#1
As a gigging guitarist I confess I've never really found multi-fx at all convincing so I've always stuck to more traditional amps and effects but fairly recently I switched to a BluGuitar AMP1 that I now have sat on my pedalboard and while it's not quite as good as my old Orange TH30, it still offers some great valve tones and the compact nature of the set up is something I REALLY love. In the next few months I'll be moving to The Falklands to live so I guess that while there may be a few live shows at the school where I'll be teaching, most of my playing will now be in the home where I'd like to experiment with a bit of recording. My original idea was to keep my compact amp and effects for playing live and use a Presonus iTwo as an audio interface to record to my computer. However, recently I've been wondering about the possible wisdom of going the whole hog and buying a Pod HD500X to use for everything. This idea raises a few questions:

1) How do the amp models on the HD500X stand up to a real valve amp?
2) Can the HD500X be used for recording as I want?
3) What's the best way of getting a live sound from the HD500X - hooked up to a traditional guitar amp, connected to a power amp and then into a guitar cabinet or into a FRFR system like an active PA speaker or keyboard amp?
4) If the answer to the previous question is a PA speaker then what sort should I be looking at? I seem to vaguely recall in the past someone saying that active PA speakers with a 15" speaker was best or is it better with a 12" speaker like a traditional guitar cabinet?

Thanks
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#2
I'm not convinced by the hd500, they just feel wrong. I intend to buy one of these next month though. It's got the same DSP as an AxeFX with software by Studio Devil.

http://atomicamps.com/amplifire-pedal/
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#3
A lot of people say modeling doesn't sound "right" to them and then they can't tell the difference blindfolded anyway. The advantages (provided you use them correctly) over standard Tube amps include; access to many amp sounds, built in effects, the same tone low volume or high volume, and better dispersion.
The proper way to use them is with a FRFR power speaker system and not a guitar amp!
Guitar amps will colour the sims and have a narrow beam the cab projects where the tone has all the frequencies, quickly rolling off highs as you move sideways across that beam.
It's also important to remember Modeling emulates the sounds of a mic'ed cabinet (ie what you'd ideally hear at the front of the house through a good PA from a MIC amp).

There are tons of demos and lessons/tutorials on how to use these and other modellers to get very convincing tones. The link below is to one Australian Artist that uses the HD500X for recording, he shows how to tame the sounds of some of the sims to get realistic tones out of it.
USIBNG PARA EQ to tame HD500 SIMS
Moving on.....
#4
Quote by Cathbard
I'm not convinced by the hd500, they just feel wrong. I intend to buy one of these next month though. It's got the same DSP as an AxeFX with software by Studio Devil.

http://atomicamps.com/amplifire-pedal/



AXE FX II has dual DSPs.
Moving on.....
#5
So does the Amplifire.
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#6
Anything with POD in is shit, that's all you need to know really.

Long story short, if you're not paying the big bucks for those Kemper type fake amps it's just not worth it. It'll sound shite live if there's even a semi-decent amp in the same vicinity. Just stay away from anything with POD on or any multi-fx boards that are under like $600-800. You get what you pay for with these types of things
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#7
OK, I tried a Pod HD today and I'd have to say that I was completely underwhelmed by the whole thing. The amp tones were flat, lifeless and NOTHING at all like a real valve amp. It made me realise just how ingenious my BluGuitar AMP1 is!!!

New idea - how about switching my focus to the Atomic Amplifire? It seems to me that if I connect the Amplifire to the effects return on the AMP1 and run it through my Orange cabinet I'll have the best of everything. Will the Amplifire act as an audio interface to record to my computer like the Pod?
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#8
Quote by Doadman


1) How do the amp models on the HD500X stand up to a real valve amp?
2) Can the HD500X be used for recording as I want?
3) What's the best way of getting a live sound from the HD500X - hooked up to a traditional guitar amp, connected to a power amp and then into a guitar cabinet or into a FRFR system like an active PA speaker or keyboard amp?
4) If the answer to the previous question is a PA speaker then what sort should I be looking at? I seem to vaguely recall in the past someone saying that active PA speakers with a 15" speaker was best or is it better with a 12" speaker like a traditional guitar cabinet?


1. Surprisingly well, once you've got them dialed in. Ignore the factory presets altogether, do a bit of hanging out on vettaville and other Line 6 forums. Check into meambobbo's Tone Guide for the Pod HD and pay attention to what he's done to get rid of "fizz", etc. The more expensive modelers (Axe-FX, Kemper, Line6's own Helix) have put together a better set of factory presets and sound better out of the box without fuckwithage, but with some tweaking, the Pods are excellent.

2. Whole albums have been done with the Pods (Neal Schon, Dino Cazares), so depending on what you're doing, there's no issue from the Pod, at least, in terms of recording.

3. I've handled live output several ways. I'm currently running a power amp into PA-style cabinets, and that's probably where I'll stay.

I've also used the old Atomic Reactor 112 and 212 tube-power-amp powered guitar-like cabinets. Compared to headphones, they sounded a bit muffled until I picked up on some tips from "Vettaville's Bundle Barn" (128 specially designed patches for use with the Atomic 112 amp). http://www.vettaville.nl/page.php?id=51#78 These are also useful as a beginning tweak if you're going to try to run live through a guitar cabinet. If you can FIND one of these things (the 50-W 112 version is golden in terms of compact size, output and convenience, but all have been discontinued) and if it's in good shape (they were built in China and the tolex is sometimes in need of being tacked down again), it's really worth having. The 50W 112 has a 200W Eminence speaker in an oversize ported closed-back cabinet and runs real 6L6 tubes, etc. Serious grunt and bottom end if you want it.

4. Cone size isn't really a consideration; it's more about quality, power output (*real* power, not program or peak power) and correcting for odd spikes ("flat" response doesn't always happen with relatively cheap PA speakers -- that's why MeyerSound cabs are so insanely expensive). Best Bang For The Buck comes from Carvin -- their PM12A cabinets have 400W RMS amps built in and they have a 12" LF driver and a 1" (or thereabouts) HF driver and they only weigh about 30-something pounds. There's a PM15A as well for not much more money and only a bit more weight. http://carvinaudio.com/products/pm12a-molded-2-way-12-inch-powered-loudspeaker-monitor for the 12" version. $272 (plus shipping, handling, recappable tire, etc.).

I'm actually currently using cabinets designed to provide flat response, tons of power handling and great dispersion for bass players. But I'm using them for keyboards and bass (as well as modeled guitar), and running them with a 1500W power amp, and they're expensive (around $1100 if you have an "authorized builder" custom build them for you).
#9
Quote by Doadman
OK, I tried a Pod HD today and I'd have to say that I was completely underwhelmed by the whole thing. The amp tones were flat, lifeless and NOTHING at all like a real valve amp. It made me realise just how ingenious my BluGuitar AMP1 is!!!


Lemme guess -- you listened to the factory presets? Through a guitar amp?
#10
Quote by dspellman
Lemme guess -- you listened to the factory presets? Through a guitar amp?


No, the whole time I was going through a Yamaha FRFR PA speaker as I assumed that would be best. I started with the factory presets and they were awful so I started playing around with it to set up my own. I'm not denying that if I spent longer with the unit it would yield better results but I did get far enough to realise that I disliked the red mode on every amp and the amp models improved a lot with the addition of a Tubescreamer model. I eventually found some tones that were useable but I couldn't shake the very 'processed' feel to them and they didn't really either sound or feel like a real valve amp. I know that's asking a lot and has been what's put me off modellers before but the reason I'm looking at them again is because my AMP1 DOES sound and feel like a proper valve amp. Perhaps the Pod HD would have fared better had I connected it to the effects return of the AMP1 and then run it into my Orange cabinet but I chose to try it with an FRFR speaker because that's what many people, yourself included judging by your comments, suggested would sound best.
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#11
Quote by Doadman
No, the whole time I was going through a Yamaha FRFR PA speaker as I assumed that would be best. I started with the factory presets and they were awful so I started playing around with it to set up my own.


There are recommendations that I'm guessing didn't make it to your test session regarding what settings on the Pod you should use when working with an FRFR speaker. A single wrong setting can produce exactly what you experienced. I grew up with tube amps and still have a lot of them, so I feel your pain.

Too bad. If you don't like it, you don't like it. Take a glance at this:http://foobazaar.com/podhd/toneGuide/ if you should ever have one in your grasp again.

Beyond that, I've been using the Pod HD with a Two Notes Torpedo C.A.B. The combination is really interesting; the C.A.B. works with cabinet IRs that are superb, and it also offers tube power amp simulations. The Pod actually does a fine job with the preamp stuff and the FX, but I think the cabinets could have used some more work. The C.A.B. brings the combination right into the levels you'll find with the Axe, Kemper, Helix.
#12
Once again, anything with POD on is shit. People can defend it, I get it, it cost you a lot of money, but those things are bad.
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#13
The Amplifire isn't an interface, you will still need an interface to go between it and the computer.
The great thing about the Amplifire is that it feels like a real amp. It has proper picking dynamics. I issued a challenge to people here quite a few times to produce some edge of breakup blues on a modeller and nobody has produced anything satisfactory.
But that was before the Amplifire. Check this out:

https://youtu.be/iZ921eVXkGg

The Amplifire isn't competition for the similarly priced hd500x, it is competition for the AxeFX. It's just a LOT cheaper.
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#14
I was excited to try the HD500x. I used a pair of headphones. I thought the distortion modeling still sounded digital. I was using the presets though. But I'm not sure how you can dial out "digital" lol. If I only played cleans I'm sure this thing would be very good. Delay and reverb effects etc are usually much easier to model.
#15
Quote by Anthony1991
Anything with POD in is shit, that's all you need to know really.

Long story short, if you're not paying the big bucks for those Kemper type fake amps it's just not worth it. It'll sound shite live if there's even a semi-decent amp in the same vicinity. Just stay away from anything with POD on or any multi-fx boards that are under like $600-800. You get what you pay for with these types of things


dumb statement is dumb.

I am assuming that you don't have much time on one. the HD500's are pretty good for the price they fetch.

you really do need to sit down for a bit and dial them in.

i haven't tried the blu thing. nor do i plan on it. nor do i plan on getting a HD500. been there done that.
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#16
The only time I've heard someone sound good through that unit was the lead guitarist for Helstar, Larry Barragan and he was running it simply for its effects in a 4 cable method.

I guess if you want to do a live/recording rig, you could possibly get the HD500 for effects, I'll get something good for overdrive sounds though, like a Mesa or Engl preamp and will then either get a Mesa/VHT tube power amp for live work and then bypass the power amp and just use speaker sims (IRs) in the DAW for recording, directly from the quality tube preamp, unless you can mic a cab, which I still think is the best way to go.

Personally, I achieve much better results with software sims than I do with multifx, but still prefer to mic a real amp as there is no substitute, the real tube amp via a mic recording just sits way better in the mix. I track mostly everything direct through my interface and then reamp through real amps.

The cool thing about the HD500 is that it can also do midi switching, so if you buy analog midi switchable preamp you can control the whole chain with the HD500. In my case I do something similar but use a Boss GT-10. The newer Boss GT-100 can also do this and as far as I am concerned, the GT-10 and GT-100 effects sound much better than the Line6, although the Line6 simulations might be a touch better, but not much.

It really depends what a good sound means to you
#17
OK, so now I have a slightly different and admittedly more expensive idea.

Firstly, I really like the AMP1 because it's just so like playing a traditional valve amp but it strikes me that while part of its success is undoubtedly the very good modelling of the different channels, the real beauty of it is the 100w Class D, valve driven power amp section as that's what brings the models to life. It seems reasonable to conclude that the amp models on an AmpliFIRE are a lot better than those on the AMP1 but you still need a way to give it volume so I'm thinking I might also buy an AmpliFIRE and plug it into the effects return of the AMP1 so in the space of two decent sized pedals I'd have all the great amp tones I need, all of my effects and a 100w valve driven power amp. I could then use the AmpliFIRE for all of my tones when recording instead of computer software so all I'd need is a basic interface and basic recording software.

Does that make sense or am I missing something?
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#18
Quote by trashedlostfdup
dumb statement is dumb.

I am assuming that you don't have much time on one. the HD500's are pretty good for the price they fetch. You really do need to sit down for a bit and dial them in.


Cool, how about pairing up your POD with a Line 6 Spider? Then it'll sound totally authentic and not digital at all!

When you've experienced the expensive end of gear in regards to both tube amps and high end pedals, there's really no going back. The difference between them and the replicates is still an absolute mile. BIAS does gets mighty close though, Kemper is okay but again the majority of presets are just don't bother.

For me, the need to sit down and 'dial in' a multi-fx preset board kind of defeats the point.
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#19
Quote by Anthony1991
Cool, how about pairing up your POD with a Line 6 Spider? Then it'll sound totally authentic and not digital at all!

When you've experienced the expensive end of gear in regards to both tube amps and high end pedals, there's really no going back. The difference between them and the replicates is still an absolute mile. BIAS does gets mighty close though, Kemper is okay but again the majority of presets are just don't bother.

For me, the need to sit down and 'dial in' a multi-fx preset board kind of defeats the point.


And you can pick up a SLO, cab and a pile of boutique pedals for $500?

You need to dial in every rig, analog or digital.
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#20
Quote by DarthV
And you can pick up a SLO, cab and a pile of boutique pedals for $500?

You need to dial in every rig, analog or digital.


Get a decent tube combo amp, problem solved? Why are the effects even needed anyway, no one wants to hear Flea do the national anthem on bass with 10 billion effects.

Dialing in a set rig is fine, dialing in an FX pedal with endless presets? I've done that enough to the point of just total disinterest in multi-fx now. Just even thinking about going through a 1000 presets to find the 5 good ones makes me question the point of life.
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#21
So your logis is basicly "i dont like it, therfore its shit."?
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#22
You need to dial in every rig but some take longer than others and there's also the law of diminishing returns. I'm sure you can get decent tones out of the Pod HD500 but the basic sounds just weren't there for me and I felt that after hours of tweaking I'd still end up with something that was fundamentally flawed. It didn't seem fundamentally different to modellers I've tried in the past.

I'm only doing all of this because I'm moving abroad so no longer need my valve amp, which was an Orange TH30. When I moved to the AMP1 I was worried I'd respond the same way I did to the Pod but surprisingly, the AMP1 is seriously good. Is it as good as the Orange I had? No, of course not, I'm not stupid but it is good and it does offer benefits the Orange didn't. From what I can gather the amp models on the Amplifire are even better so it makes sense to use those amp models with the AMP1's power section for an even better tone that takes up almost no space and weighs virtually nothing. I don't need the midi controller for it and I don't need to work through thousands of effects for what I want. Four basic amp tones with reverb, delay and chorus will do me for any live performances and anything else can be held on the laptop ready for recording.

I honestly think this could sound great FOR WHAT I NEED RIGHT NOW and in truth, I'm not particularly missing my old Orange amp at all so it can't be that bad.
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#23
Quote by Anthony1991
Get a decent tube combo amp, problem solved? Why are the effects even needed anyway, no one wants to hear Flea do the national anthem on bass with 10 billion effects.

Dialing in a set rig is fine, dialing in an FX pedal with endless presets? I've done that enough to the point of just total disinterest in multi-fx now. Just even thinking about going through a 1000 presets to find the 5 good ones makes me question the point of life.


And a tube amp will work for what the TS wants, recording? Add in an interface, mic and mic stand, sure.

You have to dial in everything, doesn't really matter if that's on a multi-fx box or an amp. And who uses stock presets?
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#24
Quite a different attitude here on this forum about this topic. Instead of constructive comments and discussions there's basically a bunch of ill-informed opinions with the same old tired anti-modelling BS thrown out there like they're facts.
Here's a fact .... if you care to look you can find many professional guitars players (who are not on this forum), many of who we've all heard about, that use these tools & not just for effects but for live playing and recording.
Collectively people can bash them all they want but in the end who's opinions should carry more weight?
Moving on.....
#25
Agreed.

Artists using the Atomic Amplifire - Dweezil Zappa, Misha Mansoor and Marty Friedman amongst others


Artists who use BluGuitar AMP1 - Uli Jon Roth and Jennifer Batten, with the latter also using a Digitech RP1000 for effects.

While I admit there are some units I'm not keen on, I feel neither regret or shame for having sold an Orange valve amp for the route I'm now taking. The Orange was better in some respects but worse in others. Horses for courses.
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Fender Standard Stratocaster with DiMarzio pickups
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#26
Quote by Doadman

Firstly, I really like the AMP1 because it's just so like playing a traditional valve amp but it strikes me that while part of its success is undoubtedly the very good modelling of the different channels, the real beauty of it is the 100w Class D, valve driven power amp section as that's what brings the models to life.


I'm curious what you're talking about regarding the "100W Class D, Valve Driven Power Amp?" A Class D amp is a solid state amplifier. The AMP1 has a single teensy Russian-made tube hard-wired to the board. Like many pedals that include a 12 AX7 that allows them to use the word "tube" somewhere in their advertising, the AMP1 offers up a single tube small enough to not require a socket. In short, there's nothing "valve-driven."

You have a small solid-state modeler with a tiny solid state amp built in.
#27
Quote by Doadman


Artists who use BluGuitar AMP1 - Uli Jon Roth and Jennifer Batten, with the latter also using a Digitech RP1000 for effects.


I think Jennifer (and I don't want to be putting words in her mouth; she'll hurt me) will tell you that the advantage of the AMP1 is that it's small and light and that it has an amp built in so that she can do her small solo car and/or fly gigs (which is a lot of what she does these days) and it sounds decent. Aside from that Washburn guitar she's attached to, she's run through a lot of gear (and endorsements) over the years. But she's a lot more about whatever's compact and gets the job done well enough than "in search of the ultimate tone." What she's about is what's in her fingers.
#28
I'm not sure of the technical side of it but after years of playing nothing but valve amps, I can assure you the AMP1 sounds like a valve amp, feels like a valve amp and is as loud as a valve amp in a way that no modeller has ever done that I've tried before. The other guitarist in my band uses a H&K 50w valve amp and my AMP1 stays with him without any difficulty at all and the tone sounds as valve-like as his. With results like that I don't care if people tell me it's valve, hybrid or solid state, it's the results that matter. I repeat that while I think the tone on my Orange was ultimately better, it wasn't enough to outweigh the numerous advantages the AMP1 gives me over the Orange and I suspect that with the addition of an Amplifire that difference in tone will be negligible while instead of breaking my back with a valve amp I have a rig I can carry around easily and have either set up or put away in minutes.
Gibson Les Paul Studio with Catswhiskers pickups
PRS SE 'Floyd' Custom 24 with Creamery pickups
Fender Standard Stratocaster with DiMarzio pickups
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Last edited by Doadman at May 31, 2016,
#29
Quote by Doadman
I'm not sure of the technical side of it but after years of playing nothing but valve amps, I can assure you the AMP1 sounds like a valve amp, feels like a valve amp and is as loud as a valve amp in a way that no modeller has ever done that I've tried before. The other guitarist in my band uses a H&K 50w valve amp and my AMP1 stays with him without any difficulty at all and the tone sounds as valve-like as his. With results like that I don't care if people tell me it's valve, hybrid or solid state, it's the results that matter. I repeat that while I think the tone on my Orange was ultimately better, it wasn't enough to outweigh the numerous advantages the AMP1 gives me over the Orange and I suspect that with the addition of an Amplifire that difference in tone will be negligible while instead of breaking my back with a valve amp I have a rig I can carry around easily and have either set up or put away in minutes.


I agree with you completely that it's results that matter.

You tell me that you get the results you need with an AMP1, which is a solid state modeler with a solid state power amp that has enough for what you do. I tell you that I get the results I need with an HD500 (which is a solid state modeler) and a solid state amplifier (mine is a Carvin 1500W amp). You've grown up on tube amps, as did I. I took the time to figure out the HD500, and you don't want to bother.

I've got no issue with that.
Enjoy.
#30
i like some of the pre-sets on amplifire. not all, but some of them are pretty good. the JCM800 model in particular rocks. the bonus is that so many people are creating profiles and sharing them. the Michael Britt profiles i grabbed a few nights back are ridiculously good sounding.

the only thing i haven't been able to get out of the amplifire is a "bell like" fender tone. but i'm getting real close. no modeler that i've played or heard can nail that 100%, so i'm not too fussed about it. (i am a fender clean snob, i admit it). i've got it about as close as a blues jr now, but i'm going for vibroverb here.

if you want to run the different speaker cab impulse responses (IRs), then you want a powered speaker and not a tube amp to run it through. you can use a tube amp and cab, but then you want the cab emulation section turned off. both work, again, it's preference. but these things are designed to go through a powered flat response speaker.

i run mine through an ElectroVoice ZLX-12P,link here i had sam ash price match a cheaper online site, so it was $350 out the door. this is about as "cheap" as you want to go. the cheaper berringer and samson units sounded okay, but the EV rocks. great warranty, which is important but hopefully i never need to use it. i was surprised how good the EV did at lower volumes. i also use headphones, no complaints on either. i haven't tried the carvin that dspellman recommended, but i do trust his judgement on gear recommendations. it's probably a good choice too.

for me it's just the ease of use and size. we have a small condo and there isn't a big footprint for a room full of tube amps and a big pedal board. (i'd be all for it, don't get me wrong!) plus we use the PA as a home sound system by plugging my phone into it and one of the boys will be using it for magic shows.

i've only had my amplifire about a week, so i'm still going through it and setting up the 128 banks with different set ups that i like out of the who knows how many profiles i've grabbed already. i play a lot of genres so it's really nice to have.

i know i've made a sacrifice to a degree going "all in one" vs individual amps/pedals, but it's not that big of a sacrifice based on what i'm getting out of the amplifire.

of course, it's all opinion and preferences in the end, but so far i really like it and what it does.



i was able to return the monitors as the PA did fine at lower volumes.
oh, and i took the tuner of my strat's headstock, i found the tuner in amplifire finally. .
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Last edited by gregs1020 at May 31, 2016,
#31
Quote by Anthony1991
Cool, how about pairing up your POD with a Line 6 Spider? Then it'll sound totally authentic and not digital at all!

When you've experienced the expensive end of gear in regards to both tube amps and high end pedals, there's really no going back. The difference between them and the replicates is still an absolute mile. BIAS does gets mighty close though, Kemper is okay but again the majority of presets are just don't bother.

For me, the need to sit down and 'dial in' a multi-fx preset board kind of defeats the point.


Haha. Maybe you should ask what I have for gear first.

I don't even own a pod at the moment.
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alright "king of the guitar forum"


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nope i am "GOD of the guitar forum" i think that fits me better.


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youre just being a jerk man.



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#32
Talking about Uli and Batten - I actually saw them on their US tour, which was quite recent (April, I think). Jennifer was going "all in the box" and sounded like a**. Uli brought two Blackstar full stacks and sounded like God.

Didn't see Amp1 on his stage, I peaked at Jennifer's stage but didn't notice the Amp1, I think she was going completely through her Mac, but I'll have to look at my videos again.

I remember she was one of the GT-10 endorses when I got mine, touring with Jeff Back as his rhythm guitarist, so I guess she's been in the multifx camp for a while.

BTW, there's really nothing all that exciting about class D amplifiers, they're the cheapest and smallest garden variety ss amps, so I think that's why they put in a tube in there to probably add a bit of nonlinearity and make the marketing "pop" better.
#33
Quote by Anthony1991

When you've experienced the expensive end of gear in regards to both tube amps and high end pedals, there's really no going back. The difference between them and the replicates is still an absolute mile. BIAS does gets mighty close though, Kemper is okay but again the majority of presets are just don't bother.

For me, the need to sit down and 'dial in' a multi-fx preset board kind of defeats the point.


I've experienced the expensive end of gear (tube amps and pedals) and still have most of it sitting in storage and I've already whined about the storage bill on these forums. I've had Pods since the XT and I've got an Axe-FX Ultra.

I've listened to the "Anything _____ is shit" argument before, but that was a bit earlier, when keyboards began to move away from a grand piano and a real Hammond B3 to something you could carry in one hand. At this point, I have both a Korg Kronos and a Korg PA3X, and honestly, there's pretty much nothing I couldn't replicate on these things (if I were good enough. Others are, and are doing entire movie sound tracks on them and have been for years). I don't get just a piano -- I get a choice of a wide range of pianos, including german and japanese pianos. In fact, I get a choice of how open the lid is on the 9' grand piano of my choice, and if the speaker cabinets are up to the task, you can hear every little nuance and performance difference.

