#1
Hey,

I was wondering if anyone could point out why the distortion pedal sounds muddy and garbled and overall crappy on my Rogue CG30R Combo Amp. Honestly, nobody else seems to have this problem but me. No matter how hard I try, no matter how many knobs I turn, i've tried every combination but it still sounds the same-muddy and garbled.

Please help...
#2
It's probably because that amp is horrible and the pedal isn't exactly a winner either.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#4
I'm guessing that the Rogue is a solid state amp.
With a few exceptions, solid state don't take dirt pedals very well.
And the Boss MD-2 isn't exactly a good pedal either.
Boss is not known for good distortion pedals.
They make some great Overdrive and Modulation type pedals, but for distortion, they kinda suck.
#5
yeah it's not the best pedal, and plugging it into an ss amp isn't helping, either.

that being said, you should be able to get some decent tones out of it. keep the bottom knob below 12 o'clock if you don't want it to be muddy, for example. keep the tone knob below 12 o'clock as well (it's sort of voiced a little like a ds1). you also don't necessarily need to have the gain boost and distortion on both at once- having both on at once will muddy things up, try turning off the gain boost completely and just using the distortion knob, when you do that it sounds more or less like a ds1.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#6
Quote by CodeMonk
With a few exceptions, solid state don't take dirt pedals very well.

OK, honestly, ok with everything said in this thread, but... where the **** do you get stuff like this from?

There is no reason in the entire universe why a regular solid state amp would cooperate with distortion pedals worse than tube, and they're even easier to setup because the additional input from the pedal doesn't drive the amp in itself, unlike in tubes.

How good the pedal will actually sound depends on the general quality on the amp, but saying solid state amps work bad with distortion pedals in general makes just as much sense as claiming they don't work well with active pickups for whatever mystical reason.
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
There's no point in trying to convince a moron.
#7
Quote by TheLiberation
OK, honestly, ok with everything said in this thread, but... where the **** do you get stuff like this from?

There is no reason in the entire universe why a regular solid state amp would cooperate with distortion pedals worse than tube, and they're even easier to setup because the additional input from the pedal doesn't drive the amp in itself, unlike in tubes.

How good the pedal will actually sound depends on the general quality on the amp, but saying solid state amps work bad with distortion pedals in general makes just as much sense as claiming they don't work well with active pickups for whatever mystical reason.



In my experience, SS amps don't take distortion well consistantly. At the very least, distortion and overdrive pedals sound better with tube amps.

In a tube amp, the distortion/OD pedal is used to push the tubes to clip. Transistor amps don't clip quite the same way that tubes do. This is where the difference comes in.

Don't get me wrong, a distortion/OD pedal will work with a SS amp, and in many cases, they will sound good together. All I'm saying is that in my experience, they work better with tube amps.


As to the question at hand, I was never a fan of that pedal, and I don't know anything about the amp. Maybe try turning down the level or distortion knob on the pedal and see if it cleans it up a bit?
-Andrew H
band: syncopated groove punch
Last edited by fagelamusgtr at Aug 23, 2015,
#8
Quote by TheLiberation
OK, honestly, ok with everything said in this thread, but... where the **** do you get stuff like this from?

There is no reason in the entire universe why a regular solid state amp would cooperate with distortion pedals worse than tube, and they're even easier to setup because the additional input from the pedal doesn't drive the amp in itself, unlike in tubes.

How good the pedal will actually sound depends on the general quality on the amp, but saying solid state amps work bad with distortion pedals in general makes just as much sense as claiming they don't work well with active pickups for whatever mystical reason.

I get "stuff like this" from experience.
And I didn't say all, I said "With a few exceptions", meaning some SS amps deal with dirt pedals better than others.
IMO, the Vox Valvetronix and Peavey Vypyr (both modelers) seem to take dirt pedals fairly well.
The Marshall MOSFET Lead 100 takes dirt pedals fairly well too.
Some others, not so much.

There is no reason in the entire universe why a regular solid state amp would cooperate with distortion pedals worse than tube, and they're even easier to setup because the additional input from the pedal doesn't drive the amp in itself, unlike in tubes.

Yes there is.
Its called clipping.
Tubes clip differently than solid state components.
Last edited by CodeMonk at Aug 23, 2015,
#9
Quote by thejakestergamingofficial
Hey,

The distortion pedal sounds muddy and garbled and overall crappy on my Rogue CG30R Combo Amp.

