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#1
Hi, I'd really appreciate an opinion here. I'm currently running a Peavey 6505 +112, but I can't even get all the tubes kicking in at bedroom volumes, and it's a bit big to carry around. Better cleans would be good too.

I'm after something more portable, preferably a lunchbox head and 1x12, but I'm not married to that idea; I could go for a regular head and cab or a smaller combo. I also want it to sound better at bedroom volumes while still being giggable, so a power soak would be good. The channels should be controllable by footswitch and an effects loop for my delay is essential.

I play everything from melo-death and doom to shreddy power metal and alternative-gothic, so there's quite a range to cover. It needs to be able to do pretty brutal rhythm as-well as sustainy soulful leads.

I use a Wylde Wah, NS-2, DD-3, GE-7 and G Screamer boost.

I'm hoping to be able to mostly fund the new setup by selling my 6505. I'm hoping to get around £250 for it, and I don't mind putting up to £100 with it, so upper budget is £350. Any response is really appreciated. Oh, and I'd be buying used.

Many thanks
#2
What about a Dark Terror? I notice Syu uses the Rockerverb so it should be fine for that sort of lead tone as I was after, and I hear Orange suggested a lot for doom metal. It has an effects loop and a 7/15 Watt switch, I could live without the second channel. Would it achieve the same level of distortion as the 6505 with a boost for extreme metal though? I tend to keep the gain at 7 on the 6505, never any higher, but that's a lot.

I could probably stretch the budget for a Dual Terror, but I think the Dark Terror is voiced specifically for metal and would have a better distortion, etcetera. What about cabs?

The Blackstar HT-5 series is just within my budget, but I don't think they're quite as good as the 6505. The Ironheart is quite good, but not very compact.
Last edited by dragonzrmetal at Oct 24, 2015,
#3
If you don't like the 6505 then sell it

Try to get about 250-300 for it.

Then you have about 350-400 and that's a decent budget for a small valve head and a 1x12.

I'd get a Jet City 22HDM or whatever it's called(the higher gain one) and a Harley benton vintage 1x12. It's open back so something like putting it up against a wall or even hammering on some planks would do the job I think.

Then an OD and you're set.
Maybe a Bad Monkey if you're on the cheap.
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Last edited by Fryderyczek at Oct 24, 2015,
#4
Or you could simply upgrade the speaker to a V30 and the tubes to JJ. If you want better cleans, try a 12DY7 in V2.
As for the weight, buy a trolley/dolly/handcart.
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#5
Replacing the speaker with a V30 improves the tone of the amp dramatically, if you haven't already done that.
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#7
Thanks for the responses so far, but the suggestions as to do with the Peavey 6505 are missing one important thing:
"sound better at bedroom volumes while still being giggable"

The 60 watts is just too big, the 6505 has to go. I'm having to play it below one. Anyway, I'm too worried about resale value to hack it apart into a head, nor do I have the time to muck about building amp enclosures.

It isn't just weight either, it lives upstairs with me, and it's too big to lug up and down stairs every time I want to take it somewhere, and between narrow corridors in rehearsal studios.

Thanks for the Jet City suggestion, I hadn't considered that. I'll take a look. And any opinions on the Blackstar/ Orange amps I suggested?
#9
How about a small rack setup - Engl E530 Preamp with a Crown (or whatever) solid state power amp? Pair that up with a 112 speaker enclosure and you're set.

Also, the 6505+ is normally regarded as on if the better sounding amps at low volumes.

Perhaps you should want to go all digital with a POD HD500X and full range monitor speakers.
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Amps:
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Peavey Vypyr 30
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TOOOO many T.C. Electronic Pedals. . .
#10
Why not try to hunt down a used 6505 MH? Then you can switch between 20W, 5W and 1W. You might even find someone who would be interested in a trade.
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#11
Stairwalker trolleys do exist, you know?
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#12
Please stop it with the stupid smart-assed responses. Yes, I'm looking at you. I've said it's too big and too loud, I don't want a stairway walker.

I didn't know there was a mini 6505 head, thanks for the suggestion. It looks pretty brilliant for what I'm after actually, but I can't find any on the used market right now in the UK, and I can see it being hell to track one down. I'll keep an eye out, regardless.

I don't really want to go fully digital, and though I've got nothing against a rack setup, I'm not sure that's possible at this budget, and I'd rather keep things simple. I see the problems though with trying to find something to match the 6505.

I'm surprised to hear the 6505 is one of the better amps at quiet volumes. Well, I think the problem is the subjectivity of quiet volumes. It sounds great at 1 when presumably most amps don't, but that's often too loud for my purposes. At less than 1, the power tubes don't seem to kick in properly, and it just sounds fizzy.

