#1
So I've been playing 8 years, so I should know how to deal with this by now, but I haven't had the issue. But basically if I tune my guitar perfectly, the open notes all are perfect, but the higher you go the more flat the note gets.
I have a Jackson Kelly with a Floyd Rose, the bridge is set properly to be in drop B.
In the tuner, the inotation is correct. the 12 fret harmonic is the same note as the open, but when you press a fret it sounds flat.
I had a 7 string set (minus the little e) on it last, now I have ernie ball top heavy slinky bottom. But I'm pretty sure I messed something up when I had the 7 string set on it.
On the rectangle silver bridge piece where the strings go, there's to allen key screws towards the pickups. Like this
-----------l
lO l
l l
l l
l l
lO l
------------l
The "Os" are the allen key screws.

I think at some point I twisted them clockwise or something hoping to lower the action for the 7 string set (not knowing what they did).
Anyways, any ideas? I really should start learning more about this kind of thing to take better care of my instruments >.> Thanks
#2
Don't think you are intonating properly. Instead of playing the harmonic at the 12th fret, actually fret the note at 12th fret and see whether it is sharp or flat relative to open string then adjust intonation.
#3
You're not intonating properly. The 12th fret harmonic will always be exactly an octave higher than the open string, that's just physics. Intonation problems only come into play when you involve frets, intonating a guitar without using the frets is not intonating a guitar.
#4
^There's the answer. Hit the harmonic at 12 and compare it to the 12th fret, you'll be in business
Quote by zackk
seriously though, listen to DaliLama.
Quote by Arthur Curry
My spidey sense tells me some mothafuckas are gonna be BANNED.
#5
Quote by derek8520
You're not intonating properly. The 12th fret harmonic will always be exactly an octave higher than the open string, that's just physics. Intonation problems only come into play when you involve frets, intonating a guitar without using the frets is not intonating a guitar.


intonating a guitar without using the frets is not intonating a guitar.

you should have this printed on a t-shirt.
#7
Adjust the individual saddles to adjust intonation. Not the action.

And you should never adjust the action on a Floyd without loosening off the strings either. It damages the knife edges that allow the bridge to hinge on the posts smoothly and stay in tune.
Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Quote by H4T3BR33D3R
I also have to do that. Cottaging this weekend
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Dec 16, 2015,
#8
Is it true that clip on tuners should not be used to intonate?
ESP Iron Cross Sig model, Fernandes RetroRocket Sunburst, Taylor 214CE, Peavey XXX Super 40, DimeBag Crybaby from Hell, Zakk Wylde Overdrive, MXR Chorus, and a Flashback Delay and Looper.
#9
Quote by tysona23
Is it true that clip on tuners should not be used to intonate?

It's not that you shouldn't, it's just that most are not really accurate enough.
Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Quote by H4T3BR33D3R
I also have to do that. Cottaging this weekend
#10
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Adjust the individual saddles to adjust intonation. Not the action.

And you should never adjust the action on a Floyd without loosening off the strings either. It damages the knife edges that allow the bridge to hinge on the posts smoothly and stay in tune.



And you should never adjust the action on a Floyd without loosening off the strings either. It damages the knife edges that allow the bridge to hinge on the posts smoothly and stay in tune.

the manufacturer would disagree with you on this statement.

http://www.floydrose.com/support/tech-support/string-tuning-instructions
Last edited by ad_works at Dec 17, 2015,
#11
Quote by ad_works
And you should never adjust the action on a Floyd without loosening off the strings either. It damages the knife edges that allow the bridge to hinge on the posts smoothly and stay in tune.

the manufacturer would disagree with you on this statement.

http://www.floydrose.com/support/tech-support/string-tuning-instructions

Where does it say that it won't harm the knife edges?

And even if it did claim that it doesn't, I still wouldn't believe them. Basic physics says that grinding a surface against another surface when such parts are under load will induce wear. And there's absolutely no argument to be had against loosening off the strings.
Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Quote by H4T3BR33D3R
I also have to do that. Cottaging this weekend
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Dec 17, 2015,
#12
on ibanez rules, in the set up section, it says that you don't need to loosen the action either.

i don't know. however i just play it safe and loosen up the strings.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#13
Quote by trashedlostfdup
on ibanez rules, in the set up section, it says that you don't need to loosen the action either.

i don't know. however i just play it safe and loosen up the strings.


You mean loosen up the strings?

Well, I've never seen on a guide that you need to loosen the strings before adjusting the action on a Floyd Rose. This is guitar brand guides/rules, like Ibanez, Jackson, etc. Online guides made by other people, they almost always mention that.

But yeah, I don't trust them either and I would say that DeepBlue is totally right. Sometimes I even go farther and take the Floyd all together to adjust the action.
#14
Quote by DanyFS
You mean loosen up the strings?

Well, I've never seen on a guide that you need to loosen the strings before adjusting the action on a Floyd Rose. This is guitar brand guides/rules, like Ibanez, Jackson, etc. Online guides made by other people, they almost always mention that.

But yeah, I don't trust them either and I would say that DeepBlue is totally right. Sometimes I even go farther and take the Floyd all together to adjust the action.


Yea that is what I meant.

I just play it safe and loosen the strings when I adjust a floyd. It will only take a another minute or two.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#16
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Where does it say that it won't harm the knife edges?

And even if it did claim that it doesn't, I still wouldn't believe them. Basic physics says that grinding a surface against another surface when such parts are under load will induce wear. And there's absolutely no argument to be had against loosening off the strings.


"Basic physics says that grinding a surface against another surface when such parts are under load will induce wear."

regarding this particular application, less with an occasional set up then daily up and down use of the trem. the contact patch is nearly identical in both planes. c axis (the axis of rotation of the elevation screws) vs b axis (the rotational axis of the trem in use) assuming that z is surface normal to the top of the guitar because the radius of the contact area of the screw is smaller then the receiving radius on the bridgeplate. given your engineering and cad background you should know how this works out.

"And there's absolutely no argument to be had against loosening off the strings."

one argument against it is that it's a fairly inaccurate way to set string height. you could of course determine the screw's pitch (btw it's .0357, as fr uses a 28tpi screw). put an allen wrench in and move the adjuster a "1/4" of a turn will get you .0089. after loosening the strings you could do all of this if you have to but it's more work. but then the springs are still exerting pressure upon the knife edges as well when you release the string tension. so the advantage is?

i'm just encouraging you to think deeper, but you can do and post as you like.
Last edited by ad_works at Dec 18, 2015,
#17
Quote by ad_works


"And there's absolutely no argument to be had against loosening off the strings."

one argument against it is that it's a fairly inaccurate way to set string height. you could of course determine the screw's pitch (btw it's .0357, as fr uses a 28tpi screw). put an allen wrench in and move the adjuster a "1/4" of a turn will get you .0089. after loosening the strings you could do all of this if you have to but it's more work. but then the springs are still exerting pressure upon the knife edges as well when you release the string tension. so the advantage is?


When I need to adjust the action on my Floyd guitar, I decide if it needs to go up or down, then loosen the strings to the point that I can pull the bridge away from the posts, making no contact whatsoever, then I move the posts a little bit and bring it all back up to tension. It's trial and error, but it's not hard to zero it in right where you want it with only a few repetitions of the process. Tedious? Sure. But I don't change string gauge (or even brand) or tuning on the Floyd guitar, so I've only had to make action adjustments maybe 3 or 4 times in the ten years I've owned the guitar. And when it does need to be done, I don't mind taking the time because, as deepblue said, there is simply no way that turning those posts while under a full load of string tension isn't wearing them out. Even if it's very little wear, and not enough to cause serious issues when only done once in a while, it's still wear. There is no getting around that. Metal gets worn when it's jammed against more metal under a ton of pressure and grinding around. So, I'll stick with the safe method, at least until I can get a Floyd made of dwarven mithril.
Guitars
Schecter Hellraiser C-1FR, C-1 Classic, Hellraiser Hybrid Solo-II, Special Edition E-1FR-S
Orange Rockerverb 50 212
Basses
Yamaha RBX374 and Washburn MB-6
#18
Quote by ad_works
regarding this particular application, less with an occasional set up then daily up and down use of the trem. the contact patch is nearly identical in both planes. c axis (the axis of rotation of the elevation screws) vs b axis (the rotational axis of the trem in use) assuming that z is surface normal to the top of the guitar because the radius of the contact area of the screw is smaller then the receiving radius on the bridgeplate. given your engineering and cad background you should know how this works out.

I don't know how this is relevant. We're not talking about the area of contact when the trem is dived or not dived; that change in surface area is unavoidable when the bridge is dived. The problem we're really talking about here is the surface of the knife edges being dulled when the studs are rotated under load. The rotational moment of when the stud is rotated encourages the studs and the knife edges to strip material and displace chips from one another.
one argument against it is that it's a fairly inaccurate way to set string height.

I'd rather use some trial and error than cause unnecessary damage to the bridge.
Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Quote by H4T3BR33D3R
I also have to do that. Cottaging this weekend
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Dec 19, 2015,