You just described what the MD-2 sounds like in front of a shitty SS amp.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#10
Quote by thejakestergamingofficial
Hey,

I was wondering if anyone could point out why the distortion pedal sounds muddy and garbled and overall crappy on my Rogue CG30R Combo Amp. Honestly, nobody else seems to have this problem but me. No matter how hard I try, no matter how many knobs I turn, i've tried every combination but it still sounds the same-muddy and garbled.

Please help...

Are you engaging the pedal thro the amps clean channel?
#11
Quote by smittyanthrax
Are you engaging the pedal thro the amps clean channel?


good ?. i've found that most SS amps (as opposed to modellers) work reasonably well if the distortion pedal is played through a clean amp. if not then the mess the OP described is often the result.
#12
Quote by monwobobbo
good ?. i've found that most SS amps (as opposed to modellers) work reasonably well if the distortion pedal is played through a clean amp. if not then the mess the OP described is often the result.

Thats how i use mine and to me they sound fine.
#13
Quote by CodeMonk
I get "stuff like this" from experience.
And I didn't say all, I said "With a few exceptions", meaning some SS amps deal with dirt pedals better than others.
IMO, the Vox Valvetronix and Peavey Vypyr (both modelers) seem to take dirt pedals fairly well.
The Marshall MOSFET Lead 100 takes dirt pedals fairly well too.
Some others, not so much.


Yes there is.
Its called clipping.
Tubes clip differently than solid state components.

Explain to me what exactly "not taking pedals well" is supposed to mean in this case then. I'm also talking from experience.

It doesn't matter how they clip. A pedal through a clean channel will sound like that pedal through any amp with clean channel, just better or worse depending on the general quality of the amp. It won't magically create rainbows and give you a hug from sparkling unicorns just because it's a tube amp, at best it will react differently.

Either we're having some sort of misunderstanding here or I seriously don't get what you're trying to say, another one of the cases on this forum when it feels to me some people firmly believe solid state amps can't do literally anything else other than making fizzy noises and exploding.
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
There's no point in trying to convince a moron.
#14
Quote by TheLiberation
Explain to me what exactly "not taking pedals well" is supposed to mean in this case then. I'm also talking from experience.

It doesn't matter how they clip. A pedal through a clean channel will sound like that pedal through any amp with clean channel, just better or worse depending on the general quality of the amp. It won't magically create rainbows and give you a hug from sparkling unicorns just because it's a tube amp, at best it will react differently.

Either we're having some sort of misunderstanding here or I seriously don't get what you're trying to say, another one of the cases on this forum when it feels to me some people firmly believe solid state amps can't do literally anything else other than making fizzy noises and exploding.

It absolutely matters how they clip.
If you have ANY amp set to clean, and push it into clipping, SS clips differently than tubes.
This is generally how most people set dirt pedals, particularly Overdrives, to do.
SS is considered to be harsher, which in some cases, may be what you are looking for. This is what I meant when I say that SS amps don't take DIRT pedals well.
And some SS amps do handle clipping better than others. See my amps named above that I have either previously owned or currently own of which I am well aware of how they sound when they clip.
The problem with most SS amps is they low budget/price/quality and are aimed at beginners. And the fact that many of these low budget SS amps also have 6, 8, or 10 inch speakers certainly don't help them. Thats probably where some of the "fizzy" stuff comes from.
There are higher end SS amps (Roland JC120 Jazz Chorus and the aforementioned Marshall MOSFET Lead 100 come to mind), that do clipping better than most other SS amps, But those are higher quality SS amps.
And low end SS amps outnumber high end SS amps by a very wide margin.


And in case you are getting confused, I am only talking about DIRT pedals (Overdrive, Distortion, Fuzz, and the like).
Modulation or other types of NON-DIRT pedals (Delay, Chorus, Flange, Phase, etc.) are pretty much equal no matter if the amp is tube or SS. The difference there comes done to amp sound quality more than anything else.
If its a crappy sounding amp, its gonna sound just as crappy with a $50 delay pedal as it does with a $1000 delay pedal.

And I've been at all this (both guitars and electronics) since 1981, so my experience encompasses hundreds of amps and thousands of pedals over the years.
Many of those pedals I have built myself. That's what my experience entails.
And cheap components tend to make for crappy sounding SS amps as they do for crappy sounding pedals.

