#1
I'm looking at buying one of these two amps but I am not sure which one would be best for me. I'm looking for something that sounds good at bedroom playing levels but I am not sure which would be best. I also dont know if it would be better to have a combo or amp stack. Any comments would be appreciated.
#2
I prefer a head and cab over a combo. they are easier to move and you have options with cabs.
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#4
i just picked up a 5150, a long time ago i had a 6505+. the plus has a much better clean tone.

i would probably say to go with the 6505+ combo though. i personally prefer the 6L6's over EL84's in high gain amps.
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#5
Quote by trashedlostfdup
i just picked up a 5150, a long time ago i had a 6505+. the plus has a much better clean tone.

i would probably say to go with the 6505+ combo though. i personally prefer the 6L6's over EL84's in high gain amps.

I agree, that is why I went with a Krank Jr head. It runs 6l6's for 20watts in it so it doesn't sound so small.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#6
Well if the better cleans, foot switchable Crunch button, and separate EQ for each channel are important for you then get the 6505+.

If you only want the tones the 6505 are known for and not as much versatility try the MH. I have no experience on how the MH compares to the sound of its older sibling with the bigger 6L6 tubes.

Volume based on the wattage is not what you need to be looking at here. 1W cranked in your bedroom will deafen you. The amps have a volume knob - use it. What you want is how the amp sounds at the volume you will play it.

The best sounding tones at crazy low "don't wake up the kids" volume comes from the computer and headphones IMO.
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#7
I normally tend to prefer head + cab setups, but I'm going to agree with other people above and say that I prefer 6L6 tubes to EL84 tubes for high gain.

Don't let the wattage thing fool you. Both will be incredibly loud and at a fraction of the volume at home for most people. Also, if you want to play live with it, you can't have enough headroom for high-gain, in my opinion. That would lead me to buy the combo instead.

If you're handy, you could also build the combo into a head and cab set-up. There are probably enough threads to be found on that both here and other forums. That way you'd have the 6L6 tubes and the headroom offered by the combo and still have the flexibility of the head + cab setup the MH would give you.
#8
These amps (and i suspect all tube amps) sound terrible at bedroom level. It is just a bunch of noise. These amps are good for rehearsals when playing with drummer and gigging. I'have had 6505+ 112 for two years and then bought 6505+ head. The head sounds a lot better. So if you really want to buy these, buy MH version.

Still, keep in mind if you will be playing at home, these amps will sound bad. Better use some emulation like Amplitube 4 and such.
#9
^I disagree. I have been able to use all of my amp heads in a bedroom/living room environment and get (at least from my own ears) a good tone from them. They all have master volumes, so its not like I am using a plexi in my bedroom.

It's all about dialing in your amp for the environment. Granted most tube amps sound better cranked, but most of what a 6505 and the like use is preamp distortion, which can be achieved at lower volumes.
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#10
Quote by Reages
These amps (and i suspect all tube amps) sound terrible at bedroom level. It is just a bunch of noise. These amps are good for rehearsals when playing with drummer and gigging. I'have had 6505+ 112 for two years and then bought 6505+ head. The head sounds a lot better. So if you really want to buy these, buy MH version.

Still, keep in mind if you will be playing at home, these amps will sound bad. Better use some emulation like Amplitube 4 and such.


Can't say I agree...with any of this -- no offense.

Bad tone at bedroom volumes = user error, in my experience.

I converted my 6505+ 112 into a head and use it through a 412 cab loaded with some of the loudest speakers ever made (Eminence Governors and Swamps Thangs in an X pattern, specifically). I have no trouble whatsoever getting a great tone at low volumes. The key is that you have to EQ it differently at various volume levels to get the optimal tone for the room and conditions. A TS-style boost helps a great deal in getting a tight, clear tone at low volumes, as well as cutting some bass and boosting the mids and treble a bit higher than you would at high volumes. But finally, one of the BIGGEST factors in getting good low-volume tone is to make sure the speaker(s) are right at ear-level. You'd be surprised how similar it actually sounds at low-volume when you're right in front of the speaker.

As for the 112 combo vs. the full 120-watt head -- the biggest difference is that the 112 has a crappy buffer in the effects loop that must be fixed before it sounds its best. Once you do that -- it is very, very close to the tone of its big brother.

Regarding the 112 vs. the MH --here are my thoughts:

The MH uses EL84s and the 112 uses full-blown 6L6 power tubes for a full 60 watts. I've heard, many, many complaints from people using various "mini-heads" loaded with EL84s that the amp can't produce that "oomph" or "thump" that us metalheads know and love. That heavy, thick tone comes from having higher wattage, because low-end takes a lot more power to reproduce than mids and high-end. Every low-wattage amp I've ever tried has suffered from this. They sound alright at low volumes, but as you turn them up (and you WILL, don't kid yourself), the low-end stops increasing while the mids and treble keep increasing -- resulting in a harsh, unusable tone.

