#1
Is it just me, or does anyone else have this problem? In other terms, trying to motivate people that have similar interests in you, ie play musician instruments, to become part of your team, ie form bands, and to tackle your goals in life?

It seems like the last 8 years of my life have been focused on trying to get people to do what I want them to do, rather than only having to worry about myself. I know so many musicians, yet none of them care enough to want to become a professional and do this for a living, rather than just using excuses to why it isnt gonna happen.

THoughts? ADvice? COmments? COncerns?
#2
The thread title is convoluted and misleading.

Anyway, it's pretty selfish of you to consider this a problem and to complain about it. People have the agency to say no to you. You aren't entitled to their time and efforts. Why should people care about your goals if it doesn't concern them?
Free Ali
#3
Quote by chrismendiola
The thread title is convoluted and misleading.

Anyway, it's pretty selfish of you to consider this a problem and to complain about it. People have the agency to say no to you. You aren't entitled to their time and efforts. Why should people care about your goals if it doesn't concern them?

Is it misleading? Colleagues are the people that are in the same profession as you, peers are the people of that profession that are on your level of experience and determination. That being said, I have trouble finding musicians to work with that want to put in an equal level of determination to make it as professionals. I know plenty of musicians, plenty of colleagues, yet all of them have better things to do. When is music going to be the better thing to do?
#4
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Is it misleading? Colleagues are the people that are in the same profession as you, peers are the people of that profession that are on your level of experience and determination. That being said, I have trouble finding musicians to work with that want to put in an equal level of determination to make it as professionals. I know plenty of musicians, plenty of colleagues, yet all of them have better things to do. When is music going to be the better thing to do?

The word "peer" is really just someone with whom you have an equal relationship. The word "colleague" is pretty much "peer" only in the context of work. AFAIK, at least.

I assume your colleagues would rather focus their time doing other things. I think it's really selfish to try to convince them to change their priorities to be more congruent to yours. I'd just wait until you find people who have the same goals as you do, or you could actively seek them out using classified ads or something.
Free Ali
#5
Yes, lets all just wait around waiting for the "right" people to come into our lives to take us by the hand and say, I am your savior, it's time to be successful now. How about no. How about we discuss ways to teach people so that they can be more determined and to tackle challenges rather than running from them.
#6
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Yes, lets all just wait around waiting for the "right" people to come into our lives to take us by the hand and say, I am your savior, it's time to be successful now. How about no. How about we discuss ways to teach people so that they can be more determined and to tackle challenges rather than running from them.

How 'bout you let people live their lives the way they want to instead of trying to convince them to adhere to your agenda? It's not as simple as determination or conviction towards achieving goals. Not everyone has the same priorities as you do. And even if it was solely because others aren't as determined or whatever qualities you want to attribute to having the will to become a professional musician, you'd still be an entitled brat by trying to discredit their agency to decline. They don't want to pursue music with you, and pushing them to do something they said they don't want to do is only gonna make them want to do it less.

I don't usually try to tell people what to do with so much conviction, but your idea is so awful that I feel like I have to. It's so socially inept that you're proposing to cross the boundaries of people's decision-making and you've conflated to whatever negative attributes you want in order to vindicate your bratty attitude. This is one step removed from a kid throwing a tantrum at the supermarket because mom/dad wouldn't buy that sugary cereal.

I'm surprised, but I feel like I shouldn't be. Every post you make leads me to believe you make it all up in order to create a ridiculous character, and these last few have been no exception.

And have you ever thought that it's not because they don't want to be in a band at all, maybe they don't want to be in your band?

Leave your colleagues alone.
Free Ali
#7
That's not how it is though. The repeating pattern is that they don't have time. Nobody has the time to be a professional musician. It's not that they haven't dreamed of it. It's that they don't think they can do it. They don't believe in themselves. They don't have time to play because they have other priorities. They are comfortable in their discomfort. They know they would be happier if they practiced more but they don't because why practice if you've already convinced yourself you won't make it as a professional musician. You would rather go to work and work your stupid ass day job that makes your life miserable than to man up and practice and make your life better by being a professional at the thing you are always gonna call just a hobby. Anyone can be a professional musician. Not everyone wants to but anyone can. Anyone can learn math. Anyone can learn music. There's no willpower. I'm not trying to force my beliefs upon anyone and trying to tell people what to do, all I do is present the idea, the idea that anyone that works together as a team and has their mid set to win can achieve anything. I'm waiting on Black's move. Check.
#8
maybe you should accept that not everyone wants what you want. They do have other priorities. As in, they have things more important to them than being a professional musician. I like the idea of being a musician all the time because I miss playing in a group, that's the thing. I like the idea. I don't want to do that for my career.

You're presenting an idea that everyone has no willpower and is miserable because they aren't doing what you think they should be doing.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#9
Wrong. You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi, but what happened? We're all those people just better than us? Yeah cuz they practice more than us. Their fame didn't come by luck or chance. They had the mind set. The Garry Kasparov mind set that if you play your best game you are going to win. They're all professional musicians cuz they believed in themselves and practiced. They all worked day jobs. They all were in our shoes.
#11
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Wrong. You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi, but what happened? We're all those people just better than us? Yeah cuz they practice more than us. Their fame didn't come by luck or chance. They had the mind set. The Garry Kasparov mind set that if you play your best game you are going to win. They're all professional musicians cuz they believed in themselves and practiced. They all worked day jobs. They all were in our shoes.

