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#2
He's a fantastic player, but I think he gets a lot of bad press because of what he does on youtube. Same as Jared Dines and Steve Terreberry.

They ain't taken too seriously.
#3
I just saw Tosin last night with Generation Axe, what show it was!
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#5
The songs he writes and puts on youtube, like Anchor and HomeHomeHome, are very good songs. However, he does goofy stuff on the channel too and it makes people take him less seriously.

HomeHomeHome

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8mVl2aF5Go&list=PLjRyh8JaC_eQTYsASWO6G4N1KbuaU0CSh&index=11

Anchor

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xiERPVIEvSc&list=PLjRyh8JaC_eQTYsASWO6G4N1KbuaU0CSh&index=1
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#6
Rob Scallon is a pretty mega skilled player that's for sure. Rob does a fantastic amount of very different things on the guitar - all of which are done to a very, very high skill level. But even by Rob's own admission he's a studio player and that is where he's most comfortable playing guitar. From what I've seen of his live performances it's not quite as clean as Guthrie Govan or Tosin, but then again, that's not his chosen stage. And that is by no means a put down in any way, playing anything of those guy's stuff live is a challenge - even sitting at home playing it can damn near push you to breaking point.

People can rag on Rob all they want, but they should go learn one of his songs. I'm pretty sure that'll make them understand just how much skill is needed to play his songs. You don't even have to pick a song that requires an entirely new technique, pick one of his metal songs and have at it; I can guarantee it'll take a while to play any of them cleanly.

I entered Rob's Super Metal Audition challenge and learning that song pushed my abilities to a new level, it wasn't so much the BPM itself, it was the amount of notes and movement in such a small space that really made me struggle. Still, I was one of four (off the top of my head) who submitted at the correct BPM though (and I worked for it).

Jared Dines is a monster player too. But unlike Scallon Jared is a very traditional player in the sense that he has the typical abilities of someone who's really practiced to a super high level, Scallon has brought in a variety of techniques from outside of metal to incorporate into his playing. I wish Jared would do more original songs with less emphasis on pure shred, his original songs are pretty kick ass (I mean the non-comedic).

I personally rate Rob Scallon in the same league as Guthrie and Tosin, there's just no denying the skill. That said, I do think Tosin and Guthrie are more skilled players - but for Rob to even be in the same league and come from YouTube alone, that's one hell of an achievement.
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#7
Out of Scallon, Dines, and Terreberry, Scallon is my personal favorite. The songs that he writes and shares are stellar, and he's a great player. When he does funny videos, he's nowhere near as obnoxious (besides doing extremely obnoxious head-bobbing) as others; his video content is probably the most well-rounded out of most YouTube guitarists.

Dines is pretty good, but I never thought he was much to write home about when it came to playing guitar. Sure, he can play, but it seems very cliche for the "x"-core/modern metal guitarist scene.

Stevie T, who is a wonderful player, I cant get over how obnoxiously annoying he can be in a majority of his videos. He brings quite a few viewers through it, but I think that completely discredits his playing.
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#9
Quote by aerosmithfan95
Out of Scallon, Dines, and Terreberry, Scallon is my personal favorite. The songs that he writes and shares are stellar, and he's a great player. When he does funny videos, he's nowhere near as obnoxious (besides doing extremely obnoxious head-bobbing) as others; his video content is probably the most well-rounded out of most YouTube guitarists.

Dines is pretty good, but I never thought he was much to write home about when it came to playing guitar. Sure, he can play, but it seems very cliche for the "x"-core/modern metal guitarist scene.

Stevie T, who is a wonderful player, I cant get over how obnoxiously annoying he can be in a majority of his videos. He brings quite a few viewers through it, but I think that completely discredits his playing.


I agree about Stevie T, he's just not a personality I like (or at least the personality he uses for YouTube) - I don't think he travels as well internationally as the others. He is a good player though, it's just that to me it's fairly standard. In a way I think we're all a bit spoiled, virtuosity these days is practically common place so you've go to really be something special to stand out. But that's what competing on the internet stage is

I think Scallon's work is generally less in your face and much more focused on the music, whereas I think Dines/Stevie focus a lot more on the personality aspect; which I think is much more divisive.

To me, Dines is a great player with fantastic voicing I've always found his solos to be largely better than those he was competing against, his solos seemed much fuller and 'fresh', whereas I found the others to be fairly stale. But each to his own.
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#11
He plays very well at everything he tries

But he can't write good songs to save his life. He's not reached Tosin level yet where he's both skilled and a good song writer.
o()o

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#12
The dude has skills, but like everyone else says, he doesn't really help himself by being silly. I also personally hate his Slayer videos where he does "banjo" covers, when all he's doing is flatpicking like a guitar and playing the song verbatim, only usually transposed an octave up. It's played cleanly and all, but it's not actual banjo playing and it's stupid and gimmicky. I think that in a way sums up most people's opinion of him. Too goofy for his own good.

Quote by EpiExplorer
He plays very well at everything he tries

But he can't write good songs to save his life. He's not reached Tosin level yet where he's both skilled and a good song writer.