These amps don't get their tone from being cranked, I don't care what anybody says. It comes from the preamp which doesn't need to be cranked. Most of the "better" tone from being cranked comes from the speakers themselves being utilized fully, and filling the room better as a result.

As for head + cab vs. combo -- that's a bit of a "6 of one, half dozen of the other" type of situation. Before I modded my 112 into a head, it was indeed a very heavy and big combo amp. But, it wasn't that bad to carry around. Now that it's a head -- that part is easy to carry -- but my cab weighs at least 100 pounds and is obviously huge. I use a dolly when on flat surfaces, but I do have to carry it up and down the stairs of my house. I think a head + 212 cab would be the best of both worlds. Still has a pretty deep, heavy tone, but not so friggin' huge and heavy.

My $.02 --
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Last edited by KailM at Jan 11, 2016,
#11
^+1 to all of the that.
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#12
@KailM, depends on what tone you are after and think is a great tone. I need that super tight and smooth metalcore guitar tone and you can't get this with bedroom volume. If you want to play AC/DC style music where distorted guitar is a crunch you can get that easily at bedroom volumes, because thats basically how the amps sound at that volume.
Last edited by Reages at Jan 11, 2016,
#13
I dunno, but I have no problem getting well past AC/DC on my 5150. I normally use it for Trivium and KSE, gets there no problem. Not hearing crunch unless I set it as such.
Gibson LP traditional and DC standard, PRS S2 Custom 24, Schecter Banshee 7
EVH 5153, Mesa DR Tremoverb combo 2-2x12's
Line 6 M13
#14
Quote by Reages
These amps (and i suspect all tube amps) sound terrible at bedroom level. It is just a bunch of noise.


That's crap.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#15
Quote by Reages
@KailM, depends on what tone you are after and think is a great tone. I need that super tight and smooth metalcore guitar tone and you can't get this with bedroom volume. If you want to play AC/DC style music where distorted guitar is a crunch you can get that easily at bedroom volumes, because thats basically how the amps sound at that volume.



KailM is a metalhead through and through, he knows his shit when it comes to good metal tones.

Everything sounds better when you turn them up, this has nothing to do with tube vs solid state. If you want powerful sound you need to move a lot of air and that needs volume BUT the power amp has to stay clean. Any power amp saturation tends to result in the opposite of tightness.

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#16
Quote by Reages
@KailM, depends on what tone you are after and think is a great tone. I need that super tight and smooth metalcore guitar tone and you can't get this with bedroom volume. If you want to play AC/DC style music where distorted guitar is a crunch you can get that easily at bedroom volumes, because thats basically how the amps sound at that volume.



Again, I have to disagree. With my 6505+'s lead channel, it sounds brutal no matter how low I set the volume. I run my gain between 3 and 3.5, and at low volumes, the distortion level is FAR beyond AC/DC levels. There is enough gain for death metal; certainly more than enough for metalcore (which admittedly, I don't play). Basically, what I'm saying is the character or amount of gain shouldn't really be changing at higher volumes with a 6505. Speakers being pushed sound better to our ears; that's about it.

I think something's wrong with your amp or you're not dialing it in appropriately.

Furthermore, it is AC/DC levels of gain and tone that traditionally require cranking a non-master volume tube amp to insane levels. For metal, you usually want your power tubes to stay clean regardless of volume so the tone stays tight and precise.

Edit: @ MaaZeus -- thanks for the kind words! I am totally a metalhead. The more dark/extreme/gRIM, the better! Probably need to branch out a little...I grew up on classic rock though at least -- just got bored of playing it.
Atmospheric dark metal w/ black and death metal influences:
(My Soundcloud page):

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Last edited by KailM at Jan 11, 2016,
#17
Quote by Reages
These amps (and i suspect all tube amps) sound terrible at bedroom level. It is just a bunch of noise. These amps are good for rehearsals when playing with drummer and gigging. I'have had 6505+ 112 for two years and then bought 6505+ head. The head sounds a lot better. So if you really want to buy these, buy MH version.

Still, keep in mind if you will be playing at home, these amps will sound bad. Better use some emulation like Amplitube 4 and such.


You suspect wrong. maybe instead of suspecting, you could inspect a bit more before you spout off bullshit.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#18
the billion dollar question is how much are you going to travel with it and how big is the trunk of your vehicle? wait bedroom playing hunt down a line 6 vetta they are like 150 usd and will slay the 6505 at low volumes.
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#19
Quote by trashedlostfdup
You suspect wrong. maybe instead of suspecting, you could inspect a bit more before you spout off bullshit.


Hey man relax, if your ears are not the best there is no reason to be mad.
#20
Quote by Reages
Hey man relax, if your ears are not the best there is no reason to be mad.


Yeah, that must be it, it couldn't possibly be your obvious utter lack of understanding of amp design and the properties of sound.

FFS!
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin