#1
Hey everyone.

Along my quest to replace my EL84 tube power amp I got a chance to buy a used VHT/Fryette 2/50/2, which is a very rare occasion in my area. The guy originally asked for 750 euros, I´m trying to push it down to 700. Do you think that is a good price? For EU of course, I know the used market in the States is bigger, prices are lower, but overseas shipment, taxes and duty fees are enormous, so buying from over the pond is not an option for me.... One more detail: it´s the standard version with EL34s and I might be wanting to have the thing modified to 6L6s, to achieve the most agressive and tight sound for metal....

So whatcha think?
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
Last edited by Airfish at May 3, 2016,
#2
i love my fryette sig:x. they make nice stuff. as far as price goes i have no idea. doesn't seem too bad though.

as far as the 6L6 v. EL34 thing goes, i don't think it would be worth it to get it switched. i think you are making too big of a deal regarding that.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


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youre just being a jerk man.



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#3
Quote by trashedlostfdup
i love my fryette sig:x. they make nice stuff. as far as price goes i have no idea. doesn't seem too bad though.

as far as the 6L6 v. EL34 thing goes, i don't think it would be worth it to get it switched. i think you are making too big of a deal regarding that.


....that´s why I wrote "I might".... of course I want to hear the EL34s first and if they impress me enough, I won´t touch them.
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#4
Now I also got a chance to buy a Mesa Fifty/Fifty - not the current 2: Fifty, but the older one, with the low/high power switch on the front panel. And the guy is asking for 600 euros. So what is a better buy in your opinion: a newer 700 euros VHT/Fryette, or and older 600 euros Fifty/Fifty? Somewhere I read, that the VHT´s sound is tighter and more articulate on the low frequencies, but that was just someone in a forum on some other guitar/gear page....
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#5
Really, guys, I need to decide.... The newer VHT with EL34s, or the older Mesa with 6L6s? Every personal experience shared is greatly appreciated!
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#6
age doesn't matter to me personally. life on the tubes a little bit, but not much. physical appearance, not a ton. i go for quality, tone, and bang for the buck.

i don't think that either would be a bad choice. i own a MKIV and a Tremoverb and i love them both. to add to that, i like my MKIV a lot with EL34's, over 6L6's. my tremoverb i haven't tried with EL34's.

both companies make nice stuff. pick one and go with it.
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#7
Quote by trashedlostfdup
age doesn't matter to me personally. life on the tubes a little bit, but not much. physical appearance, not a ton. i go for quality, tone, and bang for the buck.

i don't think that either would be a bad choice. i own a MKIV and a Tremoverb and i love them both. to add to that, i like my MKIV a lot with EL34's, over 6L6's. my tremoverb i haven't tried with EL34's.

both companies make nice stuff. pick one and go with it.


I´m almost decided on the VHT. People elsewhere say it sounds more transparent and does not colour the sound as much as the Mesa. And my tech says he should be able to mod the thing to 6L6, in case I would really want that. But firtst I´m about to test-drive the crap out of those EL34s, for sure....
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#8
Quote by Airfish
I´m almost decided on the VHT. People elsewhere say it sounds more transparent and does not colour the sound as much as the Mesa. And my tech says he should be able to mod the thing to 6L6, in case I would really want that. But firtst I´about to test-drive the crap out of those EL34s, for sure....


good luck!
WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#9
Quote by trashedlostfdup
good luck!


Thanks!
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#11
Quote by diabolical
The VHT is dry even on high gain sounds, the Mesa is more "loose", I like both so I dunno...up to personal preference. Good luck!


Thank you!
My next high-gain toy could be more on the loose side, but right now I prefer tight & dry.
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#12
Quote by Airfish
I prefer tight & dry.


We are talking about tube amps right
"A well-wound coil is a well-wound coil regardless if it's wound with professional equipment, or if somebody's great-grandmother winds it to an old French recipe with Napoleon's modified coffee grinder and chops off the wire after a mile with an antique guillotine!"
- Bill Lawrence

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#13
Quote by Evilnine
We are talking about tube amps right


Exactly, dude....

Some call it transparency (incl. me), others call it lack of character (you?)....

A tube amp CAN be tight and dry, without sounding like solid state.

If our dear brother Dimebag was still alive, he could tell you more, in case I´m not credible enough for you....

The world is not black/white, my boy....
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
Last edited by Airfish at May 7, 2016,
#14
Coming back to this thread to share the result. I bought the VHT 2/50/2, the standard version with EL34s and I really am astonished. Compared to my good old Marshall 20/20 with EL84s suddenly everything sounds clearer, more articulate, less muddy, there´s incredible bite, yet tons of definition.... This power amp appears to be a very good combination with my Engl E530 preamp, excelent combination with my two Engl 2x12s. Yes, I can imagine that some people would call this sound "dry", but to my ears it´s not as dry and lifeless as s solid state power amp. You can still hear those tubes work. And you can absolutely hear what you play. Mod to 6L6? No f*cking way! This is THE SH*T !!!!