Honestly I don't see Tosin as being as skilled as everyone says he is, since all the tech death, progressive metal, power metal, neoclassical, etc guys have way better technical skills. And that's just metal really. Then you have jazz fusion and instrumental rock, etc.

When there are guys like Ron Jarzombek, Mattias Eklundh, Shane Gibson (even though he died), Dave Martone, Daniele Gottardo, Marco Sfogli, Guthrie Govan, etc out there representing modern shred guitar, I just don't see Tosin as being on that level. And that's not even counting the old school shred guys like Shawn Lane, Tony McAlpine, Rik Emmett, Paul Gilbert, Marty Friedman, Chris Poland, and the usual suspects. It's not to say that he isn't skilled, but I just don't see Tosin as being as "godlike" as people make him out to be.

And that's just comparing him to other shred guys and not the other fingerstyle guys like Tony Emmanuel and John Butler and all of them that easily outclass him in that regard, which seems to be another thing that he is praised for incorporating into his playing. People also love to say that Tosin also incorporates so much jazz and classical influence, but he really doesn't.

The other thing I don't like about him is the riffing. A lot of the rhythm parts in Animals as Leaders are fairly trivial. I just haven't seen anything significant from him in terms of rhythm playing, and honestly when it comes to metal, a lot of rhythm playing, like what you hear in death metal bands and that sort of stuff, as a lot more demanding than shreddy lead playing. It's not that it's harder per se, but it is more physically demanding. A lot more effort in the hands is needed and it requires a very high level of precision with things like consistent palm muting and accenting (or lack thereof) that shreddy lead playing doesn't need. Maybe it's because it isn't flashy and acrobatic looking, but people underestimate the difficulty of type rhythm guitar playing in metal.

It's kind of hard to rate a metal guitar player highly in terms of technical ability when he doesn't really show off his riffing ability. You know, from a technical point. That's not to say that he can't play intricate riffs in the low end. Maybe he has crazy rhythm chops. But if he doesn't, he doesn't display it on the same levels as the death metal guys and the prog metal guys and the tech/prog thrash guys.

That's just me though and that's just raw technical ability. I don't know if I would consider Tosin a great songwriter, but I would certainly not consider most of the guys that I name dropped to be great songwriters. Some of them are pretty god awful. You know, like Michael Angelo "9001 notes of the fastest and cleanest playing you have ever heard and not a single one was interesting" Batio.
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#13
Quote by JackalUK at #33946152
He's a fantastic player, but I think he gets a lot of bad press because of what he does on youtube. Same as Jared Dines and Steve Terreberry.

They ain't taken too seriously.


i have only been shown like a video or two of each but all i have to say is steve terreberry annoys me far more than any other human ive come in contact with

straight up irrational hatred of that man
#14
Quote by soundgarden1986
i have only been shown like a video or two of each but all i have to say is steve terreberry annoys me far more than any other human ive come in contact with

straight up irrational hatred of that man


No man. He's legitimately annoying. Everything about him is insufferable. Not only that, but check out at about 1:30:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Jf9-VyXEKE

So he's saying that classical guitar left hand position is wrong. Like does he seriously not know about that?

And how terrible is his tone? Like... 50 modeling amp?
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Last edited by theogonia777 at Apr 27, 2016,
#16
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Omg^ that guy is horrible.
I hate that I clicked on that

this Xforever

i hate that he got another view from us.....
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#18
They are whatever you want them to be. We all have different interests and value different characteristics more and less so than others. I think Rob, Jared, and Steve are all pretty good for what they are trying to accomplish, but they arent quite what I am looking for. I think Tosin is the same way, he has some chops but doesnt quite do what I would do. Still makes better metal than 99% of metal bands out there though, it could use more improvisation and some jamming though. Van Halen is a joke hahaha there are so many better guitarists out there than he.
#19
I was never a van Halen fan but in a historical context he's above those other guys.
His stuff was groundbreaking 40 years ago.
#21
Quote by soundgarden1986 at #33946437
i have only been shown like a video or two of each but all i have to say is steve terreberry annoys me far more than any other human ive come in contact with

straight up irrational hatred of that man

That guy has such a punchable face.
#22
they're all wankers, well Tosin is 90% wanker, some his melodic stuff is nice on the ears.

i'd take a soulful player, like eric clapton, over an ADHD kid raping his guitar who drank too many redbulls that day.
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https://soundcloud.com/95dank



#23
Quote by k.lainad
they're all wankers, well Tosin is 90% wanker, some his melodic stuff is nice on the ears.

i'd take a soulful player, like eric clapton, over an ADHD kid raping his guitar who drank too many redbulls that day.

What is a soulful player? Someone that has the same feelings and thoughts and expectations from life as you? That isnt how life works. Everyone has a soul and every artist paints with their soul. Every soul is different. Playing a predictable solo with lots of bends and vibrato doesnt take any more skill or heart or determination than trying to play the Jordan guitar solo by Buckethead, note for note. I would say it is actually more difficult to play Jordan than Layla or any other clapton vaughn or any other solo by any guitarist said to have more soul than everyone else. Recreating bends and vibrato isnt difficult if thats what you want to do, but playing 13 notes a second, sweep tapping arpeggios and 6 finger nubbing takes every ounce of soul you have.
#24
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Recreating bends and vibrato isnt difficult if thats what you want to do, but playing 13 notes a second, sweep tapping arpeggios and 6 finger nubbing takes every ounce of soul you have.


You appear to be confusing "soul" and "technical proficiency"?
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#25
I hate it when people use 'soulful' as some sort of zen condition that all guitarists should apparently be a part of when it only ever seems to be slowly played blues scale notes.

It's also quite immaterial a description, cuz how can one define a soul, how can one define soulful playing? One that makes you feel good on the inside? That's the only criteria I can decode from people who espouse 'soulful' playing. Would rather have a billion tech wankers that know how to actually use their instrument over a billion boring fucks appeasing to other boring fucks.
o()o

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#26
Quote by Arby911
You appear to be confusing "soul" and "technical proficiency"?

Someone that doesnt have the personality to become technically proficient is usually the same kind of person to say theory kills creativity, or that solo had no soul and was just wank. People just wanna relate to things and some people cant relate to Buckethead because they cant imagine themselves doing that.
#27
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Someone that doesnt have the personality to become technically proficient is usually the same kind of person to say theory kills creativity, or that solo had no soul and was just wank. People just wanna relate to things and some people cant relate to Buckethead because they cant imagine themselves doing that.


Ok. Your opinion is noted.

"Soul" is a subjective term, technical proficiency can be objectively measured. All I'm saying is that they aren't the same thing, making your conflation a bit silly.
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#28
Has this guy written music that was as notable as either of those two?


If your answer is no, then I probably wouldn't consider him on the same level. Regardless of technical proficiency
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#29
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#30
Quote by Arby911
Ok. Your opinion is noted.

"Soul" is a subjective term, technical proficiency can be objectively measured. All I'm saying is that they aren't the same thing, making your conflation a bit silly.


They can be the same thing. If we really have to use as flimsy a word as 'soul', then there are loads of extremely proficient solos that also ooze what plebs would call 'soul'.

Examples:
@2:20


@7:22


@2:11


@1:12


Also Jams gone mental again.
o()o

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#31
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Everyone has a soul and every artist paints with their soul.


What about people that don't have souls?
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#32
Quote by EpiExplorer
They can be the same thing.

Also Jams gone mental again.


If that's true, show me how to measure "soul"?

Also, SSDD...
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#33
Quote by Arby911
If that's true, show me how to measure "soul"?

Also, SSDD...


The ghost dudes on TV use an EMF detector.

Wait. I changed my mind. Play music for Don Cornelius. The bigger his afro gets, the more soulful.
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Last edited by theogonia777 at Apr 27, 2016,
#34
Quote by Arby911
If that's true, show me how to measure "soul"?

Also, SSDD...


Iunno man, I'd ask a priest but they never give me a straight answer.

Also, TIL SSDD.
o()o

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#36
But how do you play with soul if you already sold it for rock and roll?


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#37
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#38
Quote by EpiExplorer
He plays very well at everything he tries

But he can't write good songs to save his life. He's not reached Tosin level yet where he's both skilled and a good song writer.


I agree. Phenomenal instrumentalist, but not much creativity there. And he's admitted it himself so it's not a big deal or anything.
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#39
Quote by jrcsgtpeppers
Someone that doesnt have the personality to become technically proficient is usually the same kind of person to say theory kills creativity, or that solo had no soul and was just wank. People just wanna relate to things and some people cant relate to Buckethead because they cant imagine themselves doing that.


Not really, I like Buckethead, some of his stuff is cool, but be real - a lot of his stuff is totally just dicking around. Have you even listened to what must be an album for every day of the week last year? Some of it had promise if it wasn't wanked away in a day album release. Does that mean I can't imagine myself playing as well as Buckethead, or that I can't play as well as Buckethead? No.

I've spent the time learning Jordan to Bucket's speed. Do I feel there's wanking in that song? Absolutely, and that's why I learnt it. Wanking it may be but I appreciate the technical proficiency - whilst maintaining that realistically it's only going to be other guitarists who are going to even remotely appreciate it. And even then they're going to call me a dick.

The point is soul is always relative: to music, to objects, and even to people. To say something is soulless does not equate to a binary meaning that that person is simply jealous or someone's ability.

The same thing can occur in studio recordings, you often record the same thing countless times. Where does the soul go? Can you imbue the same thing 500 times with soul? Or does that defeat the point of soul altogether if it can be canned and repeated?

Such is the problem of studio sessions. And to be honest, I feel I can tell when something is being played for the sake of being played as opposed to something being played with meaning. I have to constantly watch myself to stop myself from falling into complacency, soul isn't something that happens all the time, you really have to fucking work on it and paradoxically be aware of it whilst not focusing on it.

Technical ability mixed with soul is a seriously hard combination.
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#40
Quote by whywefight
shredders are soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo boring

Huu

Also "soul" might be the worst word ever when talking about music
___

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