And either way, the pedal in the OP, I think sounds like crap.
And that's through a Vox AC30.
I also don't particularly care for the Boss DS-1 (even a Keeley modded one) through my amp.
Tubescreamers are just OK, IMO there.
Some pedals, can sound great through some amps, and crap through others.
Quality of amp has little to do with that.
Amp voice has everything to do with that.
For the record, Fulltone Fulldrive 2 MOSFET is my personal favorite OD with my AC30.
Last edited by CodeMonk at Aug 24, 2015,
#15
Quote by TheLiberation
Explain to me what exactly "not taking pedals well" is supposed to mean in this case then. I'm also talking from experience.

It doesn't matter how they clip. A pedal through a clean channel will sound like that pedal through any amp with clean channel, just better or worse depending on the general quality of the amp. It won't magically create rainbows and give you a hug from sparkling unicorns just because it's a tube amp, at best it will react differently.

Either we're having some sort of misunderstanding here or I seriously don't get what you're trying to say, another one of the cases on this forum when it feels to me some people firmly believe solid state amps can't do literally anything else other than making fizzy noises and exploding.


Yes, that "it will react differently" is the "not take pedals well" that's under discussion.

You seem to have the misconception that people like tube amps because they are tube, but that's simply not the case. They are liked, and in many cases preferred, because under the circumstances as described as well as many others, they simply sound better. ("Better" of course being subjective, but weight of evidence tends to suggest there's a strong consensus...)

I think what you're trying to say is that a given signal through one clean channel is that same as another clean channel, regardless of how the clean channel is generated, and that's true...up to a point.

Because the pedals not only create internal distortion, they also (depending on settings) hit the front end harder, which can drive the amplifier preamp into distortion as well. That interaction, which can be as subtle or as aggressive as the settings allow, often sounds like hammered shit with a SS amp, but can be exceptional with a tube amp.

That's why amplifier design and components matter. If it weren't that way it would be simpler just to run your pedalboard into a good clean SS power amp and be done with it.

So you're right in that if you aren't pushing the preamp into distortion, the pedal will sound materially similar (although not identical) through a given clean channel, it's just that that is rarely the case.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#16
So far the clean channels on all solid state amps I have tried have been consistently sterile. Too clean so to speak. Add a thin sounding fizzbox distortion pedal and the result is just thin can of bees. But through a tube amp with generally thick and warm clean channel it kinda adds meat to the distortion pedal sound. Like the Valveking I used to have. Fantastic pedal platform.

I like a well done aggressive solid state distortion a lot, often more than tubes even (I'm death metal head, uglier and angrier the better), but I never liked the sterile cleans they have. Tubes rule for cleans to me, especially when its just at the edge of clipping when you hammer the strings hard.

ESP LTD F-50 + Tonezone
Cort EVL-Z4 + X2N
Cort EVL-K47B

Marshall Valvestate 8100
Randall RG1503
Bugera 333
Peavey Rockmaster preamp

Line6 Pod X3
#17
^And I'm the exact opposite.
I much prefer the sound of a boosted JCM800 to, say, a Marshall MOSFET (though it really depends on the type of music. I mostly play thrash, but I get where you're coming from with death metal tones)
But , for what I play, I LOVE sterile, chorus soaked, solid state cleans, like a Roland Jazz Chorus.
Though what I used would change if, say, I played country
Last edited by darkwolf291 at Aug 24, 2015,
#18
yeah what fagelamusgtr, codemonk and arby said- when you run a dirt pedal into a tube amp, you're often running it a bit higher than unity gain, plus a lot of tube amps aren't really totally clean, so you're adding a bit of tube distortion in there which tends to round off the harsh edges of solid state distortion. that doesn't happen with a solid state amp.

funnily enough, dirt pedals into (tube) blackface fender style amps (which are pretty clean) can often sound fizzy, especially if the bright switch is on. it always mystifies me a bit when people say a great clean is the foundation for a good dirt sound, because to me a great clean sound is blackface fendery, and IMO it's anything but a good foundation for a good dirt sound.
I'm an idiot and I accidentally clicked the "Remove all subscriptions" button. If it seems like I'm ignoring you, I'm not, I'm just no longer subscribed to the thread. If you quote me or do the @user thing at me, hopefully it'll notify me through my notifications and I'll get back to you.
Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?