In fact, Line 6 was formed by a bunch of keyboard designers who decided to make the same technology available to the average guitarist.

Most guitar players yearn for a clean channel and a gain channel that suits them and their bedroom. I've had to wear a lot more hats, and the ability to change whole sets of FX (I have two and a half bins of the real thing, and growing) including how individual FX are set in the mlddle of playing appealed to the point where I was willing to put in the work to make whatever gizmo was being used sound right. Often the "Marshall" setting didn't sound enough like a Marshall, but the "Park" setting was a better jumping off point. The Pods (and the Variax guitars) have some pretty good computer editing software that will not only let you produce whole set lists of presets, but will also allow you to tweak things to your heart's content.

My willingness to work with the unbelievable number of sounds available on a keyboard no doubt made it easy for me to understand tweaking modelers. My experience with the Triaxis and Carvin Quad-X preamps I used for years (the Quad-X has nine 12AX7 tubes, four channels, up to 11 gain stages, several kinds of active and assignable EQ setups, plus MIDI controls, six (!) FX loops, etc.) run into a 100W stereo tube power amp and wider-than-normal-frequency 2x12 (plus 2xtweeters) has also probably helped in that regard.

And oh, by the way, if that "expensive end of gear" notion is still swirling, I'd be pleased to price out just the system I used routinely onstage before I got around to the Pods you dislike. I can virtually guarantee you've never seen or heard 90% of it in person.
#34
Quote by gregs1020

the only thing i haven't been able to get out of the amplifire is a "bell like" fender tone. but i'm getting real close. no modeler that i've played or heard can nail that 100%, so i'm not too fussed about it. (i am a fender clean snob, i admit it). i've got it about as close as a blues jr now, but i'm going for vibroverb here.

The US Clean is a Twin and there's bassmans and deluxes in there too. They don't cut it?
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#35
Quote by gregs1020

i run mine through an ElectroVoice ZLX-12P,link here i had sam ash price match a cheaper online site, so it was $350 out the door. this is about as "cheap" as you want to go. the cheaper berringer and samson units sounded okay, but the EV rocks. great warranty, which is important but hopefully i never need to use it. i was surprised how good the EV did at lower volumes. i also use headphones, no complaints on either. i haven't tried the carvin that dspellman recommended, but i do trust his judgement on gear recommendations. it's probably a good choice too.


I had assumed that a FRFR speaker would be best too and that's the way I was going to go but then I saw this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ0zyKEVyKQ

The PA-style speaker was horrible whereas going through the effects return of a normal amp and into a Vintage 30 loaded 1X12 sounded as good as through Atomic's own cabinet and it's at this point I got the idea of running into the effects return of my AMP1 and then into my Orange 1X12, which also uses a Vintage 30. Actually, on the higher gain stuff I thought the traditional guitar amp sounded even better than the Atomic cabinet. In fairness, with the right use of EQ, any of them would probably sound good.
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#36
Quote by Cathbard
The US Clean is a Twin and there's bassmans and deluxes in there too. They don't cut it?

the US Clean is good, the M Britt fender is better though. it's as if they focus'd on how the fenders break up more than how they sound truly clean. dunno, didn't mess with it last night. was playing black crows on the acoustic.

i'll get it, it's in there.
Quote by Doadman
I had assumed that a FRFR speaker would be best too and that's the way I was going to go but then I saw this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQ0zyKEVyKQ

The PA-style speaker was horrible whereas going through the effects return of a normal amp and into a Vintage 30 loaded 1X12 sounded as good as through Atomic's own cabinet and it's at this point I got the idea of running into the effects return of my AMP1 and then into my Orange 1X12, which also uses a Vintage 30. Actually, on the higher gain stuff I thought the traditional guitar amp sounded even better than the Atomic cabinet. In fairness, with the right use of EQ, any of them would probably sound good.

nothing wrong with that. like i said, everyone has different preferences.

i watched a lot of videos featuring the amplifire and they aren't all done the same way. sometimes the speaker cab sim is on and in other videos it's off. i've been running it through the FRFR with cab sim off, and it sounds great that way (to me, in person) as well.

there's no wrong way to use it, just do what works for you in your situation with your current gear. you can adjust everything if you're getting too much mids from the V30.

good luck!
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