B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
Last edited by Airfish at May 7, 2016,
#15
fryette makes great stuff. some of my favorite amps.
I mean anything would have been an upgrade over the 20/20 that power amp is just garbage.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#16
Glad you like it fish! I told you long ago that you wanted a new poweramp,aren't you glad you listened?

WTLT 2014 GG&A

Quote by andersondb7
alright "king of the guitar forum"


Quote by trashedlostfdup
nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


Quote by andersondb7
youre just being a jerk man.



****** NEW NEW NEW!
2017-07-07 2017-07-07 Update and a Chat On Noise Constraints *** NEW FRIDAY 7/7
2017-04-13 RUN AWAY from COMPUTERS!!! TCE? RANT ALERT!!!
2017-03-02 - Guitar Philosophy 1001- Be Prepared For the Situation (Thursday 2017-03-02)
2017-02-21 How to Hot-Rod the Hell of your Stratocaster for $50! (Tuesday 2017-2-21)
Resentments and Rambling from a Guitar Junkie
---> http://trashedengineering.blogspot.com/
#17
Quote by trashedlostfdup
Glad you like it fish! I told you long ago that you wanted a new poweramp,aren't you glad you listened?



Sir, yes, sir! Hearing is believing!
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#19
Quote by diabolical
... and now we have to hear a sound clip...


Oh dear, that´s gonna be hard....
You have to choose a cab: w/ V30s or w/ K100s....?
And also choose your mike: SM-57 or E906....?
And mike position: off/on axis....?
So?
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
Last edited by Airfish at May 8, 2016,
#21
Quote by diabolical
Well, let your ears be the judge man.

How about both mics on axis mixed in together? Whatever speaker sounds better to you.


OK, so be it. My favourite combination: SM-57 with K100 - on axis and E906 with V30 - off axis, a 50/50 blend. Just gimme a couplne days or so, right now I´m very busy at work (which is other sh*t, not music)....
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#23
OK, here we go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FwN8N4ga9c

Sorry, I had an insane working week and had absolutely no time to do it earlier.

Please do not judge my playing, I´m not a pro, not even an active giggin´musician.... And if you can´t help it, OK, do it, but please not in this forum....
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
#25
Quote by Airfish
Really, guys, I need to decide.... The newer VHT with EL34s, or the older Mesa with 6L6s? Every personal experience shared is greatly appreciated!


With some (*some*) rack mount tube amps, you'll almost never hear the difference. Here in the US, one equivalent to the VHT is the Carvin TS-100. If you run the amp in stereo (or just one channel at a time) you can run EL34s on one side and 6L6/5881s on the other (bias switching is provided). With that particular power amp, however (it's a 2U rack mount like the VHT) the specs are so tight that it can be used as a audiophile amp. THD% is *nothing* like the slop on a guitar-based tube amp, so you're not really going to hear much difference between the two sides.

I looked at the VHT before I got the Carvin, and found the Carvin for $200 used (that's an unusually low price and the guy even threw in a couple of bottles of handcrafted beer!). I bought a whole retube set for it, but it was so good as is that I tossed them in a drawer.

I've got Marshall and Mesa tube power amps (larger than 100W) as well, but those are back breakers to carry around. The Carvin is about 26 lbs, but I've switched that up as well, and am using a 2U solid state power amp capable of over 1500W that only weighs 9 lbs.
#26
Quote by diabolical
Sounds good to me, especially on the clean and crunch tones. The heavy stuff is a bit too dense for my taste.


Thanks. Yeah, I admit, it IS dense. But I like it that way. And the good news for me: compared to my old Marshall 20/20 the density, produced by the preamp, stays more articulate now with the VHT. The Marshall added audibly more mud to the final sound. Too bad I can´t prove it with a comparison recording, but I simply had no time to make any sound clips with comparable setting, I sold the Marshall very quickly.
B.C. Rich, Cort, Engl, Engl, Engl, Epiphone, Epiphone, Fender, Fender, Gallien-Krueger, Gallien-Krueger, Ibanez, Ibanez, Ibanez, KRK, KRK, KRK, Laney, Line6, Michael Kelly, Schecter, VHT, Yamaha....
Last edited by Airfish at May 16, 2016,
#27
Quote by dspellman
With some (*some*) rack mount tube amps, you'll almost never hear the difference. Here in the US, one equivalent to the VHT is the Carvin TS-100. If you run the amp in stereo (or just one channel at a time) you can run EL34s on one side and 6L6/5881s on the other (bias switching is provided). With that particular power amp, however (it's a 2U rack mount like the VHT) the specs are so tight that it can be used as a audiophile amp. THD% is *nothing* like the slop on a guitar-based tube amp, so you're not really going to hear much difference between the two sides.

I looked at the VHT before I got the Carvin, and found the Carvin for $200 used (that's an unusually low price and the guy even threw in a couple of bottles of handcrafted beer!). I bought a whole retube set for it, but it was so good as is that I tossed them in a drawer.

I've got Marshall and Mesa tube power amps (larger than 100W) as well, but those are back breakers to carry around. The Carvin is about 26 lbs, but I've switched that up as well, and am using a 2U solid state power amp capable of over 1500W that only weighs 9 lbs.


....and that´s why I envy you guys, on the other side of the Pond: you have way more options, both on the new and used markets.

As for weight, it was absolutely no factor for me: the VHT really IS heavy as f*ck, but it stays in the rack box of my home studio/rehearsal room and I don´t need to drag it around....

And one more positive change for me: The cooling of the VHT is way better, compared to the Marshall. The fans on both amps are equally noisy, but the Marshall was getting almost untouchable hot, after a couple of hours. And the VHT stays surprisingly cool.... I guess this must be the magic of 2U space and bigger/more venting openings.
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Last edited by Airfish at May 16, 2016,
#28
No that's the magic of proper engineering by a team of people that actually know what they are doing.

Google that marshall amp and it's cooling problems. It should have never gone to market like that.
Prs se Holcomb is the answer
#29
Quote by AcousticMirror
No that's the magic of proper engineering by a team of people that actually know what they are doing.

Google that marshall amp and it's cooling problems. It should have never gone to market like that.


Actually, my Marshall never stopped working, so I was not too worried about that overheating. But then again, I had a 1U free space above and also below it, so that might have helped.

And you seem to be right as far as the VHT is concerned - I have heard from multiple sources, that it IS properly designed and well built - that was one of the reasons why I bought it.
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#30
I won't put the Carvin in this league at all. I have a Peavey Classic 50/50 which is a Mesa knockoff that's a bit better than the Carvin but I don't think it gets up as good as the big name brands like the Marshall EL34 or the Mesa power amps, or the VHT.
I think that preamp might just be a bit too dense for my taste, again personal preference more than anything else.
#31
Quote by diabolical
I won't put the Carvin in this league at all. I have a Peavey Classic 50/50 which is a Mesa knockoff that's a bit better than the Carvin but I don't think it gets up as good as the big name brands like the Marshall EL34 or the Mesa power amps, or the VHT.
I think that preamp might just be a bit too dense for my taste, again personal preference more than anything else.


Peavey Classic 50/50? That thing has like eight EL84s as power tubes, am I right? And how does it sound? Not that I would consider buying it, I´m just curious....
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#32
Quote by diabolical
I won't put the Carvin in this league at all.


You have absolutely no experience with the Carvin, I'm guessing.
#33
I do, played the Carvin at their store, its okay, but it is the least very basic tube amp, plain potatoes.
Not bad but for example, the Mesa feels like it has an extra dimension.
The Peavey is a good amp, a lot of tubes, good options to tune based on different speakers, etc.
#34
Quote by diabolical
I do, played the Carvin at their store, its okay, but it is the least very basic tube amp, plain potatoes.
Not bad but for example, the Mesa feels like it has an extra dimension.


I'm not sure what you mean by "played the Carvin." If by that you mean that you played something (including some preamp) *through* the TS100 for a few minutes, then I have to tell you that working with one every day, running several different preamp setups into it and having others there to compare to might be a different thing.

Both the Mesa and the Marshall 2/90's that I have DO have an extra dimension, and that's harmonic distortion. Unfortunately, in a power amp, that's not a great thing. What you call "basic tube amp" to me is tightly controlled and limited distortion. What goes in is what comes out. I've got enough sloppy tube guitar amps, so when I was running a Mesa Triaxis and a Carvin Quad-X (tube preamps) I wanted something that didn't have an opinion of its own. It's just a PIA to have to try to EQ out baked-in biases in both power amps and speaker cabinets if that's not what you're looking for. I've also got old tube Dynaco, JBL and Marantz tube amps for comparison (I think there's a Macintosh in there somewhere as well), and that's what I want. I love the other two, make no mistake, but they sort of force their personalities on a rig, and that's not what I was looking for.
#35
I went to the Carvin store in Sacramento and spent a few hours there. They had all their rigs in a closed room and a friend of mine that is a guitar player and I drove our wives crazy as they had to wait around the area in coffee shops as we spent 4 hours in there. If you've been to Sacramento, there's basically nothing to do there so the missuses were livid

I tried it with their gear, so I plugged in a V3 fx send into it and their preamps which I don't remember what they were called. It was OK.

I like more character in a tube amp. For example my Peavey 50/50 Classic power amp could do the bland Carvin sound and had more options to tune the speakers via the front panel, I could get tighter or looser response if needed by dialing in the resonance, etc.

This is what I have:



Definitely a better amp than the Carvin. Not that the Carvin is bad, it is just more limited. The Peavey could do the Carvin sound, but on top of that you could play with the "Presence" and "Resonance" on each channel and achieve better results, for example run say Celestions on one side and Eminence on the other for fuller sound and tune the speaker response to your taste.

Still, I was a guitar tech for a touring guitarist with a Traixis rig and a wall of Mesa Stereo 2:90's and those amps had another extra added dimension of quality and depth of tone. I remember I was also really into the Marshall JMP-1 and Dual Monobloc EL34 setup, which again had a few notches up in quality on the Carvin.
Last edited by diabolical at May 17, 2016,