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#1
How about we ‘defend European values’ by not arresting people who say stupid things?
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/03/how-about-we-defend-european-values-by-not-arresting-people-who-say-stupid-things/

After terrorist outrages like the one in Brussels, our leaders always say the same thing: ‘We must defend European values against these evil killers.’ It seems the Metropolitan Police didn’t get the memo. For they have just arrested someone — actually arrested someone — for tweeting something unpleasant about the Brussels attack, in the process trampling their coppers’ boots all over what is surely, or at least ought to be, the most important European value of all: freedom of speech.

The arrested man is one Matthew Doyle. He went viral after tweeting about a run-in he had on the day of the Brussels attacks: ‘I confronted a Muslim woman yesterday in Croydon. I asked her to explain Brussels. She said “Nothing to do with me”. A mealy mouthed reply.’

Now, if this encounter really did happen — and many have their doubts — it was a rude and ugly thing for him to have done. But to be arrested for tweeting about the incident, on suspicion of ‘inciting racial hatred’? To be locked up for hours, as Doyle has been, for saying something silly to a woman in the street and then tweeting about it? That is outrageous. The awfulness of his tweet pales into insignificance in comparison with the awfulness of his having been arrested for it. If you’re still shocked by his tweet rather than by the fact that 21st-century Britain arrests people for what they say, then your moral priorities need urgent rearranging.

The true horror here is not what Doyle said — it’s his arrest. That should make you angry. Because if we aren’t free to say silly things to people, and to tweet about it later, then we aren’t free. If we don’t have the freedom to say ‘Muslims should answer for the Brussels attacks’ — which I don’t think they should, by the way — then we don’t have freedom of speech. It’s that simple. Laugh at Doyle all you like, but his arrest is as much an attack on your freedom as it is on his freedom, because it tells us there are certain things we may not think or tweet without facing potential arrest.

‘The terrorists hate our freedoms’, people say. They aren’t the only ones. Angry tweeters, the easily offended, time-rich policemen… some people at the very heart of our societies seem to hate freedom too and want to rein in the right to speak freely. We have to defend our values against both nutters with bombs and a PC mob with Twitter accounts.


#2
Five hours to suppress free speech, five months to find a man who coordinated the attacks that killed 130 in Paris. Damn fine police work.
#3
I think the real crime here is the sensationalist and angsty tone of the blog.

Can we arrest people for that too?
Quote by Axelfox
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
#4
It's nothing to do with free speech ffs. Harassment falls under the bracket of hate crime. This does seem like a fairly minor example of harassment, but it was obviously intended to be intimidating behaviour, and the cunt was stupid enough to provide the evidence himself. Given the massive upsurge in violence against Muslims since the Paris attacks, he should have known better than to 'confront' one.
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Mar 25, 2016,
#5
If it was America he would have been shot instead.
Last edited by DardySon at Mar 25, 2016,
#6
eh


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silen ženimo hrup,
uboga gmajna, le vpup, le vkup,
le vkup, le vkup z menoj,
staro pravdo v mrak tulimo,
da se pretulimo skozi to zimo
#7
still above america in the heritage freedom index
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
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#8
I get the impression that the arrest was more due to racial/ethnic/religious harassment than the tweet itself

going through his feed I can't help but think that he made the tweet up because it's like studying an e-marriage between UKIP and @dril. either way this is no big surprise and hardly the most alarming of authoritarian actions on part of the British state
they're coming to take me away
ha-haaa
#11
I agree, I find it worrying how often the standard line now is "oh yeah free speech is great, but unless it's something racist or really offensive, then I don't think it should be allowed" and people don't seem to see why there's an issue with that line.

Then again there is also a scary number of people who think freedom of speech means doing and saying what you want without anyone being able to criticise what you're saying, disagree, or even say "I don't think you should say that".

From what I've seen that guy who got arrested is an absolute massive dick btw. And I think it's not exactly accurate to call approaching strangers on the street (presumably on a racial basis, though I'll admit I don't know that) and blaming them for a terrorist attack simply "saying silly things". Not that that justifies arresting him, but I don't have a great amount of sympathy.
#12
Quote by MadClownDisease
I agree, I find it worrying how often the standard line now is "oh yeah free speech is great, but unless it's something racist or really offensive, then I don't think it should be allowed" and people don't seem to see why there's an issue with that line.



Amen. The whole point is to protect offensive speech.
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#13
I don't agree with what he said or the thing the blog says about making Muslims answer for the Brussels attack but arresting someone for a tweet as evidence of a 'hate crime' is absolutely ridiculous. He might be a prick but that's not really enough grounds to go on to arrest someone, and especially not to convict someone of a crime, if it goes that far. Considering people's tendency to get mad and move on real quick, I doubt it would get that far though.
Last edited by Fatlumpthe1st at Mar 25, 2016,
#16
I confronted a white man yesterday about slavery and 400 years of systematic oppression, theft, and murder.
He replied "That's has nothing to do with me".
What a dumb white reply.