Perfect example. I said what I'd like to do with my life. You say I'm wrong and I want something else.

I do not want to be a professional musician. I really like music. I've been neglecting it recently and need to get back to playing, but that is not what I want to do as a profession. Simple as that. I did dream of being like those people, but I was not willing to put the time in. I've put my time into other areas that are higher priorities for me.

People don't want to be in a band with you because of you, man.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#12
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Wrong. You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi

nah
mugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmugmug
#14
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
That's not how it is though. The repeating pattern is that they don't have time. Nobody has the time to be a professional musician. It's not that they haven't dreamed of it. It's that they don't think they can do it. They don't believe in themselves. They don't have time to play because they have other priorities. They are comfortable in their discomfort. They know they would be happier if they practiced more but they don't because why practice if you've already convinced yourself you won't make it as a professional musician. You would rather go to work and work your stupid ass day job that makes your life miserable than to man up and practice and make your life better by being a professional at the thing you are always gonna call just a hobby. Anyone can be a professional musician. Not everyone wants to but anyone can. Anyone can learn math. Anyone can learn music. There's no willpower. I'm not trying to force my beliefs upon anyone and trying to tell people what to do, all I do is present the idea, the idea that anyone that works together as a team and has their mid set to win can achieve anything. I'm waiting on Black's move. Check.

First of all, yeah, people don't have time, because people have lives outside of music and you have to respect that. Your inclination to want to play music for a living and to have the conviction to do it is yours, don't project it onto other people. That's how the world works. Everyone has hobbies, but most people work regular jobs for a living. Just imagine for a second that everyone, or even half the people in the world decided to pursue their passions rather than contribute to society through the workforce.

No, not everyone can be a professional musician, and not everyone can learn math. Suggesting that willpower alone decides success in an endeavor is the most naive thing I've ever encountered. The next most naive thing I've ever encountered is the idea that the right attitude and teamwork is a recipe for guaranteed success.
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Wrong. You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi, but what happened? We're all those people just better than us? Yeah cuz they practice more than us. Their fame didn't come by luck or chance. They had the mind set. The Garry Kasparov mind set that if you play your best game you are going to win. They're all professional musicians cuz they believed in themselves and practiced. They all worked day jobs. They all were in our shoes.

First of all, no, we haven't all dreamed of being a famous guitarist. Secondly, fame can't happen without luck or chance. If that were true, only the most talented people would become famous. Justin Bieber isn't the most talented singer in the world. He just happened to be accessible to a large audience and was discovered by Usher. It's by chance that every famous musician comes to be famous, because you have to be at the right place, at the right time, around the right people- and a million other extraneous circumstances- to be discovered and signed. Ambition and drive can get you closer, but can only get you so far without chance.
Free Ali
#15
I can safely say I've never dreamed about being Zakk Wylde.

Put an ad on Craigslist or some shit. Go to an open mic. Just do your own thing. There are plenty of UGers who have done amazing solo work.
#16
I feel for you Jr, I do. But unfortunately the will has to be there, I don't believe you can put it there.
#17
Some pretty harsh responses here but odd statements from OP too.
Particularly:
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

It seems like the last 8 years of my life have been focused on trying to get people to do what I want them to do

Yeah you can't force people into something they don't want to do and for a lot of people they get into rock n roll so they don't have a boss, they are their own boss. That phrase kinda disturbs me a little. Perhaps its your tact or communication skills you need to look at?

and..

Quote by jrcsgtpeppers

You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi

Not everyone wants to be a great "technical" guitarist or virtuoso and you certainly don't need to be one to be successful.

I see where you're coming from OP. I was the same back in the day. I was in a band and I wanted to make it but not everyone had the same drive and wanted the same goal. I tried working with other muso's in order to find that success but it never worked out for me.

You're like a Paul Stanley without his Gene, a Papa Het without his Lars. You just need to find the right person / people that have that fire and same musical mindset. Its rough but you've just got to keep searching for different people to have that dream with.

The flip side is it could also be that desire that maybe puts people off. To quote Radiohead: "Ambition makes you look pretty ugly"

Anywho, for what its worth from a random, hope that helps
#19
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Wrong. You have all dreamed of being a famous guitarist like Slash and Buckethead and John 5 and Steve Vai and Zakk Wylde and Tosin Abasi, but what happened? We're all those people just better than us? Yeah cuz they practice more than us. Their fame didn't come by luck or chance. They had the mind set. The Garry Kasparov mind set that if you play your best game you are going to win. They're all professional musicians cuz they believed in themselves and practiced. They all worked day jobs. They all were in our shoes.

Then -- using your own logic, mind -- why don't you go do it instead of complaining about it on an internet forum?
Quote by Vornik
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to put it, along with your other advice, into a book, the pages of which I will then use to wipe my ass.
#20
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers at #33751573
Their fame didn't come by luck or chance. They had the mind set. The Garry Kasparov mind set that if you play your best game you are going to win. They're all professional musicians cuz they believed in themselves and practiced. They all worked day jobs. They all were in our shoes.

you realize that above all they're professional musicians because they, you know, wanted to be professional musicians?

not sure how you skipped mentioning that desire, because its absence would render everything you've said invalid
#21
OP, there are a lot of people like you floating around on the music scene where I live.

If they're in any sort of functional band (and they're usually not), they wind up having to hire musicians to play their music because they have such a toxic attitude that no one wants to work with them for free.

So yeah, start paying people to play with you, start charging people to watch your shows and bam, you're a pro. Simple as that.