#1
So I've got an album and I want to put drums to it via samples/MIDI purely for an actual drummer I know to get a feel for what I want so he can then re-do them with a real kit.

I've had bad experiences with technology e.g. getting it to work and I recently bought an APK Mini.

My music isn't played to a click track (speeds up and slows down a lot) and I'm starting to wonder if perhaps a drum machine rather than this keyboard would be a better purchase?

I thought I could also overdub any keyboard parts whilst I'm at it, but nothing seems to be going smoothly. Cant get Ableton to pick up the APK, it doesn't match to the correct MIDI notes and I'm also wondering how feasible it is to record MIDI drums to something that isn't clicked in the first place as I don't think I'd be able to play the drums (MIDI wise) correctly all the way through without mistakes.

Can anyone provide some advice e.g more suitable equipment, using MIDI drums without clicks etc - I feel lost.
#2
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/electronic-drum-sets#pageName=category-page&N=500311+100505+100506&Nao=0&recsPerPage=20&v=g&profileCountryCode=US&profileCurrencyCode=USD

Maybe look at pads or ekit, like these on the cheap. Used they get a lot cheaper. You'll have to tap your drum parts.
You can technically be able to put your songs on the grid but you'll have to manually edit the tempo map,and use hit points as called by some software. AFAIK Cubase and Pro Tools seem to be best at that. Not sure about Ableton,last I used it couldn't even do several meter changes within a song,so if you're in 4/4, you couldn't move to 7/8 and come back, so I ditched it and haven't looked back since version 5.

It will be probably better for you to retrack the whole album to grid, or get a studio engineer to give you a quote about putting it on grid.
#3
Always try and record to a click is the first thing to say That way you don't develop all these problems down the line. Outside of that, an electronic cheap kit is probably the easiest way of doing it - I mean you're only doing a rough outline. Your mistakes when recording it don't matter that much, it's more about feel than being perfect - that's why you're using a real drummer later!

I'd forget about using MIDI drums since the recording isn't in time - I mean you could get it to work, but ain't nobody got time for that.

Also I'd ask, why bother? Drummers drum, I know they need some hand holding at times (burn ) but they should be able to just improvise what should be there. If anything, just jam together and record that. You can provide more direction in person as you work through it.

Honestly that's the best thing to do, and it's much more fun. Go out and talk to the person in real life That's when good stuff happens.
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#4
Quote by Anthony1991
Always try and record to a click is the first thing to say That way you don't develop all these problems down the line. Outside of that, an electronic cheap kit is probably the easiest way of doing it - I mean you're only doing a rough outline. Your mistakes when recording it don't matter that much, it's more about feel than being perfect - that's why you're using a real drummer later!

I'd forget about using MIDI drums since the recording isn't in time - I mean you could get it to work, but ain't nobody got time for that.

Also I'd ask, why bother? Drummers drum, I know they need some hand holding at times (burn ) but they should be able to just improvise what should be there. If anything, just jam together and record that. You can provide more direction in person as you work through it.

Honestly that's the best thing to do, and it's much more fun. Go out and talk to the person in real life That's when good stuff happens.


I am capable of recording to a click, but the music naturally slows up and down and when "forced" to a click it doesn't sound natural. The recordings are in time, just not in time with a click. The guitar and vocals are in time with me.

We dont have the cash to jam in a room so this is what we've agreed we will do. Plus if I could get the drums to sound decent then I might be able to use virtual kits.

If I had a studio, space for a drum kit, someone who was committed and cared about my songs and wanted to commit and get this album done then I wouldn't need a virtual drum kit. I don't mean to sound like a dick, but yeah. That's how things are. The reason I'm asking about virtual kits is because it would make my life easier in the long run.

Quote by diabolical
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/electronic-drum-sets#pageName=category-page&N=500311+100505+100506&Nao=0&recsPerPage=20&v=g&profileCountryCode=US&profileCurrencyCode=USD

Maybe look at pads or ekit, like these on the cheap. Used they get a lot cheaper. You'll have to tap your drum parts.
You can technically be able to put your songs on the grid but you'll have to manually edit the tempo map,and use hit points as called by some software. AFAIK Cubase and Pro Tools seem to be best at that. Not sure about Ableton,last I used it couldn't even do several meter changes within a song,so if you're in 4/4, you couldn't move to 7/8 and come back, so I ditched it and haven't looked back since version 5.

It will be probably better for you to retrack the whole album to grid, or get a studio engineer to give you a quote about putting it on grid.



Hmmm I guess I'll youtube some tutorials, see what is feasible.


Thanks for your responses so far guys.
#5
Quote by rocknrollstar
I am capable of recording to a click, but the music naturally slows up and down and when "forced" to a click it doesn't sound natural. The recordings are in time, just not in time with a click. The guitar and vocals are in time with me.


Interesting...I don't get how they can be in time and not in time at the same "time"
Sounds like a recipe for disaster. The only way to track that is to play with the drummer together so both of you are in time. Otherwise, it will be impossible to track drums to your performance.

Maybe we can hear a sample of your material to understand better?
#6
Quote by diabolical
Interesting...I don't get how they can be in time and not in time at the same "time"
Sounds like a recipe for disaster. The only way to track that is to play with the drummer together so both of you are in time. Otherwise, it will be impossible to track drums to your performance.

Maybe we can hear a sample of your material to understand better?


What I mean is, I can play and sing it at the same time and it works, however due to tempo changes, doing the vocals after the guitar makes it feel disjointed and it's very minute changes which making a click work to it makes it feel odd.

Consider:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6zjQhMH8p0E

So I cover that for example - imagine trying to put a click to that. Just wouldn't work.
#7
Maybe something like this guy does will do it for you?
https://youtu.be/SIQ_q1sP9JQ

Studio One has a free version, you might wanna try it, lenghty process but it might just be enough to create tempo map for your drummer...or Cubase "hitpoints" which does the same thing.