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#1
It's in the news a lot these days.

Obama administration issues guidance on transgender access to school bathrooms
http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/12/politics/transgender-bathrooms-obama-administration/index.html

(CNN)The Obama administration issued guidance Friday directing public schools to allow transgender students to use bathrooms matching their gender identity.

A joint letter from the Departments of Education and Justice went to schools Friday with guidelines to ensure that "transgender students enjoy a supportive and nondiscriminatory school environment," the Obama administration said Thursday.

The announcement comes amid heated debate over transgender rights in schools and public life, which includes a legal standoff between the administration and North Carolina over its controversial House Bill 2. The guidance goes beyond the bathroom issue, touching upon privacy rights, education records and sex-segregated athletics, all but guaranteeing transgender students the right to identify in school as they choose.

"There is no room in our schools for discrimination of any kind, including discrimination against transgender students on the basis of their sex," Attorney General Loretta Lynch said. "This guidance gives administrators, teachers and parents the tools they need to protect transgender students from peer harassment and to identify and address unjust school policies."

North Carolina Gov. Pat McCrory slammed the guidance and called on Congress to address the issue.

"Most Americans, including this governor, believe that government is searching for a solution to a problem that has yet to be defined. Now, both the federal courts and the U.S. Congress must intercede to stop this massive executive branch overreach, which clearly oversteps constitutional authority," McCrory said in a statement.

Sen. Lamar Alexander, the chairman of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions Committee, reiterated in a statement that the guidance was not federal.

"This is the kind of issue that parents, schools boards, communities, students and teachers should be allowed to work out in a practical way with a maximum amount of respect for the individual rights of all students. Insofar as the federal government goes, it's up to Congress to write the law, not the executive departments," the Tennessee Republican said.

Justice and Education Department officials have repeatedly made clear that under their interpretation of Title IX, the federal anti-discrimination law in education, schools receiving federal funds may not discriminate based on a student's sex, including a student's transgender status.

"The guidance makes clear that both federal agencies treat a student's gender identity as the student's sex for purposes of enforcing Title IX," the administration said Thursday.

Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick accused the Obama administration of "blackmail" and called the guidance "social engineering."

"The families in America will not accept it," Patrick said at a news conference.
Mississippi Gov. Phil Bryant issued a statement Friday afternoon calling the directive "outrageous" and directed his state's education department to disregard the order.


Do you think transgendered people should be able to freely use the public restroom of their identification? Do you think that Obama is doing the right thing here?
#4
yes
yes

/thread

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#5
Like whats the penalty?
And how do they "catch" someone.
Like someone has to stand at the bathrooms and examine everybody's genitals before they can go in?
#6
Quote by neidnarb11890
ugh liberals!
so sick of this politically correctness!!

Lol.

Yes and yes.
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#7
As a counter, some argue against it by saying that statistic s show most transgendered people who go on to get sex reassignment surgery regret it. That, to critics, shows that transgender issues are less legitimate than some would have you think.

Trouble In Transtopia: Murmurs Of Sex Change Regret
http://thefederalist.com/2014/11/11/trouble-in-transtopia-murmurs-of-sex-change-regret/

Our culture seems pretty much “to each his own” when it comes to elective bodily mutilation and the regret thereof. And there’s a lot of regret out there. According to a British poll, a whopping 65 percent of those who’ve had various cosmetic surgeries regret it. People who regret their tattoos, plastic surgery, or more extreme body modifications (here’s a sad Buzzfeed pictorial on the effects of ear gauges) can read up on the Internet and find an open array of remedies. Plastic surgeons make money both puttin’ it in and takin’ it out.

Hollywood stars can speak openly about misgivings over their boob jobs and whatnot. Regarding her lip enhancement surgery, Courtney Love said: “I just want the mouth God gave me back.”

But the difference between Love and the guy with phantom penis syndrome is that the guy isn’t allowed to talk about his regret. Not openly. The transgender lobby actively polices and suppresses discussion of sex-change regret, and claims it’s rare (no more than “5 percent.&rdquo However, if you do decide to “de-transition” to once again identify with the sex in your DNA, talking about it will get you targeted by trans activists. So it’s a challenge to understand the scope of regret for sex change surgery. It’s out there, but…

Let’s start with Alan Finch, a resident of Australia who decided when he was 19 to transition from male to female, and in his 20s had genital surgery. But then, at age 36, Finch told the Guardian newspaper in 2004:

". . . transsexualism was invented by psychiatrists. . . .You fundamentally can’t change sex … the surgery doesn’t alter you genetically. It’s genital mutilation. My ‘vagina’ was just the bag of my scrotum. It’s like a pouch, like a kangaroo. What’s scary is you still feel like you have a penis when you’re sexually aroused. It’s like phantom limb syndrome. It’s all been a terrible misadventure. I’ve never been a woman, just Alan . . . the analogy I use about giving surgery to someone desperate to change sex is it’s a bit like offering liposuction to an anorexic."


Tennis champion Rene Richards was one of the first to go through sex-change surgery and was something of a sensation in the 1970s. As such, you might expect Richards to be a tower of strength, offering encouragement to those in similar circumstances today. Well, not so much. This is what Richards had to say in an excerpt from a March 1999 interview attributed to Tennis Magazine (unavailable in full online):

"If there was a drug that I could have taken that would have reduced the pressure, I would have been better off staying the way I was—a totally intact person. I know deep down that I’m a second-class woman. I get a lot of inquiries from would-be transsexuals, but I don’t want anyone to hold me out as an example to follow. Today there are better choices, including medication, for dealing with the compulsion to cross dress and the depression that comes from gender confusion. As far as being fulfilled as a woman, I’m not as fulfilled as I dreamed of being. I get a lot of letters from people who are considering having this operation…and I discourage them all.’ —Rene Richards, “The Liaison Legacy,” Tennis Magazine, March 1999."
Last edited by bradulator at May 14, 2016,
#8
I believe he isn't doing the right thing. Someone could easily pretend and take advantage of that which will cause a whole lot of problems.
#9
Quote by roger
I believe he isn't doing the right thing. Someone could easily pretend and take advantage of that which will cause a whole lot of problems.

What's stopping perverts from dressing in drag and sneaking into opposite gender bathrooms now?
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#11
What does a kid go to jail if they use the wrong bathroom, what is this rule?!?!?
#12
Quote by genghisgandhi
or just walking in wearing jeans and a t shirt

That too.

Really, why does anyone give a shit about people being able to use the bathroom they're comfortable with?

I mean, I'd personally prefer not having exclusively unisex bathrooms just because I don't want cuties at work hearing me take a shit. (And I don't want to hear them)
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#13
I volunteered at a legal org that had unisex bathrooms it was wild man.

I share Trump's opinion. The bathroom issue is something that's caused so little trouble and North Carolina's getting so much bad publicity and losing business/money over a non-issue. It's stupid.
Quote by jakesmellspoo
ooh look at me i'm ERIKLENSHERR and i work at fancy pants desk jobs and wear ties and ply barely legal girls with weed and booze i'm such a classy motherfucker.
Last edited by ErikLensherr at May 14, 2016,
#14
Quote by jakesmellspoo


I mean, I'd personally prefer not having exclusively unisex bathrooms just because I don't want cuties at work hearing me take a shit. (And I don't want to hear them)

my student union has those, I'm a liberal guy but I absolutely hate them
#15
Quote by genghisgandhi
my student union has those, I'm a liberal guy but I absolutely hate them


lol we had them at our uni

heading into there on a club night when you just wanted a piss

girls in there taking selfies

so weird

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#16
what I still don't get, is they wanna use the bathroom they are comfortable using. what is uncomfortable about using the other bathroom? is it the conversation in there?, is it the sight of a urinal? the smell? I'm still looking for an answer to the elementary question.
#18
people are missing the bigger point. you now give guys a pass to go into womens locker rooms. this should be good
#19
Quote by bradulator





But you see, it's different with women. They can't fight back if a man came onto them.
#21
go to college, learn facts, deny facts, waste money


thoughts don't change gender. that is a fact
#22
Your gender is set by your body. If you have male genitalia you are male, if you have female genitalia you are female. People who are 'transgender' have psychological issues, not physical issues. Treatment should be given to help their mental state and shouldn't be based on physical mutilation.

As far as the toilet issue goes, as a man I wouldn't feel very comfortable sharing a public toilet with women. I reckon that most women would feel even more uncomfortable sharing public toilets with men. If places want to I have no problem with them making unisex toilets as an addition to separate male and female toilets but not in place of them.
RPD - Finger Pickin' Good
#23
Quote by rpd
Your gender is set by your body. If you have male genitalia you are male, if you have female genitalia you are female. People who are 'transgender' have psychological issues, not physical issues. Treatment should be given to help their mental state and shouldn't be based on physical mutilation.

As far as the toilet issue goes, as a man I wouldn't feel very comfortable sharing a public toilet with women. I reckon that most women would feel even more uncomfortable sharing public toilets with men. If places want to I have no problem with them making unisex toilets as an addition to separate male and female toilets but not in place of them.