I'm going to go try a boosted Tubemeister 18 on Wednesday and see how that goes, maybe try a few Blackstars and anything else that looks like a possibility.
#13
Suggesting ways to make what you have work for you is being a smartass?
I'm sorry but you are talking bout sacrificing your on stage tone so it sounds better when you're playing with yourself - seriously? A man needs epic tone in the bedroom like mood lighting to masturbate.
A second attenuator (volume pedal/EQ) in the FX loop will help your low volume sound, although why that actually matters escapes me TBH.
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Marshall 18W clone
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#14
Because I'm playing in my bedroom 99% of the time is why my low volume sound matters, and some sacrifice in on stage tone can therefore be justified. I'm just a 16 y o hobbyist, some small gigs would just be a future thing.

So like I've said, the 6505 as it is really won't work. I don't have bucketfulls of cash to spend so that I have an amp for home, and an amp for practise, and an amp for stage. I need one good amp that I can take everywhere. Yes, compromises will be made, but getting a guitar case through my teeny local rehearsal studios without bashing it on everything is hard enough, let alone a 6505 combo, it's going to get broken to pieces.

Thanks for the suggestion with the EQ, it sounds like an odd place to put it and I certainly can't afford a second unit to do that with, but I'll put my main one in the effects loop and see what happens.
#15
My gigging amp is much bigger than yours, both in dimensions, power and weight. So I own a trolley and never carry it anywhere without it. It's all about setting yourself up. What you need is a better speaker, tubes, a trolley and maybe an EQ. That should be fairly cheap, really. And it will sound far better than some cheap shitty little hybrid like you are suggesting.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
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Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
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#16
The problem you will find is that a smaller wattage amp may not sound any better at low volumes than your current amp, which is why several of the very experienced folks here have tried to offer reasonable solutions with your current gear.

If that's not what you want to hear, perhaps you asked the wrong question.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#17
I'd seriously consider just playing with amp simulations on the computer with some quality monitor headphones.

You can get a basic guitar to usb interface for about $20 or less - just do a search on Amazon.

Start with Peavey ReValver (free) and just purchase what you want.
Guitars:
Jackson Kelly KE3 - MIJ (Distortion/Jazz)
Jackson DKMGT Dinky (EMG 81/85)
ESP E-II Eclipse Custom (JB/'59)
ESP LTD EC-1001FR (EMG 81/60)
Fender MIM Strat

Amps:
Mesa/Boogie Dual Rectifier Roadster 212
Laney IronHeart IRT-Studio
Peavey Vypyr 30
Peavey ReValver Amp Sims
TOOOO many T.C. Electronic Pedals. . .
#18
Crazy suggestion but grab an used Boss Micro Br (about $60 eBay) and play with headphones.
Then use the Peavey for stage work and when you want to crank it a touch in the bedroom. The 1x12 is not that heavy, go lift some weights and build up core strength. I used to carry full stacks to rehearsals and our bassist had an Ampeq stage rig the size of my fridge, no big deal as long as you keep exercising, just part of being a man. Kinda prepares you when you have to carry the missus through the threshold of wedding day :-) .
#19
I can get great tones out of mine at whisper volumes and through a 4 X 12 cabinet. It helps to run an OD boost and an EQ in the loop. I also EQ differently for low-volume vs. high-volume. Not sure what you're doing wrong, as it appears you have that equipment.

Obviously, I like the sound better when it's cranked -- but that has very little to do with 'power tubes being pushed' and a lot more to do with the speakers doing their thing. I would not suggest going with a smaller wattage amp if you plan to gig -- they just sound, well, smaller. Trading it in for a 6505 MH would be a downgrade as well, and you'd probably lose money on top of that because they're still so new.

As for moving the thing, as others have said, start lifting weights. It's not that heavy. A 412 cabinet loaded with Eminence Governors/Swamp Thangs is heavy...

Edit: Another thing I forgot to mention that helps a great deal with low volume tone is to get the amp up off the floor and close to head level or tip it back against the wall so the speaker is pointed up to your face. It'll sound A LOT louder to you even if it's not turned up very loud or at apartment-friendly volumes. Sometimes I find myself marveling at just how close it sounds to 'cranked' tone when you get your ear right up to the speakers at low volume. The tone is still there, for the most part -- it just won't fill a room.
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Last edited by KailM at Oct 25, 2015,
#20
I'm not running the effects loop at the moment as I'm a cable down and one cable short of having enough to use it, but I'll try and sort that as quickly as possible and try exactly as you've said. Fingers crossed, it will help.

It's still a big amp to carry round to places, and a trolley isn't an ideal solution. Shame the head is so much more expensive, or that would be the solution.
#21
Why isn't a trolley an ideal solution? You say the amp is too heavy for you to carry - well that's why trolleys were invented.
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Telecasters
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Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
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Cathbard Amplification
My band
#22
http://www.andertons.co.uk/guitar-amp-heads/pid27927/cid689/laney-iron-heart-15h-15w-valve-head.asp

Whaddya think? Has 1W mode for the whole bedroom volume thing and is just generally quite awesome. Got some brootalz metal tones for you as well. The laney ironhearts are pretty universally recognised as being sweet amps. Goes quite perfectly with the 'ol budget as well.
Last edited by sasquatchjosh96 at Oct 25, 2015,
#23
lower wattage does NOT equal better sound quiet. thats not how things work.

i would listen to cath. i would try speaker, and an EQ and OD.

if you need something quiet, look for a korg pandora or something that you can play with headphones, and just use the amp when you are going somewhere.
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#24
Quote by Arby911
The problem you will find is that a smaller wattage amp may not sound any better at low volumes than your current amp, which is why several of the very experienced folks here have tried to offer reasonable solutions with your current gear.


+1

FWIW I don't agree with cath that home tone isn't important- if that's what's important to you (it is to me too since I don't gig), that's absolutely fair enough, just a lower wattage amp isn't guaranteed to sound better at really low volumes.

Also FWIW 1W isn't most people's idea of bedroom volume, either.
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Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 26, 2015,
#25
I think the combo (Chinese) vs head (USA) has a lot to do with the price there. The combo also supposedly has a bum fx loop, someone on here posted some modifications to fix that.

We have a forumite that took out the speakers and got an extension cab instead to solve that issue. Ugly but it works, maybe you could do just that or save up for a head/cab.
#26
Quote by Cathbard
Why isn't a trolley an ideal solution? You say the amp is too heavy for you to carry - well that's why trolleys were invented.

I didn't say that, I presume you assumed that from when I said it was too big. When I said it was too big, I meant it was too big. It's likely to get damaged in small corridors and such. Though a lighter amp would be a plus. It's just inconvenient, and I have to put the trolley somewhere. Still wouldn't make it sound better quiet either. Thanks for the thought though.

The Ironheart is a possibility, I can't play one locally though to see what it's like. If I can find one I might go for that.

Why isn't a lower wattage amp going to sound better at quiet volumes? I'm 99% sure it will, I've played all sorts, the Peavey just isn't suited to play at lower volumes. My MG15CDR can go to a whisper and sound pretty much the same.
#27
Quote by dragonzrmetal

Why isn't a lower wattage amp going to sound better at quiet volumes? I'm 99% sure it will, I've played all sorts, the Peavey just isn't suited to play at lower volumes. My MG15CDR can go to a whisper and sound pretty much the same.


Then you're 99% wrong.

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/the_guide_to/killing_the_myths_of_low_volume_amp_performance.html
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#29
Quote by dragonzrmetal

Why isn't a lower wattage amp going to sound better at quiet volumes? I'm 99% sure it will, I've played all sorts, the Peavey just isn't suited to play at lower volumes. My MG15CDR can go to a whisper and sound pretty much the same.


Again, I'll say it:


User-error.


Admittedly, I'm not a fan of these new low-wattage/multi-wattage lunchbox amps. I believe the "low-wattage = better tone at low volumes" claim is a total gimmick and a myth 99% of the time. Most of these amps are high-gain designs and/or are meant to get most of their tone from the preamp circuit and actually AVOID power-tube distortion. There are a few cases where they're designed to get power-tube breakup, and in those cases I do think it's smart to lower the wattage to get that tone at *slightly* less than ear-bleeding levels.

But for high-gain metal playing, you actually don't want your power tubes to break up. That kind of distortion is loose and spongy -- not the kind you want for tight riffing and tracking. So lowering the watts on an amp like that basically just lowers the volume, which could have been accomplished with the volume knob.
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Last edited by KailM at Oct 26, 2015,
#30
Look at the Jca 22 watt head I mentioned.

You're in europe so even better.
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#31
Quote by Arby911


^This.

Also, just read the article and I think it is something to be on the front page of GGA, due simply to the fact that there are a massive amount of questions around not wanting a 100w amp because its too loud and wanting a 5w because it will be quieter (for bedroom use).

So, in short, well done Arby!
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#32
Quote by bobafettacheese
^This.

Also, just read the article and I think it is something to be on the front page of GGA, due simply to the fact that there are a massive amount of questions around not wanting a 100w amp because its too loud and wanting a 5w because it will be quieter (for bedroom use).

So, in short, well done Arby!


Thanks for that but as mentioned elsewhere I didn't write the article, I merely helped it get published. Craig at CECamps is the genius behind the words, and I'd hate for people to think I was trying to get credit for his excellent work.

I will continue to use it as an explanation whenever an appropriate question comes up, and encourage others to do the same.
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#33
I may have misread, but as I understand it, you're not using your EQ pedal in the FX loop?

That would be your problem.

Also have to point out as I always do that I've owned a 5150 and a 6505 in the past, and KailM 100% knows what he's talking about about these amps.

Cath mentioned the EQ loop volume trick briefly, but it didn't get emphasized enough I don't think.

When you run the EQ in the loop, turn the level slider down. This essentially makes your amp volume more responsive, and you can turn it up. This defeats the "kick in" issue completely, and lets your amp sound the way it is supposed to sound at whisper volumes. This is more important than running an OD in front, which is also very important.

I understand you need a smaller amp for transportation purposes, but since you have everything you need already, try this out first so you can see and add it to your thought process.

No other lunchbox amp is going to sound as good, unfortunately. That's why people are trying to get your to keep it.
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#34
Quote by Cathbard
Suggesting ways to make what you have work for you is being a smartass?
I'm sorry but you are talking bout sacrificing your on stage tone so it sounds better when you're playing with yourself - seriously? A man needs epic tone in the bedroom like mood lighting to masturbate.
A second attenuator (volume pedal/EQ) in the FX loop will help your low volume sound, although why that actually matters escapes me TBH.

mood lighting, scented candles, soft music are very important for masturbating damn it

buy a damn trolley and a pod boom done end thread.
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#35
Thanks for everything so far.

I've got the effects loop back together and the sound's better. There was no need for the EQ, simply engaging the effects loops fixed the problem. The problem was the volume sensitivity, it has this thing where it's either so quiet that the cone doesn't move properly and it sounds thin and fizzy, or that it's too loud. Not much of an in-between. I still need to try the EQ thing, driving the amp at low volumes could be fun.

So not much of a link between watts and volume? I'm still looking for a smaller rig and a trolley isn't a solution to everything. Big gear is easier to damage in my pokey little local rehearsal spaces, and I don't particularly want a trolley sitting in the corner of my room. I've put the 6505 up for offers and I'm intending to go for a 60W Ironheart head. It cuts the weight of the Peavey in half and should be much easier to move. As for a cab, I'm still researching that. It's basically between a 1X12 and a 2X12, while compromising size, weight, bedroom levels and stage sound.
#36
I personally think you're making a mistake, but okay.
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#37
If you go for that Laney plus a 1x12 cab you're going to net about the same amount of weight, the only difference is now you'll probably have to make two trips instead of one. And any 2 x 12 cab worth buying will be BIGGER than your 6505+ 112.

But you know what? Knock yourself out. You seem to have made up your mind before even posting here.
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#38
you know, sometimes things are heavy because they are built more ruggedly. i saw a peavey 5150 fall off of its cab at a local show. it cut out, and had a ding. but after the guitarist reseated the tubes it was up and roaring. they were able to finish the gig.

i really don't think you are making the right decision either, but thats you deal.
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youre just being a jerk man.



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2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
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#39
I've tried to listen to what everyone's said, but at the end of the day the Laney is much better suited to my needs. Net weight doesn't matter, it's just going to be easier to be able to split the Peavey's ~32kg into two smaller parts. It's just as giggable, but there's no need for an attenuator with the watts control. Also, I don't fancy the EQ's bypass kicking in, and suddenly having a 6505 at full blast in my bedroom.

Anyway, at rehearsal I'll only need to worry about taking the head, so for most purposes it's still only one trip for me. Not to mention, the 6505's cleans are god-awful, while the IT 60's are pretty much as good as they get in metal amps.

Impressive to hear the story about the head.

So yeah, pretty much [/thread] here. I did consider the JC, but the distortion just isn't what I'm looking for. The IRT I much prefer. I'm also quite aware of having the speakers pointing at you, it does make a big difference, I keep it at head height actually, but thanks.
#40
Quote by dragonzrmetal


I don't really want to go fully digital,


I think that may be your best option, however.

Something like a used Pod XT Bean will run you around $80-90, a "Live" perhaps $125 or so. From there you have a ton of options for moving air, from a good set of headphones (you can crank them loud enough to induce tinnitus and not wake the baby) to a pair of powered recording monitors to a powered speaker like the Carvin PM12A (new, around $300-ish) or PM15A to an arena PA system.

Dino Cazares famously used an XT to record one of his albums, so there's obviously no issue making metal sounds with it.
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