#1
in small combo or tube head amps ?


If they don't even bother to implement built in reverb/delay, at the least they could do is give you a loop so you can use your own?

Cost effectiveness surely can't be the major issue right ? It should not add much cost to the amp itself.

It's ok not to have any effects on the tiny tube heads but at least give users an option to use their own.

If we're forced to use delay/reverb in the front, then we can't crank the amp and yet get proper reverb/delay from the front.

Is this some sort of culture, where if you want the loop, you gotta buy their higher end gears?
#2
Because they take up a lot of room and they're hard to fit into smaller amps.
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#3
Quote by Eppicurt
Because they take up a lot of room and they're hard to fit into smaller amps.



No way...

#4
Quote by sfx

.....Is this some sort of culture, where if you want the loop, you gotta buy their higher end gears?


He shoots, he scores.

While component cost, and complexity of build, will increase the production cost marginally no manufacturer with a range of amplifiers is going to give you all the features on a base model as you would have no incentive to buy their higher end products.
Please note: The above comments are based on my experience, and may represent my perception of that experience. This may not be accurate and, subject to the style of music you play, may be irrelevant or wrong.
#5
Quote by John Sims
He shoots, he scores.

While component cost, and complexity of build, will increase the production cost marginally no manufacturer with a range of amplifiers is going to give you all the features on a base model as you would have no incentive to buy their higher end products.
%50 of the reason why I bought an AC30 instead of a 15.
#6
Quote by John Sims
He shoots, he scores.

While component cost, and complexity of build, will increase the production cost marginally no manufacturer with a range of amplifiers is going to give you all the features on a base model as you would have no incentive to buy their higher end products.

On the other hand, there's the question of competition, which generally means that if you can fit more cool stuff onto your gear for an insignificantly higher cost, that means your gear is better than the competition's and people have an incentive to buy yours, not theirs.

I don't think this works as an explanation, unless you're Gibson or some similar company which makes 90% of its profit off brand name and history rather than actual quality (and so you have plenty of poorly informed clients who will probably buy your products over the competition's even if you make them out of paper).
#7
Quote by sfx

Cost effectiveness surely can't be the major issue right ? It should not add much cost to the amp itself.
Is this some sort of culture, where if you want the loop, you gotta buy their higher end gears?


Cost-cutting at the low end can make a big difference to overall profit on those amps.
FWIW, an amp's selling price is 6-10X what the company's cost is to produce it. Fender, which is traditionally about 10X, has actually held parties to celebrate a $1 cost reduction.

Add-ons like FX loops DO require more labor and materials (and design changes) and are marketing department "bullet points" to help get the buyer to move up to a more expensive version of the amp.

When the 5W Epiphone Valve Jr arrived, the $99 price tag flabbergasted everyone. "A real tube amp for under $100?" It started the whole "lunchbox" amp movement. It has a volume knob, period. Its simplicity was the key to the price, and of course a whole movement sprang up around modifications and add-ons (like FX loops). These days we have the same 5W amplifier, but we're willing to pay $500 to have the bits and pieces of a standard amplifier tacked on.
#8
Quote by dspellman
Fender, which is traditionally about 10X, has actually held parties to celebrate a $1 cost reduction.


Which year was that?
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#9
FX loops can also add a lot of noise to the circuit if not done properly.

If your $250 lunch box amp is now all of the sudden $375 because it has a buffered series/parallel effects loop then it jumps into a higher bracket of amps and out of the reach of some who it may have been designed to sell too.


(PS: I kind of made that up but it sure sounds good)
#10
Quote by John Sims
He shoots, he scores.

While component cost, and complexity of build, will increase the production cost marginally no manufacturer with a range of amplifiers is going to give you all the features on a base model as you would have no incentive to buy their higher end products.

Not completely true. Amps like the Orange AD30 and OR50 don't have FX loops even though they're higher end in the Orange range. The OR15 even has an FX loop. The Vox AC30HW doesn't have reverb, an FX loop, or tremolo but the AC30C has all of those. The Evil Robot C30 had an FX loop and a master volume but the handwired American version didn't.

There are very few transparent reverb and FX loop circuits. Many players end up preferring the tone of the amp when the FX loop or reverb is hard bypassed if that option is given to them. But only a small portion of amps offer that. Designers are making compromises with everything they add or remove. If they think the amp sounds better without reverb and an FX loop, they might not put them in. It really depends on who the amp is marketed toward though. Some amps try to sell you on tone and some try to sell you on features. And then you have to factor in price. But in cheaper amps like DSLs, it's often so you buy the more expensive version.