Your sex is set by your body

Your gender is not

longing rusted furnace daybreak seventeen benign nine homecoming one freight car
#24
Quote by mattedbird
go to college, learn facts, deny facts, waste money


thoughts don't change gender. that is a fact

I'm amazed at how worked up people get over this. there's something really visceral and primal about this shit that gets under people's skin and I don't really see what it is

also you think exactly how I imagine a carpenter from Kansas would. go Cards
#25
Segregated bathrooms are so old fashioned
Quote by ErikLensherr
Did you hear about the cockney Godfather?

He made them an offer they couldn't understand.
#26
>2016
>it has been decades since scientists distinguished between biology and gender
>people STILL conflate "man" with "male"
>STILL

We really should "reboot" the human race
Quote by EndTheRapture51
who pays five hundred fucking dollars for a burger
#28
Quote by Banjocal

We really should "reboot" the human race

this is the most ******ed thing said in this thread so far. why do you want to start over? so we have to deal with stuff like women not being able to vote and legalised slavery again? at least we've started to discuss stuff like this, imagine this debate happening even 20 years ago
#29
Quote by genghisgandhi
this is the most ******ed thing said in this thread so far. why do you want to start over? so we have to deal with stuff like women not being able to vote and legalised slavery again? at least we've started to discuss stuff like this, imagine this debate happening even 20 years ago
Quote by EndTheRapture51
who pays five hundred fucking dollars for a burger
#30
Quote by mattedbird
go to college, learn facts, deny facts, waste money


thoughts don't change gender. that is a fact


Well yeah. You're whatever gender you feel you are. You don't just think your way to another gender.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#31
Quote by genghisgandhi
this is the most ******ed thing said in this thread so far. why do you want to start over? so we have to deal with stuff like women not being able to vote and legalised slavery again? at least we've started to discuss stuff like this, imagine this debate happening even 20 years ago


Haha, we have survived and thrived as a species for hundreds of thousands of years, why do we suddenly need to change things?
RPD - Finger Pickin' Good
#32
Quote by genghisgandhi
I'm amazed at how worked up people get over this. there's something really visceral and primal about this shit that gets under people's skin and I don't really see what it is

also you think exactly how I imagine a carpenter from Kansas would. go Cards
yeah I'm not an intellect like yourself. people like you have all the answers without answering a question
#33
Quote by rpd
Haha, we have survived and thrived as a species for hundreds of thousands of years, why do we suddenly need to change things?


I mean, we've survived and thrived because of adaptive changes to our biology and societal arrangements lol
Quote by Skibolky
No one can really fuck with the power of empathy.
#34
Quote by rpd
Haha, we have survived and thrived as a species for hundreds of thousands of years, why do we suddenly need to change things?

Quote by mattedbird
yeah I'm not an intellect like yourself. people like you have all the answers without answering a question

I don't know who's trying to be meta and who isn't anymore
#35
Quote by theogonia777
Well yeah. You're whatever gender you feel you are. You don't just think your way to another gender.

how did I miss that?
#36
Quote by mattedbird
how did I miss that?


Because you're not an intellect.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#37
Quote by theogonia777
Because you're not an intellect.
I was looking in my tool bags for the answer. thanks for helping
#38
People tend not to be good at finding things when woodshop was their strongest subject in school.
There's no such thing; there never was. Where I am going you cannot follow me now.
#39
some serious #bodying going on here
Quote by EndTheRapture51
who pays five hundred fucking dollars for a burger
#40
Quote by bradulator
As a counter, some argue against it by saying that statistic s show most transgendered people who go on to get sex reassignment surgery regret it. That, to critics, shows that transgender issues are less legitimate than some would have you think.

Trouble In Transtopia: Murmurs Of Sex Change Regret
http://thefederalist.com/2014/11/11/trouble-in-transtopia-murmurs-of-sex-change-regret/

another possible explanation is that it reinforces the societal problems surrounding transgender individuals because society says genitalia dictates gender, so when the surgery happens and there's almost more stigma thrown on the individual, it's not gonna feel like a great idea.

idk the transgender issue is one that is really big and nebulous and vague and i don't know that much about it. i do think bathroom laws are dumb though. implying that people would take advantage of it to take a peek at someone else's genitalia implies that: a) gay people aren't capable of sexual harassment (otherwise we'd have gay bathrooms), and b) trans people are more morally deviant.
it's all just coming back
it's all coming back

it's all coming back to me