#1
I could be delusional, but there seems to me, to be a strong tie between Gypsie and Russian music. I wonder why that seems to be the case? Also, does the Fiddler on the Roof have any basis in traditional Jewish music? I guess it could just be me but I feel like it is decidedly Russian sounding. Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance.
#2
So different types of music from the same geographical region have similarities? That's an absolutely amazing discovery that you made there.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#3
Quote by theogonia777
So different types of music from the same geographical region have similarities? That's an absolutely amazing discovery that you made there.


My bad, I hadn't intended it to come across as a "Discovery". I was trying to leave room for the possibility that the connection was self manufactured. I did intend for it to be inquisitive, not a statement.

All though I'm sure there are musical similarities, the Russian/Gypsy connection was more in reference to there frequently being published together.
#4
It's really weird. It's not like gypsies are from Russia and other Eastern European countries or anything like that. And it's not like foreign music tends to be stereotyped by Western culture, so I'm not sure why there would be any reason to group them together.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#5
I prefer "Romani"
it's all just coming back
it's all coming back

it's all coming back to me
#6
Quote by Baby Joel
I prefer "Romani"


Assuming you didn't intend it jokingly, I do apologize for the use of anything construed as offensive. It's just that in publications the songs are often entitled "Gypsy Dance" and things of that nature. Hence my use of the term.
#7
nah i'm just messing. it's a lot easier (and recognisable) to describe 'gypsy' music as, well, gypsy music. so it's no worries.

interesting op though, i'm gonna check it out as well
it's all just coming back
it's all coming back

it's all coming back to me
#8
What does it really mean.

Music through times is heavily influenced by political, cultural and religious factors. Yes they may use the same oscillations, but it's about intent and structure, the sum of it's parts.

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#9
Quote by theogonia777
It's really weird. It's not like gypsies are from Russia and other Eastern European countries or anything like that. And it's not like foreign music tends to be stereotyped by Western culture, so I'm not sure why there would be any reason to group them together.


I would mostly agree with that assessment. I have seen the same grouping by artists and such from the denominations in play.
#10
need sum proper gamelan in here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZZTfu4jWcI

I'd be interested in your opinion in whether there's any connection to our western pitch system and theirs, or would you think they are totally separate from one and another.

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#11
Quote by xxdarrenxx
What does it really mean.

Music through times is heavily influenced by political, cultural and religious factors. Yes they may use the same oscillations, but it's about intent and structure, the sum of it's parts.


That really is genuinely true. I do find the categorization helpful though, just for making it easier to find precisely what I'm looking for.
#12
Quote by 96yoda
That really is genuinely true. I do find the categorization helpful though, just for making it easier to find precisely what I'm looking for.



When one categorizes though, making leaps within rhetoric seems not the proper intent to go about, especially when you are inquisitive.

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#13
Quote by xxdarrenxx
When one categorizes though, making leaps within rhetoric seems not the proper intent to go about, especially when you are inquisitive.


Forgive my lack of understanding. But could you elaborate please.
#14
Quote by 96yoda
Forgive my lack of understanding. But could you elaborate please.



I can not.

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#15
Quote by xxdarrenxx
I can not.


Okay, with your permission, I would like to open it up to others, to continue where you left off.
#16
Quote by 96yoda
Okay, with your permission, I would like to open it up to others, to continue where you left off.


Do as you please, the flute halfway through is very soothing.

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#17
I've noticed this, too. Russian "romance" songs have been influenced by Gypsy music since the 19th century, specifically by the very dramatic way in which they are performed. There are many Russian songs that reference Gypsies and their culture.
#18
Quote by xxdarrenxx
need sum proper gamelan in here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZZTfu4jWcI

I'd be interested in your opinion in whether there's any connection to our western pitch system and theirs, or would you think they are totally separate from one and another.


It would of course depend on both the definition of "connection" and " western pitch system". Without that context however, I would say that they are more similar than different. I personally find pleasure in listening to it. Nice video.

Do you have an opinion as to which way you lean on the matter?
#19
Quote by sashki
I've noticed this, too. Russian "romance" songs have been influenced by Gypsy music since the 19th century, specifically by the very dramatic way in which they are performed. There are many Russian songs that reference Gypsies and their culture.



Also comparing western classical music to the more eastern classical music, certain composers of the time do seem to have this dramatic return within the melodies, and also in how the structure or harmony if you will seem to nuance this.

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Last edited by xxdarrenxx at Aug 28, 2015,
#20
Quote by sashki
I've noticed this, too. Russian "romance" songs have been influenced by Gypsy music since the 19th century, specifically by the very dramatic way in which they are performed. There are many Russian songs that reference Gypsies and their culture.


Enlightening fact sashki. I have no concept of the lyrical content of... well, really any non English music.
#21
I'm sorry I can't provide more detail about the history, but there's definitely an influence there. Here's a popular song which I think has the main elements of the gypsy influence: use of harmonic minor, free time, variable tempo, lyrics about being hopelessly in love. The chord progression is common in Russian music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJuQQsTvx_k
#22
I remember listening to an old Russian(well, Ukranian) record where a somewhat famous Jewish Ukrainian singer started explaining how Jazz came to be in Odessa in the early 19th century by Klezmer musicians and not in New Orleans in the late 19th. Then he began to play a Ukrainian Klezmer standard, after that he played When the Saint Go Marching In and pointed out how similar the two are, claiming that some Jew immigrated to New Orleans and somehow introduced Klezmer music into jazz.


Also, note how Russian gypsies all used a 7 string acoustic guitar, which was later adopted by most Russian acoustic guitarists.
Purple string dampener scrunchy.
Last edited by Guitar0player at Aug 28, 2015,