque towards the high notes. and the low notes are pretty good but it's still not exactly what a I want
#22
Quote by ratsrelow
the tbx is badass. I never get to open it up either I can only jeep it at like 1 is that why? I also use a esp ltd m330rfm which it's pickups are a bit lighter (comparable to emg60-60) also I just got this amp. nothing is WRONG with it. the TONE is PHENOMENAL but it's just missing a certain distortion I need. I didn't say the blues stuff isn't badass but it's not coming out through the metal sound. it's hard to explain over this without showing you but I know what I'm looking for I just don't know how to exactly get it.

Try an overdrive. The SS amps+overdrive=shit is bullshit.
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#23
Quote by ratsrelow
I've tried various settings on my Ibanez tbx150h. cranked highs, mids, lows, etc. turned up the gain etc. but I can't get the high 3 strings to sound "metal" (like metallica or avenged sevenfold etc.) I know generally you'd have to hear it but every time I play guitar I tend to do riffs that are bluesy and I can't shake it.


Pedals (and amps) don't dictate style.

Develop the style. Build the gear around the style.
#24
I know it's bullshit cause syn used a Marshall ss amp And ran pedals through it during the nightmare age (which is sorta the tone I was looking for). I can't seem to find a Krank distortus maximus though. what's the most similar pedal to it? and I know I don't need an overdrive cause the prebuilt overdrive already oomphs the sound but it's missing the distortion I want and the dirty channel is nice but it doesn't sound like I want either.
#26
well I've done various settings but I mainly set the mid frequency (bottom knob at max) treble around 7 o clock. bass at 5 or 6 gain at about 6 or 7 and the actual mids around 7-8 with the hue knob at max
#27
I try to get a nice crunch so highs are generally a bit higher but I never forget about the bass and the mids cause I don't want a scooped sound. I want a full badass tone.
#28
It sounds like you have your amp EQ'ed to boost the high mids, which is kind of a sweet spot for vintage-voiced (eg blues) amps.

A more typical metal-style EQ tends to be mid-scooped: something like bass and treble both at 7 out of 10 and mids at 3 or 4 out of 10.
#29
Quote by TS
every time I play guitar I tend to do riffs that are bluesy and I can't shake it
.

Why are we still talking about your gear? Your gear is fine. Hell, you can make a nylon couie sound heavy if you play it right. I'd respectfully encourage you to resist using gear to compensate for underdeveloped musicianship.
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#30
Quote by Fryderyczek
Try an overdrive. The SS amps+overdrive=shit is bullshit.


all an overdrive used as a boost into a solid state amp does is make the signal louder it doesn't have the same effect as boosting a tube amp. when you turn up a SS amp to band levels and try an overdrive chances are it will sound like crap.
#31
^ I'm not sure. It often doesn't work as well, I'd agree, but it should do more or less the same thing, all the same. it's a long while since i've used pedals with an SS amp, but I know (solid state) distortion pedals, when hit up-front with an od pedal set up to boost, certainly distort more (in much the same way a tube amp would). I'm guessing SS amps should be similar, since their OD channels are normally similar to distortion pedals (I think).
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
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#32
Quote by Dave_Mc
^ I'm not sure. It often doesn't work as well, I'd agree, but it should do more or less the same thing, all the same. it's a long while since i've used pedals with an SS amp, but I know (solid state) distortion pedals, when hit up-front with an od pedal set up to boost, certainly distort more (in much the same way a tube amp would). I'm guessing SS amps should be similar, since their OD channels are normally similar to distortion pedals (I think).


well i have given it a try on a few SS amsp with varying results. none of the amps gave results anywhere near as good as a tube amp. often i just got a muddy tone that was yes more distorted but not in a really good way. you have to be careful when stacking pedals as the results can be mush as well. guess what i;m getting at is that while you may get acceptable results using an ovdrdrive in front of a SS amp that's going to be about it acceptable. personally i'd be way more likely to suggest getting one fo the better distortion pedals and running the amp clean. modellers are a whole different ball game.
#33
Quote by kindadumb
It sounds like you have your amp EQ'ed to boost the high mids, which is kind of a sweet spot for vintage-voiced (eg blues) amps.

A more typical metal-style EQ tends to be mid-scooped: something like bass and treble both at 7 out of 10 and mids at 3 or 4 out of 10.

Depends on what kind of metal sound you're after. Plenty of mids + some treble works great for a more modern, maybe even "djenty" kind of tone, which in my opinion sounds ****ing heavy, just totally different than an '80s/'90s thrash/death metal tone. Personally I run low 5, mid 10, high 8. And it sounds quite massive.

Either way, I agree with what some people have said: tone and gear is one thing of course, but heaviness and metal sound definitely begins at what and how you're actually playing. You can literally sound brutal on an acoustic (I tried playing "Deliverance" by Opeth on acoustic, and trust me, it can sound intimidating. ), but then if you have any kind of distortion, then of course you won't be able to sound like any band you like any moment, but it should definitely allow you to sound heavy.

Still, if you're convinced it's actually the tone and not your playing that's the issue then well, I guess you could try looking for a new amp, as it has a huge impact on tone and its character.
Last edited by TheLiberation at Jun 14, 2015,
#34
Quote by Danustar
.

Why are we still talking about your gear? Your gear is fine. Hell, you can make a nylon couie sound heavy if you play it right. I'd respectfully encourage you to resist using gear to compensate for underdeveloped musicianship.



This, 100%. It seems pretty obvious that your playing is the culprit. Try one of the following, and it should help narrow down the source of your unwanted, bluesy tone:

1. Unplug your guitar from the amp and play. Does it still sound bluesy? Then it's your playing.

2. Plug into your amp, with your current settings. Instead of playing something off-the-cuff, play a lick from Slayer, or Dying Fetus, or whatever metal lick you're capable of playing. Does it still sound bluesy?
#35
Quote by TheLiberation
Depends on what kind of metal sound you're after. Plenty of mids + some treble works great for a more modern, maybe even "djenty" kind of tone, which in my opinion sounds ****ing heavy, just totally different than an '80s/'90s thrash/death metal tone. Personally I run low 5, mid 10, high 8. And it sounds quite massive.

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#36
Ummm, depends. Do you also have a thing for Hawaii pizza and growling "The Baying of The Hounds" in the shower?
#37
Quote by TheLiberation
Ummm, depends. Do you also have a thing for Hawaii pizza and growling "The Baying of The Hounds" in the shower?

OH, right. Ok, no.
What amp do you have?
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Fly on, fly on
#38
well TS hasn't posted in a while, I think he was expecting different answers than he ended up getting.
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#39
I used to have one of the funky new silver Tubescreamers and an MXR 10-band for my Bugera. I used the TS pre-gain and the EQ in the loop. When the TS died I started using the 10 band pre-gain and it's not the best (it's pretty microphonic too, can feedback all by itself) but it works. I've used it with a Line 6 Uber Metal pedal and a Pocket POD effectively.

I set the sliders about like how a TS9/808/820 etc might color the tone: 1k a little over +6, 2k a little below +6, the sliders above that don't make much difference, 500k near center, +/-3 (varies per guitar), 250 and below very near the bottom. With a tube amp the signal strength right into the amp can make a significant difference to the feel, into anything solid state, not so much.

Boosting the mids will make the feeling of their presence in the attack "crunchified" (think djent). Single notes and especially chords. If you then turn down the mids on your amp you can achieve a more open sound without losing the punch in your mids. At the same time with the reduced bass you'll have less flub, so with half the gain or less on the low frequencies, they will come through almost clean, very audible without being overbearing. Your amps bass control should become more sensitive.

That said an Ibanez overdrive might work well with your amp. I like to set my amp first, to approximately the same overall voicing as I want in the end (scooped-ish mids), gain high enough that the flub is unbearable but not eternal, then kick on the overdrive. Drive all the way down, tone maxed, level maxed. Tweak everything. I have a Kustom 16 watt solid state that takes the EQ boost quite well. You also might want to try starting with your tone knobs all the way down and slowly bringing them up one at a time to see what's happening where. My Bugera 6262 gets thin sounding with the knobs all high. With every knob around 2 it sounds enormous.
Last edited by mosquitohater93 at Jun 19, 2015,