Come get me British police!!!!
#17
Quote by BelowTheSun at #33894620
I 100% support the arrest of racist pricks harrassing Muslims on the street.


dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#18
People who support arresting others for offensive speech deserve to be blown up by ISIS.


"Every day I wonder how many things I am dead wrong about."
#19
ok
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#20
Yup, twitter is worse than Hitler.
Quote by Diemon Dave
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#21
Quote by Trowzaa



Easy to say when you don't like what's being said. You'd change your tune real quick if the shoe was on the other foot.
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#22
i can't think of any hate speech i'd like being said tbh

got any examples?
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#23
English Moral Czar Trowzaa Calls for the Arrest of Anyone that Claims to Hate the EDL
#24
Quote by BelowTheSun
I 100% support the arrest of racist pricks harrassing Muslims on the street.


Agreed

Thing is here, is that a man has been arrested for writing a tweet claiming he harrassed a Muslim woman on the street

First off, the definition of harrassment is broad.

Second off, there's no evidence the story was ever true.
#25
Quote by StewieSwan
Easy to say when you don't like what's being said. You'd change your tune real quick if the shoe was on the other foot.

Of course he would, it would be pretty natural for him to defend himself if he'd committed a hate crime. Not many people want to go to prison. But obviously the shoe would never be on the other foot.
#26
Quote by EndTheRapture51 at #33894641
Agreed

Thing is here, is that a man has been arrested for writing a tweet claiming he harrassed a Muslim woman on the street

First off, the definition of harrassment is broad.

Second off, there's no evidence the story was ever true.

obviosuly he's not gonna go to jail based on just the tweet, they'll investigate it, it'll turn out they can't prove it happened and he'll go free
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#27
Quote by Trowzaa
i can't think of any hate speech i'd like being said tbh

got any examples?


Thats the thing, you don't really get to decide if what you said is hate speech. Others do.
It all just boils down to mob justice in this particular case, he was only arrested because his tweet went viral and a mob was calling for his head.
If a mob is calling for your head then laws and rules are just an unnecessary formality.
#28
Quote by Trowzaa
obviosuly he's not gonna go to jail based on just the tweet, they'll investigate it, it'll turn out they can't prove it happened and he'll go free

"Just be thankful we didn't actually convict, but we'll be watching."

Yep, sounds pretty just to me, no big deal. Process isn't the punishment at all.


"Every day I wonder how many things I am dead wrong about."
#29
Quote by seanlang01 at #33894649
"Just be thankful we didn't actually convict, but we'll be watching."

Yep, sounds pretty just to me, no big deal. Process isn't the punishment at all.


your country sends people to jail for 20 years cos they had a bit of weed on them 3 times, pipe down lad.
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#30
Quote by Trowzaa
your country sends people to jail for 20 years cos they had a bit of weed on them 3 times, pipe down lad.


Sean isn't likely to defend that shit. You think you've said something here but you haven't.

Also, report yourself to jail for harassing Americans with hateful speech.
#31
Quote by Trowzaa
your country sends people to jail for 20 years cos they had a bit of weed on them 3 times, pipe down lad.



And that's not right either. Nice try, though.
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#32
Also, "your country," lol no, the state of California has the notoriously strict 3 strikes law. Not that this is relevant.


"Every day I wonder how many things I am dead wrong about."
#33
This happens an awful lot in Britain particularly.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#34
Quote by seanlang01
"Just be thankful we didn't actually convict, but we'll be watching."

Hopefully that is the message that is conveyed. It needs to be made clear to these people that their behaviour is not acceptable. Trying to get them to actually understand is likely impossible, like trying to get a hamster to read a book by Gilles Deleuze, but if every harassment ends in a trip to the police station at the very least, they might think twice. Freedom is overrated. These people don't know what's good for them or for society, and they should be stopped.
#35
Quote by korinaflyingv
But obviously the shoe would never be on the other foot.



Obviously. I mean, you guys are right after all.


Quote by korinaflyingv
Freedom is overrated. These people don't know what's good for them or for society, and they should be stopped.



Jesus christ
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#36
Well I think all Britons are sub-human racists. Are you going to do anything to me now UK government?
#37
Do they have black Israelite sermons in the street in Britland.
I might even be ok with this policing if it was actually applied consistently to everyone.
#38
Quote by StewieSwan
Obviously. I mean, you guys are right after all.

Maybe I shouldn't speak for Trowzaa, but personally I wouldn't end up in that situation because I don't deliberately intimidate people. That is against the law.

Quote by StewieSwan
Jesus christ

Do you want a world where people go around harassing each other for no reason?
Last edited by korinaflyingv at Mar 25, 2016,
#39
Quote by Rossenrot at #33894654
You think you've said something here but you haven't.


neither have you

Quote by StewieSwan at #33894655
And that's not right either. Nice try, though.


still waiting on an example of the shoe being on the other foot

Quote by seanlang01 at #33894659
Also, "your country," lol no, the state of California has the notoriously strict 3 strikes law.


found a story of a missouri man getting life without parole for buying weed 3 times

Not that this is relevant.


but yeah
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect