#1

and why the hell not?

what actual advantage is there to doing calculations on pen and paper rather than on a computer or calculator?

sure, in early education, doing the problems out on paper can facilitate internalizing the procedure so as to be able to do mental math later on.

but ain't no one gonna do long division in their head and absolutely no one outside of school has said "hey, this calls for long division" rather than whip out a calculator.

what is with this obsession of doing pen and paper calculations? is it simply because it's easy to test for? inertia in an educational system which has failed to adapt to new technologies? a sadistic fetish of math people everywhere? tell me.

what actual advantage is there to doing calculations on pen and paper rather than on a computer or calculator?

sure, in early education, doing the problems out on paper can facilitate internalizing the procedure so as to be able to do mental math later on.

but ain't no one gonna do long division in their head and absolutely no one outside of school has said "hey, this calls for long division" rather than whip out a calculator.

what is with this obsession of doing pen and paper calculations? is it simply because it's easy to test for? inertia in an educational system which has failed to adapt to new technologies? a sadistic fetish of math people everywhere? tell me.

#2

not having calculators ensures that you have to know the concepts. on my ti89 i can differentiate equations that take ages by hand (ages meaning like five minutes) so I don't need to understand the theory (for the most part) in order to get the answer

also, I really like it when calculators aren't allowed because then you assume that the math problems given aren't going to have crap numbers in it. Like if you have to do a problem by hand, and after forty minutes you get 8.2384982738427937567028394729837508293928648732958439482 as the answer, you've gone wrong somewhere. a calculator gets in the way there because you could be totally wrong, but not have any indication because you think the answer is just "26^[13/24]/e" or something

also, I really like it when calculators aren't allowed because then you assume that the math problems given aren't going to have crap numbers in it. Like if you have to do a problem by hand, and after forty minutes you get 8.2384982738427937567028394729837508293928648732958439482 as the answer, you've gone wrong somewhere. a calculator gets in the way there because you could be totally wrong, but not have any indication because you think the answer is just "26^[13/24]/e" or something

#3

When in school I thought math problems were going to be a much bigger part of everyday adult life. Fucking lying bitches

#4

When in school I thought math problems were going to be a much bigger part of everyday adult life. F~~ucking lying bitches~~

Yeah, up to basic algebra is all that's really needed.

They had me doing this triangle shit with hippo nooses

#5

DRP planning in case you're reaching a deadline at work and the power goes out

#6

not having calculators ensures that you have to know the concepts. on my ti89 i can differentiate equations that take ages by hand (ages meaning like five minutes) so I don't need to understand the theory (for the most part) in order to get the answer

maybe we should just be skipping straight to the questions where

**understanding**the concept is central to coming up with the solution, rather than applying them mindlessly simply because we

**know**them.

for example, proofs of mathematical theories.

*Last edited by Godsmack_IV at Dec 16, 2015,*

#7

You need to do math to impress asshole old men.

#8

that can kinda be said for education in general thanks the interweb. computers are not helping anyone use their brain skills

#9

and there are absolutely no light sources to activate the calculator's solar panel

#10

Doing simple mental math and more complicated problems helps to prevent/slow the onset of dementia. So it is definitely not useless even if you have access to a calculator.

I don't know a lot about the specifics of the acquisition of arithmetic skills. But if it's anything like language acquisition, the more you do it and the earlier you start doing it the better it is for your brain.

I don't know a lot about the specifics of the acquisition of arithmetic skills. But if it's anything like language acquisition, the more you do it and the earlier you start doing it the better it is for your brain.

#11

we should do that for everything then. forget all application problems, just have all classes be fundamental conceptsmaybe we should just be skipping straight to the questions whereunderstandingthe concept is central to coming up with the solution, rather than applying them mindlessly simply because weknowthem.

for example, proofs of mathematical theories.

relabel all foods in the grocery store so it just is "various fruit things and other stuff that grew from trees, some are yellow some are red" "this came from animals" "we made these in factories"

#12

we should do that for everything then. forget all application problems, just have all classes be fundamental concepts

relabel all foods in the grocery store so it just is "various fruit things and other stuff that grew from trees, some are yellow some are red" "this came from animals" "we made these in factories"

a calculator can help you tackle more interesting application problems.

#13

It made sense in Calc I when you had to learn how to draw graphs based on minima/maximum/inflection points and such. It's also a bit useful to learn graph translation and scaling, but I just figured that stuff out with a graphing calculator.

I had to use a shitty little casio with a department stamp throughout engineering school. Some profs didn't care in 4th year, as long as the calculator didn't have memory.

Overall, I didn't feel the need for anything more than the casio by the time I was through so I don't care for graphing calculators.

I had to use a shitty little casio with a department stamp throughout engineering school. Some profs didn't care in 4th year, as long as the calculator didn't have memory.

Overall, I didn't feel the need for anything more than the casio by the time I was through so I don't care for graphing calculators.

#14

a calculator can help you tackle more interesting application problems.

i agree, but there is something to knowing why things work the way they do. i sometimes wonder how much more we need to know.

*Last edited by mattedbird at Dec 16, 2015,*

#15

because Y2K or something..

#16

It helps us math educators to help correct your miscalculations that would otherwise remain unseen, as well as solidify the concept within your mental processes

#17

I was gonna say the same thing as Baby Joel. The only mathematics I've bothered to take past high school is statistics, so I can't speak about other courses that are more advanced. Some things I remember doing by hand are combinations, variance, standard deviation, standard error of the mean, t-tests (and all different variations of the formula), etc. All of these can be done on a graphic calculator, and it's important to know what you're doing rather than how to have a machine do it for you so you actually learn something beyond that.

#18

I was gonna say the same thing as Baby Joel. The only mathematics I've bothered to take past high school is statistics, so I can't speak about other courses that are more advanced. Some things I remember doing by hand are combinations, variance, standard deviation, standard error of the mean, t-tests (and all different variations of the formula), etc. All of these can be done on a graphic calculator, and it's important to know what you're doing rather than how to have a machine do it for you so you actually learn something beyond that.

calculating the standard deviation by hand only shows that you know the definition of standard deviation. it doesn't show that you understand

**why**it is significant to define it in such a way.

*Last edited by Godsmack_IV at Dec 16, 2015,*

#19

ITT mathematicians lamenting

#20

ITT Fat Lard doesn't know how to calculate the probability of himself getting friendzoned on reality TV

Slam dunk ayyooo

Slam dunk ayyooo

#21

a calculator can help you tackle more interesting application problems.

really? i don't really see how it would make things more interesting in an education system.

like I just don't know why allowing calculators would be a 'better' thing. it's not worse by any means, but if you know the math, it's really not gonna bother you if you can or can't use a calculator. like adam said, you just don't really need a graphing calculator. teachers aren't gonna design tests that require crap efforts of written work (to an extent).

like this just kinda seems like a petty thing

#22

it's not worse by any means, but if you know the math, it's really not gonna bother you if you can or can't use a calculator.

it does if you're lazy like me.

i was good at math in school but srsly aint nobdy got time for that

#23

really? i don't really see how it would make things more interesting in an education system.

because you can more accurately model real world applications, rather than get stuck doing standard textbook problems that don't reflect real life, and have people saying that math seems pointless as a consequence.

#24

idk you'd have to give me an example cause i really can't think of many.

#25

"How many combinations of watermelons ($0.32 each), pears ($1.30 each), and apples ($0.45 each) can Jane buy with $396.43?"

#26

because you can more accurately model real world applications, rather than get stuck doing standard textbook problems that don't reflect real life, and have people saying that math seems pointless as a consequence.

good answer

#27

idk you'd have to give me an example cause i really can't think of many.

pretty much every one of my highschool physics labs

#28

They had me doing this triangle shit with hippo nooses

Illuminati hypnosis?

#29

Math beyond the basics is mostly dumb and not useful for life.

#30

Math beyond the basics is mostly dumb and not useful for life.

Math is boring, dumb, and I'd give my life to have it end so that no other will ever have to endure.

#31

what branch of knowledge cannot be deemed "useless" "beyond the basics"?

we need more welders tbh.

we need more welders tbh.

#32

what branch of knowledge cannot be deemed "useless" "beyond the basics"?

we need more welders tbh.

Language

#33

i am just wondering, can you articulate for me what we mean when we talk about "use"?? let's be honest -- isn't it really just the "cash value" of knowledge?

#34

I just meant like I've never used it. Not for money or for fun either.

#35

i am just wondering, can you articulate for me what we mean when we talk about "use"?? let's be honest -- isn't it really just the "cash value" of knowledge?

Nah.

#36

i am just wondering, can you articulate for me what we mean when we talk about "use"?? let's be honest -- isn't it really just the "cash value" of knowledge?

Also, when people say this, I wonder what they mean by "basics." Is it just simple arithmetic, or is it beyond that?

I don't go out of my way to learn math, but I retain what I do have to learn and actually use 'em in real life. I don't personally do DIY, but if you are going to, then geometry would be useful. I've done some work on a few things that are sorta/kinda DIY, and I know I've used a bit of geometry. Sometimes, I go out to dinner with friends and they can't figure out how much to tip on their own. Learning how to do combinations in your head is useful, if you need to plan something. Or converting from one unit of measurement to the other (especially across different systems). Nowadays, you can have your phone do all that for you, I guess. But would any of that be defined as "basic?"

#37

but ain't no one gonna do long division in their head

Ah, a lot of people can, that's not particularly hard or rare.

People can look at two numbers and just have them crunch with almost no thought.

What is annoying is being one of these people, and failing math because you tell them it's pointless to write out the work when there's no need for the process.

#38

Ah, a lot of people can, that's not particularly hard or rare.

People can look at two numbers and just have them crunch with almost no thought.

What is annoying is being one of these people, and failing math because you tell them it's pointless to write out the work when there's no need for the process.

are you factoring or doing long division in your head?

#39

yeah, what is "basic" math? in this context.

#40

Pre-algebra I think.